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POSTGAME: Rd 21 vs Collingwood



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A big highlight for me though was Trac's first quarter goal out of congestion in the pocket, that was freakish.

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Watch the game for a third time.

It is easily game of the year for mine.

I have no idea how we lost it. But Collingwood hunt in packs. If their fitness stays up they will win at least one final.

Our game is more sustainable but we can't lose any more to end the season. That's five losses now in similar fashion. 

We should take care of Carlton and Brisbane easily. But so we should have Bulldogs, and Pies on Friday.

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28 minutes ago, Scipio said:

Our forward line was such a shambles. And what the hell is with continually kicking it to the same congested pocket, every bloody time? Needs to be sorted out ASAP.

Collingwood's forwards were consistently marking 20m out, no angle... and not just after a coast to coast break.

It was predictable all game.

Was waiting for the change up in game plan with forward entries after half time but nope.

Coaching staff extremely slow to react.

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A very entertaining game.

A poor performance by some of our key backs. I hardly sited Salem in the last.

I think we need to get a tad more physical and not leave it up to just Viney and May.  One of our mids is built like a tank and needs to use his body more.  An absolute brain fade by Oliver to give da gooeey that first goal.

Kozzie needs to get front and centre and not go for pack marks, or one handed.

And hey fellas look disappointed if you miss the shot on goal.

I'm ok with the Hibberd free but not the Viney one.

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2 hours ago, praha said:

Watch the game for a third time.

It is easily game of the year for mine.

I have no idea how we lost it. But Collingwood hunt in packs. If their fitness stays up they will win at least one final.

Our game is more sustainable but we can't lose any more to end the season. That's five losses now in similar fashion. 

We should take care of Carlton and Brisbane easily. But so we should have Bulldogs, and Pies on Friday.

I want to watch it again but can't bring myself to. It was a cracking game though.

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I can see Collingwood’s belief taking them to a Prelim. And from there anything is possible as they found out in 2010 and 2018.

It sounds trite, but god we skipped over earnest and honest enjoyment of footy to arrogant expectation due to 4 games of footy last year - it is so hard to win a flag, let alone repeat and we should respect those that are rising (or hopefully falling - Geelong) more than we do. Collingwood remind me of us in 2018. We were brash and a bit sloppy but hard as nails and willing to work. We beat a hardened Geelong and a Hawthorn team with little left but then were dispatched by a WCE team that respected us enough to destroy us and everything we stood for. 

We need to show that same respect.

Edited by rpfc
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9 hours ago, rpfc said:

I can see Collingwood’s belief taking them to a Prelim. And from there anything is possible as they found out in 2010 and 2018.

It sounds trite, but god we skipped over earnest and honest enjoyment of footy to arrogant expectation due to 4 games of footy last year - it is so hard to win a flag, let alone repeat and we should respect those that are rising (or hopefully falling - Geelong) more than we do. Collingwood remind me of us in 2018. We were brash and a bit sloppy but hard as nails and willing to work. We beat a hardened Geelong and a Hawthorn team with little left but then were dispatched by a WCE team that respected us enough to destroy us and everything we stood for. 

We need to show that same respect.

I wish there were more comments like this from Demon fans because it is true. These things are really hard to win.

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9 hours ago, rpfc said:

I can see Collingwood’s belief taking them to a Prelim. And from there anything is possible as they found out in 2010 and 2018.

It sounds trite, but god we skipped over earnest and honest enjoyment of footy to arrogant expectation due to 4 games of footy last year - it is so hard to win a flag, let alone repeat and we should respect those that are rising (or hopefully falling - Geelong) more than we do. Collingwood remind me of us in 2018. We were brash and a bit sloppy but hard as nails and willing to work. We beat a hardened Geelong and a Hawthorn team with little left but then were dispatched by a WCE team that respected us enough to destroy us and everything we stood for. 

We need to show that same respect.

Who is "we"?  The fans, in which case it is utterly irrelavant if some of the fan base is arrogant and disrespectful, or is "we" the players and coaches, in whch case you have no idea of their attitude.

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10 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I want to watch it again but can't bring myself to. It was a cracking game though.

Same here, Dr. G. I watch the replay every week, win or lose. I have to if I wanna know anything about the match since you’d be surprised how much is missed by the members of the cheer squad due to having to concentrate on so much else. 
But this week it’s different. I just can’t bring myself to watch it, nor even the highlights. 🙁

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10 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I want to watch it again but can't bring myself to. It was a cracking game though.

I can't either, over the weekend I kept thinking about the last 10 minutes and last 4 goals from either side and trying to change what happened after that. 

