On 25/10/2020 at 10:26, Wiseblood said:

Well, why wouldn't they be, seeing as he played a few games for us when we first got him?  That would indicate he was over them, especially as there is no chance he would have played with concussion symptoms in this current climate.

He then got further knocks to his head and that has brought the symptoms back to the fore, as it would for anyone.

I'm not guessing.  Just the cold, hard facts right there.

All repeat concussion suffers have periods were they recover in between episodes. Just because KK was symptom free when he played mean nothing to me. It's not like he played even half a season, he has played 2 AFL intensity games in 2 years and will likely retire symptom free.

It's a no brainer that If you have a history of repeat concussion (or injury for that matter) that you are more susceptible to a recurrence and MFC misjudged his chances of being able to handle the bumps and bruises and he is now still on our list taking up valuable cap space through no fault of his own for that matter.

  On 25/10/2020 at 12:01, Demon Disciple said:

That’s what I thought, though I think Jacko might surprise us and develop rapidly. For me, if Weid fails to take the next step next year we may as well put a line through him as a KPF.

Seriously AF and Demon Disciple how long do you think Jacko will take to develop as a regular Ists player? 
A number of years. 

Thats not accurate as he will develop next season as a Ruck support for Max and as a floating forward around the Forward line.

I have no doubt he will earn his place next season due to his talent competitiveness and determination to succeed.

He will learn as he plays and may need a couple of rest days or to be managed but full steam ahead and with Brown  and Weid Providing greater support fir each other our Forward line should function  much better also with Kossie Fritta and others 
 

 

  On 25/10/2020 at 10:25, buck_nekkid said:

Another small forward would be high on my shopping list, too.  I dont think Sideshow Bob was a ‘needs’ play, more an opportunistic one.  I would think we saw the opportunity and decided it was an unexpected windfall.  If he nominates us, he will play more games than most players selected in the second round of most drafts.  I also think you can’t judge a deal in isolation, and the final balance of the draft and trade period is when it is reasonable to assess the result.

Who is Sideshow  Bob?

  On 25/10/2020 at 08:09, Wiseblood said:

KK wasn't about getting it wrong - I have no doubt he was a gamble and, when you think about it, we got him as a 'steak knives' addition to the May trade.

he was out of contract... had nothing to do with the May trade

it was simply a case of which club offered him the better deal

and we blinked

not sure what is has to do with brown either

Edited October 25, 20204 yr by Diamond_Jim

  On 25/10/2020 at 11:46, binman said:

On Jackson i reckon with brown and weed in the team he will play almost a half forward  utility role, such is his athleticism and ability below his knees.

Get up and down the ground the way Hogan - and tmac in 2018 - did. Be a marking option when exiting our back half and of course still be an aerial threat up forward. 

He has unique attributes and of course he will do some rucking but I can also see him playing as a mid at times with Max rucking. 

He is something special. Really looking to seeing him after his first full preseason, with some space at the g and proper length quarters.

Excellent post exactly my thoughts on Jackson, we won't be so predictable always going to max out of defense and once at the wing still have tall targets inside 50 to kick to. Could be a real weapon for us having Jackson, Brown Weed, and Maxy as marking targets all over the ground 

  On 25/10/2020 at 14:49, 58er said:

Who is Sideshow  Bob?

 

General warning to all.

It's ok to argue your point without getting nasty.

Also please use the ignore function if you do not like a posters views. Mods can't ban someone just for an unpopular view.

Abuse however is not tolerated regardless of opinion.

  On 25/10/2020 at 21:49, Demonland said:

Mods can't ban someone just for an unpopular view.

I will add that if you continually bait people in an attempt to troll you may be warned or banned.

I do not like doing this as what constitutes trolling can be subjective so please don't flog a dead horse.

We're all frustrated with a lack of success. Have your opinions but keep it constructive and civil. We don't all have to agree but we have to be respectful.

  On 25/10/2020 at 21:49, Demonland said:

Also please use the ignore function if you do not like a posters views. Mods can't ban someone just for an unpopular view.

Abuse however is not tolerated regardless of opinion.

It's your forum. Whilst I understand that it's a difficult line to tread, you do have the right and ability to warn/ban posters who are being obvious trolls. That way we can reduce the loss of quality posters from this site.

