COVID & AFL 2021

[Demon17 5,191]

3 hours ago, faultydet said:

Does venting about Alan Jones somehow make up for Dan Andrews shutting down your state?

 

Hoping that Victoria can re-open so all of you guys can see the Grand final live. Vic sure has been hit hard by this thing.

 

Otherwise a Brisbane granny. I would walk down if that's what it took to see the Dees win a flag.

When you live down here (in Vic.) esp. after the last 2 Deta outbreaks, managed effectively for the first time in the world, you actually appreciate Dan Andrews and his team. His decisionfor 8.00pm shutdown yetsreday was first class.

The rest of your post are meaningless platitudes which are of no interest.

Everyone should keep any sort of political claptrap off this site and keep it for the News Corporation Letters pages.(This last comment is clickbait so don't bother responding to the irony)

 

[Superunknown 4,223]

9 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I'm a bit worried about your risk assessment thought processes. You willingly stand outside the Casey ground to watch training (for which we are grateful) even though you know there are snakes in the vicinity.

The number of deaths in Australia from blood clots caused by AZ is 7 out of 7 million doses given, obviously the classic "one in a million". The number of fatalities in NSW from Covid is 76 out of 8.2 million people. That's more than 9 in a million. Are you sure it's worth taking that risk of remaining unvaccinated when an alternative is available? (I appreciate every person's circumstances and individual health profile can vary.)

Oh, and in Australia there is an average of two fatal snake bites per annum. Just something for you to think about.

The data on ITP from AZ is 1/100k to 1/200k it seems

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-safety-report-08-07-2021

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01408-4#article-info

For refernence, motor vehicle death probability 1/25k.

https://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/ongoing/road_deaths_australia_annual_summaries

11/100k in 1993. May be less now.

https://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/[email protected]/2f762f95845417aeca25706c00834efa/96781e47a4d2d886ca2570ec0073f6a9!OpenDocument

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,906]

9 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

The data on ITP from AZ is 1/100k to 1/200k it seems

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-safety-report-08-07-2021

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01408-4#article-info

For refernence, motor vehicle death probability 1/25k.

https://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/ongoing/road_deaths_australia_annual_summaries

11/100k in 1993. May be less now.

https://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/[email protected]/2f762f95845417aeca25706c00834efa/96781e47a4d2d886ca2570ec0073f6a9!OpenDocument

Thanks. If I'm reading it correctly, the data on blood clots showing a rate of 1 case per every 100,000 to 200,000 of doses is total of all cases, including fatal and non-fatal. Is that right?

And as you point out, getting in your car to escape to the country to avoid lockdown is far riskier than getting AZ and staying put.

[bing181 9,328]

1 hour ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Thanks. If I'm reading it correctly, the data on blood clots showing a rate of 1 case per every 100,000 to 200,000 of doses is total of all cases, including fatal and non-fatal. Is that right?

Fatality rate from TTS is falling as doctors etc. become more aware of it and better able to treat it. Rates are approaching 10% from what I've seen: i.e. fatal in 1 in 10 people who get TTS post AZ vaccination. People with more time on their hands than me can compare that to the risk of death from lightning strikes, car accidents or daily aspirin use.

Tragic of course, but Covid takes no prisoners.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,935]

Our commitment to our members is to continue to investigate ways to get as many of you back to the footy as safely as possible, as soon as possible. We have a team working closely with the state governments and health officials on revised plans leading into the finals and beyond - AFL Membership Department

Lip service from the AFL.

[binman 43,714]

4 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

For those who are vaccine connoisseurs (a phrase used to describe vaccine shoppers in Brazil) it seems Moderna is now the favourite.

Similar initial efficacy to Pfizer but after 6 months still at 94% against Pfizer around 84%.

 

I'm double AZ dosed.

But keen to try the full range of options. 

[faultydet 7,619]

2 hours ago, rpfc said:

Can you just give it a rest? Do you realise how you seem? You don’t have to be ‘on’ all the time.

 

I'll make you a deal.

I'll give it a rest when everyone else keeps their opinions to themselves also.

 

Until that day arrives......

