POSTMATCH DISCUSSION - Round 18

[layzie 33,989]

46 minutes ago, A F said:

Hope you're okay, mate. Know that there are plenty of us hurting tonight and that you're not the only one.

None of us would be on here if we didn't see the football club as a central part of our lives. I gave up another Saturday evening to head on down to Geelong, only to get kicked in the teeth by our club again.

Let's hope it stops soon otherwise there won't be any supporters left to kick in the teeth.

I’ll be fine, we all will. Life definitely goes on. But man! It seems like nearly every other club has at least at some varying degree of success of at very least a finals appearance. Breaking the flag drought is definitely the goal but this finals drought has almost become a flag in itself. We’re so sick of having it hang over our heads and impatiently just want it to end so we can look forward to bigger and better challenges.

Demonland is one of the only comforts because other people are going through the same thing. It just feels like we’ve got so much more manure to eat before we get to something decent. 

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

1 hour ago, Petraccattack said:

We know you dont care if Melbourne wins or loses, you have admitted that yourself.

Makes it even more gutless of you to come into the post match thread and call people whingers after a loss like that.

 

Of course I care, but then it is just footy, nobody dies

I was disappointed we allowed ourselves to be overrun 

But it says post match discussion on the tin, not woe is me, poor me censored censored 

[Maluski 24]

3 hours ago, Jaded said:

Goodwin can go get [censored]. I’m sick of his stubborness. Put McDonald down back and we win. 

I am disgusted that we lost this game. Honestly I’m so tired of being disappointed with this club. 

Spot on. Goodwin's game day coaching is atrocious. Stubborn as an ass. When you have a 4-5 goal lead you shutdown and slow the tempo of the game, not turn it into a free flowing shoot out. T Mac should have been moved back, spare behind the ball, after Geelong's first goal in last qrtr, or at least after the 2nd. Give Hogan the responsibility and freedom as the number 1 forward.

If they manned him up, good, that means a congested forward line for them and an open one for us.

Epic fail from Goody.

 

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

What a great game. Felt like the final against SAF way back in 2006 or whatever it was. There's no shame in losing a great contest like that at all.

I really didn't think we could make finals. Haven't for weeks now... We lost the game, and somehow now I'm more confident we'll make finals than ever.

We should all be proud of what was dished up by the red and blue tonight. The greatest game of the year in the greatest game on earth.

[rjay 25,063]

14 minutes ago, Bobby McKenzie said:

TV much more guide than being at the game. Gets you in nice and close to the action..

Yes, but you don't see the bigger picture & positional moves which means you are reliant on the clowns they call experts to fill in the blanks.

The ones who thought it was going to be a boundary throw in when the behind decision was turned over because it hit the point post & was out of bounds on the full....imbeciles.

[Adam The God 30,403]

59 minutes ago, P-man said:

Didn’t hear the interview but this sounds right. There isn’t a more arrogant little [censored] in the entire league.

Yeah there is. P Dangerfield. Oh, sorry. C Scott. Oh, sorry. G Ablett. 

I don't know how all three manage to fit in the same locker room with the size of their heads. 3 of the most arrogant footballers still playing the game, coached by one of the most arrogant coaches in league.

57 minutes ago, Bobby McKenzie said:

And some people think our boys dont care if they win or lose. That video says it all. They not only suffered a gut wrenching defeat but worked their backsides off and would have been physically exhausted. Let's be realistic, how many would have predicted getting beaten after the siren at Geelong?  

When Tuohy marked it on the siren, my sister and I walked closer to the fence from the standing room area where we watched the rest of the match from.

When we got closer, we were some 50 metres away from most of the MFC team on the mark.

When the ball sailed through, Brayshaw and Oliver looked shattered. Gus looked like he wanted to punch someone and just walked off towards the pocket by himself. Meanwhile, Oliver stood there in disbelief, frustration completely etched across him.

I'm sure others were the same, but those two stood out to me. But it shouldn't have got to this point. Wasn't Collingwood in Round 23 enough? Wasn't Geelong in Round 1 enough? What is it going to take, before this team realises what they must do in order to win proper games of footy?

