1 hour ago, Gorgoroth said:

For me the changes would be

Out: Tyson, ANB, T Smith

In: Weid, Garlett, Spargo

ANB’s pressure is elite.  I agree his disposal needs some work but he is one of the reasons they get repeat entries. 

2 hours ago, Radar Detector said:

I think this week against the Saints is the wrong week to bring in a second tall defender unless we think Josh Bruce will play. OMac and J. Smith are the right size match-ups for McCartin and Mambrey, unless we want to release Smith into a more running role (probably instead of Vince) or if OMac is suspended. There will come a time to bring in another tall defender but we can cover this week.

In terms of other spots, Tim Smith offers a bit as a tackler but doesn’t hit the scoreboard much and offers little in the ruck. Whilst it’s important to create forward pressure, our conversion against Port was awful. Weid gets less of the ball but is more likely to score when he does and is a better second ruck option. He is also the future, Bull is not. On the subject of scoring, we were crying out for someone to take a half chance in that last quarter against Port. Felt like a Garlett cameo moment. He doesn’t touch it much but generally takes his chances and lays 3 tackles a game.

Tyson offered little on the weekend and Harmes butchered it. Petracca at least started on fire and his touches have more impact. So I’d be looking at:

Ins: Weid, Garlett/Stretch (very good VFL form)

Outs: T Smith and Tyson

I'm tired of players who butcher the ball or are crap at set shots inside forward 50. They need 2 get players in who are good kicks like Salem .So unless players like Harmes, Hannah, ANB, Tyson and the like improve their kicking we are always going 2 rue our lost opps

Since Lever was injured, our back line hasn't been functioning as well as it could. Whatever changes are made must address this. 

3 minutes ago, Demonised said:

Since Lever was injured, our back line hasn't been functioning as well as it could. Whatever changes are made must address this. 

Because we are using Joel Smith and Hibberd for a KPD role, it’s ludicrous and beyond stupidity. Bring in Frost or Petty and those guys go back to the HBF and perform roles more suited to them and provide run. Even Goodwin said on radio yesterday we went in too short. No [censored] Sherlock 

Edited June 23, 20186 yr by SFebey

In: Frost and Weed

Out:  T.Smith and Vince

If I hear one more person say that Hogan or Petracca should be dropped, I’ll spew up. 

Get a clue people.

Edited June 24, 20186 yr by Demons11

1 hour ago, Demons11 said:

JKH, you are kidding. 

No. Do you follow the VFL? His form has been outstanding.  We cannot win because our outside ball winners Fritsch aside and lesser extent Jones if played there have no carry, connect  or skill and so we dump long into 50 when under pressure. Playing Harmes or Tyson there will not fix this. We need someone to rotate through with Fritsch and Jones who lowers their eyes, offers quality connection and can change the angles moving forward. JKH has killed it the last month in the VFL playing a similar role as has Stretch and both have also worked on their inside game. Time to reward the recent form of both with some time in the seniors against weaker oppo and attempt to fix the part of our game that has cost us against Richmond early, Collingwood and once again on the weekend. 

Edited June 24, 20186 yr by big_red_fire_engine

Now bear with me here. A couple of seasons ago I watched a young Freo player carve us up at the G. What I noticed was his capacity to pinpoint targets inside 50. He didn't kick on for them but it wasn't because of talent. There were other issues at play.

Time to give Balic a run. Offers more than Stretch and provides the spread we're after.

We lost by 10 points.....take out the dodgy umpiring factor (shouldn’t have been in that situation for it to matter) & even if 25% of those forward entries were delivered with eyes lowered & correctly .....if Hogan clunked maybe two marks & if we didn’t have a spate of injuries all at once .....a lot of the above comments wouldn’t be made......our backline was let down by our forward entries.....you may have also noticed that when a team beats us they are now considered premiership favourites so as a team we are actually rated.  Opposition coaches are putting a lot of work into us & that is new for us so each time we lose we also learn . It is no surprise that the teams that have beaten us are just a little more experienced & assured at the crucial times ......not necessarily more talented but their top end talent is generally in the 25+ echelon. As a supporter I am excited that we are now seen by opposition coaches as someone to beat....I rate their opinion  100% more than any media hype  Am I worried we aren’t going to get there ......absolutely not. We have truckloads of talent...YOUNG....talent & it will take some time.  I don’t want to be a Bulldogs ...pinch one & then wallow in mediocrity for the next few years.  If you can be bothered to look over the history of the “great” teams it is generally 7 or so years in the making before they make it but then pretty much all of them are still contending finals today.  That is the type of club I want to support & I am extremely confident we will get there.  

