Round 6 changes

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

OUT: Newton, Bate, Bartram, Jetta

IN: Robertson, Wonaeamirri*, Grimes, Maric

*Fitness pending

FB: Frawley Warnock Martin

HB: Petterd Rivers Grimes

C: Morton Moloney Davey

HF: Dunn Miller Bruce

FF: Wonaeamirri Robertson Maric

Foll: Meesen McLean Sylvia

Int: Johnson Jones McDonald Bennell

[The Jack of Grimes 0]

FB: Frawley Warnock Martin

HB: Petterd Rivers Grimes

C: Morton Moloney Davey

HF: Dunn Miller Bruce

FF: Wonaeamirri Robertson Maric

Foll: Meesen McLean Sylvia

Int: Johnson Jones McDonald Bennell

Now that's a team! Unfortunately you have to look at the opposition. Who tags Ablett? What about Selwood? Hell even Scarlett needs a tagger.

[Jaded No More 68,915]

Who tags Ablett?

What's the point?

He'll rip us a new one anyway.

I'd play Davey on him. Might as well hurt Geelong going the other way, since nobody is capable of successfully shutting Ablett down.

Basically I would avoid tagging on Sunday. We'll get smashed, we know it. Let's play one on one and properly measure just how far we have come and what we are capable of. Throw the players the challenge of being competitive against the best in the competition (yes that word again). It's the truest test we'll have all season.

[Guest petjud]

FB: Frawley Warnock Martin

HB: Petterd Rivers Grimes

C: Morton Moloney Davey

HF: Dunn Miller Bruce

FF: Wonaeamirri Robertson Maric

Foll: Meesen McLean Sylvia

Int: Johnson Jones McDonald Bennell

That's not a team that's a knee jerk reaction to perception, one person started the Jetta out and all the sheep followed, he played well yesterday, obviously you missed the two or three tackles he put on and the work he does without the ball, look up and open your eyes and not follow the ball, MFC could do with that a bit as well.

I would not have Sylvia, Johnson or Jones in that team.......they have quite a few games in them now and it did not show yesterday.Sylvia was on notice and did not produce, if he wasn't 100% he should have said so and not played, Jones is back to trying to hard and Johnson not hard enough

smallest forward line I have ever seen, you can hear Scarlett sniggering from here.......the forward line witll be in no paricular order Robertson, Dunn, Bate, Miller, Petterd with Maric/Jetta interchanging........agree with Grimes coming in but no at the expense of Bartram, I know it will be a bit of a waste trying to tag one of Ablett/Bartel/Corey et al but we may as well give it a try

[H_T 3,047]

FB: Frawley Warnock Martin

HB: Petterd Rivers Bennell

C: Sylvia Moloney Davey

HF: Morton Miller Bruce

FF: Bate Robertson Maric

Foll: Spencer McLean Bartram

Int: Johnson Jones McDonald Dunn

IN: Spencer, Robertson, Maric

OUT: Meesen, Newton, Jetta.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

What's the point?

He'll rip us a new one anyway.

I'd play Davey on him. Might as well hurt Geelong going the other way, since nobody is capable of successfully shutting Ablett down.

Basically I would avoid tagging on Sunday. We'll get smashed, we know it. Let's play one on one and properly measure just how far we have come and what we are capable of. Throw the players the challenge of being competitive against the best in the competition (yes that word again). It's the truest test we'll have all season.

Agreed.

[Guest petjud]

I will ask a straight question.......

In the last five games exactly what have Jetta and Bartram done wrong?

All answers on the back of a small envelope...........

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Basically I would avoid tagging on Sunday. We'll get smashed, we know it. Let's play one on one and properly measure just how far we have come and what we are capable of. Throw the players the challenge of being competitive against the best in the competition (yes that word again). It's the truest test we'll have all season.

You want to avoid tagging but you feel we will get smashed and knowingly but you want to play one on one? Gotcha

[Jaded No More 68,915]

You want to avoid tagging but you feel we will get smashed and knowingly but you want to play one on one? Gotcha

Tagging gonna help us reduce the margin?

Has it helped any other team in the AFL?