  On 25/10/2020 at 14:35, 58er said:

Seriously AF and Demon Disciple how long do you think Jacko will take to develop as a regular Ists player? 
A number of years. 

Thats not accurate as he will develop next season as a Ruck support for Max and as a floating forward around the Forward line.

I have no doubt he will earn his place next season due to his talent competitiveness and determination to succeed.

He will learn as he plays and may need a couple of rest days or to be managed but full steam ahead and with Brown  and Weid Providing greater support fir each other our Forward line should function  much better also with Kossie Fritta and others 
 

 

He will develop a lot quicker if he is not the number two man.

  On 25/10/2020 at 14:49, 58er said:

Who is Sideshow  Bob?

Ben Brown.  Ref: the simpsons

  On 25/10/2020 at 11:46, binman said:

On Jackson i reckon with brown and weed in the team he will play almost a half forward  utility role, such is his athleticism and ability below his knees.

Get up and down the ground the way Hogan - and tmac in 2018 - did. Be a marking option when exiting our back half and of course still be an aerial threat up forward. 

He has unique attributes and of course he will do some rucking but I can also see him playing as a mid at times with Max rucking. 

He is something special. Really looking to seeing him after his first full preseason, with some space at the g and proper length quarters.

I have next to no confidence Weid will develop past his current level, therefore he needs to be pushed back to 2nd forward to relieve some pressure. Agree Jackson as high half forward to utilise his mobility and athleticism, rather than key position with short stints in the ruck.

  On 25/10/2020 at 22:13, Demonland said:

I will add that if you continually bait people in an attempt to troll you may be warned or banned.

I do not like doing this as what constitutes trolling can be subjective so please don't [censored] a dead horse.

We're all frustrated with a lack of success. Have your opinions but keep it constructive and civil. We don't all have to agree but we have to be respectful.

Thanks DL.  Worth noting that all of us in Victoria right now don't need extra reason to feel crappy about life. Posts that attack fellow Demonlanders personally have real potential for negative consequences. Nothing we discuss here warrants making another individual feel that way.

  On 25/10/2020 at 12:29, Demons1858 said:

All repeat concussion suffers have periods were they recover in between episodes. Just because KK was symptom free when he played mean nothing to me. It's not like he played even half a season, he has played 2 AFL intensity games in 2 years and will likely retire symptom free.

It's a no brainer that If you have a history of repeat concussion (or injury for that matter) that you are more susceptible to a recurrence and MFC misjudged his chances of being able to handle the bumps and bruises and he is now still on our list taking up valuable cap space through no fault of his own for that matter.

From memory, the reports were that they thought his ongoing concussion symptoms were actually related to a neck issue, rather than concussion itself. He'd done a body of work to put it behind him and medical advice was that he was ready to go.

It might have been a bad call, but sounds like it had its reasoning.

While I still have reservations about the impact on our forward pressure, one of the possible advantages of recruiting Ben Brown may be the potential ability to play him as a third ruck option if Gawn and Jackson both get injured (at least for centre bounces). With Preuss departing, it means we don't really have to carry ruck insurance and so more of our salary cap is in our best 22.

It also could be interesting how we can set up in a defensive zone with Gawn, Brown and Jackson behind the ball. This could be a bit of a nightmare for the opposition if we can get them to kick down the line.

The other thing I was thinking is that AVB could play a key role if we go with Brown, Weideman, Jackson and Fritsch, because we are going to need someone who tackles like a mad man.

  On 26/10/2020 at 00:05, Fat Tony said:

While I still have reservations about the impact on our forward pressure, one of the possible advantages of recruiting Ben Brown may be the potential ability to play him as a third ruck option if Gawn and Jackson both get injured (at least for centre bounces). With Preuss departing, it means we don't really have to carry ruck insurance and so more of our salary cap is in our best 22.

It also could be interesting how we can set up in a defensive zone with Gawn, Brown and Jackson behind the ball. This could be a bit of a nightmare for the opposition if we can get them to kick down the line.

The other thing I was thinking is that AVB could play a key role if we go with Brown, Weideman, Jackson and Fritsch, because we are going to need someone who tackles like a mad man.

