Such Is Life

[Red Sox 2]

The thing that sticks out for me, is that the cocaine was undoubtedly performance enhancing.

Even if he wasn't using during games or training, it provides the confidence that proves more and more to be the key to a player getting the best out of himself.

Case in point: Travis Cloke - his confidence must shot to pieces with all the horrendous goalkicking.

One small line and boom - confidence is sky high again. That arrogance that only coke can supply.

There's no doubt in my mind he wouldn't have been as good a player without the drugs.

The man has a lot of self-belief, but the cocaine would have taken it to another level.

I cannot help but agree - somehow this seems to have been overlooked. To me it has to tarnish his Brownlow - and the 1996 flag

Wrong, just simply wrong.

Go have a line of anything, stay up for 3 days straight and see how you go in any physical, running pursuit.

The flag, brownlow is not tainted in anyway and is ridiculous by people to suggest as much. This accusation comes from people that have never been near drugs and have no qualifications to accuse as such.

How is it tainted exactly, outside of your perceived advantage of taking cocaine to improve performance? It is not tainted by Ben Cousins drug use in anyway. Are any other flag winners that have convicted players, alcoholics etc etc tainted? Of course not, neither are WCE & Cousins achievements.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Why does it even bear relevance and need to be bought up in any case? Because you wanted to give your argument more strength by loosely comparing Cousin's issues with Newtons?

You may not be exactly comparing offences, but you are certainly comparing them as 'troubled individuals'. Far too easy to do that.

Well done you missed the point. And I have explained why earlier.

If you're looking for similarities how about comparing Matthew Newton to Andrew Lovett. In terms of real world issues, outside of football, the issues of these two people bare more relevance to each other than a self confessed drug addict in Ben Cousins.

I wasn't. You have unnecessarily focussed on the nature of the offence.

I think it's time to move on from the Ben Cousins issue and leave it to his family and close friends to look out for him.

Agree but the media wont.

The flag, brownlow is not tainted in anyway and is ridiculous by people to suggest as much. This accusation comes from people that have never been near drugs and have no qualifications to accuse as such.

How is it tainted exactly, outside of your perceived advantage of taking cocaine to improve performance? It is not tainted by Ben Cousins drug use in anyway. Are any other flag winners that have convicted players, alcoholics etc etc tainted? Of course not, neither are WCE & Cousins achievements.

Yep. Agree with that. There a number of legends of the past that do have a "past". It does not belittle the history of the game. I am not so sure the North premierships of the 90s are tainted at all.

[WonnaJurah 5]

Was justin Charles suspended for performance inhancing or other, i cant remember?

[e25 5]

Wrong, just simply wrong.

Go have a line of anything, stay up for 3 days straight and see how you go in any physical, running pursuit.

The flag, brownlow is not tainted in anyway and is ridiculous by people to suggest as much. This accusation comes from people that have never been near drugs and have no qualifications to accuse as such.

How is it tainted exactly, outside of your perceived advantage of taking cocaine to improve performance? It is not tainted by Ben Cousins drug use in anyway. Are any other flag winners that have convicted players, alcoholics etc etc tainted? Of course not, neither are WCE & Cousins achievements.

We're not talking about a line of "anything", we're talking a line of cocaine.

And it would undoubtedly be of benefit.

I'm sure some people here think they know from personal experience, but the fact is if you

get "cocaine" here in Australia it is usually either heavily diluted or other drugs dressed to appear like cocaine.

The stuff ben was taking would have made a significant difference.

And the psychological effects are lingering.

[John Crow Batty 8,864]

Was justin Charles suspended for performance inhancing or other, i cant remember?

Yes he was. The consensus at the time was that he was more of an idiot for getting caught than for taking the PE drugs. At that time too there were a few tall skinny players around that all of a sudden developed into big power forward gorillas from the end of one season to the other. I'm sure most posters who have been following footy in the 90's to early 2000's know who they are. Theres also a certain player from an even earlier era noted for his swagger and hairstyle who raised a few eyebrows.

Another example from further back was Fred Cook, the Port Melbourne VFA "living legend". Also played for and was sacked by both Carlton and Footscray for non football related issues. In the 60's/70's there was less of a tolerance for these kind of behaviours in the VFL and otherwise good players with "issues" ended up playing in the VFA. Port Mebourne was noted as much for its rogues gallery as its success on the field. He had a viable media career until his recreational drug taking became public knowledge and he ended up as the public image of the fallen sporting hero wasted by drugs. Ended up in court on a series of crimes related to his addiction. Don't know what he's up to now.

Edited August 27, 2010 by america de cali

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Yes he was. The consensus at the time was that he was more of an idiot for getting caught than for taking the drugs. At that time too there were a few tall skinny players around that all of a sudden developed into big power forward gorillas from the end of one season to the other. I'm sure most posters who have been following footy in the 90's to early 2000's know who they are.