17 hours ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

there's no way lewis is being dropped, and i'd doubt vince will either

anb completely blanketed motlop out of the game, but didn't make the most of his opportunities up forward, and harmes kept running and kept presenting

if we do choose to bring in another tall back, our whole defensive structure is messed with, no matter who rotates out

FACT is we lose big games! Something has to give 

Weeds, Frost, Stretch ( even though not a fan) demand inclusion after very very solid form in Magoos, Garlett presents some serious x Factor and can kick telling goals he he comes in as well.

Time to send a rocket up a few that have not performed well enough when it counts 

This is a live or die caper and we need some strong decision making from selectors before its too late.

Just a thought, but does anyone else think Bugg deserves another chance??

Outs- Hogan. Petracca. Tyson. Lewis

Ins- Weideman. Bugg. KennedyHarris. Frost

The outs have given sfa for the last 2 rounds. The ins should be enough to beat StKilda.

The outs need a rocket or retire.

 

So many different views from people who watch the same thing.  Makes the world go round.

Hogan and Petracca won't be dropped.

Frost is a potato at AFL level.  Pass.

Tim Smith ?  I'm not a fan.  I know he provides size, pressure and aggression, but he's not AFL quality for me.  I'll forego his 7 disposals, 1 mark and 6 tackles.  I think we can cover that.  Just...

I'm not rapt in a defence that has Joel Smith as the second tall.  It's just not a great structure.  I'd like to see how Petty performs as 2IC.

We need a crumber, so I'd like one of Garlett or Spargo in the team.

And the sooner Weideman becomes a staple in the side the better.  Prior to his injury he'd played in 3 straight wins.  

IN: Weideman, Petty, Spargo or Garlett

OUT: Smith, Smith, Vince

2 hours ago, Demons11 said:

In: Frost and Weed

Out:  T.Smith and Vince

If I hear one more person say that Hogan or Petracca should be dropped, I’ll spew up. 

Get a clue people.

Petracca should be dropped

 

 

 

 

Did it work?

1 hour ago, Deestar9 said:

We lost by 10 points.....take out the dodgy umpiring factor (shouldn’t have been in that situation for it to matter) & even if 25% of those forward entries were delivered with eyes lowered & correctly .....if Hogan clunked maybe two marks & if we didn’t have a spate of injuries all at once .....a lot of the above comments wouldn’t be made......our backline was let down by our forward entries.....you may have also noticed that when a team beats us they are now considered premiership favourites so as a team we are actually rated.  Opposition coaches are putting a lot of work into us & that is new for us so each time we lose we also learn . It is no surprise that the teams that have beaten us are just a little more experienced & assured at the crucial times ......not necessarily more talented but their top end talent is generally in the 25+ echelon. As a supporter I am excited that we are now seen by opposition coaches as someone to beat....I rate their opinion  100% more than any media hype  Am I worried we aren’t going to get there ......absolutely not. We have truckloads of talent...YOUNG....talent & it will take some time.  I don’t want to be a Bulldogs ...pinch one & then wallow in mediocrity for the next few years.  If you can be bothered to look over the history of the “great” teams it is generally 7 or so years in the making before they make it but then pretty much all of them are still contending finals today.  That is the type of club I want to support & I am extremely confident we will get there.  

I actually would be perfectly happy nabbing a flag then sitting in MTM for a few years before rising again, it'd beat the last 54 years (coz we won't win this year)

If Goodwin also said we were too short then I expect Joel.Smith to be dropped and I think Frost will get his last chance at AFL level hopefully he doesn't stuff it up like Pedo did.

IN: Weed, Frost

OUT: The Smith's

Garlett  doesn't seem to do much in the reserves, but he is worth a recall to the seniors. Cannot keep Vince and Lewis in same side,so I think Vince has to go,best days are behind him, Petty needs a go,for the fresh "blood" reason.( vampires not welcomed).T.Smith not yet senior player and may never be,so he needs to be dropped. ANB position could to replaced by J.Smith.Petracca may have to play defence,or needs to be dropped.Waiting "awfully" for his breakout game. Weed needs another run in the seniors, 7 reserves goals against a shite team means nothing however I think he is better than Ped,T.Smith at this stage. 

Despite losing, out opponents only kicked 75 points. We also won the contested midfield battle. 

