Is Liam Jurrah a star for the Mfc?

[rpfc 27,573]

Id go with fp / hff. I think our centreline will be too busy to fit him in, even on a wing..

May not be KPF yet, but at 196cms and 90+ kgs already- he's going to have to get used to bigger opponents now anyway. Plus he'll take another defender off LJ!

Which is great.

For 2010, I would start with:

- Martin / resting Jamar at FF

-Watts in a f. pocket (soon to be KP)

-Miller at CHF (No other choice atm)

-LJ on a hff (soon to be KP.. in place of Miller)

This is where some of you guys lose respect - where is Bate?

He was the best forward in 2009. Second in goals and second in assists. And that is despite the fact that he spent a bit of time in the last third of the year in the midfield for various reasons.

If Freak's dismissiveness is as good a guide as I think it is - Bate can be very effective lead up HF (possibly CHF) at 192cm in a good team.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Until then, give him a licence to be as sneaky as he wants, without the added pressure of needing to be our main goal kicker. I'd hate to see him have a downer in 2010, if it were to happen, playing him at FF/CHF would make it more noticeable, which will result in people jumping off the band wagon.

So who plays our No 1 and 2 forward?

Robbo was leading goal kicker this year but has been "retired".

In the modern game the roles of FF/CHF are fluid at best.

And in a forward line not plush with talent atm, Jurrah is hardly likely to be a shrinking violet.

And finally, it would be healthy having people jumping off the bandwagon given Jurrah is already a "star" after nine games.

The expectations on this kid are in some cases sky high. He will get more attention next year and it will be a real test. There might be a few heady expectations of Jurrah popped next year. I hope not but he will be a focus of oppositions.

[H_T 2,941]

This is where some of you guys lose respect - where is Bate?

He was the best forward in 2009. Second in goals and second in assists. And that is despite the fact that he spent a bit of time in the last third of the year in the midfield for various reasons.

If Freak's dismissiveness is as good a guide as I think it is - Bate can be very effective lead up HF (possibly CHF) at 192cm in a good team.

Fwiw, my forward 6 from your Forward/backward/midfield thinking polls (which showed good initiative rp): -

HF: Morton Watts Sylvia

F: Bate Jurrah Green

I have him there, where they play I have no qualms. Bate could play FF, CHF, Jurrah the same, Watts the same....all I said I'd like to see Morton given some time at CHF....ie. let's have a look at it.

[The Chazz 4,077]

Jurrah strikes me as the sort of man who WANTS to be our main goal kicker.

I don't give two f's about people on his band wagon - he is a KPP who should learn his craft now. Especially considering that he will be 21 next year.

That's a great attitude for him to have, and he will achieve that by playing that sneaky role in the coming years. I just don't want to see him play FF/CHF yet, while he is 21, he's only played 9 games. I think FF will restrict him and his development (not many true FF's venture outside of the 50), and I think he's far from CHF yet.

Slot him in at forward pocket with the instruction to go as far up the ground as he feels he needs to, based on this years performance, he will kick his 40 goals a season, maybe more, plus set many, many more up for Petterd (who he seems to have some freakish connection with!).

Not the appropriate thread, but assuming all are fit, this is how I would line them up come roound 1, 2010;

HF Green Miller Watts

F Jurrah Thorp Bate

Rotations would include Petterd, Stef Martin and Jetta.

Feel the need for Miller and the recruitment of Thorp due to a lot of opposition defenders (eg. Scarlett, Lake, Presti(?)) having a field day on our kids if we exposed them too much.

Edited November 18, 2009 by billy2803

[45HG 1,539]

There is no "true FF" anymore IMO anyway - so I think that concern can be dispelled.

Your forward line containts 5 "talls," not to mention one guy with questionable character.

[The Chazz 4,077]

There is no "true FF" anymore IMO anyway - so I think that concern can be dispelled.

Your forward line containts 5 "talls," not to mention one guy with questionable character.