Ananbolic Steriods in Charles case. Hawthorn and WCE suddenly became alot bigger in the chest/ body. Hmmmm

Another example from further back was Fred Cook, the Port Melbourne VFA "living legend". Also played for and was sacked by both Carlton and Footscray. He had a viable media career until his drug taking became an issue and he became the public image of a fallen hero wasted by drugs. Ended up in court on a series of charges for crimes related to his addiction. Don't know what he's up to now.

Financial and personal ruin.

[John Crow Batty 8,864]

Ananbolic Steriods in Charles case. Hawthorn and WCE suddenly became alot bigger in the chest/ body. Hmmmm

Financial and personal ruin.

I suggest you also look further than WC and Hawthorn.

[Red Sox 2]

We're not talking about a line of "anything", we're talking a line of cocaine.

And it would undoubtedly be of benefit.

I'm sure some people here think they know from personal experience, but the fact is if you

get "cocaine" here in Australia it is usually either heavily diluted or other drugs dressed to appear like cocaine.

The stuff ben was taking would have made a significant difference.

And the psychological effects are lingering.

I would suggest that people here that think they know from personal experience, probably do, that's why it is personal experience.

The more diluted that it is from its pure form, the more danger there can be. If he was taking 'dirty' drugs, it would have affected his output even further, not improved it. But I would suggest, with some little knowledge the cash and resources at his disposal that he would have been taking 'stuff' in it's purest form more often than not.

It certainly would have made a significant difference, he would have partied for longer, but on the football field? Not a chance in hell.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

I suggest you also look further than WC and Hawthorn.

They were the only ones I can remember. I seem to recall WCE getting alot bigger over one pre season for 1992.

[Red Sox 2]

They were the only ones I can remember. I seem to recall WCE getting alot bigger over one pre season for 1992.

Guy McKenna was one that doubled in size when we saw him in 92. There were rumors of him jumping fences at Subi way back then, a well worn path over the fence that one.

[daisycutter 29,616]

The similarity is closer and relavent. Similar age and both great talents in the public eye sunk by their own excesses. The only difference seems to be that deep down Cousins is a nice guy and Newton is a psycho chicken.

Not convinced on the "nice guy" analogy, but I do agree that Newton is a nastier type of person

[e25 5]

I would suggest that people here that think they know from personal experience, probably do, that's why it is personal experience.

The more diluted that it is from its pure form, the more danger there can be. If he was taking 'dirty' drugs, it would have affected his output even further, not improved it. But I would suggest, with some little knowledge the cash and resources at his disposal that he would have been taking 'stuff' in it's purest form more often than not.

It certainly would have made a significant difference, he would have partied for longer, but on the football field? Not a chance in hell.

What I am saying is that your personal experience may be limited or your knowledge clouded by your personal experiences.

That is why is say that the "dirty drugs" are what many would have personal experience of, when he wouldve most likely had "top quality" drugs.

The drugs would have worn off by the time he was playing, but that is why coke is the drug of choice - becuase pf the fast recovery.

What lingers is the psychological effect that a player would benefit from.

Physically it wouldn't be ideal, but at the same time it would keep your body fat right down.

From my experience with high level footballers that I know, and from experiencing it myself, a night on the powder is a lot easier on your body than a night on the booze.

Playing the next day is hard at first, but something you get used to quickly. Playing a week later? Piece of cake.

Hypothesise all you like, but I know what effect it has.

[Red Sox 2]

What I am saying is that your personal experience may be limited or your knowledge clouded by your personal experiences.

That is why is say that the "dirty drugs" are what many would have personal experience of, when he wouldve most likely had "top quality" drugs.

The drugs would have worn off by the time he was playing, but that is why coke is the drug of choice - because of the fast recovery.

What lingers is the psychological effect that a player would benefit from.

Physically it wouldn't be ideal, but at the same time it would keep your body fat right down.

From my experience with high level footballers that I know, and from experiencing it myself, a night on the powder is a lot easier on your body than a night on the booze.

Playing the next day is hard at first, but something you get used to quickly. Playing a week later? Piece of cake.

Hypothesise all you like, but I know what effect it has.

E, (not a great alias for this discussion! )

I agree with you about the ability to bounce back or recover, maybe not the next day if it is being done right, but near enough. I thought you were suggesting that it was an aid in performance which I could not agree with.

[e25 5]

Unfortunately I know too much about this subject from my younger days.

I know it's splitting hairs, but it would be marginally performance enhancing.

When you look at a guy struggling with confidence like Roughead, you know that on the mental side of things it would actually help in his self-belief.

[John Crow Batty 8,864]

They were the only ones I can remember. I seem to recall WCE getting alot bigger over one pre season for 1992.

Yes I agree with you. The two two suspects you mention tend to stand out but I think it was a broader comp wide problem with few clubs left untouched.

Going back to drugs. Its just not drugs. Footballers are human and susceptable to all the usual and perhaps unusual human vices. Perhaps more so because of the attention they receive and youth.

Over the years I've heard of unusual and bizzare stories regarding footballer behaviour as many others have too. And I've seen it at my local clubs.

