Lay off Jack Watts...

[stuie 7,374]

jones doesnt pay bills. He doesn't pay to follow the club...in fact hes on the other end....just saying.

Is Jack accountable to Chunk ...Absolutely ? Wouldn't think so. Nice of Nate to vack a team mate...Personally dont give a fcuk.

I want a premiership.

I don't get paid...in fact the opposite.

[Chook 15,013]

try engaging brain ...not youtube

Tried. Still couldn't figure it out. Something about money.

[Lucifers Hero 39,804]

jones doesnt pay bills. He doesn't pay to follow the club...in fact hes on the other end....just saying.

Is Jack accountable to Chunk ...Absolutely ? Wouldn't think so. Nice of Nate to vack a team mate...Personally dont give a fcuk.

I want a premiership.

I don't get paid...in fact the opposite.

Say that again...?

The most balanced assessment of Watts is by our captain: http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-premiership/jack-watts-lacking-confidence-but-doesnt-fear-contact-on-field-says-melbourne-kipper-nathan-jones/story-e6frf3e3-1227322101333

BB, if that doesn't convince people that Jack is an asset (who has areas to improve) then nothing will.

[beelzebub 23,376]

Tried. Still couldn't figure it out. Something about money.

Who is Jack really answerable to ? Chunk ? Or the club...and by the club read "it's supporters"? Edited April 26, 2015 by beelzebub

[stuie 7,374]

Who is Jack really answerable to ? Chunk ? Or the club...and by the club read "it's supporters"?

The captain and the coach. Not the supporters, by any stretch.

[sydneydee 687]

Watts is still one of my favourite players. My son has the number 4 on his jumper. He is clearly in our best 18.

Off field he is an asset to the club and he can help win back the younger generation.

While he is a Melbourne player we all should support him.

[dee-luded 2,959]

He retains his spot in the same way other players who have had patchy form this year eg Tyson, Dunn, Dawes, Garlett and even Lumumba.

The spotlight is always on Jack and it seems only Jack. Until he stops following the coach's instructions he stays in the side...he gets the same deal as all the players.

For all DL's and especially in the media, I hope all the anti-Watts rubbish stops this week. He plays his 100th game next Saturday. Lets focus on that for a while. A worthy and loyal achievement at a club that has struggled for his whole career. Most people acknowledge he would be a better player at Hawthorn, Geelong or a better side. Have we all forgotten the relief when re-signed a few years ago? He stuck by us. Now its for us to stick by him.

I hope the cheer squad honour him on the banner next Saturday. I hope Melbourne supporters come out in droves to celebrate. I hope we cheer him loudly. It may just be the confidence boost he needs.

I hope we all cheer for Watts in his 100th game. & I hope Wattsy shows undeniable courage in his 100th game.

I for one don't want watts to leave, I hope he manages to find the confidence & belief in himself to go 'where angels fear to tread' on the footy field of men.

..... if he doesn't find the belief & then the courage, to further his game to another level, then maybe a trade could possibly happen one day.

I do hope Wattsy can become a manly player in the Red & Blue jumper, one fine day.

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

Notice how all the players love Roos...back each other & themselves. They're playing as a united group & they are excited with the direction the club is heading. I'm excited at where the club is going...I'm excited for the players & the other long-suffering demon supporters. How about us as Supporters do what the players are doing & bond together & just back one of our own...I am heartily sick of everyone who is not involved with the MCG bagging Jack Watts. Love him or hate him....he has been one of the most criticised players of recent times & it is so unfair. Can we just not have threads like this any more....he is just one player on our list .....he doesn't deserve the pages of stupid threads.....criticise him or laud him but do it as just as one of the 22 players that take the field. And FFS show a bit of loyalty &'respect the to club, the coaches & the players you support & don't act like every half assed supporter & media sycophant out there. I for one will never post on another Jack Watts thread (unless it's to say I told you so)!

