Training Ground?

[Giles 181]

I’ve been wondering for years why this club has had no success for such a long time. This club doesn’t have a home. Where is our social club? The kids don’t know where the team trains. The players don't know where the kids are. They players don't have to look the kids in the eye after their last performance. If we won a flag, where would we take the Cup? Where would the family celebration be? We're the only club in the AFL without a home training ground and a heartland. We gave it up in the 80s. Simply, we don’t have a home and home is where the heart is. We have no heart.　

[Adam The God 30,221]

On 5/23/2020 at 9:26 PM, ding said:

Chairman Dan could get his Chinese mates to whip us up a new island base as part of their Honorable investment into the Great Peoples Republic of Danistan. Im told they have some recent experience making islands.

 

His Chinese mates are only in play because Costello and Howard let all those multinationals take billions of mining profits off shore, which has left the Federal Government refusing to co finance basic infrastructure projects with the state governments because it claims it doesn't have the money. So the state governments, McGowan, Andrews and Berejiklian are all co financing with AIIB, where China has the majority ruling. I don't agree with taking the money but where else should they get it when our own Federal government refuses to co finance Australian infrastructure projects?

As for the MFC base, it won't get done in the MCG precinct. I think we have to look back at commercial property in South Eastern suburbs.

[ding 5,126]

41 minutes ago, A F said:

His Chinese mates are only in play because Costello and Howard let all those multinationals take billions of mining profits off shore, which has left the Federal Government refusing to co finance basic infrastructure projects with the state governments because it claims it doesn't have the money. So the state governments, McGowan, Andrews and Berejiklian are all co financing with AIIB, where China has the majority ruling. I don't agree with taking the money but where else should they get it when our own Federal government refuses to co finance Australian infrastructure projects?

As for the MFC base, it won't get done in the MCG precinct. I think we have to look back at commercial property in South Eastern suburbs.

Bit slow off the mark AF.

Do you think China will be so happy to help out Australian States now after ScMo announced we will give safe haven to over 10k citizens of Hong Kong? Yeah, it will cost our economy, but i am really happy that my country is standing up to an arrogant, authoritarian CCP.

Approaching $1T in debt, i NOW say we take Chinas money, and when the [censored] hits the fan, claim it as reparations. Conflict is almost certainly coming, and coming soon. CCP is picking fights with the entire democratic world atm. Eventually someone will accept the invite. Its the nature of humanity. must keep them away from power generation and anything to do with communications. Xi just cannot be trusted.

 

 

If our club survives, i will be satisfied with a modern home base practically anywhere. Beggars cant be choosers.

Edited July 9, 2020 by ding

[Adam The God 30,221]

1 hour ago, ding said:

Bit slow off the mark AF.

Do you think China will be so happy to help out Australian States now after ScMo announced we will give safe haven to over 10k citizens of Hong Kong? Yeah, it will cost our economy, but i am really happy that my country is standing up to an arrogant, authoritarian CCP.

Approaching $1T in debt, i NOW say we take Chinas money, and when the [censored] hits the fan, claim it as reparations. Conflict is almost certainly coming, and coming soon. CCP is picking fights with the entire democratic world atm. Eventually someone will accept the invite. Its the nature of humanity. must keep them away from power generation and anything to do with communications. Xi just cannot be trusted.

If our club survives, i will be satisfied with a modern home base practically anywhere. Beggars cant be choosers.

Only just saw it mate. 

And Morrison's clearly intent on killing the economy. Since the Libs took over in 2013, they doubled all national debt since Federation (since Federation!) in 6 years, in strong economic conditions. But you'd never know it because Costello runs Channel 9 and The Age, Murdoch still has the largest circulation of newspapers and Sky News, the ABC has been gutted (turning into the Government's mouthpiece as Tony Abbott said they should be), Channel 10 have Joe Hilderbrand (need I say more) and 7 West Media may as well be the official mouthpiece of Gladys' State Government.

There's multiple instances where countries have defaulted on loans and the CCP have stepped in (see Sri Lanka), which is why Andrew Robb's deal for the Darwin Port to his new Chinese company that he sat on the board of was so traitorous. 

But in terms of our club, in the short to medium term (the next decade), we'll survive because there's money at stake and the AFL is a multi billion dollar business. But in the long term... unless we start winning, I don't think we'll survive.

Edited July 9, 2020 by A F

[Diamond_Jim 12,569]

are we going for a training ground in Beijing? Could be an easier get than the MCG precinct

There's always a bright side...Kochie's China plans aren't looking good

[deebug 1,754]

12 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

are we going for a training ground in Beijing? Could be an easier get than the MCG precinct

There's always a bright side...Kochie's China plans aren't looking good

Not and less we plan to change to the water polo demons?

