For those defending Lumumba because he attacks people being non PC.

I worked in the US with someone similar.

When someone' does something not PC, he uses that as an excuse to really give them a talking down, really tear them apart publicly. He enjoys being superior, oppressing, psychologically bullying the other, and if someone complains he says they're defending the non PC act he's ostensibly riling against, so anyone against him must be guilty of the heinous non PC thing he's pretending his bullying session is all about.

Hope you understood that. Also has to be the center of attention.

Lumumba seems the same. It's a selfish, non team spirited mindset to be avoided.

Tell him god does not exist and put your smoke out in his salad.

For those defending Lumumba because he attacks people being non PC.

I worked in the US with someone similar.

When someone' does something not PC, he uses that as an excuse to really give them a talking down, really tear them apart publicly. He enjoys being superior, oppressing, psychologically bullying the other, and if someone complains he says they're defending the non PC act he's ostensibly riling against, so anyone against him must be guilty of the heinous non PC thing he's pretending his bullying session is all about.

Hope you understood that. Also has to be the center of attention.

Lumumba seems the same. It's a selfish, non team spirited mindset to be avoided.

Isn't the essence of camaraderie and team spirit to respect your teammates irrespective of class, race, sexuality, whatever? You're criticising him for calling out people that *aren't* like that, in essence trying to argue he's the antithesis of team spirit.

Look, I hate the ultraPC [censored] as much as the next guy, but a good culture is not one that makes a mockery of lifestyle and brushes it off as "team spirit". That's not professionalism.

I agree that his type tend to think the absolute worst of people for the most trivial of reasons, but you can't seriously blame him for not wanting the club he's involved with to have a culture of homophobia. I'm not gay and I tend to think debate on issues surrounding homosexual lifestyle (like gay marriage) are mindlessly tedious, but that doesn't mean I have a free pass to act intolerant towards that lifestyle, no matter how casual or good intentioned the comments and acts may be (the mardi gras scandal seems very trivial, admittedly).

There must be more to the story and he probably just want an environment where a group of men can get along and be mates without joking like 15 year-olds. It's not an unreasonable expectation to have as an adult.

I would take him in a heartbeat. He's run and drive out of half-back is something this team is absolutely screaming out for.

The fact some are arguing they don't want him because he tries to rise *above* a culture of homophobia and racism is quite astonishing. I'd rather a bloke like that than someone that hangs around with bikie criminals, or has a history of alcohol and/or drug abuse.

Isn't the essence of camaraderie and team spirit to respect your teammates irrespective of class, race, sexuality, whatever? You're criticising him for calling out people that *aren't* like that, in essence trying to argue he's the antithesis of team spirit.

Look, I hate the ultraPC [censored] as much as the next guy, but a good culture is not one that makes a mockery of lifestyle and brushes it off as "team spirit". That's not professionalism.

I agree that his type tend to think the absolute worst of people for the most trivial of reasons, but you can't seriously blame him for not wanting the club he's involved with to have a culture of homophobia. I'm not gay and I tend to think debate on issues surrounding homosexual lifestyle (like gay marriage) are mindlessly tedious, but that doesn't mean I have a free pass to act intolerant towards that lifestyle, no matter how casual or good intentioned the comments and acts may be (the mardi gras scandal seems very trivial, admittedly).

There must be more to the story and he probably just want an environment where a group of men can get along and be mates without joking like 15 year-olds. It's not an unreasonable expectation to have as an adult.

I would take him in a heartbeat. He's run and drive out of half-back is something this team is absolutely screaming out for.

The fact some are arguing they don't want him because he tries to rise *above* a culture of homophobia and racism is quite astonishing. I'd rather a bloke like that than someone that hangs around with bikie criminals, or has a history of alcohol and/or drug abuse.

I asolutely agree with your post Praha, ..except the highlighted sentence which shows you didn't fully understand my post. And that's what makes the subject most delicate to see through. I've been around those activist causes a lot. Supported much of it.

I didn't criticize him for calling people out who aren't like that at all. Not at all. I'm saying he seems to have used good causes as an excuse to further his own selfish wants (which also isn't team spirited). It's not the biggest deal in the world, but when that happens in the PC world it's a shame.

Go and watch the Dane Swan footage on one of the footy shows where he talks about Harry - and says he hopes he stays. His description of him is the complete opposite of the picture you paint - though you don't know HL in any case, so how the (*&^%$ would you know what he's actually like?

You might also like to go back to the original story - HL didn't "attack people", or attack anyone for that matter. He complained to the club that they weren't doing enough in response to what had happened.

etc etc

My god ... the longer this goes on, the more I hope he comes to the Dees.

You're right, I've not met him Bing. And it's just my opinion, so no big deal.

I've read a lot of things Lumumba wrote, noticed what he's done and what he's been quoted saying.

I worked and hung out a lot in the US for 12 - 13 years with someone who seemed very similar and was extremely charming (when getting what he wanted). We'd say nice things publicly about him too. Not saying Dane Swan wasn't right tho.