Edited August 6, 2021 by faultydet

[daisycutter 29,703]

36 minutes ago, bing181 said:

Fatality rate from TTS is falling as doctors etc. become more aware of it and better able to treat it. Rates are approaching 10% from what I've seen: i.e. fatal in 1 in 10 people who get TTS post AZ vaccination. People with more time on their hands than me can compare that to the risk of death from lightning strikes, car accidents or daily aspirin use.

Tragic of course, but Covid takes no prisoners.

well covid does take prisoners. not everyone who gets covid dies.  some do,  some get long term effects and some are asymptomatic.......just like people who get az and may get tts

just different probabilities

p.s. looking forward to second dose of az next wed

Edited August 6, 2021 by daisycutter

[Slartibartfast 17,518]

3 hours ago, rpfc said:

Can you just give it a rest? Do you realise how you seem? You don’t have to be ‘on’ all the time.

 

I welcome a variety of views and on this thread where people with different views have regularly commented.  It's my option to read and to judge and I like the opportunity to do so.

I support the latest lockdown in Melbourne and I like the fact it was done immediately, previous experience supports acting as quickly as possible. Full marks to the Andrews Government.

But I question why all of country Victoria is in lockdown, that is something worthy of debate and I can see why country Victoria might be of the view that Andrews has shut them down not Covid.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

We should consider ourselves lucky being in a well developed country.  Although i also get the damage being done to small business and sole traders with each lockdown.  Heart breaking for many who are losing their livelihoods.

The recent pic here is pretty confronting.  Mods feel free to remove if you feel the need.

This is a hospital hallway in Columbo Sri Lanka being used as some sort of ward with all beds having been  over run, i have been told their equivalent to say Box Hill Hospital here.

Apparently they have no oxygen, intravenous or any other assistance.  As for intubaters ...well.  

The other pic i have is not postworthy here and shows bodies piled side by side in an ante room as there just isn't enough space in the mortuary area and too many to be picked up by the funeral parlours etc.

Very tough times in many places i'm sure and already have been in the likes of India, Bangladesh etc but Sri Lanka is copping it big time at the moment unfortunately.

Puts our worrying about where finals might be played into a bit of perspective.

[Superunknown 4,223]

1 hour ago, daisycutter said:

well covid does take prisoners. not everyone who gets covid dies.  some do,  some get long term effects and some are asymptomatic.......just like people who get az and may get tts

just different probabilities

p.s. looking forward to second dose of az next wed

 

[Guest]

48 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

We should consider ourselves lucky being in a well developed country.  Although i also get the damage being done to small business and sole traders with each lockdown.  Heart breaking for many who are losing their livelihoods.

The recent pic here is pretty confronting.  Mods feel free to remove if you feel the need.

This is a hospital hallway in Columbo Sri Lanka being used as some sort of ward with all beds having been  over run, i have been told their equivalent to say Box Hill Hospital here.

Apparently they have no oxygen, intravenous or any other assistance.  As for intubaters ...well.  

The other pic i have is not postworthy here and shows bodies piled side by side in an ante room as there just isn't enough space in the mortuary area and too many to be picked up by the funeral parlours etc.

Very tough times in many places i'm sure and already have been in the likes of India, Bangladesh etc but Sri Lanka is copping it big time at the moment unfortunately.

Puts our worrying about where finals might be played into a bit of perspective.

Very sobering. Thank you for posting. And FWIW, I don’t think the mods should remove the pic. 

[dieter 3,325]

6 hours ago, faultydet said:

Facepalm emoji doesn't cover this adequately.

I've noted that a lot of ex-pat Victorians reveal their true selves when they move to Queensland: it ain't a pretty sight.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

5 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Thanks. If I'm reading it correctly, the data on blood clots showing a rate of 1 case per every 100,000 to 200,000 of doses is total of all cases, including fatal and non-fatal. Is that right?

And as you point out, getting in your car to escape to the country to avoid lockdown is far riskier than getting AZ and staying put.

