THE BOMBERS' DOPING SAGA - THE FAT LADY SINGS

[beelzebub 23,376]

Shorten...lol...short of a brain

[Bluey's Dad 3,419]

12 hours ago, Whispering_Jack said:

Just listened to the tape and don't understand the drama. Nothing new and it seems to me that it demonstrates that the AFL and the EFC were doing their level best to make a deal that would have circumvented the anti doping rules. 

Exactly. For mine, this is something we all knew was happening, but couldn't be proven.

Now we can see Gil making assurances he can't have made and the EFC being angry they weren't kept.

For that's the drama. The attempted subversion of the anti doping rules by the AFL. Gil's the one who should be under fire here.

[george_on_the_outer 7,591]

Caro has come out this morning telling them to move on:

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-20170224-gukxno.html

If that isn't a message from Head office, I don't know what is.

But listening to the tape it became obvious that the fools at Essendon thought they had a deal with the AFL, and they probably did.  Trouble was ASADA is the prosecuting and penalty authority. 

If this was their "leadership" then all....players, coaches, supporters and sponsors have been severely led astray.  And this was the same leadership who got them into the situation in the first place.

[Wells 11 5,401]

35 minutes ago, Choke said:

Exactly. For mine, this is something we all knew was happening, but couldn't be proven.

Now we can see Gil making assurances he can't have made and the EFC being angry they weren't kept.

For that's the drama. The attempted subversion of the anti doping rules by the AFL. Gil's the one who should be under fire here.

Agreed . Except if Gil goes down its going to be portrayed as he was guilty and the bombers were innocent. Part of me would love it to be opened up again and the real extent of the performance enhancing drug use to be made public, Essendon to shamed all over again and Gil to be sacked. 

[beelzebub 23,376]

16 hours ago, rjay said:

Interesting...I would have thought him the least likely.

My bet would be...someone a bit sneakier.

What you heard ?

[rjay 24,928]

49 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

What you heard ?

Nothing 'bb', just an educated guess based on previous form but Caro seems to be pretty hot on Thompson.

[Willmoy1947 4,088]

Just like to say "thanks"

[Willmoy1947 4,088]

Great sense of humour, you moderators!!!!

[Lucifers Hero 39,809]

It seems the EFC apologists cannot win anywhere:  McDevitt cleared of lying allegations by the Senate Estimates Committee.  http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/senate-estimates-committee-clears-ben-mcdevitt-over-false-evidence-claim-20170301-guom9v.html

Importantly, he states the requested Senate Inquiry won't change anything: 

"One plain fact I would make is the obvious point that a Senate inquiry cannot have the effect of setting aside the rulings of either the finding of lawfulness of ASADA's actions by the full bench of the Federal Court, nor of the findings of doping violations against Essendon players by the Court of Arbitration for Sport," he said.

"A second plain fact I make is that so far as anti-doping matters can be litigated, either on merit or process, the Essendon matters have been finalised."

It is good and important that those facts are on the record in the Senate, which is where the requested Senate Inquiry will be considered.

McDevitt is a clever man.

[ManDee 7,148]

From :- The Age http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/jake-carlisle-yet-to-lodge-compensation-claim-with-essendon-bombers-20170301-guoi3n.html

"Essendon remain mystified as to why they cannot achieve closure with controversial former Bomber Jake Carlisle, who has not yet lodged a compensation claim against the club. "...." But they are understood to have become increasingly frustrated with Carlisle's advisers as they seek to move forward in 2017 and out of the shadow of the drug scandal that has haunted the club for four years. "...."Carlisle's manager Anthony McConville was not available for comment regarding the state of Carlisle's claim. The 25-year-old is being represented by former AFL Coaches Association lawyer Chris Pollard. While it was revealed almost 12 months ago that Carlisle's legal team had linked his 2015 illicit drug use with the trauma of his final three years at Essendon no claim has yet been put to the club."

 

My guess is that there is no financial reason to settle early, and holding out will probably get him a better payout. He may also be waiting on medical tests on himself or & children.