Agreed we should have the superiorty in the air most weeks with all of them playing, I also think Jackson is so versatile to play a variety of positions that we can make it work. Regarding tackling pressure to compliment them, I reckon we should play Viney as a forward pocket. This would allow for Oliver, Brayshaw, Harmes, Trac to fit into our midfield and I reckon he has some qualities of a good small forward. Tackles relentlessly, has tricks to win 1 v 1's, very strong and can be zippy at times, if he could add another string to his bow with kicking harder goals like snaps more consistently I reckon he'd be a great compliment to the talls up forward.

Edited October 26, 20204 yr by Gawndog98

  On 25/10/2020 at 11:03, A F said:

And what makes you think we're not targeting small forwards? This is nonsensical.

List management isn't about targeting one player and that's it. We're trying to address numerous weaknesses.

Tom McDonald is finished and has been since early 2019. Brown is a far superior player anyway.

As for Jackson, we shouldn't be expecting a second year tall and a still developing Weideman to be the key pillars up forward next year. Maybe by 2023.

In the meantime, we've secured Brown, we also secured Smith as another runner and are targeting small forwards as well.

Well said Goody!!

  On 25/10/2020 at 20:44, Deemented Are Go! said:

 

You know you have it made when you get to guest in the Simpsons.... Well done Ben Brown!!

Ben Brown has kicked 60+ goals three times.

Even if diminishing, I would take half that for pick 23 and it isn’t even a discussion.
Sometimes it seems there is some overthinking from fans and clubs... If you get an opportunity to get proven talent into your list for a slightly cut price, you take it.

  On 26/10/2020 at 00:36, Gawndog98 said:

Agreed we should have the superiorty in the air most weeks with all of them playing, I also think Jackson is so versatile to play a variety of positions that we can make it work. Regarding tackling pressure to compliment them, I reckon we should play Viney as a forward pocket. This would allow for Oliver, Brayshaw, Harmes, Trac to fit into our midfield and I reckon he has some qualities of a good small forward. Tackles relentlessly, has tricks to win 1 v 1's, very strong and can be zippy at times, if he could add another string to his bow with kicking harder goals like snaps more consistently I reckon he'd be a great compliment to the talls up forward.

I agree, I think one of Harmes or Viney should be looked at as a small forward, as both are not 100% necessities in the midfield at all times with Petracca, Oliver and Brayshaw (assuming he recaptures his form/stays) but are far too good not to play. 

  On 26/10/2020 at 00:50, Domgus Petrogan said:

I agree, I think one of Harmes or Viney should be looked at as a small forward, as both are not 100% necessities in the midfield at all times with Petracca, Oliver and Brayshaw (assuming he recaptures his form/stays) but are far too good not to play. 

Hunt to play this role!

  On 26/10/2020 at 00:36, Gawndog98 said:

Agreed we should have the superiorty in the air most weeks with all of them playing, I also think Jackson is so versatile to play a variety of positions that we can make it work. Regarding tackling pressure to compliment them, I reckon we should play Viney as a forward pocket. This would allow for Oliver, Brayshaw, Harmes, Trac to fit into our midfield and I reckon he has some qualities of a good small forward. Tackles relentlessly, has tricks to win 1 v 1's, very strong and can be zippy at times, if he could add another string to his bow with kicking harder goals like snaps more consistently I reckon he'd be a great compliment to the talls up forward.

I would prefer Petracca spend more time forward. Let him start in the middle and drift forward like Dusty.

  On 26/10/2020 at 00:53, picket fence said:

Hunt to play this role!

I don’t mind that either, but how to we keep Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Brayshaw and Harmes in the same game day team? All at their best are far too good not to be playing, but can’t all play only as mids. 

  On 26/10/2020 at 00:57, Domgus Petrogan said:

I don’t mind that either, but how to we keep Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Brayshaw and Harmes in the same game day team? All at their best are far too good not to be playing, but can’t all play only as mids. 

Brayshaw to play on a HFF Taking Melkshams place

  On 26/10/2020 at 00:56, Fat Tony said:

I would prefer Petracca spend more time forward. Let him start in the middle and drift forward like Dusty.

I also agree, I think Trac should play 50/50 midfield forward, I just think we should rotate more players through the midfield. I would have Oliver, Brayshaw, and Harmes as the mainstays, Trac 50/50 mid forward, and then Viney and even Jackson pinch hitting through there. 

Edited October 26, 20204 yr by Gawndog98