The Tom Scully Saga

[Mazer Rackham 14,970]

A person VERY close to Tom Scully ...

Gubby Allen??????

[Hannabal 4]

I've only read a few posts, but some of you remind me of my Mother. My only gutfeel is that he'll stay and I'll take his words on face value, rather than assume he's a liar. If he goes he goes. I'll be exceedingly disappointed. But I'll not fret every day and try and second guess any move he makes, or doesn't make.

I'd hate to be in the trenches with most of you.

[Jarka 767]

TT, it was discussed on 360 last night. Robbo has a similar impression as most, that the result of Friday night was a big positive in us trying to keep him. They commented on the way all players got around him after he kicked his goal, even though it was a pretty standard 40m set shot..

Thanks billy, my advice is to not name your source unless they don't mind. You want to protect him/her so the info keeps coming!

Did your source say what he wanted to do?

[Roost It 1,434]

I've only read a few posts, but some of you remind me of my Mother. My only gutfeel is that he'll stay and I'll take his words on face value, rather than assume he's a liar. If he goes he goes. I'll be exceedingly disappointed. But I'll not fret every day and try and second guess any move he makes, or doesn't make.

I'd hate to be in the trenches with most of you.

You are in the trenches with them

[Mac7 309]

I don’t know if Scully will stay or go, however, there is NO WAY Scully would hold a press conference and blatantly lie saying that he has not spoken to GWS if he had already signed a contract.

He would just say nothing and avoid the questions... the same as every other out of contract player does.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

Thing is, to put your reputation on the line, don't you need to have a decent reputation to begin with??

Andy Maher has nothing.

But seriously, does anyone really think that if Scully stays, that Maher's career will be over?

That no one will respect him? (no one does now!)

But even then, that's the beauty of claiming it's from an impeccable source.

If Scully goes, you can claim you're a genius with an inside scoop.

If he stays, you can say "well, that's what my source told me at the time."

You then go on to say how (your source told you) he had signed a HOA and then backed out of it.

Who will conclusively prove you wrong??

A HOA is not binding, and the only reason it would be signed is to set out terms for Tom, so that if he did decide to go, it is binding and he knows what he is getting out of the deal.

It means he doesn't go to GWS and say "ok, I've decided to get on board - what can you offer me?" and they can't then shift the goalposts on him.

I'm still reasonably confident he wouldn't have done this.

All you need to do is look at the way he plays the game and his values, and it makes it clear the kid has great integrity and is not a liar.

You can tell a lot about how a person is in life, by how they act on the footy field.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

Why is this worrying?

He's either going or staying, and there's not a goddamn thing any of us can do about it.

So have an extra glass of warm milk before bed and get on with the rest of your lives.

...............

So Andy Maher has an "impeccable" source?

What of those impeccable sources who say Scully's staying?

This GWS/Scully affair is a mine field of vested interests, scuttlebutt, disinformation, and plain old sh*t-stirring.

Who can possibly make sense of it? Not Andy Maher, Mike Sheahan, or anyone except Scully and his manager.

The word Sheedy comes to mind. Edited June 9, 2011 by Wadda We Sing

[Demonic Ascent 0]

If he has signed a heads of agreement he will be able to renege without any difficulty, heads of agreement are not binding.

Not to single your post out as it has been mentioned in a few, but what is the point in signing a heads of agreement if it's not binding?

As I said before, I'll take Scully at his word at this stage. He said he has not signed anything nor has his manager or parents. He said he has not spoken to GWS, nor has his manager or family. He seems like an honest kidand I'm willing to take him at his word at this stage especially when compared to flakes like Maher & Sheahan.

[The Chazz 4,077]

Thanks billy, my advice is to not name your source unless they don't mind. You want to protect him/her so the info keeps coming!

Did your source say what he wanted to do?

Sorry Jarka, my source is the man himslef. There is constant speculation from many people, but out of everyone that has spoken, which includes Maher, McGuire, etc, the one person I trust the most out of all of them is Scully. Some will think it's keeping my head in the sand, I don't believe that is case at all.

He instructed the Club what he intended to do late last year. So far, to the best of my knowledge, he hasn't deviated off that line, and I have faith in him, and by the looks of it, so too does the MFC.

I just fail to see what he would achieve by lying. If he has already signed, his pay would no doubt have been agreed on so form wouldn't be a factor. I'm sure the Club would keep playing him knowing how important he is for us over the next 10 or so weeks. He has absolutely nothing to gain by lying thorugh that press conference.

He wanted to focus on his football this year, and unluckily for him and us, it has been interupted. With us sitting 1/2 game outside the 8, I want him to do whatever he needs to to help see us playing finals at the end of the year.