[Diamond_Jim 12,569]

Recent article by Caroline Wilson linking the Bomber's woes to their move to Tullamarine away from Windy Hill.

Not sure I agree with her attempted conclusions but it is an alternative view. For example she questions the Hawks' move to Dingley but lauds their earlier move to Waverley as a masterstroke.

"That Essendon have ended a crisis-ridden season in a crisis of their own making is beyond dispute. And while this unfolding predicament is man-made it's worth revisiting once again the Bombers' ill-fated decision to abandon their spiritual home and move to an isolated new base at Tullamarine......

Boasting a footprint double the size of Windy Hill, the cavernous Hangar, futuristic fittings and fixtures, an MCG-sized training oval and one the dimension of Marvel Stadium has not exactly spelt success for the Essendon Football Club."

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/bombers-lost-their-soul-with-their-move-from-windy-hill-20201008-p563e6.html

Edited October 13, 2020 by Diamond_Jim

[3183 Dee 2,853]

6 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Recent article by Caroline Wilson linking the Bomber's woes to their move to Tullamarine away from Windy Hill.

Not sure I agree with her attempted conclusions but it is an alternative view.

"That Essendon have ended a crisis-ridden season in a crisis of their own making is beyond dispute. And while this unfolding predicament is man-made it's worth revisiting once again the Bombers' ill-fated decision to abandon their spiritual home and move to an isolated new base at Tullamarine......

Boasting a footprint double the size of Windy Hill, the cavernous Hangar, futuristic fittings and fixtures, an MCG-sized training oval and one the dimension of Marvel Stadium has not exactly spelt success for the Essendon Football Club."

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/bombers-lost-their-soul-with-their-move-from-windy-hill-20201008-p563e6.html

Could be something in it - like the Saints’ return to Moorabbin.

Conversely, if our new hub is in the MCG precinct, we should be on a fast-track to Premiership glory!

[Half forward flank 1,022]

7 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Recent article by Caroline Wilson linking the Bomber's woes to their move to Tullamarine away from Windy Hill.

Not sure I agree with her attempted conclusions but it is an alternative view.

"That Essendon have ended a crisis-ridden season in a crisis of their own making is beyond dispute. And while this unfolding predicament is man-made it's worth revisiting once again the Bombers' ill-fated decision to abandon their spiritual home and move to an isolated new base at Tullamarine......

Boasting a footprint double the size of Windy Hill, the cavernous Hangar, futuristic fittings and fixtures, an MCG-sized training oval and one the dimension of Marvel Stadium has not exactly spelt success for the Essendon Football Club."

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/bombers-lost-their-soul-with-their-move-from-windy-hill-20201008-p563e6.html

Deadly silence on our proposals. 

[Diamond_Jim 12,569]

7 minutes ago, 3183 Dee said:

Could be something in it - like the Saints’ return to Moorabbin.

Conversely, if our new hub is in the MCG precinct, we should be on a fast-track to Premiership glory!

As we haven't had a home for thirty plus years it's hard to see where we fit. The article seems to be more about the big multi function corporate structure and the physical location vs history. She seems to ignore the advantages offered by indoor training facilities.pools etc.

The club stuff could have been dealt with better by replicating the Windy Hill trophy room or similar perhaps. Tullamarine is fast becoming the Waverley of the North as the suburbs such as Gisborne, Sunbury etc grow ever larger so I wouldn't call it outer Melbourne. (And of course it's a lot closer than Casey).

[george_on_the_outer 7,590]

Absolute piece of rubbish from Wilson. 

Essendon stay at Windy Hill and all their mis-demeanours would never have occurred?  Move from a sub-standard training facility to probably the best in the league and that caused them to stray to the dark side? 

[TeamPlayedFine39 8,503]

It's a huge stretch  by Wilson.
Google maps puts it 15 minutes drive down the road, yet she's described it as 'isolated'.
There was zero room for expansion at Windy Hill and can't be compared to the Saints move to a truly isolated location at Seaford.

 

 

[old dee 23,787]

4 minutes ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

It's a huge stretch  by Wilson.
Google maps puts it 15 minutes drive down the road, yet she's described it as 'isolated'.
There was zero room for expansion at Windy Hill and can't be compared to the Saints move to a truly isolated location at Seaford.

 

 

There was if the bowls club had given up there site and moved else where but they refused. So the FC moved out. Have been there for Casey games over the last few years I can easily see why they moved. 

[old dee 23,787]

1 hour ago, Half forward flank said:

Deadly silence on our proposals. 

