21 minutes ago, Razor said:

The concern with this match is between the ears.  When we have nothing to lose (eg Hawthorn) we come out with intensity and confidence.  When we do have something to lose - when the players know that if we lose there will be hell to pay (eg Essendon, Carlton) they play differently - hesitant, indecisive, 2nd to ball.

We could tell in first 5 minutes the mindset wasn;t right.  The sad thing is nobody (coaches, player leaders) could turn it back on.

We could've easily gotten back into it had we kicked straighter in the 2nd, our intensity was right then. For most of the 2nd half we just gave up on having a forward set up though

1 hour ago, Forest Demon said:

Carlton played better, but we still could have won. Hogan and Petracca's set shots are officially an issue.

Petracca has a hook and pulls them left... Hogan needs a rebuild

Edited August 21, 20169 yr by frankie_d
Spelling

The Viney handpass to Gawn in the goal square just before half time said it all. I knew we were cooked from that moment on. Just so dumb. 

28 minutes ago, P-man said:

I thought Garlett was injured, not dropped.

To clarify you are right. I meant we had two fast players out and two plodders in

Just now, wizardinoz said:

The Viney handpass to Gawn in the goal square just before half time said it all. I knew we were cooked from that moment on. Just so dumb. 

Wasnt that the Vandenberg one? Or was this another situation? 

Just now, wizardinoz said:

The Viney handpass to Gawn in the goal square just before half time said it all. I knew we were cooked from that moment on. Just so dumb. 

That was vandenBerg 

53 minutes ago, Jock Strap said:

Easy to say when the team was terrible

But why would you flirt with form? 3 changes time a winning side when only 1 was required was stupid, especially considering the weather and dropping hard attacking triersifor a 2nd gamer and a bloke on his last legs who had barely done anything all year

1 hour ago, Rod Grinter Riot Squad said:

Disagree, obviously.

 

let them have the extra man in defence all day, that way we had an extra player for 'ball use'. Sorry, but on a wet day that makes no sense. Go man on man, get the ball and get it forward. Instead, all day, we had players look up and have Carlton numbers in front of them so they hand balled excessively. 

 

Yes there were were many other factors, but to me Roos could have changed things to stop the overuse of handball and didn't.

So Goodwin isn't at fault? It was all down to Roos was it?

My apologies to Viney

 

54 minutes ago, stuie said:

I'm usually the first to blame selection, even started a thread about it, but if you're blaming Michie, ANB and Weed for the loss today you are clueless.

We were let down by our leadership.

 

Pedersen would've been a big help especially for that get out kick. He crashes packs and makes and contest if nothing else, Weideman looked lost today

Whether it's Roos or Goodwin our coaches aren't perfect, they make mistakes. Errors at selections and some strange in game decisions. I can live with it. Everyone's an expert in hindsight.

Cartlon have played well more weeks than not this year. They aren't very young at all, far older than us, and well coaches by a coach schooled in the number 1 system that the league has right now.

I'm not all that angry about lack of effort - after the first quarter there was plenty. Or even the lack of skills. Or game plan. 

When your teams best players don't play very well and the other teams best players do AFL footy is a hard game to win.

Gawn's our best player right now and he was nullified. Viney and Jones couldn't lift the team early. Oliver and Tyson tried hard. The backs and forwards are super young an inexperienced.

A champion player could've got us right back in it and take the game away from Carlton. Even Petracca tried in the last quarter with 3 shots on goal for 0.2 and  an out on the full. 

A bad way to effectively end the season but I'm not going to go in to full melt down mode after it.

I think the players still look to someone else when things go wrong. The lose confidence and struggle to get it back. We need a strong leader with match winning capability, who drags everyone with them. Jonesy has done heaps for this club, and is a good captain, but not outstanding. Viney and Gawn aren't there yet. 

I don't think we can trade this in, because that calibre of player rarely comes on the market, and when he did he chose geelong. We can develop it, but it will take time

2 minutes ago, A F said:

So Goodwin isn't at fault? It was all down to Roos was it?

Yes, he is still the senior coach.

1 hour ago, Petraccattack said:

Last two seasons we are 0-8 vs Essendon, Carlton and St Kilda.

Thrilled that we have broken carlton's nine game losing streak

4 minutes ago, Je Roos Salem said:

We could've easily gotten back into it had we kicked straighter in the 2nd, our intensity was right then. For most of the 2nd half we just gave up on having a forward set up though

Yes you are right we had a lot of the play in the second quarter but our execution was appalling and decision making was laughable at times. 

