POSTGAME: Rd 09 vs West Coast

[Brownie 5,969]

2 hours ago, Deestar9 said:

In a prelim final...i saw in person our team get thrashed and humiliated.  Tonight on the couch I saw a very young team who pretty much had travelled from the Gold Coast with a stop over in Melb to pick up a few players head onto Perth and play 6 days later.  With most predictions of thrashing’s and mental scarring ...we got a team that played three and a half quarters, but inexperience and lack of class just showed in the end.  We were by far the better team and I was pretty happy with Petty and Baker ...the continued form of Lockhart and Hore, def Max’s best game and also thought Brayshaw, Oliver, Hunt, Harmes and T McDonald continued to also improve.  Frost and O McDonald were def not disgraced and others that are probably not best 22 but because of injury are in the team....were probably the difference between winning and losing.  If we hadn’t had such a bad start to the season we would have probably been quite happy with the result.   There were some appalling umpiring decisions and some appalling shots on goals but whilst i am extremely disappointed I am also extremely excited.  

 

 

ou

Great post.

It maybe too late for the season but we played some fantastic footy.

Fix our forward entries (And Traccs brain) and we'll be flying again.

Hore is a great find. Really composed.

Gawns ruck work was brilliant.

Still love Frosty and the way his season is building. That one handed Guernsey shred tackle was brilliant.

Hunt is finally in the right spot.

Fritsch should probably be up there too.

Go Dees.

 

[Aus in Engerland 75]

1 hour ago, pitmaster said:

Ling says he will cop one week.

And it was a two goal turnaround!

I think Margetts was the fraud who called it...anyone confirm?

Remember that Margetts is a Freo supporter who hates WC, so it wouldn't have been a deliberate decision. His mother was a Fremantle politician and his partner is one of the Fyfe clan.

Jetta will get  a week. Seems the standard for that.

[Fanatique Demon 2,642]

Brayshaw doesn't even look interested.

[zeldacat 53]

Who is our kicking coach.. just asking for a friend..

[DeeSpencer 25,472]

Gawn dominated. Harmes and Oliver led the stream through the midfield. Rag tag defenders more often than not for 3/4's held up. Forward line created space at times, competed hard at others and pressured well.

If Tommy Mc was in anything like his best form or if Petracca or Garlett wouldn't go to water mentally or physically the forwards would've put up a winning score by 3/4 time.

Eventually the backline will improve and develop chemistry between the good players, which will cut down so many easy goals.
There were still a ridiculous number of Frost specials:
- running 30m off Kennedy to go up to Hickey 70m out with other defenders converging on the ruck
- the goal line stuff
- some crazy turnovers

Not to mention Oscar turning a great first half in to more of his usual stuff - he's the one who should've occupied space at the drop of the ball to stop Ryan's mark. Throw in Petty who's super raw, Wagner who's going ok but limited and Fritsch who really should be on a wing and it's a miracle they did as well as they did.

Disappointing night if the plan was to win and get back in to finals contention. A pretty decent night if the plan is to use this year to have a good look at players and build a more sustainable defensive game plan.

[DV8 2,271]

Demon woes...   Rnd 9

 

Let me say I think this was our best effort so far this season. even though we cam away minus the points.

I think it was our best shape,   and best flow.     BUT we leave so much left behind every match.

 

Far too many players only play parts of the game and stop.

Let me look at just tackling for an example, with some stats.

https://finalsiren.com/MatchDetails.asp?GameID=8147&Code=bd1702eee047aec8033d7ee99c1a14f6&Sort=Tackles Desc

 

Check those with the least tackles.  bottom third of this list...  don't worry about our defenders so much,  as they have yo keep their feet...  cannot afford to go to ground.

So I'm really looking at our Mids and Half-forwards, and generally forwards.

 

Fritta,   0 tackles...  not good enough Fritta, your a 2nd year player...  bruise-free isn't the future,  its the past.

Hunt,  1 tackle,  Your big enough and quick enough to run down Oppo players, Jayden.  You've got to have 3 or 4 tackles in you,  Per game ???

Petracca,  1 tackle,   Plays like Jane.  Christian, your like Milton the monster...  Although one passage of play when you got angry... you showed what you've kept hidden. a powerful build unused...  have to work harder defensively and your build should be crunching tackles on Opponents...   at least 4 Per game, minimum.

Lockhart,  1 tackle,  not good enough for a running mids to only get one tackle.

Neal-Bullen,  1 tackle,   Same as above, Nibbler... wheres your aggression hiding ?

Baker,  1 tackle,    1st gamer,  has some strength...  has to be good for 3 tackles a game minimum

Garlett,  2 tackles,    You've got to get more Jeffy. chasing down opponents.