 

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,755]

Just now, ManDee said:

From :- The Age http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/jake-carlisle-yet-to-lodge-compensation-claim-with-essendon-bombers-20170301-guoi3n.html

"Essendon remain mystified as to why they cannot achieve closure with controversial former Bomber Jake Carlisle, who has not yet lodged a compensation claim against the club. "...." But they are understood to have become increasingly frustrated with Carlisle's advisers as they seek to move forward in 2017 and out of the shadow of the drug scandal that has haunted the club for four years. "...."Carlisle's manager Anthony McConville was not available for comment regarding the state of Carlisle's claim. The 25-year-old is being represented by former AFL Coaches Association lawyer Chris Pollard. While it was revealed almost 12 months ago that Carlisle's legal team had linked his 2015 illicit drug use with the trauma of his final three years at Essendon no claim has yet been put to the club."

 

My guess is that there is no financial reason to settle early, and holding out will probably get him a better payout. He may also be waiting on medical tests on himself or & children.

 

Is there a legal timeframe within which he must lodge any claim? Or could he choose to wait years to see what the consequences of the program may be on his longer-term health, including that of any children he may have? If there's no limit on the timeframe, we (and Essendon) could be waiting years for final closure.

[Sir Why You Little 37,038]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

It seems the EFC apologists cannot win anywhere:  McDevitt cleared of lying allegations by the Senate Estimates Committee.  http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/senate-estimates-committee-clears-ben-mcdevitt-over-false-evidence-claim-20170301-guom9v.html

Importantly, he states the requested Senate Inquiry won't change anything: 

"One plain fact I would make is the obvious point that a Senate inquiry cannot have the effect of setting aside the rulings of either the finding of lawfulness of ASADA's actions by the full bench of the Federal Court, nor of the findings of doping violations against Essendon players by the Court of Arbitration for Sport," he said.

"A second plain fact I make is that so far as anti-doping matters can be litigated, either on merit or process, the Essendon matters have been finalised."

It is good and important that those facts are on the record in the Senate, which is where the requested Senate Inquiry will be considered.

McDevitt is a clever man.

Maybe "The Justice for the 34 Campaign" could now concentrate on finding the paperwork and reciepts that i am sure actually do still exist somewhere or alternatively just F off

Stephen J Peake how it is you are given air time on radio is astounding...

Saul Goodman has far more cred than you

Edited March 2, 2017 by Sir Why You Little

[Sir Why You Little 37,038]

1 minute ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Is there a legal timeframe within which he must lodge any claim? Or could he choose to wait years to see what the consequences of the program may be on his longer-term health, including that of any children he may have? If there's no limit on the timeframe, we (and Essendon) could be waiting years for final closure.

I would be waiting as long as i could for the exact reasons you state...

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,755]

3 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

I would be waiting as long as i could for the exact reasons you state...

Of course, if he believes the products he took were harmless, he'd be better to settle quickly before the lack of harm becomes apparent.  The longer he waits the more you might assume he does not have confidence in what he was given.

[Sir Why You Little 37,038]

1 minute ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Of course, if he believes the products he took were harmless, he'd be better to settle quickly before the lack of harm becomes apparent.  The longer he waits the more you might assume he does not have confidence in what he was given.

Exactly. Carlisle doesn't like Essendrug at all, he has made that clear all along. 

DNA can be effected 2-3 generations down so i suspect this will be an ongoing case for quite a while...

[Willmoy1947 4,088]

The only thing better than a 'plain fact" is a "downright lie"

[Cards13 9,117]

1 hour ago, ManDee said:

From :- The Age http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/jake-carlisle-yet-to-lodge-compensation-claim-with-essendon-bombers-20170301-guoi3n.html

"Essendon remain mystified as to why they cannot achieve closure with controversial former Bomber Jake Carlisle, who has not yet lodged a compensation claim against the club. "...." But they are understood to have become increasingly frustrated with Carlisle's advisers as they seek to move forward in 2017 and out of the shadow of the drug scandal that has haunted the club for four years. "...."Carlisle's manager Anthony McConville was not available for comment regarding the state of Carlisle's claim. The 25-year-old is being represented by former AFL Coaches Association lawyer Chris Pollard. While it was revealed almost 12 months ago that Carlisle's legal team had linked his 2015 illicit drug use with the trauma of his final three years at Essendon no claim has yet been put to the club."

