Bombers scandal: charged, <redacted> and <infracted>

[Bedraggled Dee 336]

I agree Pink, I think the NRL's strategy in hindsight seems the better approach. I think Demitriou acted to protect the brand and the Bombers but in the end due mainly to the beligerence of Hird and Co he has not acheived that. It is easy to sit in judgement after the event but at the end of the day he is paid a lot of money to get this right. This is by far the biggest issue the AFL has faced in my time following the game and linking the AFL to the ASADA investigation appears to have been a mistake. I dont think he or anyone else predicted the way Essendon would react when this started. Hird and Co obviously follow the "attack is the best form of defence" school which is their right but may not the right thing to do. IMO if Evans was still at the helm this would have played out differently.

[pitmaster 3,110]

Demetriou's mistake has been to try to manage the crisis without knowing the full extent of what Essendon were up to, and without securing their absolute compliance with his method.

Once he could not get that he needed to throw the Bombers on the bonfire.

[Bedraggled Dee 336]

Not sure as the CEO of the competition he should ever do that. he is duty bound to act in the best interests of the competition and that means where possible acting in the best interests of Essendon (by that I mean the club not Hird). I think that was occuring with Evans even though the objectives of Evans and Demitriou were never going to be identical but Little has come in on the back of the Hirdy train and is far more focussed on being combative than doing what he can to join forces with the AFL. While the desired outcomes for individuals and the AFL are different (ie whats best for Hird is not nessecarily best for the AFL) the strategic outcomes are identical (whats best for Essendon is best for AFL). The issue is that Hird thinks he is the Essendon Football Club and as a consequence we have ended up with the circus. What Essendon have done is push the AFL closer to ASADA, they are morons!!!!!!!!

[binman 39,095]

I agree Pink, I think the NRL's strategy in hindsight seems the better approach. I think Demitriou acted to protect the brand and the Bombers but in the end due mainly to the beligerence of Hird and Co he has not acheived that. It is easy to sit in judgement after the event but at the end of the day he is paid a lot of money to get this right. This is by far the biggest issue the AFL has faced in my time following the game and linking the AFL to the ASADA investigation appears to have been a mistake. I dont think he or anyone else predicted the way Essendon would react when this started. Hird and Co obviously follow the "attack is the best form of defence" school which is their right but may not the right thing to do. IMO if Evans was still at the helm this would have played out differently.

Good post. I have to say i didn't think the joint investigation was a bad idea but in hindsight it clearly was. What i would say is that rather that whilst Little has been abrasive Hird has been the real wild card. The AFL would have expected it all to disappear but they underestimated Hird's manic refusal to let it go. I best they wished they slugged him harder. But given they control the draw (amongst other things) the AFL have still got some cards to play in terms of whacking the bombers

[rjay 24,046]

Not sure as the CEO of the competition he should ever do that. he is duty bound to act in the best interests of the competition and that means where possible acting in the best interests of Essendon (by that I mean the club not Hird). I think that was occuring with Evans even though the objectives of Evans and Demitriou were never going to be identical but Little has come in on the back of the Hirdy train and is far more focussed on being combative than doing what he can to join forces with the AFL. While the desired outcomes for individuals and the AFL are different (ie whats best for Hird is not nessecarily best for the AFL) the strategic outcomes are identical (whats best for Essendon is best for AFL). The issue is that Hird thinks he is the Essendon Football Club and as a consequence we have ended up with the circus. What Essendon have done is push the AFL closer to ASADA, they are morons!!!!!!!!

I think you've put it pretty well here.

[beelzebub 22,344]

The joint investigation was the fulcrum for all of this mess.

[old dee 22,983]

The joint investigation was the fulcrum for all of this mess.

I don't agree bb

Hird and the FD at Essendon are the reason for this mess.

Everything else flows from their actions IMO

[rjay 24,046]

I don't agree bb

Hird and the FD at Essendon are the reason for this mess.

Everything else flows from their actions IMO

Yep 'old dee' and it's a pity they won't take responsibility for their actions.

[Bedraggled Dee 336]

I agree OD. The other presidents must be shaking their heads. I am surprised about the defening silence from them, There would be a fair bit said behind closed door I am tipping.

[beelzebub 22,344]

I don't agree bb

Hird and the FD at Essendon are the reason for this mess.

Everything else flows from their actions IMO

No , No

There was no precedent for a joint investigation. it was folly ( proven ) and thwart with danger from the get go. It had to be by its very nature conflicted. You cant have total transparency if the investigated is a co -investigator . The AFL's involvement wasnt at all necessary in order for WADA/SADA to carry out its job.

Its about a 99% certainty Vlad opened his mouth ( deliberately or otherwise..i'm picking the former ) when he ought not have. His agenda is not that of WADA"s therein lies the conflict and its undoing ( AFL's ).

[daisycutter 28,691]

was it really a genuine joint investigation?

or was it more a concurrent investigation?

is the joint/concurrent investigation by the afl still active?

[Biffen 12,433]

was it really a genuine joint investigation?

or was it more a concurrent investigation?

is the joint/concurrent investigation by the afl still active?

Add a Workcover investigation to that.

[beelzebub 22,344]

was it really a genuine joint investigation?

or was it more a concurrent investigation?

is the joint/concurrent investigation by the afl still active?

Hird: The main game is still in play

reference

"The AFL's insistence on a joint investigation with ASADA has certainly not been the huge success the AFL suggested it was.