1 hour ago, Scoop Junior said:

I don't think I'll be able to fall asleep soon so I might as well write something.

I went down to Geelong for the game and I can't remember being that shattered after a H&A game. Even though I fully expected Geelong to come back and probably even snatch it near the end (we've seen this script too many times before), nothing could have prepared me for losing like that. Lead the whole second half, 5 goals up in the last, missed shots, unfavourable umpiring, Cats not missing a shot at goal, ball in our forward line with 40 seconds left, we can't hold up their final surge and then let them have a one-on-one inside 50...it's just the most heartbreaking way to lose a game of footy (and with so much on the line).

3 seconds away from what could have shaped our season, being 2 games plus % ahead of Geelong and sitting in 4th spot. 3 seconds the difference between final 8 consolidation and now being at risk of missing out.

And from a selfish point of view, 3 seconds away from what would have been one of my great footy memories - going down to Geelong on a Saturday night, without key players, sitting amongst the Melbourne fans right near the players' race and holding on to win a thriller - I can imagine the scenes would have been incredible after the game and it would have been one of the great walk backs to the car and drive home. 3 bloody seconds. Instead, I don't want to watch the replay, I don't want to see the paper, I don't want to see a footy show, I don't want to hear the radio. What a fine line between one of the great footy nights and gut-wrenching emptiness.

It was probably as close as I've got to shedding a tear at the end of the game (as an adult).

I was only 4 when we lost the 87 prelim but my parents always spoke of the pain Melbourne fans felt after that game. This wasn't a prelim, but I think I now understand what that feels like.

I've been there before multiple times, but winning tonight (given our disgusting record down there) would have been a famous win. 

I was angry after the game, but wasn't confident at three quarter time that we'd get the job done. My sister and I did say though that if we could kick 3 or 4 we'd win, because they were never going to kick enough. But, this was Melbourne. And so of course the worst happened.

Great post btw.

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Fritsch still had some excellent marks, a lovely run down tackle and a handful of beautiful corridor kicks.

That said, clearly his most error prone game. Fumbles, missed tackles, dropped marks. Given it was probably the highest intensity game he's played in, with a hostile crowd, skinny wings and some top quality mids on the other side that's not a huge surprise. Just a disappointment. 

I don't like him used as the spare back. It's a huge job for a young and inexperienced player. And the spare back as the goalie is just a bad move as well. Unfortunately not a lot of great options in the side. Fritsch can pinch hit on a half back flank and Hibberd or Lever free in the hole is the dream. Without them in the side, Vince? Melksham? Joel Smith loose? Lewis loose who will at least find the ball but won't offer much as an extra in a marking contest?

He's also a kid who's played 1 year of VFL as a forward and is now clearly an above average AFL wingman. Arrgh, so frustrating because I want him to be great and he's already doing so well.

I agree. He did some nice things, but the bad far outweighed the good.

And it did strike me as strange that Jones directed him back to play the goal keeper role, rather than taking it himself. But obviously they were instructions from the box. 

[DeeSpencer 26,070]

2 minutes ago, A F said:

 

I agree. He did some nice things, but the bad far outweighed the good.

And it did strike me as strange that Jones directed him back to play the goal keeper role, rather than taking it himself. But obviously they were instructions from the box. 

Great overhead, reads the play, lovely safe kick. There's a lot to like about Fritsch as that loose man so I get why he does it, but it's just too defensive and ineffectual to have a deep goalie and a big hole of space 30m out.

[Neil Crompton 5,600]

Hogan needs to watch a review of Hawkins goals to learn how a good key forward needs to play. Hawkins got 5 of his goals after making fast leads and, as a result, marking the ball virtually uncontested.Hogan doesn’t lead. He prefers to stand still and try and mark within a pack, usually one handed. Tom Mac can mark in a pack - Hogan can’t. Hawkins got his other 2 goals from desperate ground play. Hogan is rarely desperate for the ball once it hits the ground. 

Hogan is a worry. 

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

Just now, Neil Crompton said:

Hogan is a worry. 