In this covivd year of 2020 there is no government money for a silver tail club when we cannot even get the city working again. Imagine the wails of complaint if the government suddenly came with $10mill. For the MFC. Won't happen for another few years.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,753]

1 hour ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Recent article by Caroline Wilson linking the Bomber's woes to their move to Tullamarine away from Windy Hill.

Not sure I agree with her attempted conclusions but it is an alternative view. For example she questions the Hawks' move to Dingley but lauds their earlier move to Waverley as a masterstroke.

"That Essendon have ended a crisis-ridden season in a crisis of their own making is beyond dispute. And while this unfolding predicament is man-made it's worth revisiting once again the Bombers' ill-fated decision to abandon their spiritual home and move to an isolated new base at Tullamarine......

Boasting a footprint double the size of Windy Hill, the cavernous Hangar, futuristic fittings and fixtures, an MCG-sized training oval and one the dimension of Marvel Stadium has not exactly spelt success for the Essendon Football Club."

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/bombers-lost-their-soul-with-their-move-from-windy-hill-20201008-p563e6.html

Generally, I think Caroline Wilson's articles are pretty good. They are clearly opinion pieces rather than factual reporting, but that's OK because it's clear from the outset that that is her stock-in-trade. This article, though, is poor. It's full of individual points which she has tried to meld into a cohere whole. It's as if she was joining the dots of an elephant (a white one) and managed to draw a vacant space instead.

[TeamPlayedFine39 8,503]

38 minutes ago, old dee said:

There was if the bowls club had given up there site and moved else where but they refused. So the FC moved out. Have been there for Casey games over the last few years I can easily see why they moved. 

And good on the bowls club for standing their ground under what would have been immense pressure. 

 

[Diamond_Jim 12,569]

46 minutes ago, old dee said:

There was if the bowls club had given up there site and moved else where but they refused. So the FC moved out. Have been there for Casey games over the last few years I can easily see why they moved. 

Agree..the Bowls club land might have given them room for a pool and a gym but not much else 

She lauds the Richmond setup whereas I think it's a cobbled together solution made better somewhat by the surrounding parkland.

The one area I would like to see explored is shared facilities with the likes of Collingwood, Richmond or Carlton. The big land item are the ovals (two seems to be the requirement) which could be used on alternate days or on a morning/afternoon roster. Same with the indoor training facility.Two gyms (they are not big space requirements) and two admin areas.

As an aside people do not realise how lucky we were to have the old Board of Works (MMBW). The CEO in the time of Bolte was a guy called Croxford. The authority was as rich as Croesus and the story is told that if Croxford saw some spare land near a river or creek he would zone it or buy it. He locked the land off from the public and it was only opened up in the early seventies but without his "misguided" foresight we wouldn't have the fantastic river parks we have today.

(of course Kennett saw the landbank along with that owned by the SEC ad flogged a lot of it off.)

 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Diamond_Jim

[BDA 22,743]

2 hours ago, 3183 Dee said:

Could be something in it - like the Saints’ return to Moorabbin.

Conversely, if our new hub is in the MCG precinct, we should be on a fast-track to Premiership glory!

worked for Richmond

[old dee 23,787]

29 minutes ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

And good on the bowls club for standing their ground under what would have been immense pressure. 

 

The problem is Bowls clubs are dying by the month in Australia. Some of them sit on very valuable plots of land. I can see the time not too far into future were there will be not a need for the Essendon Bowls club. To fund these projects you need Government help either State and or Federal. That I believe will be very difficult this decade after the Covid effects. Unfortunately we are seen as silver tails so getting a labour government already with problems up to their eye balls  to make payments to the MFC looks very unlikely to me. It is not helped of course by our set in concrete desire to have the facility near the MCG. Any project in that area is a big money item due to the complexity and cost of it. I believe we are just going to have to suck it up with what we have at present and just concentrate on winning games. In the end winning games fixes most problems.

[old dee 23,787]

3 minutes ago, Better days ahead said:

worked for Richmond

How? They have a team of good players that's what wins games not Wether you have a base near the MCG. They had that base for the previous 20 years and were cellar dwellers.

[BDA 22,743]

7 minutes ago, old dee said:

How? They have a team of good players that's what wins games not Wether you have a base near the MCG. They had that base for the previous 20 years and were cellar dwellers.

You’re right.  I was being a little flippant in my previous response.  

Success depends ultimately on people. IF you’ve good people involved you’ll get success. I think that’s where Essendon have gone wrong (and indeed ourselves in the past).  Richmond, West coast, Geelong, Hawthorn even Collingwood (as much as I dislike Eddie) always have quality people involved.