Brayshaw,  2 tackles,  Not enough Gus... Have to be more accountable, and both ways...  kicking,  and defending.

 

Surely these guys can do more over 100 minutes of a game.?

 

Maxy had 4 tackles, common Maxy...  your got things round about. 

Don't tackle so much Ol Son...  but you only took 2 Marks...  for the whole game....  this us where you should be trying for domination...  holding your ground and body shape,  and landing on feet.

Taking Marks Maxy...  this is where you'll help your team Go Far.  can't fault the rest of your top game tonight.    Marks Marks Marks,  Max.

 

IMO,  all this   ^  ^  ^   is about workload, and Mindset.  and a focus on where you can help your team-mates to be WINNERS.

 

.

Edited May 17, 2019 by DV8

[Fanatique Demon 2,642]

4 hours ago, A F said:

Talk about typical Melbourne. Only Melbourne turns what should have been a 6 or 7 goal (minimum) victory into a loss.

Our kicking in front of goal was pathetic. Absolutely pathetic.

I can't recall Petracca ever snapping a goal or kicking a goal around his body. He missed an absolute soda in the third to go with his under 12 miss in the first 5 minutes of the game. Great that he's getting it, but by missing shots, he's undermining all our hard work. Practice your set-shot kicking.

Tom McDonald needs to do the same. His snap from the pocket was not AFL standard.

Baker was okay in his debut, but struggled with the pace at times. But he's a better option than Stretch IMO. It's an indictment on our outside mid stocks that he's still getting a game. I don't want to be mean to Billy, because he seems like a real trier and I don't think the yo-yoing selection he's faced in the last 2-3 seasons has helped his development, but we can surely see he's not going to make it now.

And I'd love to be able to see what everyone sees in Fritsch, but I'm sorry, his lone asset of skill now alludes him too. Turnover merchant.

As for our leadership, it'd be easy to say that we have a lack of it, but I don't think it's as simple as that. Gawn was for the most part brilliant tonight and Viney tried hard, but needs to play to his limitations more often. But I want to point out something Jones did tonight that for mine, turned the momentum of the game.

It's nearing the end of the third quarter. We've dominated most of the game and are 19 points up. We fail to capitalise on a forward foray and it pings up the other end and there's a stoppage. Our almost 300 game co-captain stands Shuey at the stoppage in our defensive 50. The ball is about to be bounced and Shuey jogs to the other side of the contest. Jones fails to see this and is caught ball-watching. West Coast win it, Shuey is standing by himself as Jones is still ball-watching, and Shuey kicks a relatively easy goal from a defensive stoppage. A goal we should never concede. If it were a first or second year player, you might be able to cop it, but there are not many players with Jones' experience that would switch off like that or lack the game sense in that moment like he did.

This closed the gap to 13 points and the Eagles propelled forward again and managed to get another shot on the siren that Sheed missed. It's embarrassing to call Jones a champion of our club. He's no Flower. He's no Lyon. He's no Neitz. He's no Schwarz. Leadership-wise, James McDonald was a mile ahead of him. Nathan has been a loyal servant who we could say wore the jumper with care in very dark times for us. Constantly putting him up on a pedestal is lovely, but it's sentimental for sentimentality's sake.

On the positive side, our ball movement at times mirrored 2018 and we played with dare and a dash. It was terrific to see. Particularly, in the first three quarters.

We also set up defensively really well and we stopped West Coast from switching the ball too easily.

I thought Petty was quite impressive in 1v1s, despite occasionally getting caught in transition.

Salem was again a stand out. His tackling was a real feature. 

I'm liking what Hunt is bringing to our forward half, but he, like the rest of the forwards, needs to continue to work on his goal-kicking from set shots. That said, he's been pretty good from set shots this year.

Harmes has become a proper mid. He's on the cusp of A grade now IMO. He's almost as important to stoppage wins as Oliver. But WTF has happened to Brayshaw?!

Anyway, that was the inevitable nail in the coffin for our 2019 season. You watch us win 7 or 8 games now (GWS, Freo, Lions, Carlton, Dogs, St Kilda, Sydney and North) and finish 12th or so and miss out on a top 5 draft pick that we could really do with to strengthen our forwardline or midfield.

Great post. I agree with you 100%. 

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,772]

3 hours ago, Fanatique Demon said:

Brayshaw doesn't even look interested.