Well spoken Deestar3. If Jack did happen to visit this forum some of the unfair comments would certainly not help his present, possible lack of confidence. Hopefully though he would not be silly enough to read some of the tripe written about him on this forum. It is just so easy to sit at the computer and criticise a person who has far more ability than the arm chair critic. Bit like me as a social tennis player having a go at Murray or Nadal because he didn't have a good match.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Agree with all that Jumbo but to be fair lots of other players faced those same challenges. Most of us on here are over the no.1 tag and we understand the difference between inside and outside or contested/uncontested. I've written before about watching Watts kick the ball and wonder where the f##k it's going only to have him spot someone up through heavy traffic. But his decision making is terrible at the moment along with other aspects of his game. Grimes is out of the team at the moment and I've drawn a line through his name, not fussed if he never plays for us again and seeks a trade at years end. Watts being dropped doesn't mean the end but it could be just what he needs, go back and focus on certain areas with help of McCartney and Roos. Something as simple as being dropped for a few weeks could change his whole mindset, but if we don't try we'll never know and the mental pressure will increase each week on him.

I didn't really see the game. But I do agree with you re Watts, based on what others have sighted of his game on the weekend. disappointed he hasn't responded to the criticism of him.

I think really then that maybe some weeks at Casey to work his butt off, under instruction to work on areas of weakness, to try to get those areas up a notch or two... any improvement on his tackling & contested work would be a godsend.

and may just help his confidence & enjoyment of his footy. this is what I really want to see him do, play real footy.

come on Jack its not as hard as you think it is, go in son, but go in HARD, & hit hard, make like a rock & crunch... just not tooo high.

AD, that's the thing....I don't think a stint in the seconds will prove beneficial at all.

By your own admission, you wonder how he finds players in traffic.....I don't believe there's enough development at Casey for him to find those players, as they're still working on structures. Thus, his frustration levels will rise and may push him back further.

Freo will be a terrific test for this young team....and, if we're to be competitive, JW needs to be in that selected 22.

he can concentrate on the things he's weakest at,,, get tuition on those & focus on those. his strengths should remain for 3 or 4 weeks without any trouble, but his non-efforts in some of his problem areas are glaring. he needs to be more rounded out, so his all round game improves, & all his teammates can feel proud of him... not trying in your weak areas, is just a cop out.

its our clubs fault he played before these areas were addressed properly; all players should be willing & able in defensive areas, before they are given their first games.

I don't think there are many disagreeing with your last line - the point being made by timD and t_u is that we ignore others that perpetrate the same sins as Watts. That isn't delusion.

Don't lump all those that think he cops too much nonsense, with the few who say he shouldn't cop anything.

a lot of JW apologists are off the mark thinking we don't care when others put in the short step, or pull out of a contest. its equally bad when anyone does this.

but those others have proven they have the courage & the commitment to the jumper & team, to do the things that worry them... if they put one bad one in occasionally you cut them some slack. that's all that is.

But JWatts has not earned his courageous mouse stripes as yet, and until he shows this level of courage, & of commitment to the jumper & team mates, he will cop it, & cop it sweet.

Watts stays in the team because he still offers more than those playing at Casey, despite his skill level being down this year. And he is still contributing to the team.

After watching the replay for a 2nd time, there's no doubt that he works hard when it comes to running both ways, but he doesn't work hard in a contest, and never has. All his coaches have bent over backwards to accommodate him, by changing his roles to suit his play. But at the end of the day, it's up to him to show more heart for the contest.

and the injuries will save his bacon & eggs once again... but maybe not his career in the future. jack has talent, loads of it,,,,, but his soft footy side is just a sbad as his best footy side.

Jack will be the one who makes it, or breaks jack watts career.

Edited April 26, 2015 by dee-luded

[Robbie57 2,020]

The captain and the coach. Not the supporters, by any stretch.

If the captain is behind him why aren't we? About time we got behind him.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Watts wasn't soft on Friday night, amazingly it was his skills that let him down.

He won't get dropped, nor should he.

[binman 42,961]

From the Hun:

'ON THE BLOCK: It’s hard to see Paul Roos making any forced changes after such a spirited win. Jack Watts lifted his intensity after a disappointing performance against the Crows and laid four tackles along with 14 disposals and a goal.'

As Clint rightfully says Watts wasn't soft on Friday night and of course he wont be dropped.