Where we struggled was not defending, it was delivery into forward and converting possession into goals.  So changes are either about improving our delivery or about changing the forward mix/structure to be more efficient and/or offer better targets. "Delivery" is often as much about the positioning of forwards as it is the kicking skills of the midfield. Create space and delivery looks amazing; stand still and delivery looks crap.

Adding Weid may straighten us up. His strengths are his leading patterns (which make space for others) and his ability to not loose marking contests (he either marks well or halves the contest). This may improve both our forward efficiency and our delivery (by adding a target and creating space).

Garlett, despite form, may increase efficiency by creating opportunities.  He won't help delivery by changing structures or creating space. 

I'm not sure we have any "highly skilled" mids waiting in the seconds.  Stretch and JKH are it. Are they major upgrades on current skills?

 

In Weid, out Smith for mine. 

Garlett the other option if wet think he can generate more opportunities than another small forward. 

 

1 hour ago, Bravo Oscar, Bravo said:

Just a thought, but does anyone else think Bugg deserves another chance??

NO NO NO and DOUBLE NO.

22 minutes ago, dl4e said:

NO NO NO and DOUBLE NO.

I'll take that as a no

I am I the only one reading this thread and almost being embarrassed to be a Melbourne member. How can people be calling for Hogan to be dropped. Two weeks ago he was mentioned in almost every expert commentators mid season All Australian teams. He then has two quiet games for the most obvious of reasons. I lost count of the number of times ANB, Jones, Oliver and Petracca kicked the ball on top of or over Hogan's head giving him zero chance. But it seems to be easier to blame Hogan. 

Also,  I understand Max Rooke is our forward line coach. Does he need to take some responsibility for McDonald and Hogan being so close together inside fifty on Friday night making the long kicks even more predictable. Surely it was obvious they needed to spread the Port defenders more.  

Edited June 24, 20186 yr by Knuckles

2 minutes ago, Knuckles said:

I am I the only one reading this thread and almost being embarrassed to be a Melbourne member. How can people be calling for Hogan to be dropped. Two weeks ago he was mentioned in almost every expert commentators mid season All Australian teams. He then has two quiet games for the most obvious of reasons. I lost count of the number of times ANB, Jones, Oliver and Petracca kicked the ball on top of or over Hogans head giving him zero chance. But it seems to be easier to blame Hogan. 

Also,  I understand Max Rooke is our forward line coach. Does he need to take some responsibility for McDonald and Hogan being so close together inside fifty on Friday night making the long kicks even more predictable. Surely it was obvious they needed to spread the Port defenders more.  

I have said somewhere else that those calling for Hogan to be dropped need to see a man in a white coat. Ridiculous.

1 hour ago, timbo said:

Petracca should be dropped

 

 

 

 

Did it work?

?

1 minute ago, dl4e said:

I have said somewhere else that those calling for Hogan to be dropped need to see a man in a white coat. Ridiculous.

Agree.  Some supporters have no idea

3 hours ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

No. Do you follow the VFL? His form has been outstanding.  We cannot win because our outside ball winners Fritsch aside and lesser extent Jones if played there have no carry, connect  or skill and so we dump long into 50 when under pressure. Playing Harmes or Tyson there will not fix this. We need someone to rotate through with Fritsch and Jones who lowers their eyes, offers quality connection and can change the angles moving forward. JKH has killed it the last month in the VFL playing a similar role as has Stretch and both have also worked on their inside game. Time to reward the recent form of both with some time in the seniors against weaker oppo and attempt to fix the part of our game that has cost us against Richmond early, Collingwood and once again on the weekend. 

I’d be happy to give JKH a run against the Saints but for him and to a lesser degree Frost it’s last chance at the OK Corral. If they stink it up against a very meager oppo then I won’t be in any rush to see them in the seniors again.

8 minutes ago, Knuckles said:

I am I the only one reading this thread and almost being embarrassed to be a Melbourne member. How can people be calling for Hogan to be dropped. Two weeks ago he was mentioned in almost every expert commentators mid season All Australian teams. He then has two quiet games for the most obvious of reasons. I lost count of the number of times ANB, Jones, Oliver and Petracca kicked the ball on top of or over Hogan's head giving him zero chance. But it seems to be easier to blame Hogan. 

Also,  I understand Max Rooke is our forward line coach. Does he need to take some responsibility for McDonald and Hogan being so close together inside fifty on Friday night making the long kicks even more predictable. Surely it was obvious they needed to spread the Port defenders more.  

You new here? This is Demonland, try the Game Day thread for really interesting reading

Your guilty parties for the kicking inside 50 was missing a few names