He sure is.

Though, I would argue Hogan is the best pack mark on the list. This year, it seems, he's completely forgotten how to do it. In previous years though, he's been one of the great pack busting big uglies we've had.

Something's up with his noggin at the moment, I'm sure of it.

[Elegt 872]

2 minutes ago, Neil Crompton said:

Hogan needs to watch a review of Hawkins goals to learn how a good key forward needs to play. Hawkins got 5 of his goals after making fast leads and, as a result, marking the ball virtually uncontested.Hogan doesn’t lead. He prefers to stand still and try and mark within a pack, usually one handed. Tom Mac can mark in a pack - Hogan can’t. Hawkins got his other 2 goals from desperate ground play. Hogan is rarely desperate for the ball once it hits the ground. 

Hogan is a worry. 

sooooo lazy, I don't care how talented and how close to winning the Coleman he is , pedo and tim Smith are giving their  all at Casey , they deserve the ff spot more than Hogan does 

[Adam The God 30,403]

25 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Great overhead, reads the play, lovely safe kick. There's a lot to like about Fritsch as that loose man so I get why he does it, but it's just too defensive and ineffectual to have a deep goalie and a big hole of space 30m out.

Seems an incongruously defensive move from a coach who seemed to think Gawn needed to be saved during our momentum surge at the start of the last. We needed Gawn out there to kill the game. Have a rest when we're 7-8 goals up and Geelong have themselves, put the cue in the rack.

[kev martin 10,404]

2 hours ago, 000 said:

 

 

2 hours ago, Jaded said:

No, I’m merely suggesting that you’re on the wrong forum if you think anyone agrees with you that winning isn’t everything. 

In life it may not be, but in football, it is. 

If you’re not playing to win, then what the hell are you doing?

My last word on Demonland!

You can do your training observations yourself.

Your not playing, you're a spectator. 

You have imbalanced thoughts and live vicariously through others. 

To claim everyone on Demonland agrees with you is delusional. 

Winning is not everything!

There is nothing wrong with losing nor with being last.

You superior, shallow people, who value inequality. Squash the weak and worship the powerful. You poor people.

I know some agree with me. Only BULLIES isolate others telling them they are by themselves.

I have enough stress in life then to put myself out to you kind of critics. I like a life of freedom, not one where I have to fillter myself in-order to avoid your accusations, no matter how subtl,e it is still unkind. 

So I'll stop before you get serious. 

I have seen some cruel statements on Demonland. Get over yourselves.

Thankyou to those who supported my post. I appreciated your kindness.

From kevin martin

 

 

 

 

Edited July 21, 2018 by 000

[layzie 33,989]

32 minutes ago, 000 said:

 

My last word on Demonland!

You can do your training observations yourself.

Your not playing, you're a spectator. 

You have imbalanced thoughts and live vicariously through others. 

To claim everyone on Demonland agrees with you is delusional. 

Winning is not everything!

There is nothing wrong with losing nor with being last.

You superior, shallow people, who value inequality. Squash the weak and worship the powerful. You poor people.

I know some agree with me. Only BULLIES isolate others telling them they are by themselves.

I have enough stress in life then to put myself out to you kind of critics. I like a life of freedom, not one where I have to fillter myself in-order to avoid your accusations, no matter how subtl,e it is still unkind. 

So I'll stop before you get serious. 

I have seen some cruel statements on Demonland. Get over yourselves.

Thankyou to those who supported my post. I appreciated your kindness.

From kevin martin

 

 

 

 

I’m not gonna attack anyone for having that attitude. More power to you my friend, I honestly wish I could be more like that about football but unfortunately I can’t. I see things very much the way @Jaded does. 

When a game is there to be won and you need that win, you must win it. Simple as that. Maybe if the shoe was on the other foot and ai were a cats fan with 3 flags in the last decade and seemingly yearly finals appearances things might be different but it’s not. We crave this success. The elusiveness of it just makes you want it that much more. It’s extremely difficult. 

[At the break of Gawn 4,460]

I’m o/s at the moment so I didn’t see the game (just highlights and the last 2 minutes), so I just have two comments.