Roos has been crystal clear what his players need to do to remain in the team. Run both ways and play their role. Watts does both. A coach brave enough to drop an ex captain and much respected player would not hesitate to drop Watts if he wasn't meeting those two non negotiables.

It really is ridiculous how a handful of commentators (and some DL posters) have run with this notion of him ducking his head and being soft. Equally ridiculous how some recommend dropping him as some sort of sign that his play is not acceptable.

Such a position surely must relate to prefixed ideas about Watts that are unlikely to change, even when there is evidence to the contrary.

It is also amazing how the goal posts shift for Watts. People criticized him for lack of intent, not tackling enough, not beating opponents one on one and not competing in the air and when he achieves those things (as the stats attest to, as does the vision and the fact he gets picked each week) suddenly it is the perceived ducking of the head, which some seem to be suggesting is a chronic issue when in fact it has rarely occurred and i would argue didn't this week.

Watts brilliantly out points his opponent in a one on one duel, doesn't mark it but wins the ball and turns on a dime. What does Commeti say when he miskicks the ball - deplorable effort. Despite the fact that he had a man on his tail and he didn't kick the ball to an opposition player or on the full. It just went out of bounds, unlike Brayshaw, a brilliant kick of the ball normally who under no pressure kicks the ball straight out on the full entering the forward 50 (at a crucial time i might add).

Watts drops a ball in the driving rain and it is evidence of his softness but Cross drops a similar one, Garland drops an even easier one (all by himself and when the rain has eased) and a tiger player drops a sitter. Barely a word said about those though.

No mention - anywhere that i have seen- is made of his effort in the last second or so of the first quarter to fly into a pack, running with the flight of the ball. This is often seen as the very epitome of braveness yet Watts does it and gets no kudos.

What about his effort to redeem himself after coughing up the ball with a miskick on the half back flank (which by the by came after he had gut run from the forward line tracking the ball as the tiges moved it forward) and the tiges scoring a point from the turnover? On the resulting (fast) kick out he wills himself to the opposite pocket and dives across the boot of a player having a shot on goal causing him to miss. Crucial - but again no praise and many of those with fixed ideas would say that it was simply a poor kick and Watts efforts had no bearing on it.

What about Watts gut running? Look at where he gets so many of his possessions - in the back half. Remember he is a forward. I'd bet London to a brick that outside of our mids he leads the GPS stats (Saty could you check this at training please). But his critics would just say he jogs around at half pace and picks up easy kicks. Bollocks.

Look at the goal he he got. He tackled Rance on the wing and caused him to handball our way and cough it up (though his critics would say he just got lucky and Rance made an error - he seems to get lucky a lot). He then ran with the MFC player, directed him to kick it to a leading player, kept running forward and then doubled back to offer the lead. After that gut running he was able to mark the ball under intense pressure from Martin (though not in the rain as i mistakenly posted previously). Does he get kudos for this gut running? No. The focus from some is on his lucky 50 meters.

That was a crucial goal as was the goal he set up with the beautiful 15 meter handball he gave to Vandenburg (after snaring the ball from the pack - though i'm positive some would say this was lucky). Roos said Jones had improved because he had become a team player. Watts has always been a team player and this was just another example where he put his team mates into scoring positions (as opposed to firing away himself, which a more selfish player would have), as was the beautiful handball he fed to Newton about 20 metres from goal (Newton missed) and the tap out where he went third man up from a stoppage at the same end that ended up with Tyson. Kudos? Not a one.

As someone noted that video of Watts bloopers on the AFL site is an absolute disgrace and the club should ask them to take it down. Even better they should produce a highlights package from the tigers game showing the plays noted above and the others he did, eg the marking contests he halved, bringing the ball to ground (something he has been roundly criticized for not doing - 'all we want is for him to compete!' yet when he starts doing it not a peep from this critics).

Edited April 27, 2015 by binman

[dees189227 12,394]

Watts plays his 100th match this week. Has there been a more scrutinised player to play 100 games. Anyway lets hope its a good one.

[CBDees 3,167]

Well said Binman. It is nice to see some supporters look objectively at the efforts put in by our players. Roos does not get it wrong in his team selections.