Fev?

Franklin/Roughead? - when one is outside 50, the other is in the goal square.

Bradshaw/Brown? - see above.

I think there is still old-fashioned full forwards in our game, and always will be.

Why my forward line contains that many talls is because I want to see more goals kicked this year from our midfielders. I'd be happy to play Watts on a wing, Bate at HFF and put a true small in the FP if need be. I don't class Jurrah as a true tall, as his ground work is as good, if not better than Farmer's was at that stage.

[The Chazz 4,077]

There is no "true FF" anymore IMO anyway - so I think that concern can be dispelled.

Your forward line containts 5 "talls," not to mention one guy with questionable character.

The Geelong GF team had the backline of

HB Mackie Taylor Harley

B Milburn Scarlett Enright

That's a bit of height to contend with, especially considering the Saints had Milne, Schnieder, Montagna that floated around goals.

[45HG 1,539]

Fair call, I just don't see a lot of flexibility in there - marking types and a few of them suspect below the knees.

Your Roughead/Franklin, Brown/Bradshaw only highlights what I'm saying - positions in the modern game are fluid. There is no true FF - otherwise you wouldn't use the Roughead/Franklin comparison because one would be a FF.

[45HG 1,539]

Jurrah's ability below the knees does not count out his ability in the air, it is simply an added strength.

I have used the Farmer comparison in the past, but to say he's better along the ground than Farmer was at 21 is ludicrous in my view.

[rpfc 27,573]

I think this is what 45HG16 is getting frutrated with, and many don't get:

If this 'desperately needed' KPF that we are going to get in Nov or Dec is not incredibly good, he will demand less ball than Jurrah, Watts, and Bate.

So this begs the question - if we cannot get that sort of a talent - why should we spend Pick 11 on a 4th tall in the forward line?

Thorp, Carlisle, Black, or whoever, do not become a '1st tall' because we say so, Scarlett (or any 1st choice defender) will go to Jurrah with or without this extra KPF.

Edited November 18, 2009 by rpfc

[The Chazz 4,077]

Fair call, I just don't see a lot of flexibility in there - marking types and a few of them suspect below the knees.

Your Roughead/Franklin, Brown/Bradshaw only highlights what I'm saying - positions in the modern game are fluid. There is no true FF - otherwise you wouldn't use the Roughead/Franklin comparison because one would be a FF.

A true full forward in my view rarely leaves the 50m, and is the main target when the mids/HFF are kicking forward. As I said, Fev is a true FF. When people say they want LJ to be one of our KPF's, that to me means either Full Forward or Centre Half Forward. Some of the top teams are in the luxury position now where they have 2 KPF's that can rotate from FF to CHF when need be (eg. Franklin/Roughead, Riewoldt/Kosi, and even Hawkins/Mooney). What's the common denominator in that group? At least one is a bigger body. I can't see Jurrah physically developing to be one of those, I can see Watts will (in a few years), therefore, if we play our "twin towers" as Watts/Jurrah, the kids, IMO, will get smashed at the moment. Hence my desire to draft Thorp if his head is screwed on right. That would leave a potential Jurrah/Thorp or Watts/Thorp, starting to look better as far as match ups go. I don't think at this stage that Jurrah would play CHF well at all. HFF, yes, not CHF. Therefore, that would mean playing Thorp at CHF and Jurrah at FF, but I think Jurrah would be wasted playing that FF role (eg, staying inside 50) for a majority of the game.

Maybe a better option would be rotate LJ and Watts from HFF/FF for spurts, but I'm not sure if Thorp will be a dominant CHF that he would need to be in this situation.

I personally would have loved Melbourne to chase Bradshaw, put him on a 3 year deal as a true full forward (never leaves the 50m). He would kick his 50 goals a season for us, and that would give the likes of Jurrah and Watts time to grow, develop and learn from a true KPF.