[Older demon 2,741]

58 minutes ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

And good on the bowls club for standing their ground under what would have been immense pressure. 

 

Sorry Old Dee this is no ordinary bowls club but agree many blows clubs are struggling. It is no no surprise that this bowls club refused as they are huge. They have a massive bar and their function room is enormous with a stage. I have been to a 70th there and then another birthday on a Sunday with the Herberts playing and the place was packed. Bands regularly play there Sundays pre COVID and the club is an institution and used all year around. The footy club misjudged that one when they took on the bowls club. In addition it is very much suburbia and I doubt the residents would agree to a larger oval with a huge hangar and all the other stuff at their new location. 

Some learning for MFC there is a difference between a training facility and a home and place for members to visit. If you locateg too far away it creates a problem. The trouble with trying to build a sports facility exclusively for footy in the inner city area is it isn't used enough. Multi function/sports facility the only way to go. For all its criticism AAMI park houses MGC, Storm and Victory with all 3 clubs sharing

 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Older demon

[Half forward flank 1,022]

49 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Agree..the Bowls club land might have given them room for a pool and a gym but not much else 

She lauds the Richmond setup whereas I think it's a cobbled together solution made better somewhat by the surrounding parkland.

The one area I would like to see explored is shared facilities with the likes of Collingwood, Richmond or Carlton. The big land item are the ovals (two seems to be the requirement) which could be used on alternate days or on a morning/afternoon roster. Same with the indoor training facility.Two gyms (they are not big space requirements) and two admin areas.

As an aside people do not realise how lucky we were to have the old Board of Works (MMBW). The CEO in the time of Bolte was a guy called Croxford. The authority was as rich as Croesus and the story is told that if Croxford saw some spare land near a river or creek he would zone it or buy it. He locked the land off from the public and it was only opened up in the early seventies but without his "misguided" foresight we wouldn't have the fantastic river parks we have today.

(of course Kennett saw the landbank along with that owned by the SEC ad flogged a lot of it off.)

 

I think your idea has merit, however I would suggest sharing with a minor partner like a amatuer or VFL Club. There must be Clubs struggling financially struggling financially and sitting on good ovals and parking facilities. Elsternick was one of those options but it has closed with the development of the wetlands on the adjacement golf course and further development of a second oval and facilities. To make it work you need to have something to give the council and ratepayers such as community facilities, meeting rooms, creches and the like. 

[dazzledavey36 54,866]

I wanted to bring this back up on the AGM thread as it was an active discussion around our training base. As it stands the men's will be training out at Casey for the year. I've had my own opinion about this and I've felt that this simply cannot be a viable long term option because one of the key reason will be the struggle of attracting future recruits because of the distance etc. I have reasons but a lot have already covered it off in thr AGM thread.

Interesting I was reading an article on Shaun McKernan just then and found this bit interesting around our obvious interest in him last year. Now I'm not saying that I'm spewing we missed out on him etc, but I do worry that by trying to attract big name players, this could be one of the key hurdles that may potentially effect us.

He had a choice of his third AFL club, with Melbourne also showing interest in McKernan at the end of last season.

He said the call to pick the Saints was ultimately based around location, with McKernan reluctant to travel every day from his home in Greenvale to the Dees’ base at Casey Fields.

“It wasn’t anything to do with Melbourne. I had a pretty good chat with Goody [coach Simon Goodwin]

“I told him it’s got nothing to do with where the club’s at, just really a personal decision.”

[daisycutter 29,613]

On 3/7/2021 at 1:20 PM, dazzledavey36 said:

I wanted to bring this back up on the AGM thread as it was an active discussion around our training base. As it stands the men's will be training out at Casey for the year. I've had my own opinion about this and I've felt that this simply cannot be a viable long term option because one of the key reason will be the struggle of attracting future recruits because of the distance etc. I have reasons but a lot have already covered it off in thr AGM thread.

Interesting I was reading an article on Shaun McKernan just then and found this bit interesting around our obvious interest in him last year. Now I'm not saying that I'm spewing we missed out on him etc, but I do worry that by trying to attract big name players, this could be one of the key hurdles that may potentially effect us.

He had a choice of his third AFL club, with Melbourne also showing interest in McKernan at the end of last season.

He said the call to pick the Saints was ultimately based around location, with McKernan reluctant to travel every day from his home in Greenvale to the Dees’ base at Casey Fields.

“It wasn’t anything to do with Melbourne. I had a pretty good chat with Goody [coach Simon Goodwin]

“I told him it’s got nothing to do with where the club’s at, just really a personal decision.”

dazzle, where did you get it that we will be stuck at casey all year?

i just thought it was temporary and the guys would get back to gosch's before too long