 

My guess is that there is no financial reason to settle early, and holding out will probably get him a better payout. He may also be waiting on medical tests on himself or & children.

 

hhmmm maybe they are waiting to see how he plays this season before making a claim? If he excels could they be lining up for a bigger claim?? ie I was a mess because of the whole saga and my profession was affected I want more $$.

[rjay 24,928]

Sounds familiar...

...lost the records, no backup lol.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/mar/01/british-cycling-team-sky-package-bradley-wiggins

[FireInTheBennelly 4,072]

7 minutes ago, rjay said:

Sounds familiar...

...lost the records, no backup lol.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/mar/01/british-cycling-team-sky-package-bradley-wiggins

I can't understand how 'the dog ate my homework' never once worked all those years ago back in school.

[Lucifers Hero 39,809]

35 minutes ago, rjay said:

Sounds familiar...

...lost the records, no backup lol.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/mar/01/british-cycling-team-sky-package-bradley-wiggins

Yes, so very familiar.

...and

• the doctor's records went missing
• doctor was the only one that knew what was in the bag but knows it was not the illegal stuff
• no records of purchasing the legal stuff
• but had bought more than what was needed of the illegal stuff that Wiggins had medical exemptions for in some cases.
• No explanation as to where the extra illegal stuff went.
• UKAD had met with 'a degree of resistance' in their investigation
• no audit trail
• the doctor works for the team and the governing body

It is chapter and verse the EFC story!  They learnt the art of obfuscation very well. 

Can only hope that UKAD has the fortitude of USAD (Lance Armstrong) and ASADA (Essendon) to relentlessly pursue Wiggins and Team Sky.

Edited March 2, 2017 by Lucifer's Hero

[dpositive 1,665]

2 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

I would be waiting as long as i could for the exact reasons you state...

Workers compensation claims are almost unlimited.

was advised many years ago can be lodged 99 years after death.

Asbestos claims are a good example of consequences of poor work practices

[Sir Why You Little 37,038]

1 minute ago, dpositive said:

Workers compensation claims are almost unlimited.

was advised many years ago can be lodged 99 years after death.

Asbestos claims are a good example of consequences of poor work practices

I thought that was the case

[daisycutter 29,616]

6 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Yes, so very familiar.

...and

• the doctor's records went missing
• doctor was the only one that knew what was in the bag but it wasn't the illegal stuff
• no records of purchasing the legal stuff
• but had bought more than what was needed of the illegal stuff that Wiggins had medical exemptions for in some cases.
• UKAD had met with 'a degree of resistance' in their investigation
• no audit trail
• the doctor works for the team and the governing body

It is chapter and verse the EFC story!  They learnt the art of obfuscation very well. 

Can only hope that UKAD has the fortitude of USAD (Lance Armstrong) and ASADA (Essendon) to relentlessly pursue Wiggins and Team Sky.

cue saty telling us how incompetent/corrupt/politically-influenced ukad/wada are

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,755]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Yes, so very familiar.

...and

• the doctor's records went missing
• doctor was the only one that knew what was in the bag but knows it was not the illegal stuff
• no records of purchasing the legal stuff
• but had bought more than what was needed of the illegal stuff that Wiggins had medical exemptions for in some cases.
• No explanation as to where the extra illegal stuff went.
• UKAD had met with 'a degree of resistance' in their investigation
• no audit trail
• the doctor works for the team and the governing body

It is chapter and verse the EFC story!  They learnt the art of obfuscation very well. 

Can only hope that UKAD has the fortitude of USAD (Lance Armstrong) and ASADA (Essendon) to relentlessly pursue Wiggins and Team Sky.

There is one significant difference, though. It seems that Australian sportspeople caught doping are presumed by most Australians to be innocent until proven guilty whereas non-Australian sportspeople caught doping are presumed by most Australians to be guilty until they can prove their innocence.

[old dee 23,791]

32 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

There is one significant difference, though. It seems that Australian sportspeople caught doping are presumed by most Australians to be innocent until proven guilty whereas non-Australian sportspeople caught doping are presumed by most Australians to be guilty until they can prove their innocence.

You may never speak words more true than those  LDC