Collingwood's pressure at times has to be given credit, they certainly want it right now. 

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  • I think the "Melksham instead of a genuine tall forward" experiment is over.  There were so many times that our small forwards and midfielders easily got to the fall of kicks into the F50 but instead of contesting the mark, took position front and centre expecting one of our talls to contest only for there to be an uncontested mark to Collingwood.  We can't allow that to continue so need to bring in someone to support BBB.  I think Weids is out of chances so has to be JVR or Joel SMith if he trains well.
  • No more of Max starting at FF.  Start him in the middle.  Jackson made some costly errors early on Friday and is still a second ruck that can provide some great cameos as the game wears on.
  • It's not pooular but I can see why we kick to the pocket.  They went end to end on us after an intercept mark in the middle of our back 50 late on Friday.  That doesn't happen if the intercept is deep in the pocket.
  • They broke us down and scored by creating overlap at our half forward area.  Too many bees to the honey pot was often the cause initially then they got the run through the corridor and took it forward at speed which is very hard to defend.  Was it our system not working or was it someone (or several) not sticking to the system?  Whatever it was, it needs work to combat Collingwood and Sydney's ball movement.
  • Cold comfort, but we actually got a lot of things right.  I went home thinking that 4 out of 5 times we'd probably win that game.  We won most key stats, kicked for goal badly, watched them kick for goal unbelievably and didn't get the rub of the green with HTB frees in front of goals (the McCreey non call in our goal square soon followed by the red hot call against JJ quite soon after stand out).  The expected score had us winning by 13 points.
  • Fingers crossed it is 2018 repeating, with Collingwood playing the role of 2018's Melbourne side, who when playing an exciting brand of footy went to Perth late in the season to beat WCE.  "The Dees played eye-catching footy, moving the ball with pace and putting West Coast's rock-solid defence under severe pressure." was how it was reported.  We all remember how 2018 ended up.
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5 minutes ago, Vipercrunch said:
  • I think the "Melksham instead of a genuine tall forward" experiment is over.  There were so many times that our small forwards and midfielders easily got to the fall of kicks into the F50 but instead of contesting the mark, took position front and centre expecting one of our talls to contest only for there to be an uncontested mark to Collingwood.  We can't allow that to continue so need to bring in someone to support BBB.  I think Weids is out of chances so has to be JVR or Joel SMith if he trains well.
  • No more of Max starting at FF.  Start him in the middle.  Jackson made some costly errors early on Friday and is still a second ruck that can provide some great cameos as the game wears on.
  • It's not pooular but I can see why we kick to the pocket.  They went end to end on us after an intercept mark in the middle of our back 50 late on Friday.  That doesn't happen if the intercept is deep in the pocket.
  • They broke us down and scored by creating overlap at our half forward area.  Too many bees to the honey pot was often the cause initially then they got the run through the corridor and took it forward at speed which is very hard to defend.  Was it our system not working or was it someone (or several) not sticking to the system?  Whatever it was, it needs work to combat Collingwood and Sydney's ball movement.
  • Cold comfort, but we actually got a lot of things right.  I went home thinking that 4 out of 5 times we'd probably win that game.  We won most key stats, kicked for goal badly, watched them kick for goal unbelievably and didn't get the rub of the green with HTB frees in front of goals (the McCreey non call in our goal square soon followed by the red hot call against JJ quite soon after stand out).  The expected score had us winning by 13 points.
  • Fingers crossed it is 2018 repeating, with Collingwood playing the role of 2018's Melbourne side, who when playing an exciting brand of footy went to Perth late in the season to beat WCE.  "The Dees played eye-catching footy, moving the ball with pace and putting West Coast's rock-solid defence under severe pressure." was how it was reported.  We all remember how 2018 ended up.

I understand why we go to the pocket too, it's safe. If you don't mark, you get a f50 stoppage from a ball in. However, that relies on small forwards working at the stoppage. Kozzy starts too far off the contest and hops a ball will squirt out to him. He needs to get in and win the pill or draw a free. Same goes with Spargo. We don't hunt inside 50, a large reason we lost the game. Several weeks now without tackling pressure inside 50. In contrast, Collingwood were manic and created goals from holding the ball in front of goals, even if a few were very dubious.  

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12 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

I understand why we go to the pocket too, it's safe. If you don't mark, you get a f50 stoppage from a ball in. However, that relies on small forwards working at the stoppage. Kozzy starts too far off the contest and hops a ball will squirt out to him. He needs to get in and win the pill or draw a free. Same goes with Spargo. We don't hunt inside 50, a large reason we lost the game. Several weeks now without tackling pressure inside 50. In contrast, Collingwood were manic and created goals from holding the ball in front of goals, even if a few were very dubious.  