I also think that over the past decade, Melbourne's biggest problem down forward was the fact that they played Robbo as a KPF - he was far from it. Neitz/Robbo as our "twin towers" possibly cost us more success.

Sorry to get off the track of the original thread. I clicked "no" to the question, just looking at ways to make sure that in a couple of years time I will tick "yes" when Jurrah is a true super star!

[The Chazz 4,077]

I think this is what 45HG16 is getting frutrated with, and many don't get:

If this 'desperately needed' KPF that we are going to get in Nov or Dec is not incredibly good, he will demand less ball than Jurrah, Watts, and Bate.

So this begs the question - if we cannot get that sort of a talent - why should we spend Pick 11 on a 4th tall in the forward line?

Thorp, Carlisle, Black, or whoever, do not become a '1st tall' because we say so, Scarlett (or any 1st choice defender) will go to Jurrah with or without this extra KPF.

Preaching to the converted here RPFC. I personally don't think we need to use either 11 or 18 on a tall forward, assuming we pick Thorp up in the PSD. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying he is the answer to our prayers, but he will do the job we need him I think. I think Thorp would attract the Scarlett/Lake type, otherwise he may be the one kicking that bag of 4 or 5 that we need.

[The Chazz 4,077]

Jurrah's ability below the knees does not count out his ability in the air, it is simply an added strength.

I have used the Farmer comparison in the past, but to say he's better along the ground than Farmer was at 21 is ludicrous in my view.

I was probably more a Farmer fan than most, almost got to the stage that I was going to go through his rubbish, that's how bad I was!!!

I stick by my comments that LJ's ground work is as good as Farmer's, if not better (at the same stage of their careers).

[45HG 1,539]

Thorp's played 2 matches for 1 goal - massive call saying that he would kick 4-5 against quality teams because their main defenders may go to our other forwards.

You hit the nail on the head rp

Edited November 18, 2009 by 45hotgod16

[The Chazz 4,077]

Thorp's played 2 matches for 1 goal - massive call saying that he would kick 4-5 against quality teams because their main defenders may go to our other forwards.

You hit the nail on the head rp

If he is getting the oppositions 3rd or 4th best defender, we need him to do that, we need anyone to do that in that KPF spot. Jamar did it toward the end of the year, that's what we need from whoever is in that situation.

I don't think it's that massive of a call considering he has played 2 games for 1 goal. He was pick 6 in the 2006 draft. The expectation of regularly kicking goals (and at times bags against poorer defenders) is no different to the expectation some people will have on a Butcher-type in 3-4 years time. Difference is we don't have to wait for Thorp to develop.

The point I was making about Jurrah having quality ground skills is to show that he isn't just a "tall forward", therefore, we can afford to have a taller forward line than standard as Jurrah has the ability to crumb packs as good as a small forward. It means that we have the flexibility through a game to play him anywhere in the forward line and he will play that position well. I don't think (at this stage) he has the ability/experience/body to play a KPF role for an entire game.

[DemonDan... 77]

@ "No other choice atm"

So you've squeezed him in at CHF just for the hell of it ? Was there any other candidates for CHF in your thinking ?

I would like to see Morton given some time at CHF.

PS. Yeah, I think it's a very good photo....the red, the blue....a picture tells a thousand words....one word in this case.

Millers official title this year will be 'Centre-Half Bodyguard'!

If LJ can get the weight on quick enough, he'll be ready to take over from Miller when he heads for the GC a year from now.

I hope thats the aim. He's so hard to match up on, eventually we want him & JW right in the thiick of it.

..and yeah, missed the whole 'red an blue' thing with the photo - nice catch

This is where some of you guys lose respect - where is Bate?

He was the best forward in 2009. Second in goals and second in assists.

Yeah Bate was our best forward this year by a street. But I think he's a star wingman in the making. Which is why I left him out of the F/Line.

He can still kick those big goals from outside 50 and i believe he could kick as many goals as he did this year - in a midfield role.