1. Petracca’s barrel was one of the dumbest pieces of clock mgmt football I’ve ever seen. Ever. I reckon he got scolded pretty bad for that, thus the tears. He had plenty of opportunities to go sideways. All in all it was a horrible last 2 minutes but by god that was awful.

2. Any team that lets the opposition double its goals kicked for the game in the last qtr doesn’t deserve to win. The fact that Geelong kicked 8 goals in 3 qtrs of footy and then 8 in the last is simply disgusting.

 

Edited July 21, 2018 by At the break of Gawn

[Radar Detector 1,347]

5 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

Gee I hope you are keeping your son up to speed about what he has got to face in life

 

Probably not appropriate to opine about another poster’s parenting.

[praha 11,240]

4 hours ago, Maluski said:

Spot on. Goodwin's game day coaching is atrocious. Stubborn as an ass. When you have a 4-5 goal lead you shutdown and slow the tempo of the game, not turn it into a free flowing shoot out. T Mac should have been moved back, spare behind the ball, after Geelong's first goal in last qrtr, or at least after the 2nd. Give Hogan the responsibility and freedom as the number 1 forward.

If they manned him up, good, that means a congested forward line for them and an open one for us.

Epic fail from Goody.

 

This is a loser's mentality, based on the assumption that we are incapable of maintaining and extending a lead (which is not the case). Good teams put the foot to the throat, and/or hold on when challenged. I am no fan of Goodwin, but McDonald was our only effective 4-quarter forward last night. 

We lost it last night when our forwards and mids collectively stopped running both ways. We were found out in transition, and choked. Hard. As much on Goodwin as it is on Jones, Lewis, Vince, and other on field leaders. 

[bing181 9,328]

School of hard knocks.

[GCDee 3,199]

I'm still so [censored] shattered. 

However

Looked back through Richmonds results last year as I remember them losing a lot of tight ones.

After round 18 they were sitting 11-7 we will now be 10-8 they lost 4 games by 10 points or less, we have lost 4 games by 10 points or less. 

I think our ladder position isn't a true indicator of where we stand. 

Goodwin needs to learn from this.

The players need to keep their head up.

We need to get to adelaide and get the W.

The session is not done and dusted yet

 

[praha 11,240]

2 minutes ago, GCDee said:

I'm still so [censored] shattered. 

However

Looked back through Richmonds results last year as I remember them losing a lot of tight ones.

After round 18 they were sitting 11-7 we will now be 10-8 they lost 4 games by 10 points or less, we have lost 4 games by 10 points or less. 

I think our ladder position isn't a true indicator of where we stand. 

Goodwin needs to learn from this.

The players need to keep their head up.

We need to get to adelaide and get the W.

The session is not done and dusted yet

 

We need to beat 4 of Adelaide, Sydney, West Coast, GC and GWS to be a sure thing. We're just making up the numbers at this point anyway.

[beelzebub 23,382]

7 hours ago, bing181 said:

Was interesting to see the runner go out and pull him off in the last couple of minutes. They clearly wanted calmer heads out there.

Probably needed to have made that choice BEFORE the game.

He's not AFL

[Dockett 32 1,239]

2 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I’m o/s at the moment so I didn’t see the game (just highlights and the last 2 minutes), so I just have two comments.

1. Petracca’s barrel was one of the dumbest pieces of clock mgmt football I’ve ever seen. Ever. I reckon he got scolded pretty bad for that, thus the tears. He had plenty of opportunities to go sideways. All in all it was a horrible last 2 minutes but by god that was awful.

2. Any team that lets the opposition double its goals kicked for the game in the last qtr doesn’t deserve to win. The fact that Geelong kicked 8 goals in 3 qtrs of footy and then 8 in the last is simply disgusting.

 

We just crumbled in the last quarter as we have done previously in the close ones. 

There simply are no excuses.

Such action feeds on itself it seems and when we get in these positions some of our players just struggle with the pressure. Petracca  and OMac have now joined the panic club and l haven’t seen Hogan step up once in any of these games either. They were not alone and when the time came for calmness, leadership and observance of appropriate behaviours for these circumstances there was ‘ no appearance your worship’.