Thought he was much better than last few weeks

[Deemania since 56 6,608]

7 hours ago, Deecisive said:

fritch and salem both turned the ball over. i liked frost and oscar both did pretty well. shame our forwards cannot kick straight, or mark, or tackle, or chase, or handball

Fritsch is a forward. He is not a backman. His turnovers are way too expensive. Very low percentage of effective disposals, I'm afraid. However, in front of the sticks, he can kick 'em. Get him down there, Goodwin. 

[Cards13 9,117]

That could have been a season/career/club defining win... lots of positives but it’s like dancing with your sister. I said in game day the club needs to sort out its goal kicking ASAP and on reflection the goal kicking will cost us games/finals and potentially winning a flag.

It’s such a killer when we have a young team in playing really well only for poor delivery into fwd and then disgracefully missing so many easy shots on goal. 

[Forest Demon 4,681]

Best performance of the year, but ultimately we threw 4 points in the bin. In terms of the season, it is now officially make or break, need to win 2 of the next 3 against GWS, Adelaide and Collingwood, and then go on a run after the bye against Brisbane, Freo, Carlton and Footscray. Otherwise, start putting some players in cotton wool and prepare for 2020.

[pineapple dee 2,892]

Who is the guy in the middle of the demonland banner ? He might be alright. Let's put him in next week.

[Lucifers Hero 39,597]

A bit surprised so many on here are bagging so many of our players for mistakes.  It was a fast, high pressure game and mistakes will happen.  And, how many players did we have with more than 100 games experience? 3 maybe 4.   With a bit more experience, Petty would have been animated that he touched the ball, giving the umpire enough doubt to not call it a goal straight off.  With a bit more experience, Smith may have played on and kicked the goal rather than stand there waiting.  With a bit more experience... you get my drift.  But we aren't experienced so lets factor that into our reactions. 

Each and every one of our players played their hearts out for four full quarters!  That is enough for me to look forward to games and enjoy the rest of the season.  We won't make finals but by golly we will have a big say in the shape of the final 8.  Go Dees!

Edited May 17, 2019 by Lucifer's Hero

[leave it to deever 17,511]

7 hours ago, Robot Devil said:

Liam Ryan accidentally kicked Max in the face taking that huge mark.

Nathan Vardy showed his true character in one fleeting moment by pushing Max whilst he was down.

I pity Vardy, and I will make a point to mention that moment whenever his name comes up. 

And cheered by a feral crowd.

[Red and Blue realist 2,051]

7 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I’m just completely baffled that Hickey was a late in for the Eagles and then he starts at the first centre bounce of the game.

I know Gawn dominated all night, but it was obvious Vardy was never going to go up against Gawn. Gawn would have finished with 70 hit outs.

Preuss should have played, although I did admire Smith’s endeavour tonight.

Smith kept McGovern really quite for the first 3 quarters but he dominated the last when he could roam free. Think goody actually made the right call, can't help Smith going down. 

[Lucifers Hero 39,597]

I foreshadowed in the Pre Game thread that we needed to control Yeo and Shuey who are the supply lines to their fwds.  Instead, they stopped us dead in our tracks with 16 and 12 tackles respectively!  What's more we let them have a free run at the ball with 10 and 11 uncontested possessions, respectively. 

WCE momentum in the last was built on Yeo and Shuey's work.  We were 3 goals up in a very low scoring game just before 3/4 time. We needed to shut them down then and there to help protect our lead.  We didn't. Paid the price.

6 goals to 1 in the last qtr says it all!  Yes, a couple were from frees not paid but imv we should have gone ultra defensive in the last which would have stopped some of their easy ball movement to goals.

Edited May 17, 2019 by Lucifer's Hero

[Dr.D 1,771]

6 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

I foreshadowed in the Pre Game thread that we needed to tag and stop Yeo and Shuey who are the supply lines to their fwds.  Well, they stopped us dead in our tracks with 16 and 12 tackles respectively!  What's more we let them have a free run at the ball with 10 and 11 uncontested possessions, respectively. 

WCE momentum in the last was built on their work.  We were 3 goals up in a very low scoring game just before 3/4 time.  We needed to shut Yeo and Shuey down then and there to help protect our lead.  We didn't.  Paid the price.

Dude, tackle numbers are not much to read into. you get tackles credited for just lying on top of the pack before the ump call for a ball up.

our midfield smashed theirs all game. goal kicking was the sole reason we lost. and a bit of the umpiring.

[GCDee 3,199]

Not sure if this has been mentioned in another thread but did anyone hear the WCE players yell out "Melbourne are [censored]" as they were singing the song whilst knowingly getting filmed..? 

What a fantastic bunch of role models these guys are.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/2207848796/permalink/10157996405988797/

Seriously what a bunch of absolute tossers. I would be so embarrassed of our club did that after a win.