Is it even possible to shut down Ablett + Seldwood + Bartel etc?

We play one-on-one, and we at least give ourselves a chance of winning some contests.

Yes I'm sure we'll play one extra behind the ball and all that, but I honestly don't see the point of trying to shut down their entire midfield, because all it will do is leave us 3-4 players down and they will still dominate.

Ling is still out I believe, so that means their number one tagger is out too. In that case, I rather we play attacking player on attacking player.

We know we're going to lose this one. Lets at least use this match to find out a little more about who can and can't cut it against the best of the best.

I think the backline's performance will be fascinating against a middle-of-the-road attack that gets the best delivery in the AFL.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

You want to avoid tagging but you feel we will get smashed and knowingly but you want to play one on one? Gotcha

I think the point being that we are sick of this attitude, "we will get beaten anyway, let's just stem the bleeding as much as we can" That is not a good mindset.

I would rather some positive action and get smashed, than this negative mindset.

[beelzebub 23,376]

all very curious this.

I hear time and time again that you are supposed to turn up to play, that you must be out there to play to win. If this is the case then you must take it up to the opposition even when you might correctly suppose they are a little better than you , and probably especially then. If we turn up to play the Catters with the view that its pointless taking on Ablett then why even other to compete...youve concede..youve lost already. Someone must be sent out to hassle him..to dog him..even if it only reduces his effectiveness to 20 posessions..then its a job done.

So much of this game is between the ears... if your mindset is already set to why bother..then..why bother

[mauriesy 7,296]

You want to avoid tagging but you feel we will get smashed and knowingly but you want to play one on one? Gotcha

Not tag Gary Ablett? I think I'll lay a bet on 50+ possessions.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

IMO the last thing Newton needs right now is to be dropped. Unless you never want to play him again, now's the time to show Newton some confidence and retain him next week. If he kicked straight he could have kicked 5+ goals in the past two games, which isn't a bad return in a poor side.

But the point is that he hasn't kicked 5+ goals in the past 2 games. We cannot continue to persist with a forward like Newton who does not have the ability nor the confidence to be taking set shots from 10 metres out.

That's not a team that's a knee jerk reaction to perception, one person started the Jetta out and all the sheep followed, he played well yesterday, obviously you missed the two or three tackles he put on and the work he does without the ball, look up and open your eyes and not follow the ball, MFC could do with that a bit as well.

I agree that he does put pressure on when he doesn't have the ball, but he doesn't get the ball enough and his kicking isn't very good. I think he'll be a good player, but after 5 games at AFL level I think it's time he went back to Casey to practise his kicking.

In: Maric, Robertson, Spencer, Wonaeamirri*

Out: Newton, Jetta, Johnson, Bate*

Johnson and Bate both played close to their worst games for the club yesterday. I think Bate needs a kick up the backside. He doesn't work hard enough IMO.

Robbo kicked 5 goals for Casey yesterday. That's enough for me.

[Jaded No More 68,915]

Not tag Gary Ablett? I think I'll lay a bet on 50+ possessions.

He got 42 in the rain yesterday against the Lion's midfield... and they were tagging him.

At the end of the day we ain't got a single player who could match Ablett and effectively shut him down. Obviously you have to man him up, especially at the bounces, but whether someone focuses solely on shutting him down, or whether we play Aaron Davey on him (at least he'll reward us going the other way, and he can match him for pace), he will still get 40 possessions and rip us a new one.

Having said that, they'll probably chuck Bruce on him, and not only will he rip us apart, Bruce will manage to turn the ball over when he does beat him.

Should be an awesome game!

[Guest petjud]

But the point is that he hasn't kicked 5+ goals in the past 2 games. We cannot continue to persist with a forward like Newton who does not have the ability nor the confidence to be taking set shots from 10 metres out.

I agree that he does put pressure on when he doesn't have the ball, but he doesn't get the ball enough and his kicking isn't very good. I think he'll be a good player, but after 5 games at AFL level I think it's time he went back to Casey to practise his kicking.

In: Maric, Robertson, Spencer, Wonaeamirri*

Out: Newton, Jetta, Johnson, Bate*

Johnson and Bate both played close to their worst games for the club yesterday. I think Bate needs a kick up the backside. He doesn't work hard enough IMO.

