POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 2

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,294]

I was impressed with the way we won. Yes we were bog ordinary for 2.5 qtrs but we got the job done.

Make no mistake though, we would have lost this game against more polished opposition. The glaring concern for me was how easy Carlton made the switch and had a string of players free by 20m or more. We simply have to get better at reading this during a match (we did in the last qtr) or we will be killed by quality teams.

Funnily enough, I don`t think it is as big a problem at Etihad where there just is not as much space as the wide wings of the G. We weren`t hurt by The Saints this time round, time will tell against the Cats.

[Skuit 10,030]

27 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

I can't add too much more to the comments than what's already been covered.  Lots of good, some things to work on and a few players who were down on their output.

We're being harsh on Brayshaw, though.  Wasn't his best game, but the bloke was drafted as a midfielder and he is being asked to play as a half forward for most of the day.  It's no surprise that he finds it a little bit of a struggle, and comparing his output to Toumpas is silly.  It's an excuse for the usual suspects to push their negative agenda.  When given the opportunity to play midfield minutes, as he was given towards the end of last year, Brayshaw showed he is more than capable of being, at the very least, a very good player for us.  He just needs to wait his turn for his opportunity to play in the midfield again.

You can excuse a player for being played out of position, but that doesn't mean he should continue to hold his spot in front of players for that position. Kent feels a better option at half-forward right now. The onus is on Angus to improve his versatility or he can wait for and force his midfield opportunity via Casey.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, Skuit said:

You can excuse a player for being played out of position, but that doesn't mean he should continue to hold his spot in front of players for that position. Kent feels a better option at half-forward right now. The onus is on Angus to improve his versatility or he can wait for and force his midfield opportunity via Casey.

I never said he should keep his spot, just that the criticism of him is unfair.  He's being asked to play the majority of the game out of position and, thus, it harms his output.

[John Crow Batty 8,860]

25 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I'd never heard of him until last week.

He was doing good things last season I recall.

[Wrecker45 3,378]

Think some of the criticism of Tyson is unfair. He is developing a habit of kicking crunch last 1/4 goals.

Brayshaw will be a player. He had an ordinary game yesterday and I would be tempted to drop him but if Hogan and Lewis both go we can't afford the additional changes. He is a pure mid and needs more time on the ball to be effective. 

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

Ugly, ugly, ugly.

 

Ugly, ugly, ugly.

 

But a win.

 

What a luxury. "Just another" win.

 

(for those too young to remember -- in the Northey era we won many games like that -- unattractive slogfests with the  better team -- us -- winning by a small margin.)

 

Carlton were always going to try to strangle us. It's a tried and true method against us. They will not win many games if they play an ultra flood every week. But they won't -- it was put on specially in our honour. It was a one-day-only special deal of extreme negativity and hoping we would panic. In years gone by, we would have obliged. Their whole plan was based on us failing.

 

But a 5 or 10 minute burst in the 4th showed the difference in class. They were still trying to smother us, and why not, they were in front. It was working. Suddenly we were finding other demons with the ball, when it spilled free we were first to it. We were playing this weird obscure thing ... Football! Put just enough on the scoreboard to snuff them out. Shows how much we have improved from last year. The players were simply not going to let it slip. That's huge.

 

Six goals in a quarter against a flood. Not bad.

 

Salem looked good. Oozing class. That's the Salem that has been waiting to emerge for some time now.

 

Weideman looks better and better. Caught with it too many times. But increasingly showing what he can be.

 

Garlett. Last year got a nasty habit of going for the spectacular but easy option. Now he's working harder and the results show.

 

Brayshaw. I think he may have peaked. Weed, Oscar, Hannan ... They show glimpses of what might be, given more games. That's why they're getting games! Tracc, Clearance used to show that, but they're past that stage; now they're delivering. Brayshaw used to show that too. Not any more. I think he's hit his ceiling.

 

Watts. Made some skill errors that shouldn't be made. Forget the name Watts, a bloke with that many games under his belt should not drop the marks he did.

 

Lewis. Looks a step off it but knows what to do when he gets it. Whether it's quick handpass, short kick, long kick, or let himself be tackled and go to ground to gain time.

This will do us more good than just winning a random match. "Just another win", tick. Four points won ugly, tick. Win in arm wrestle -- big big tick. Overcoming bogey oppo who we couldn't buy a win against -- biggest tick of all.

 

Onwards and upwards. GO DEMONS!

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

34 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Lucky Carlton stink because we play like that against most sides we lose by 10 goals.

Maybe we played like that because the CFC plan was to suffocate us.

 

33 minutes ago, Hell Bent said:

Make no mistake though, we would have lost this game against more polished opposition.

More polished opposition wouldn't bother trying to flood like that.

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

Reading the match day thread, MFCSS in full flight, even while we were still in the lead. Old habits die hard. For those who advocate not getting ahead of ourselves ... in case that infects the players' thinking! ... try this experiment. Every time you have the impulse to indulge in MFCSS .... don't! Restrain yourself. Stay positive. If you're sure that negative thinking can affect the players, see if it works in reverse. (It won't work, but the effect on yourselves might give you a pleasant surprise.)

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

2 minutes ago, Ted Fidge said:

Reading the match day thread, MFCSS in full flight, even while we were still in the lead. Old habits die hard. For those who advocate not getting ahead of ourselves ... in case that infects the players' thinking! ... try this experiment. Every time you have the impulse to indulge in MFCSS .... don't! Restrain yourself.

Never!