My understanding in Oz (so far) is it is approx 1 in every 73,000 end up either critical in hospital and/or dead.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

5 hours ago, Superunknown said:

The data on ITP from AZ is 1/100k to 1/200k it seems

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-safety-report-08-07-2021

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01408-4#article-info

For refernence, motor vehicle death probability 1/25k.

https://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/ongoing/road_deaths_australia_annual_summaries

11/100k in 1993. May be less now.

https://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/[email protected]/2f762f95845417aeca25706c00834efa/96781e47a4d2d886ca2570ec0073f6a9!OpenDocument

 

5 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Thanks. If I'm reading it correctly, the data on blood clots showing a rate of 1 case per every 100,000 to 200,000 of doses is total of all cases, including fatal and non-fatal. Is that right?

And as you point out, getting in your car to escape to the country to avoid lockdown is far riskier than getting AZ and staying put.

 

3 hours ago, bing181 said:

Fatality rate from TTS is falling as doctors etc. become more aware of it and better able to treat it. Rates are approaching 10% from what I've seen: i.e. fatal in 1 in 10 people who get TTS post AZ vaccination. People with more time on their hands than me can compare that to the risk of death from lightning strikes, car accidents or daily aspirin use.

Tragic of course, but Covid takes no prisoners.

Keep in mind deaths per Vax using AZ rate only takes into account those deaths confirmed as AZ related via official autopsy results.

While we have no way of knowing, certain family members / religions / races may not give consent to autopsy following death.

[daisycutter 29,703]

3 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

My understanding in Oz (so far) is it is approx 1 in every 73,000 end up either critical in hospital and/or dead.

according to covid worldometer....

australia has approx 36,000 covid cases recorded for 36 deaths, so that is a death rate of neatly 1 per 1,000 cases

of course there could be more cases due to untested asympyomatic people but this would be small as most would be picked up for testing via contact tracing

[Jaded No More 68,972]

1 minute ago, daisycutter said:

according to covid worldometer....

australia has approx 36,000 covid cases recorded for 36 deaths, so that is a death rate of neatly 1 per 1,000 cases

of course there could be more cases due to untested asympyomatic people but this would be small as most would be picked up for testing via contact tracing

It also stands the reason that more cases equals more deaths. Hospitals get overwhelmed and people don’t get adequate care. We saw that happen over and over again overseas and that is the greatest fear of our country I think. We don’t want to overwhelm our medical system. It’s also why I think we lock down regional Victoria. They don’t have the hospital capacity to deal with hundreds or even tens of cases needing ICU or ventilation. 

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

17 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

according to covid worldometer....

australia has approx 36,000 covid cases recorded for 36 deaths, so that is a death rate of neatly 1 per 1,000 cases

of course there could be more cases due to untested asympyomatic people but this would be small as most would be picked up for testing via contact tracing

I am referring to the incidents of critical cases or death from TTS following AZ shots in Oz DC

Edited August 6, 2021 by Rusty Nails

[rpfc 28,731]

3 hours ago, faultydet said:

I'll make you a deal.

I'll give it a rest when everyone else keeps their opinions to themselves also.

 

Until that day arrives......

It’s not your POV that grates, it’s the sincere impish thrill you seem to show when you give it. It borders on ‘trolling’ which I don’t want to call Land regulars, and you are a smart member of our community. I just wish you would accept that there are those in your community who have a different view to you and for you to be comfortable with that.

2 hours ago, Baghdad Bob said:

I welcome a variety of views and on this thread where people with different views have regularly commented.  It's my option to read and to judge and I like the opportunity to do so.

I support the latest lockdown in Melbourne and I like the fact it was done immediately, previous experience supports acting as quickly as possible. Full marks to the Andrews Government.

But I question why all of country Victoria is in lockdown, that is something worthy of debate and I can see why country Victoria might be of the view that Andrews has shut them down not Covid.

Without being flippant - I understand you are saying that I shouldn’t be telling people that they are not entitled to their opinion. It’s a turn of phrase - the people that decide what people can post are Andy and the mods.

Yes, I can avoid posters and the thread. I’m off my soapbox, next round is on me (this is a reference to my Demonland as a pub joke).

rp

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, rpfc said:

It’s not your POV that grates, it’s the sincere impish thrill you seem to show when you give it. It borders on ‘trolling’

This is what irks me the most! Not so much what is said as the way in which it is said. Not just this particular poster, but in general. 