We rolled and allowed ourselves to fall at the last hurdle.

I don’t understand the coaches comments that the players are sick and tired of such losses and don’t buy it. Their fate was in their hands. They just had to do what you have too, to win.

They didn’t.

Can you imagine the great Hawthorn sides of the past losing from the position we were in?

We constantly see a wonderful kid called Oliver along with Tom Mac being the true leaders of the joint trying to show the way. Instead of getting in behind them we panicked or in some cases just didn’t get involved.

Ok ,a few more weeks for these blokes. If we don’t make the eight, the supposed hurt over last year will be shown as just croc of rubbish and we may need to cut the cancer out.

I hope it’s not the latter but it’s looking like it.

 

[SFebes 4,884]

Why was Gawn on the bench for the start of the last for a while? Absolutely astonishing by Goodwin and once again tactically bamboozled, he’s the easiest coach to coach against by a long way in my view. Oh and leaders, Jones our captain, once again missing when needed and didn’t direct players into a winning position when it counted. Time after time. The sooner we move on from Jones and his era the better, Goodwin needs a big pre season himself or it’s lights out for him next year. That was a soft underbelly horrible choke.

Lewis is just sneaking his way to 300, only here for the paycheque, rarely puts his body on the line and squibs contests. Or he just falls over so he can’t squib them. People say he’s here for leadership, we’ll where was it? Didn’t even drop back in the hole in front of Hawkins. Our leaders continue to let us down this year, Jones always, Vince and Lewis. Sooner we [censored] them off the better.

[pitmaster 3,577]

6 hours ago, WERRIDEE said:

I hope not how many more games is he going to cost us?

As Junior said a poor man's Zac Dawson

Unfair. His brother was the same until he had more games under his belt. Oscar is improving. Either a fit Lever or a fit Hibberd alongside O and we win. (Ditto a fit Viney elsewhere.)

[Wiseblood 24,637]

20 minutes ago, Dockett 32 said:

We just crumbled in the last quarter as we have done previously in the close ones. 

There simply are no excuses.

Such action feeds on itself it seems and when we get in these positions some of our players just struggle with the pressure. Petracca  and OMac have now joined the panic club and l haven’t seen Hogan step up once in any of these games either. They were not alone and when the time came for calmness, leadership and observance of appropriate behaviours for these circumstances there was ‘ no appearance your worship’.

We rolled and allowed ourselves to fall at the last hurdle.

I don’t understand the coaches comments that the players are sick and tired of such losses and don’t buy it. Their fate was in their hands. They just had to do what you have too, to win.

They didn’t.

Can you imagine the great Hawthorn sides of the past losing from the position we were in?

We constantly see a wonderful kid called Oliver along with Tom Mac being the true leaders of the joint trying to show the way. Instead of getting in behind them we panicked or in some cases just didn’t get involved.

Ok ,a few more weeks for these blokes. If we don’t make the eight, the supposed hurt over last year will be shown as just croc of rubbish and we may need to cut the cancer out.

I hope it’s not the latter but it’s looking like it.

 

In the 2007 season, before their decade of dominance, the Hawks coughed up 4 games by 20 points or less, 2 of which were by 9 and 5 points. 

I'd agree that the Hawks side from 2008 to about 2016 would rarely have coughed up games like tonight, although I do recall Hawkins kicking a goal after the siren and Isaac Smith missing one that cost them a game as well. That's just off the top of my head

My point is that all teams do it at some stage, even the best teams. It's shattering for us, but not the end of the world... yet. 

[bobby1554 1,261]

5 hours ago, Dappa Dan said:

He sure is.

Though, I would argue Hogan is the best pack mark on the list. This year, it seems, he's completely forgotten how to do it. In previous years though, he's been one of the great pack busting big uglies we've had.

Something's up with his noggin at the moment, I'm sure of it.

Yep, sure is. He is living in the wrong state. Trade him back to WA where he wants to be and move on.