We need some tackling presence in our forward line. Kozzy, Spargs and co just dont have 'it' this year. Hunt? Chandler? Viney? Harmes? We need to change something. 

 

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32 minutes ago, Vipercrunch said:
  • I think the "Melksham instead of a genuine tall forward" experiment is over.  There were so many times that our small forwards and midfielders easily got to the fall of kicks into the F50 but instead of contesting the mark, took position front and centre expecting one of our talls to contest only for there to be an uncontested mark to Collingwood.  We can't allow that to continue so need to bring in someone to support BBB.  I think Weids is out of chances so has to be JVR or Joel SMith if he trains well.
  • No more of Max starting at FF.  Start him in the middle.  Jackson made some costly errors early on Friday and is still a second ruck that can provide some great cameos as the game wears on.
  • It's not pooular but I can see why we kick to the pocket.  They went end to end on us after an intercept mark in the middle of our back 50 late on Friday.  That doesn't happen if the intercept is deep in the pocket.
  • They broke us down and scored by creating overlap at our half forward area.  Too many bees to the honey pot was often the cause initially then they got the run through the corridor and took it forward at speed which is very hard to defend.  Was it our system not working or was it someone (or several) not sticking to the system?  Whatever it was, it needs work to combat Collingwood and Sydney's ball movement.
  • Cold comfort, but we actually got a lot of things right.  I went home thinking that 4 out of 5 times we'd probably win that game.  We won most key stats, kicked for goal badly, watched them kick for goal unbelievably and didn't get the rub of the green with HTB frees in front of goals (the McCreey non call in our goal square soon followed by the red hot call against JJ quite soon after stand out).  The expected score had us winning by 13 points.
  • Fingers crossed it is 2018 repeating, with Collingwood playing the role of 2018's Melbourne side, who when playing an exciting brand of footy went to Perth late in the season to beat WCE.  "The Dees played eye-catching footy, moving the ball with pace and putting West Coast's rock-solid defence under severe pressure." was how it was reported.  We all remember how 2018 ended up.

Did we finish 5th that season?

I can still see Collingwood finishing 5th, I think that is more possible and realistic than them finishing 2nd.

They have two really hard games coming, Sydney at SCG and Carlton potentially playing to stay in the 8.

Collingwood can easily lose both and with their horrid percentage it's like they have half a game handicap compared to the other top 4 contenders.

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2 minutes ago, ElDiablo14 said:

Did we finish 5th that season?

I can still see Collingwood finishing 5th, I think that is more possible and realistic than them finishing 2nd.

They have two really hard games coming, Sydney at SCG and Carlton potentially playing to stay in the 8.

Collingwood can easily lose both and with their horrid percentage it's like they have half a game handicap compared to the other top 4 contenders.

I guess history has shown anything can happen in Collingwood v Carlton games. 

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2 hours ago, Vipercrunch said:

Who is "we"?  The fans, in which case it is utterly irrelavant if some of the fan base is arrogant and disrespectful, or is "we" the players and coaches, in whch case you have no idea of their attitude.

Melbourne fans bloodletting after a top of the table loss because we are oh so awesome. If you think what fans think is irrelevant then what the [censored] are you doing on here?

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2 minutes ago, rpfc said:

Melbourne fans bloodletting after a top of the table loss because we are oh so awesome. If you think what fans think is irrelevant then what the [censored] are you doing on here?

It’s irrelevant to the outcome’s on the field.  I thought that would be clear…..

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14 hours ago, Scipio said:

Our forward line was such a shambles. And what the hell is with continually kicking it to the same congested pocket, every bloody time? Needs to be sorted out ASAP.

Collingwood's forwards were consistently marking 20m out, no angle... and not just after a coast to coast break.

I reckon that needs to start after the ball is kicked in after a score.

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12 hours ago, rpfc said:

I can see Collingwood’s belief taking them to a Prelim. And from there anything is possible as they found out in 2010 and 2018.

It sounds trite, but god we skipped over earnest and honest enjoyment of footy to arrogant expectation due to 4 games of footy last year - it is so hard to win a flag, let alone repeat and we should respect those that are rising (or hopefully falling - Geelong) more than we do. Collingwood remind me of us in 2018. We were brash and a bit sloppy but hard as nails and willing to work. We beat a hardened Geelong and a Hawthorn team with little left but then were dispatched by a WCE team that respected us enough to destroy us and everything we stood for. 