The most strange and shocking story I've heard involved an almost All Australian quality nuggety midfielder who during an interstate fixture was caught "In Flagrante Delicto" in a hotel room with his twin brother. Was caught by a team mate who is a former Melbourne player but not playing for us at the time. True or not I don't know. But he did disappear from the football world quickly and quietly and I never heard of him again.

Edited August 27, 2010 by america de cali

[Red Sox 2]

Unfortunately I know too much about this subject from my younger days.

I know it's splitting hairs, but it would be marginally performance enhancing.

When you look at a guy struggling with confidence like Roughead, you know that on the mental side of things it would actually help in his self-belief.

Very good, it would make for an interesting doco seeing the big Rough dancing shirtless in front of a camera!

[45HG 1,539]

Very good, it would make for an interesting doco seeing the big Rough dancing shirtless in front of a camera!

Almost along that line of thinking, I thought to myself last night that if Cousins had been more Cameron Ling-like in appearance, there would be no "Such is life" documentary.

[e25 5]

Very good call.

[a la johnny beckwith 25]

First time user, long time Dees supporter - not sure I should be breaking my duck on Demonland by passing comment on 'Such Is Life' but I may as well put in my two bobs worth.

I watched with interest and my uneducated and personal opinion is that Ben Cousins would have got far more out of the whole production than any viewer. I'm sure it was done with the best of intentions however there was also the inherent danger of seemingly glamorizing the use of illicit substances with the images shown - as opposed to his probable intention to espouse the exact opposite. I suspect there would be a number of people, perhaps budding AFL players, who would have seen nothing but the story of a champion footballer who was able to successfully combine the rigors of high intensity training and playing whilst regularly using drugs - that has to be of some serious concern in my view. Ben Cousins no doubt used his time out of the game putting together this video as a way to cope and recover from his addiction and although he obviously fell off the wagon along the way, much to his credit he managed to resurrect his AFL career so it was of demonstrable benefit to him - hence my statement that he had the most to gain from the production. The viewers? Not so much in my opinion.

Apart from the mixed messages being sent out my main problem with 'Such Is Life' was that I found Cousins to be very much self serving in much of his commentary. A fair bit of 'woe is me' was contained within. Sure, he recognized his drug addiction, but he continually blamed others for the predicament in which his drug addiction, and he alone, had clearly placed himself. It was the WA Media, the WA Police, the West Coast Eagles FC, The AFL, even the Victoria Police - they were all to blame at one point according to Ben. His general disposition was not one conducive to attracting a sympathetic response overall. He was/is in a very privileged position, one many other drug addicts would envy, and yet he seems somewhat oblivious to that fact which is a real shame.

Perhaps there were also more questions raised than actually answered too. Like how in the hell did the AFL allow him to flagrantly avoid one of the stipulated drug tests by shaving down, and then approve his re-registration as an AFL player? Was this not a clear sign that Cousins had something to hide? How did the Richmond FC arrive at a decision to proceed with recruiting Cousins despite his admission to Terry Wallace that he had used drugs just 2 days earlier? That one actually defies all logic in my view - they call that acting with due diligence apparently. He was afforded more leniency than many others would have been and yet again he seemed oblivious to that fact. I suspect there is still a fair amount of self reflection required in the case of Ben Cousins.

Apologies for my lack of brevity - hope some of it makes sense!!

Anyway, I wish him well in retirement and I hope he can use his high profile for the benefit of others less fortunate. Perhaps then, and only then, a much higher level of respect will come his way - from me anyway.

[John Crow Batty 8,864]

Nice summation. Interestingly you note by omission that he is not blaming his friends. I didn't watch the show on principle.

Edited August 27, 2010 by america de cali

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

Nice summation. Interestingly you note by omission that he is not blaming his friends. I didn't watch the show on principle.

Watch this, it will give you a fair idea !!! B)

[e25 5]

Nice summation. Interestingly you note by omission that he is not blaming his friends. I didn't watch the show on principle.

On principle..? What sort of principle?

I could imagine not watching it because you didn't want to, but I don't understand the principle angle.

[Fork 'em 6,983]

How did the Richmond FC arrive at a decision to proceed with recruiting Cousins despite his admission to Terry Wallace that he had used drugs just 2 days earlier? That one actually defies all logic in my view - they call that acting with due diligence apparently.

Wallace as usual is full of carp . From memory Richmond had just finished 9th again and saw Cousins as a gun midfeilder that could propel them into the 8 , nothing more , nothing less . If you remember during the pre-season the amount of hype around Richmond with media and supporters alike that was fueled more by Sheedys talk of going for the premiership . Any talk of Wallaces to help Ben out was just more snakeoil from the snakeoil salesman . See David King came out during the week and stated that the recruiting was driven by the players , a backhanded slap to Wallace who had been trying to take credit IMO .

[John Crow Batty 8,864]

Watch this, it will give you a fair idea !!! B)

Thanks. It was funny.