[Dr.D 1,771]

47 minutes ago, Cards13 said:

That could have been a season/career/club defining win... lots of positives but it’s like dancing with your sister. I said in game day the club needs to sort out its goal kicking ASAP and on reflection the goal kicking will cost us games/finals and potentially winning a flag.

It’s such a killer when we have a young team in playing really well only for poor delivery into fwd and then disgracefully missing so many easy shots on goal. 

I think the only disgrace is the fact that you mentioned the flag! jesus christ!  we've been a bottom 4 team this season. completely uncompetitive against some very average teams. the season was stuffed at round 5 and you're talking about flags. we're a laughing stock at the moment.  last night maybe earned a bit of respect, but that'll last a week.

[shorty 233]

Likes;  Hore, Hunt, Petty, Baker, Harmes, Smith, Garlett ,Gawn

Dislikes: our set shots , Oliver hit the scoreboard, Petracca ball drop from the heavens. Umpires , Brayshaw looks sulky not in the midfield.

Over its; Billy the Butcher, last kick into the fwds, ANB gets in the way.

Want to sees; Salem and Fritz play further up the ground.

???????  we have alot of defenders if Lever and May fit.

I was proud of the effort , their class in front of goals was the difference. Game should have been over at 3/4 time. We still lack X factor and polish.

Edited May 17, 2019 by shorty

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,772]

They didn't do a lot but I thought both Baker and Petty looked like they were up to the level

[Nasher 33,607]

It should be illegal to tackle a player to the ground pinning both arms. I know there’s the dangerous/sling provision, but that specific one should be covered. There’s no reason to pin both arms, you already prevent legal disposal by pinning only one arm, and it is obviously very dangerous as it prevents the player from being able to break the fall.

If we have to have a bloody rules committee farting around with the rules every year, they should be focusing on rules that are unclear or not sufficiently  ensuring player safety, rather than ones that change the look of the game in whatever whimsical way some executives think it should have.

[Lucifers Hero 39,597]

37 minutes ago, Dr.D said:

Dude, tackle numbers are not much to read into. you get tackles credited for just lying on top of the pack before the ump call for a ball up.

our midfield smashed theirs all game. goal kicking was the sole reason we lost. and a bit of the umpiring.

I know how tackles are counted but if that is all you can see in Yeo's and Shuey's games then you have missed a key factor.  And, how many on here wax lyrical when Oliver has huge tackle numbers.  It has to work both ways.

Sure if we had kicked straight we may have won and some non-decisions by umpires cost us. 

Nonethelss, the score was 7 goals to 1 from the last few minutes of the 3rd quarter and in the last qtr they took 27 to 14 marks and ramped up their attacking game but we didn't ramp up our defence.  imv that is where we lost but each to their own opinion.

We were well beaten, from the 25 min mark of the 3rd.  

Edited May 17, 2019 by Lucifer's Hero

[stranga 328]

7 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

Still a basketballer trying his best to play footy IMO.  Shows promise and glimpses but if you can't kick the simple goals or play the percentages often enough then you are effectively wasted as a forward and shouldn't play there.

Play the season out as an inside / outside mid replacing Jones who takes over Tracc's present role up forward.  If Tracc cant get it going and/or start hitting the scoreboard more often (assuming Goody refuses to recognise Tracc forward is a fail!) then subject to a decent trade deal, i would have to agree.  Time to get some decent value while it's still potentially there.

The problem is he has no tank or workrate so can't play midfield. He can't kick and has no pace. Misses easy goals that turn games. Enough is enough be has to go back to Casey and then be traded.  It may not be until Hannan van come in and replace him fwd.

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

9 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Eddie McGuire is filthy on the non decision on the dangerous tackle on Smith.

He plainly didn’t hear the ‘play on’ call and didn’t want to give away a 50 (when he could otherwise have a had a shot at goal), then gets sling tackled into the turf without any resistance (bloke should get a week for that), Smith’s pretty well knocked out, and they get the free. Seriously ...

We were the better team. Loved the effort. Loved the game style. Loved some of the return to form from key players, eg, TMac, Hunt, bursts from Jeffy etc. Loved the performance of the new kids wearing the red and the blue.

Hated our woeful set shot kicking. Hated the umpiring. Hated the Weagles supporters (they make NRL Bulldog supporters look positively enlightened). Hated Nathan Vardy - he should be suspended for his lack of class. And still hate the fact that we lost a game that we could have, perhaps should have, won.

Not sure how I feel - so many positives and negatives. It’s probably this headspace that prompted some dude to invent sweet and sour pork many years ago.

We can beat GWS next week.