[Deestar9 1,647]

2 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

We should consider ourselves lucky being in a well developed country.  Although i also get the damage being done to small business and sole traders with each lockdown.  Heart breaking for many who are losing their livelihoods.

The recent pic here is pretty confronting.  Mods feel free to remove if you feel the need.

This is a hospital hallway in Columbo Sri Lanka being used as some sort of ward with all beds having been  over run, i have been told their equivalent to say Box Hill Hospital here.

Apparently they have no oxygen, intravenous or any other assistance.  As for intubaters ...well.  

The other pic i have is not postworthy here and shows bodies piled side by side in an ante room as there just isn't enough space in the mortuary area and too many to be picked up by the funeral parlours etc.

Very tough times in many places i'm sure and already have been in the likes of India, Bangladesh etc but Sri Lanka is copping it big time at the moment unfortunately.

Puts our worrying about where finals might be played into a bit of perspective.

Interested to understand why you would post pics of 3rd world countries & compare them to a wealthy first world country like Australia. These type of posts are endemic of the “fear” factor we are currently living in & are not helpful or informative!!

[dieter 3,325]

10 minutes ago, Deestar9 said:

Interested to understand why you would post pics of 3rd world countries & compare them to a wealthy first world country like Australia. These type of posts are endemic of the “fear” factor we are currently living in & are not helpful or informative!!

Um, wait till the hospitals are fully loaded to the max. Already there is a case of medics having to sit with a Covid infected patient in the back of an ambulance in Sydney for 7 friging hours before being admitted!!!!

[dieter 3,325]

12 minutes ago, Deestar9 said:

Interested to understand why you would post pics of 3rd world countries & compare them to a wealthy first world country like Australia. These type of posts are endemic of the “fear” factor we are currently living in & are not helpful or informative!!

As to your comparison to a wealthy first first world country, you must never underestimate to capacity that Scomo's Merry Men have to lie and bull****e their way into making us a basket case. From the Ruby Princess onwards, right down to the mythology that at the end of March etc etc etc.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

9 hours ago, Jaded said:

I think Israel is the best case study for Pfizer. It’s struggling against Delta and now they are doing booster shots for over 60s. It looks like Pfizer wears off quicker than AZ. Both are still quite effective in stopping you from getting very sick and dying and that is the main point. We need vaccines so people don’t die or get hospitalized with Covid. People can get mild symptoms and we all move on with our lives because it becomes another type of cold and flu. It’s the fact that so many people get so ill that’s the issue. 
The only benefit of being so far behind our vaccination program here is we are learning what works and what doesn’t from everyone else. There are now studies into mixed vaccinations and booster shots.  I’m sure once we all get two jabs we will need to get a third one next year. Maybe of the same vaccine we’ve already had or maybe of something totally different or new. 
Novanex studies seem really promising on Delta but they are small studies still. 

Latest FDA /CDC advice (rightly or wrongly) says no need for booster shots post 2 vaccine shots at this point in time.

Where are you getting the Pfizer wearing off quicker than AZ evidence from and Pfizer struggling against Delta?  There is prelim evidence that Delta is a fitter virus and efficacy is lower against this variant but my understanding is this is the case with all vaccines to this point (to various degrees of course and the outcomes vary with each study).

My understanding is there is no peer reviewed hard evidence to suggest this albeit some prelim studies are indicating Moderna might be holding a higher efficacy but still very early days and too early to say with any certainty.

It is worth noting that Pfizer is putting together an updated vaccine specific to Delta with trials commencing sometime this month.

There is also prelim evidence (not peer reviewed etc) suggesting that two doses of AZ followed by an mRNA booster is producing some amazing efficacy results, even against the delta variant.

Edited August 6, 2021 by Rusty Nails

[Deestar9 1,647]

8 minutes ago, dieter said:

As to your comparison to a wealthy first first world country, you must never underestimate to capacity that Scomo's Merry Men have to lie and bull****e their way into making us a basket case. From the Ruby Princess onwards, right down to the mythology that at the end of March etc etc etc.

Really…seem to have forgotten that 802 people died here in Victoria… whose watch was that on. Don’t bother replying…there is absolutely no justification or excuses for the pain that 802 families went through & would be still going through. Now back to footy talk !!