I'm absolutely of the view this game was well on the way to being lost at selection.  There were half a dozen players who would have given us more drive today than the three inclusions, in a game in which we were admittedly poor around the ground, but still only lost by less than four goals.

I can't quite understand the calls to trade/delist ANB - he is only a second year player and one who shows a bit of toughness and go at that.  In my view is worth preserving with for at least another season.  Not sure I would have picked him today though.

Why Viv Mitchie played today absolutely bemuses me though.  He has been on a AFL list for six seasons, played 22 games, of which I hardly recall one worthy of an AFL player.  He is the absolute definition of a list clogger (is it OK to use that term, or am I offending people again?).

And yes, I'm having a good [censored] and winge here, but only because I bloody hate loosing, think our team is much better than that and thought this was a very winnable game.  Still encouraged by the gains throughout the year and looking forward to taking further steps forward next year.

25 minutes ago, Ted Fidge said:

I recall you were supposed to streak across the ground. Where were you when we needed you?

The Dee's weren't performing therefore I wasn't going too. 

Plus it was cold. 

We were due for a day like this. 

This was a highly significant game in the recent history of our club and the players did not rise to the occasion and did not use the momentum and enthusiasm generated by beating Hawthorn and Port Adelaide. Both of those teams would have easily smashed Carlton today. This group of players should hang their heads in shame for their putrid effort in an important game that could have led to a finals campaign. Shame on you.

Edited August 21, 20169 yr by Skin D

8 minutes ago, Je Roos Salem said:

We could've easily gotten back into it had we kicked straighter in the 2nd, our intensity was right then. For most of the 2nd half we just gave up on having a forward set up though

Agree, the 2nd had the right intensity and was on our terms. 2.6 to 3.3.

The loose back in the 3rd was staggering. Just meant the game was played there and we couldn't score, but maybe the plan was to wait until the 4th? We clearly didn't adapt to wet weather in the 3rd and the backline could've been torn open. 

Last quarter had some better moments but the continual overuse really undid the forward line. They couldn't get in the right spots when they never knew if the ball was coming or not.

 

Melbourne. King of the dumbs.

The thing about our losses to poor sides or when we are favourites to win is that we never lose them in a thrilling, high-quality contest. We always, always, lose them because we aren't switched from the first bounce, we look slow, lazy and disinterested, and we are jumped by a lower-quality side who tries harder than we do.

Every time. 

You could tell from the opening contest that we weren't switched on. Just like last year. And just the Essendon game, both St Kilda games. Similar to the second GC game too.

Leadership was woeful today. We don't have many leaders but Vince and Jones were both horrendous today. Vince has a disgusting habit of lairising and taking the easy/quick option when we are playing lesser opposition. Viney and Gawn are leaders and neither player anywhere near their best.

All three selection decisions were questionable at the time and with the benefit of hindsight were all wrong. Weideman should never have played, he wasn't fit enough when we played Hawthorn to get through a half, let alone the whole game. With a finals spot on the line this was not the game to be giving a friendly run to a kid with an eye on 2017. He wasn't up to it in any way today. His future looks bright but today was not the day to play him. Pedersen would have made a huge difference as he would have been able to compete where Weideman couldn't, and it would have in turn provided Hogan with a chop out. As it was, Hogan was forced up the ground and had no options closer to goal when he was making it at half-forward.

I hope the embarrassment of this loss is some sort of motivation for 2017.

31 minutes ago, stuie said:

Watts missed 1 sitter, Hogan missed 3.

And to think you're the guy who bangs on about judging forwards by kicking goals.

Hogan also had 0 tackles. 0. In the wet.

Hogan took 14 marks, ran all day, and was forced by reason of Weideman's lack of fitness to play both CHF and FF. 

He played a good game in circumstances where he had no support and the majority of his teammates were playing woefully.

Poorly directed criticism, IMO.

I lost count the amount times Gawn hit it directly to Cripps

Twenty free kicks to our five. Considering the fact that we had an equal number of scoring shots, do you think that that may have been the difference (plus the fact that the umpire ignored the the fact that most of their marks were under fifteen metres)?

7 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Agree, the 2nd had the right intensity and was on our terms. 2.6 to 3.3.

The loose back in the 3rd was staggering. Just meant the game was played there and we couldn't score, but maybe the plan was to wait until the 4th? We clearly didn't adapt to wet weather in the 3rd and the backline could've been torn open. 

Last quarter had some better moments but the continual overuse really undid the forward line. They couldn't get in the right spots when they never knew if the ball was coming or not.

 

Exactly. To not kick* a goal after that Gawn one early in the 4th was awful with the ball. The players did not care

Edited August 21, 20169 yr by Je Roos Salem