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,734]

As someone noted that video of Watts bloopers on the AFL site is an absolute disgrace and the club should ask them to take it down. Even better they should produce a highlights package from the tigers game showing the plays noted above and the others he did, eg the marking contests he halved, bringing the ball to ground (something he has been roundly criticized for not doing - 'all we want is for him to compete!' yet when he starts doing it not a peep from this critics).

Thanks Binman. I mentioned that earlier and I totally agree with your points. It's beyond a joke the way the media and everybody treats him. I'm sick of it and think I might write to the club with a complaint about that video because it's a disgrace and the club should stick up for their players.

[Gator 17,350]

... It is just so easy to sit at the computer and criticise a person who has far more ability than the arm chair critic.

His "ability" doesn't impress me. I love Barassi's thoughts on natural ability. He didn't respect it. It comes from your parents and doesn't warrant respect.

It's how hard you work to make the most of your natural talents that warrants respect. Watts has been blessed with more talent than most and I have no respect for what he's done with it.

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,734]

His "ability" doesn't impress me. I love Barassi's thoughts on natural ability. He didn't respect it. It comes from your parents and doesn't warrant respect.

It's how hard you work to make the most of your natural talents that warrants respect. Watts has been blessed with more talent than most and I have no respect for what he's done with it.

ProDee I think everyone knows you don't like Watts and I doubt you ever will.

As mentioned by Binman above he does work hard in the majority of games running to create separation from his opponent. I think he can definitely improve in this area even more, but to say he doesn't work hard is incorrect.

Edited April 27, 2015 by Is Dom Is Good

[robbiefrom13 887]

I came to trash. Know already what will happen. I'm a supporter.

[Mad_Melbourne 877]

i had this older supporter behind me on Friday and everything Watts did he would continue to whinge and whine about how poor it was "handball to Vandenberg, just kick the goal yourself, oh your so pathetic" was my personal highlight. It made me think he was not the full quid, after putting myself through reading all 9 pages of this (I am clearly not all there) but i have come to the conclusion that if we do not have some of the stupidest "supporters" we are definitely in the top 4.

Watts effort was at an AFL standard, did he make some execution errors? yes. did everyone? yes.

People making statements about poor workrate or lack of effort are clearly not watching the game and really have little to no idea about football and it is just embarassing to read all your dribble.

[stuie 7,374]

His "ability" doesn't impress me. I love Barassi's thoughts on natural ability. He didn't respect it. It comes from your parents and doesn't warrant respect.

It's how hard you work to make the most of your natural talents that warrants respect. Watts has been blessed with more talent than most and I have no respect for what he's done with it.

ProDee, just type "Me hate Jack Watts, me like football" then ctrl+c, ctrl+v. Will save us all some time.

[Slartibartfast 17,279]

His "ability" doesn't impress me. I love Barassi's thoughts on natural ability. He didn't respect it. It comes from your parents and doesn't warrant respect.

It's how hard you work to make the most of your natural talents that warrants respect. Watts has been blessed with more talent than most and I have no respect for what he's done with it.

And what makes you think attitude, mental ability, determination and courage aren't inherited or at least genetic traits.

Look at young kids and observe the difference in these characteristics.

Anyway good to know you're a big fan of Jordie, Ro and Jake who all have the attributes you respect most. Oh, hold on.......

[hemingway 7,627]

There are not many footballers if any that have been subjected to the criticism, negativity, and ridicule as Jack Watts. What concerns me most are the comments from the media (recent comments from Wayne Carey aside). Indeed, I have developed some respect for Wayne as a result of his comments. He had the capacity to look inside himself and ask the question. We should all do the same with Jack. The ridicule of Jack has now gone on for over 5 years. It is not always ridicule or criticism but there are on-going comments about the comments if you know what I mean. The ridicule I find particularly unfair and unreasonable. We would not make these comments of our sons or daughters so why do we think it fair game to make them of some one we do not know. I have vented my frustrations with Jack but it has not made me feel any better only worse.