[drdrake 3,160]

8 minutes ago, Ted Fidge said:

Maybe we played like that because the CFC plan was to suffocate us.

If they suffocated us you can cop that, we controlled the footy should have been up by 10 goals at half time, we continued to pick wrong option or bombed it to 3 Carlton players inside our forward 50m arc. 

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

Just now, Ted Fidge said:

Maybe we played like that because the CFC plan was to suffocate us.

More polished opposition wouldn't bother trying to flood like that.

Line 1: Fact
Line 2: Fiction

We played with 8 behind the ball for the most of the first 3 quarters. So that "flood" you're talking about was our own doing. I was frustrated with Goodwins persistance but i supose when you look at the scoring "worm" we were infront most of the game so i supose he could argue it was working, despite it being horribly inefficient. He made the change for the last quarter and we won the game, best to move in I think

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

On a lighter note: Did anyone else see Hogans "celebration" after Weiderman's goal in the last? nearly knocked Weids clean over, fair to say he was a bit frustrated, given he didnt get any good delivery all day it was probably waranted frustration.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

Had we been challenged this way last year, we would have lost.  Yep, it was ugly and very frustrating, but we won.  That is the difference this year.  Let's hope the players learn from this.  You cannot go into any game, thinking it's just a matter of going through the motions  That is what it looked liked to me.  As a side line, saw Neale Daniher after the game.  While the obvious signs of MND are with him, he still looks remarkably fit and it was great to see him with his Dees scarf.  He commented that he can only see this team improving over the course of 2017 and not going backwards as we did toward the end of last year.

[dazzledavey36 54,236]

How good was Garlett run down tackle. Was Aaron Davey like.

And did anyone see Nev Jetta absolutely smoke Kruezer with a huge hip and shouldee. Kruezer went down like a sack of spuds!

[Axis of Bob 11,674]

I wasn't worried about the result yesterday. We were always in control of the game, aside from a patch int he 3rd quarter. Overall we never really looked like we'd lose.

We have no really exceptional contributions from players, but rather just kept on grinding the game until the last quarter, when we whacked on a some quick goals to kill the game. It's what good teams do.

As for a lot of the analysis I've seen on the last 11 pages ..... wow! Brayshaw vs Toumpas?!?!?!?!

[Dr. Gonzo 24,162]

21 minutes ago, drdrake said:

If they suffocated us you can cop that, we controlled the footy should have been up by 10 goals at half time, we continued to pick wrong option or bombed it to 3 Carlton players inside our forward 50m arc. 

Yeah we almost doubled the possession count I think it was 150 to 80 at quarter time. Should've put them away early.

[DeeZee 7,361]

The amount of times we kicked straight to Carlton players inside our 50 was shocking , I really hope they work on their delivery inside fifty and overuse of the ball this week

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

Just now, dazzledavey36 said:

How good was Garlett run down tackle. Was Aaron Davey like.

And did anyone see Nev Jetta absolutely smoke Kruezer with a huge hip and shouldee. Kruezer went down like a sack of spuds!

Jetta and Betts pound for pound must be among the strongest blokes in the league. Both are capable of outbodying players much bigger than themselves

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

7 minutes ago, Axis of Bob said:

As for a lot of the analysis I've seen on the last 11 pages ..... wow! Brayshaw vs Toumpas?!?!?!?!

Read the context.

Brayshaw doesn't get a lot of the ball, statistically he is very similar to Toumpas at the moment, that is all.

There was no comparison to style of play or anything else, just the numbers.

Edited April 3, 2017 by Clint Bizkit

[Ethan Tremblay 30,825]

If Brayshaw played in the same team Toumpas did, I'd suggest he'd be getting more of the ball. Toumpas' played in a completely different team at Melbourne. 

I don't care for the comparing of them statistically. Toumpas shits himself when the ball comes near him and contact is impending. 

Edited April 3, 2017 by Ethan Tremblay

[dazzledavey36 54,236]

8 minutes ago, ArtificialWisdom said:

Jetta and Betts pound for pound must be among the strongest blokes in the league. Both are capable of outbodying players much bigger than themselves

Dont know about strongest.. but for smarts they would both be up their. Its the timing when to outbody that they master so well.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, DeeZee said:

The amount of times we kicked straight to Carlton players inside our 50 was shocking , I really hope they work on their delivery inside fifty and overuse of the ball this week

It was infuriating at times, but the Blues wanted to fill our forward 50 with as many players as possible.  It was always going to happen.

Once we stopped messing around and moved the ball quickly we kicked 6 goals in the last.  It just took us 3 quarters to get it right.

[Axis of Bob 11,674]

 

13 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Read the context.

Brayshaw vs Gawn

Read the context.

Gawn doesn't get a lot of the ball, statistically he is very similar to Brayshaw at the moment, that is all.

There was no comparison to style of play or anything else, just the numbers.

[old55 23,369]

Nathan Jones has improved, he has more time and space and his disposal is excellent.  Maybe it's because we have more insiders and therefore he's able to get outside a bit more and maybe it's because he's worked hard like he always does.  I really like to see the ball in his hands now, that wasn't always the case.

Jack Watts' dropped marks were very frustrating but glass half-full is he is getting to the front in the contest and providing an option going forward through heavy congestion.  If he holds those marks, with his disposal on the other side, he's very damaging.  I think he's working very hard on his game.

[What 18,810]

Wow just read we were the youngest team in the comp on the weekend, and still have the youngest list in the AFL.  Is this accurate?

Either way we are still bloody young and this is another important win.  Like every win we will have this season.