One other thing they said on 360 last night was that it was believed Scully was knocking on the door for about 4 weeks prior to him being selected. The Club decided it would be in his best interest to not play too early.

[Range Rover 1,935]

You can tell a lot about how a person is in life, by how they act on the footy field.

Not sure I understand this sentence.

Ben Cousins? Wayne Carey?

What do you mean exactly?

[Roost It 1,434]

Not to single your post out as it has been mentioned in a few, but what is the point in signing a heads of agreement if it's not binding?

As I said before, I'll take Scully at his word at this stage. He said he has not signed anything nor has his manager or parents. He said he has not spoken to GWS, nor has his manager or family. He seems like an honest kidand I'm willing to take him at his word at this stage especially when compared to flakes like Maher & Sheahan.

So when he leaves Melbourne they don't then offer him a reduced contract. A HOA will set out terms and agreements of a yet to be formalised contract. By signing it Tom and GWS are saying they have agreed to terms but not a contract.

[Freak 100]

I'm personally convinced that he is going so I'm just hoping that he plays really really well for the remainder of the season so that his value goes up. Otherwise it looks like we will get a mid-teen pick for him.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

HEADS OF AGREEMENT - Non binding agreement outlining main issues relevant to a tentative agreement

Calling the Lawyer types. If the player renegs, is there any recourse for that club. Ie: It has affected thier ability to sign other players and weakened thier position?

[Grand New Flag 3,226]

Not to single your post out as it has been mentioned in a few, but what is the point in signing a heads of agreement if it's not binding?

As I said before, I'll take Scully at his word at this stage. He said he has not signed anything nor has his manager or parents. He said he has not spoken to GWS, nor has his manager or family. He seems like an honest kidand I'm willing to take him at his word at this stage especially when compared to flakes like Maher & Sheahan.

The point of a HOA is to set out the terms and conditions of your contact should you decide to take it. By Scully signing a HOA he is signing that he "intends" to move to GWS. I understand that Ablett signed a HOA in a similar manner, then thought he would renege and then changed his mind back to GC. Signing an "intention" at the beginning of the season has physiological weight in the decision making process. Scully would know exactly what he is to get should he go to GWS and this can be compared with Melbourne's offer.

Edited June 9, 2011 by Grand New Flag

[Real Demon 232]

Not to single your post out as it has been mentioned in a few, but what is the point in signing a heads of agreement if it's not binding?

As I said before, I'll take Scully at his word at this stage. He said he has not signed anything nor has his manager or parents. He said he has not spoken to GWS, nor has his manager or family. He seems like an honest kidand I'm willing to take him at his word at this stage especially when compared to flakes like Maher & Sheahan.

The pot of money GWS are able to splash around is finite.

A heads of agreement would have outlined the terms should he later commit, allowing GWS to continue with their pillaging knowing what they already have potentially committed.

And Tom and his managment know what they have locked in should he decide to take it later on, as opposed to GWS coming back saying they have signed 9 others players, and the deal they originally offered they can no longer do.

He would get out of a heads of agreement easily if he wanted to.........it's a statement of intention, not final commitment. No club is going to attempt to have a HOA legally enforced to make a player play somewhere he doesn't really want to.

Edited June 9, 2011 by Real Demon

[Demonic Ascent 0]

The pot of money GWS are able to splash around is finite.

A heads of agreement would have outlined the terms should he later commit, allowing GWS to continue with their pillaging knowing what they already have potentially committed.

And Tom and his managment know what they have locked in should he decide to take it later on, as opposed to GWS coming back saying they have signed 9 others players, and the deal they originally offered they can no longer do.

He would get out of a heads of agreement easily if he wanted to.........it's a statement of intention, not final commitment. No club is going to attempt to have a HOA legally enforced to make a player play somewhere he doesn't really want to.

So then Andy Maher's "impeccable source" is full of crap as if he now wants to remain a Demon then a Heads of Agreement isn't worth the paper it's written on.

[satyricon 267]

This is now 9 pages long, there is nothing any of the posters on here can do to affect the outcome.

All we have is rumour, innuendo, falsehood, media tittle tattle, and we are perpetuating it

If Scully goes I will be disappointed, if he stays I will be pleased.

He strikes me as a very straight person, so if he says there has been no talk, I believe him.

If he goes we will be compensated, I was disappointed when Brock McLean left, but we got Jordan Gysberts in return, so it did not turn out apocalyptic

One man does not make a team, but can contribute, even Judd needs the other 21 playing well for the team to win, Scully was member of the team who contributed last Friday and no doubt he will be good again on Monday, but hopefully so will Trengove, Gysberts, McKenzie, Watts etc etc

Edited June 9, 2011 by satyricon

[Guest Artie Bucco]

Not sure I understand this sentence.