Imo, he's prob 1 - 2 with Davey as the best kick / pass in our team and I cant imagine that big, raking left-foot not being utilised thru the centre.

He's strong thru the hips and this year esp, rarely went to ground in the heat of the contest.

[H_T 2,941]

So who plays our No 1 and 2 forward?

Bate would be number one at present based on statistical data, previously highlighted by rpfc. Although, going by average goals per game though, No.1 is in fact Jurrah at ~ 2.2 per game: -

In the modern game the roles of FF/CHF are fluid at best.

And in a forward line not plush with talent atm, Jurrah is hardly likely to be a shrinking violet.

Agree.

And finally, it would be healthy having people jumping off the bandwagon given Jurrah is already a "star" after nine games.

The expectations on this kid are in some cases sky high. He will get more attention next year and it will be a real test. There might be a few heady expectations of Jurrah popped next year. I hope not but he will be a focus of oppositions.

The poll is largely representative of the fans Rhino. Who can blame anyone for getting excited about Liam Jurrah ? For years people have jumped on bandwagons. Do you recall Allen Jackovich ?

Yes, Liam will get more attention. I essentially, hold the same hope in Jurrah, as you do. I just like to talk about him a bit more than yourself.

For the record, as I've said before my expectations of him are to "expect the unexpected", so really I have none. Anything good is a bonus.

Edited November 18, 2009 by High Tower

[Hobbits's 17]

I was probably more a Farmer fan than most, almost got to the stage that I was going to go through his rubbish, that's how bad I was!!! I stick by my comments that LJ's ground work is as good as Farmer's, if not better (at the same stage of their careers).

going through Farmers rubbish, what on earth would you look for? Farmer was ok at ground level, little dangerous, two different types of player.

[The Chazz 4,077]

going through Farmers rubbish, what on earth would you look for? Farmer was ok at ground level, little dangerous, two different types of player.

Don't panic, it was just a passing comment (stalkers are likely to go trough the rubbish of the person they are stalking).

I wasn't saying they are the same type of player, was just indicating that LJ's ground skills are of a high standard.

[H_T 2,941]

Yeah Bate was our best forward this year by a street. But I think he's a star wingman in the making. Which is why I left him out of the F/Line.

He can still kick those big goals from outside 50 and i believe he could kick as many goals as he did this year - in a midfield role.

Imo, he's prob 1 - 2 with Davey as the best kick / pass in our team and I cant imagine that big, raking left-foot not being utilised thru the centre.

He's strong thru the hips and this year esp, rarely went to ground in the heat of the contest.

On Bate, I prefer him in the forward line to be honest, as a lead up role workhorse. Midfield role for him I would query. Certainly capable in short bursts in midfield, although I query his repetitive work and his stamina over longer periods in the midfield. Repetition in the midfield would not be a strong point of his in my view and I think the FD recognise his strengths up in the forward line. His kicking for goal is a strong point as well as his understanding up forward.

[WonnaJurah 5]

no yet,but his off field achievements as well(NT young Australian of the year) will guide him to the top and be a very popular player for us

[layzie 29,138]

Flash in the pan? Isn't flash in the pan something that flairs up then dies down? Whilst I agree we have seen a glimpse of potential he is no flash in the pan just yet. I also think with a few preseasons let alone a full preseason we will see something special from LJ.

That's right. Just guarding against complacency. I want to see him take the next step!

[Cards13 9,117]

That's right. Just guarding against complacency. I want to see him take the next step!

ha I'm sure he has "flash in the pan" pinned to every available space in his house to guard against such things.

[RudeBoy 164]

Believe me he's already bulked up considerably with pure muscle.

I sound like a broken record I know, but you ain't seen nothing yet. The Jurrah jet will take off in 2010.

Whatever you do, make sure you're at the 'G' for round 2 - against the Pies.

[H_T 2,941]

RudeBoy, hope you've been feeding him well.

Round 2....Can we book seats now ?!!!