I do not know Jack but he must be very resilient character and have a lot of inner strength. He also must have a lot of support from family, friends and his football club. Fortunately he has the unwavering support of his coach. However, the commentary from others is relentless. People will say well that's the nature of the gig. Public figures just have to cop it. However, most of us would not be able to cop it. It it was a normal work environment, we would pack our bag and leave. We need to remember that we talking about a person not an object. We need to remember the impact that this sort of sustained ridicule and questioning of a persons abilities and character can have on a person. People will say he is a footballer earning big money as a justification for negative comment. I disagree. He is a nice bloke, a decent person. He has feelings, doubts, sensitivities and weaknesses. However, does he deserve all the comments that are made of him? He is not a murderer, rapist or drug dealer. I am seriously concerned about the impact that this must be having on Jack, the person. A decent and kind individual. To all those Jack critics think before you comment. How would you feel if people were making these comments about you or a family member?

I would not blame Jack for walking away from the game. I am concerned that he might. It is a real option for him. I don't want to see that happen but it may be the best thing for him. We all want to be be treated with respect, kindness and consideration. We should show some to Jack.

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,734]

There are not many footballers if any that have been subjected to the criticism, negativity, and ridicule as Jack Watts. What concerns me most are the comments from the media (recent comments from Wayne Carey aside). Indeed, I have developed some respect for Wayne as a result of his comments. He had the capacity to look inside himself and ask the question. We should all do the same with Jack. The ridicule of Jack has now gone on for over 5 years. It is not always ridicule or criticism but there are on-going comments about the comments if you know what I mean. The ridicule I find particularly unfair and unreasonable. We would not make these comments of our sons or daughters so why do we think it fair game to make them of some one we do not know. I have vented my frustrations with Jack but it has not made me feel any better only worse.

I do not know Jack but he must be very resilient character and have a lot of inner strength. He also must have a lot of support from family, friends and his football club. Fortunately he has the unwavering support of his coach. However, the commentary from others is relentless. People will say well that's the nature of the gig. Public figures just have to cop it. However, most of us would not be able to cop it. It it was a normal work environment, we would pack our bag and leave. We need to remember that we talking about a person not an object. We need to remember the impact that this sort of sustained ridicule and questioning of a persons abilities and character can have on a person. People will say he is a footballer earning big money as a justification for negative comment. I disagree. He is a nice bloke, a decent person. He has feelings, doubts, sensitivities and weaknesses. However, does he deserve all the comments that are made of him? He is not a murderer, rapist or drug dealer. I am seriously concerned about the impact that this must be having on Jack, the person. A decent and kind individual. To all those Jack critics think before you comment. How would you feel if people were making these comments about you or a family member?

I would not blame Jack for walking away from the game. I am concerned that he might. It is a real option for him. I don't want to see that happen but it may be the best thing for him. We all want to be be treated with respect, kindness and consideration. We should show some to Jack.

Good post Hemingway. I actually made a complaint to the footy club via email last night in regards to the video shown on the AFL website. I think it's a disgrace that they would post a video trying to show all the things he did wrong in a game. I want to see the club stick up for its players and we shouldn't have to take that $hit.

Edited April 28, 2015 by Is Dom Is Good

[H_T 3,047]

Jack works hard both ways, but when it's time to contest in marking contests - when he can make it - he often chooses to let another contest and try take the crumb OR let it go uncontested. He still needs a bit of **** in him and an injection of will to get to the contest - which he doesnt have. He'll compete when he knows the ball is meant for him, however he is undecided when it's not meant for him, not realising he can make it - and make an impact.

Roos remains frustrated with his lack on confidence and apparent non-appetite for contact. ref: Recent marking clangers v Rich, v Adel.

Watching Jesse go about his work for a period of time, you think would rub off. Not so as yet.

[hardtack 10,537]

Jack works hard both ways, but when it's time to contest in marking contests - when he can make it - he often chooses to let another contest and try take the crumb OR let it go uncontested. He still needs a bit of **** in him and an injection of will to get to the contest - which he doesnt have. He'll compete when he knows the ball is meant for him, however he is undecided when it's not meant for him, not realising he can make it - and make an impact.

Roos remains frustrated with his lack on confidence and apparent non-appetite for contact. ref: Recent marking clangers v Rich, v Adel.

Watching Jesse go about his work for a period of time, you think would rub off. Not so as yet.

Yep... and I am guessing that is why Roos keeps naming him in the side?