Your part I highlighted is exactly what he, or I'm guessing HL'd want us to think was going on when he used PC as an excuse for oppressive verbal attacks on people (I just meant verbal of course, should have said "criticism") putting them down while aggrandizing himself. Complaining to the club could be similar.

Why do you think HL thought he would be a more appropriate person to meet the Dali Lama than any of millions of others? Doesn't it seem he thinks he's better than other people?

Anyhow I'll trust Roos's judgement.

Tell him god does not exist and put your smoke out in his salad.

Laughed at your post, as usual Biffen. .was about to hit "like," then realized some would take it the wrong way.

Would take Harry in a heart beat. He appears to have more go in him than Frawley. He takes the game on and tries to go forward, just what we need. So what if he played for Collingwood, so did Christ Dawes and I think he is great!

Would take Harry in a heart beat. He appears to have more go in him than Frawley. He takes the game on and tries to go forward, just what we need. So what if he played for Collingwood, so did Christ Dawes and I think he is great!

Christ Dawes.

Why hasn't he been capable of the sorts of miracles we need?

Make it happen Roos, Lumumba is a player we NEED.

Laughed at your post, as usual Biffen. .was about to hit "like," then realized some would take it the wrong way.

My sister lives in LA.

When she lived in NYC there would be Happy Christians camping outside her apartment every xmas.

Every day she would hear Merry Christmas,God Loves you etc.

To which she would reply,

Good get the F%$k out of my face and take all your bullshyte somewhere else.

I have been to LA myself and they are the worst.

Is your entire kin misanthropic Biffen?

Damaged Goods - Do not accept.

Wow, I thought Demonland was a footy forum....

Seems like it has been ambushed as a forum to dispute everything from Sexuality, Religion, Discrimination, Racism, Depression etc etc.

Has anyone got any footy news????

Get back on topic ....burner!

we will get him

Lets forget the personality issues and judge him by his football capability and what he can bring to the club. I think he would be an asset off the half back line, question is how much is it going to cost, collingwood is not noted for their generosity in trading. They think even their refuse is worth more than our best.

It was thrown up on SEN as a WATTS for LUMUMBA trade... Interested to see peoples thoughts...

I know DL and the broader AFL community talk about it all the time, but I just can't see Watts being traded. Internally I reckon the club loves him, certainly that was the impression I got from the B&F and the impression given all season long.

It was thrown up on SEN as a WATTS for LUMUMBA trade... Interested to see peoples thoughts...

No bloody way. I know Watts has never lived up to the hype, but he is worth more than HL. Lumumba wants out and the Pies want him gone, a 3rd rounder should suffice, but the filth play like Essendon when it comes to trade time (massively overvalue their players' and undervalue the others).

Watts on the open market would be worth an early second rounder.

No bloody way. I know Watts has never lived up to the hype, but he is worth more than HL. Lumumba wants out and the Pies want him gone, a 3rd rounder should suffice, but the filth play like Essendon when it comes to trade time (massively overvalue their players' and undervalue the others).

Watts on the open market would be worth an early second rounder.

It is an interesting one.. Watts certainly has divided opinion. I know some Melbourne fans who think he will turn the corner and i know others who think he stands for all that is wrong with this club. I am not sure of Watts value on the open market, but he is perhaps worth more than Harry in return.

Labamba for Clark.

Labamba for Clark.

I don't know which type of personality would be worse

It was thrown up on SEN as a WATTS for LUMUMBA trade... Interested to see peoples thoughts...

No thank you. (Spoken in that deliberate way your mum had when you were really in the s*7$.

Lumumba does not cut it for me - has been exposed in a less than very good team as a one trick pony.

Watts has more skill more time and more upside.

There must be more to the story and he probably just want an environment where a group of men can get along and be mates without joking like 15 year-olds. It's not an unreasonable expectation to have as an adult.

Collingwood have a history of "culture" issues, it's only 12 months ago that the shot hit the fan when Darren Jolly also managed to get himself offside. On leaving he made the point that there were "a select few that are a bit of a problem", and also commented that some at Collingwood didn't like players speaking out or challenging the status quo.

Not been the same club on or off field since Malthouse left.

Lumumba does not cut it for me - has been exposed in a less than very good team as a one trick pony.

You mean the trick of averaging 20 possessions a game?

Would be useful, we only have a handful who seem to have mastered it, and none in the backline.

(BTW, we finished second last this season).

No thank you. (Spoken in that deliberate way your mum had when you were really in the s*7$.

Lumumba does not cut it for me - has been exposed in a less than very good team as a one trick pony.

Watts has more skill more time and more upside.

Yeah, Watts has more upside, like smiling lots and giving high fives and hugs to his mates over the member's fence.

Geez, my 15 yr old cat attacks a ball with more ferocity than Jackie. Has the skills and vision to really be something, and had a reasonable to poor year IMO. Makes me scream uncharacteristically vile obscenities over the fence in frustration. I even made BBO blush once, would've messaged the abusive behaviour number, however he can't text yet.

Back on topic, those thinking Lumumba wouldn't add dash and class out of the back line and would improve our list are kidding themselves. He'd be fine in our change rooms, we are not like those black and white bigots down Olympic Park way.