We need to show that same respect.

Best summation I have read of present circumstances in a while.

I want us to show every other team the respect they deserve, because only then can we play the honest/hard-working footy that would wipe every other team off the ground this year, easily. 

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It's been 2.5 days since the loss. And I'm still burning by this one. By far the most painful loss of the year - compounded by the fact that it was the 2nd loss to the Pies, and that we threw it away.

Make no mistake, for this outcome to happen - we wasted our many, many chances and the Pies played their very, very best. 

I think we're playing decent-good footy right now (certainly better than v Freo/Cats earlier this year), so we're on the up no doubt, but I hope this will burn in our guts for finals, because we may play the Pies again, and they will be buoyed by 2 wins (sort of like our 2 wins against the Cats last year) - so they will be starting with momentum and intense belief, and their manic pressure, so we will have to do just about everything right to reverse the outcome. Which will be perfect, sending the Pies packing. When it counts. 

What we need to get rid of? Easy misses, giggles after easy misses (let's get some footage of Maxy and Co doing some goal kicking drills, lots of them), and handballing to the most under pressure member of the team, 

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1 hour ago, Vipercrunch said:

It’s irrelevant to the outcome’s on the field.  I thought that would be clear…..

Yeah, I write as a blend of fandom and on field. It’s a joy, just enjoy it.

Although we did get a glimpse into our arrogance and condescension with Ed Langdon’s opinion of the opposition as limited, and his confidence of being able to shut off their limited play by proclaiming it to Andrew’s Maher and Gaze.

While I can’t confirm our complacency, I have been seeing it with my lying eyes the entire season; the 10 game winning streak of playing half a game or less, the direction of the coaching staff to not bother with forward pressure (you don’t go from top 4 to last because of anything else) and to just let the opposition to ‘crash against the rocks’ across our half back line…

Do we know what happens to rock when enough water hits it? 

We have been flirting with our form all year for reasons that I can glean but they are reasons that don’t respect our opposition and how hard it is to maintain this kind of form.

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5 minutes ago, rpfc said:

Yeah, I write as a blend of fandom and on field. It’s a joy, just enjoy it.

Although we did get a glimpse into our arrogance and condescension with Ed Langdon’s opinion of the opposition as limited, and his confidence of being able to shut off their limited play by proclaiming it to Andrew’s Maher and Gaze.

While I can’t confirm our complacency, I have been seeing it with my lying eyes the entire season; the 10 game winning streak of playing half a game or less, the direction of the coaching staff to not bother with forward pressure (you don’t go from top 4 to last because of anything else) and to just let the opposition to ‘crash against the rocks’ across our half back line…

Do we know what happens to rock when enough water hits it? 

We have been flirting with our form all year for reasons that I can glean but they are reasons that don’t respect our opposition and how hard it is to maintain this kind of form.

Perhaps there is some truth to that,  but until season is over, I find it very hard to conclude anything.  Form, fitness and perhaps even 100% correct mindset can’t be maintained at the highest or “perfect” level for 6 months.  There have to be fluctuations and perhaps the greatest trick to coaching a team looking to go back-to-back is to manipulate those fluctuations to ensure the team peaks at everything in September.  To do so might mean some seemingly broken things get ignored for long periods, which frustrate us all, but with the aim to make the corrections at the right time to bring everything together at the desired time.   6 weeks to see if the coaches can deliver and get the team playing to its full potential, which I think most Demonlanders think is good enough to win it all.

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like this topic,   we are not far off, but enough not to win the flag.  as Red but Blue said somethings we need to get rid ov

What we need to get rid of? Easy misses, giggles after easy misses (let's get some footage of Max and Co doing some goal kicking drills, lots of them), and handballing to the most under pressure member of the team, 

 

Some pressure acts during the game would help as well

laughing after a missed goal just allows the opposition time and space to move it down their end.   like a training drill,

In the first 10 games we seemed to get in front easily the half way through the second quarter go into cruise mode.

 

I have lost count of the number of times I have yelled at the TV,  replay or live, run, tackle, shepherd, keep it low, or heavin forbid thump 'im into the ground,  doesn't seem to affect the players at all. My dog usually goes and hides or puts his paw on my knee.

Liked what Vipercrunch and RPFC have put as well.

We can play better than Friday night, but I think smarter football is the way to go, Coaching and playing. Why wasn't Harmes given a run, someone must have had a sore leg. He had 2 fresh ones.  FFS.  Its about getting into top 4 then top 2.

 

Go dees     see you on Saturday night

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