It did give each party greater powers and access to information that wouldn't have otherwise been available had they gone at it alone, but it has come at a cost in terms of public perception and has potentially compromised independence.

The interim report, that ASADA was pressured into delivering essentially so the AFL could protect its brand and integrity by eliminating Essendon from the finals, may not have been the wisest course of action.

While Demetriou has said the joint AFL-ASADA investigation would be a template for future investigations, it's understood WADA will never endorse another joint investigation with a sport and no major sporting code would ever compromise itself by agreeing to a shared inquiry with ASADA."

[Sir Why You Little 34,939]

If there wasn't a joint investigation in this mess Essendon would have played finals in 2013 and to this point no penalties would have been bought down. That would have been far worse.

The AFL were always going to get burnt whichever path they took.

They chose the correct one

[Bluey's Dad 3,419]

If there wasn't a joint investigation in this mess Essendon would have played finals in 2013 and to this point no penalties would have been bought down. That would have been far worse.

The AFL were always going to get burnt whichever path they took.

They chose the correct one

And of course it gave us the situation of Richmond being the only club ever to make the finals and lose to 9th.

That alone makes it all worthwhile.

[daisycutter 28,691]

If there wasn't a joint investigation in this mess Essendon would have played finals in 2013 and to this point no penalties would have been bought down. That would have been far worse.

The AFL were always going to get burnt whichever path they took.

They chose the correct one

maybe

the tipping point for the afl sanctions including finals was the ASADA INTERIM REPORT and to a lesser degree the Switkowski report

this could still have been delivered without a joint investigation (though probably unlikely)

[daisycutter 28,691]

And of course it gave us the situation of Richmond being the only club ever to make the finals and lose to 9th.

That alone makes it all worthwhile.

LIKE

[beelzebub 22,344]

If there wasn't a joint investigation in this mess Essendon would have played finals in 2013 and to this point no penalties would have been bought down. That would have been far worse.

The AFL were always going to get burnt whichever path they took.

They chose the correct one

far from it WYL Vlad and Co are so deep in their own manure its farcial Look where they are..they are being manipulated and roughed up by the Windy Hill gang...its laughable

[binman 39,095]

If there wasn't a joint investigation in this mess Essendon would have played finals in 2013 and to this point no penalties would have been bought down. That would have been far worse.

The AFL were always going to get burnt whichever path they took.

They chose the correct one

I had thought that but i don't now.

The AFL should have done an investigation based purely on the breakdown of governance and for the supplement program itself (ie the processes involved - lack of records, off site injections, players health put at risk, experimental program etc etc) and left ASADA to focus on the use of performance menacing drugs.

I reckon there was enough in the bombers own report ('pharmacological experimental environment, sidelining medical staff etc) to hit them with sanctions anyway. If they needed more they could have got it. For one thing the AFL could have said prove to us that your players were not administered anything harmful to their health - produce your records.

[beelzebub 22,344]

There can only be one reason why Vlad wanted the AFL involved...and its blown up in their face...as it ought to. Corruption...Fish rotting etc.

the jokes on them, the inept bastards !!

WADA had its misgivings and are proven correct. The AFL is a laughing stock now on the world sports stage.

[Bedraggled Dee 336]

I am not sure it should be called corruption but they attempted to manipulate and exert some control believing that was what was best for the comp and through a number of circumstances some beyond there control it has blown up in their face. I doubt that Demetriou and the AFL attempted to act illegally but there actions have been close to that on occasions (warning Evans). I am cnvinced that AD was advised on the side by sources in governement of what was coming and acted on that info to warn Evans and to get on te front foot and that is exactly what he should do. Doubt he will do that for Essendon again. What would be the commentry if he new this was coming and dd nothing?

I dont blame the AFL, they did not implement a supplements program or employ Dank that is all Essendons doing. They were trying to clean up the mess post event and have done it in a messy way.

[beelzebub 22,344]

I am not sure it should be called corruption but they attempted to manipulate

not a bad definition is it ??

[Bedraggled Dee 336]

The point is what would you expct the AFL to do, stand back and just let it unfold and have not influence over it? There is a big diffenerence in the way the same facts are interpreted, analysed and disseminated and influencing that does not nessecarily involve corruption. Lawyers do it ever day

[Wolfmother 182]

^^^^* I think you are right hird keeps trying to bring up that they were tipped off by AD like its the major issue rather the them injecting PEDs

The issue is the briefing AD received was from the ACC was confidential and he signed a consent that if he relieved the details he was in breach of the law ( don't know the actual offence but it has to powers the ACC has ). I have no doubt he told Evans but if that is proven he would be charged by the ACC and that's what hird wants to demonstrate because he is [censored] off with AD and wants him to go down for something

[beelzebub 22,344]

The point is what would you expct the AFL to do, stand back and just let it unfold and have not influence over it? There is a big diffenerence in the way the same facts are interpreted, analysed and disseminated and influencing that does not nessecarily involve corruption. Lawyers do it ever day

if Essendon are as guilty as some suspect, if they have indeed not only misrepresented the facts to those in their care, but opened a can of worms regarding any health problems yet to surface, then I expect the FULL weight of the LAW to fall on them, not some half twisted self serving imposter of such as enacted by the league.

The AFL has seemingly conspired to create an outcome of its own suiting. A pox on them

Edited December 19, 2013 by beelzebub