Ben Cousins? Wayne Carey?

What do you mean exactly?

Wayne Carey - Arrogance. Dismissive of others. Pretty much just does what he wants. Was fiercely in denial over all his troubles for a long time because he's not one to admit or accept defeat.

Ben Cousins - flat stick 100% of the time. Addictive personality - craves the contest and the gut-running, punishing himself.

People's personalities show through in the way they play the game.

If you're likely to give up in a marking contest, you're likely to give up in life when something else gets a bit hard.

If you dig in and put your head down to run out a game, it's likely in life you'll react in the same way when things get tough.

Football makes people wear their personalities on their sleeves, whether they like it or not.

It's often a truer representation of their inner self than what they'd like to project in normal social situations.

Honestly, think about it next time you watch someone you know play footy.

It rings true.

Edited June 9, 2011 by Artie Bucco

[jabberwocky 2,301]

"Put simply, a heads of agreement is a moral agreement that say IF we decide to sign a contract, these are the terms upon which we will sign. It does not compel a perty to enter into a formal agreement. Actualy, it doesnt even complel anyone to actually agree to those terms (although its generally seen as retrading and poor form to change the agreed terms). Any well represented player would have plastered on the top of the Heads of Agreement "This is not a legally binding agreement. a legally binding agreement will only exist upon the signing of a definitive agreement."

They are typically only intended to provide lawyers and advisers with an understanding as to what the parties have agreed to so they can paper the deal without having to go back to the parties to ask them.

However, that is a smartly drafted heads of agreement. Some heads of agreement are drafted as an agreement and it places the onus on the parties to work in good faith to formally recoird that agreement in a definitive contract. This latter kind of agreement can only be escaped from IF there is a material point not contained in the heads of agreement that gives the player a justifiable grounds to say it would be reasonable to walk. I'd be shocked if anyone was dumb enough and poorly advised enough in the AFL to agree to this form of HOA."

Hows that sound Law people?

[Chopper Lovell 3]

Not sure I understand this sentence.

Ben Cousins? Wayne Carey?

What do you mean exactly?

Pretty much what I was going to say...

What a stupid statement....

[Disco Demons 92]

scully had a great game friday night...playing under the lights at the mcg on friday night in front of 50k people would have been an amazing experience for the young lad....there is no chance he's going to get that a GWS. At least for awhile.

[Grand New Flag 3,226]

Lets not ever forget that the Brisbane Lions lost Nathan Buckley after 2 seasons to Collingwood. It was obvious that Nathan Buckley was going to be a star is the same way it is obvious Scully will be. Nevertheless this did not stop Brisbane winning 3 Premierships back to back.

All is not lost if Scully goes.

[Real Demon 232]

Lets not ever forget that the Brisbane Lions lost Nathan Buckley after 2 seasons to Collingwood. It was obvious that Nathan Buckley was going to be a star is the same way it is obvious Scully will be. Nevertheless this did not stop Brisbane winning 3 Premierships back to back.

All is not lost if Scully goes.

Very true, and I wonder what Bucks would rather have now........some extra coin, or a premiership medallion.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

Pretty much what I was going to say...

What a stupid statement....

No, actually your statement was the stupid one.

If you're smart enough, and you take the time to think about it, you'll realise I'm right.

I'm not the first to say it (can't remember where I heard if first) and I won't be the last.

[Jarka 767]

Sorry Jarka, my source is the man himslef. There is constant speculation from many people, but out of everyone that has spoken, which includes Maher, McGuire, etc, the one person I trust the most out of all of them is Scully. Some will think it's keeping my head in the sand, I don't believe that is case at all.

He instructed the Club what he intended to do late last year. So far, to the best of my knowledge, he hasn't deviated off that line, and I have faith in him, and by the looks of it, so too does the MFC.

I just fail to see what he would achieve by lying. If he has already signed, his pay would no doubt have been agreed on so form wouldn't be a factor. I'm sure the Club would keep playing him knowing how important he is for us over the next 10 or so weeks. He has absolutely nothing to gain by lying thorugh that press conference.

He wanted to focus on his football this year, and unluckily for him and us, it has been interupted. With us sitting 1/2 game outside the 8, I want him to do whatever he needs to to help see us playing finals at the end of the year.

One other thing they said on 360 last night was that it was believed Scully was knocking on the door for about 4 weeks prior to him being selected. The Club decided it would be in his best interest to not play too early.

That's a pretty reliable source!! I agree, we trust what Tom's saying and have faith in the club to get the right deal on the table to enable him to sign. The one thing that has impressed me through this entire episode is how well the club has handled it. Every response to q question from the media has been in such a way to try to take the pressure off TS and let him concentrate on his footy

Thanks for sharing the info, appreciated