Robbo kicked 5 goals for Casey yesterday. That's enough for me.

What will be the reaction if Maric comes in and under the severe pressure from the Geelong defence gets two touches the whole game and misses a sitter from 10metres in front, public crucifixion probably, I think DB still hes a question mark over his defence, that is why I think Maric/Jetta will share a spot.

I also not noboby has answered my question, would require some logic and footy nous

[H_T 3,047]

I will ask a straight question.......

In the last five games exactly what have Jetta and Bartram done wrong?

All answers on the back of a small envelope...........

Is this in reply to my side, petjud?

Jetta has been okay. So too Bartram. I want to see Maric in for Jetta, that's all. You will note I still have Bartram in.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Tagging gonna help us reduce the margin?

Has it helped any other team in the AFL?

Is it even possible to shut down Ablett + Seldwood + Bartel etc?

We play one-on-one, and we at least give ourselves a chance of winning some contests.

We know we're going to lose this one. Lets at least use this match to find out a little more about who can and can't cut it against the best of the best.

Playing one on one implies direct accountability for your opponent. If we are as bad as you bleat then we are playing superior players who are going to win more possession of the ball. If we are playing accountable football then we are going to be trying to shut them down. Aren't we? Then you would be tagging as part of your one on one role. Right???

You should have your negative mindset seen too...really.

BTW, what bigger challenge can you give to a player to say I want you to be accountable and cover Gary Ablett. You wont completely nullify him but if you can hold him to sub 30 possessions a game would that not help the team's position. You dont tag him then you have flown the white flag from the start.

I got no problem with one on one Jaded it sounds good and appeals to masses. However it would be nice to think that the players would still play to their team plans and hopefully, if we dont massacre the ball, we just might put some pressure back on them.... on the scoreboard.

I think the point being that we are sick of this attitude, "we will get beaten anyway, let's just stem the bleeding as much as we can" That is not a good mindset.

I would rather some positive action and get smashed, than this negative mindset.

I agree with you. However, the poster I responded is displaying a negative mindset that would do an ostrich with its head in the sand proud.

He got 42 in the rain yesterday against the Lion's midfield... and they were tagging him.

At the end of the day we ain't got a single player who could match Ablett and effectively shut him down. Obviously you have to man him up, especially at the bounces, but whether someone focuses solely on shutting him down, or whether we play Aaron Davey on him (at least he'll reward us going the other way, and he can match him for pace), he will still get 40 possessions and rip us a new one.

Having said that, they'll probably chuck Bruce on him, and not only will he rip us apart, Bruce will manage to turn the ball over when he does beat him.

Should be an awesome game!

The Lions were as soft as butter at Geelong and they didn't tag him effectively. They did not have a red hot go. They have a midfield stacked with overripe tomatoes like TJ, Brennan, Sherman, McGrath that disappear when the going gets tough. Their rucks yesterday were putrid.

Geelong dont have Ottens in. They rely on Blake. The first point of pressure to put on them is the centre bounce. Its a start.

Clearly if we are going to play one on one as you demand, then someone is going to have to play on Ablett!! So your solution is..lets give up we are all doomed. Top effort that!

[Rampaging Demons 1]

Paul Johnson must be dropped immediately - we lose momentum when he rucks and yesterdaythe simple errors that he made: -

1. kicking the ball so that it floated;

2. mishandling the ball straight to the opposition

3. handballing to the opposition with a no look

4. dropping easy/ regulation marks.

I would rest Jetta - he has shown enough to suggest he is a 10 year footballer.. maric should come in for him.

newton - i think you persist. keep playing him - he has to do more but by playing him, you will see how genunie he is and how committed he is!!!

stef martin contineus to shine for me - he could be anything!

meeson - who would have thought but he continues to do the right things - present, spoil, etc

for me, we are on the right track!!

[Demons 32 235]

Is this in reply to my side, petjud?

Jetta has been okay. So too Bartram. I want to see Maric in for Jetta, that's all. You will note I still have Bartram in.

But he wants to know why Jetta should be dropped..... and so do I?

[titan_uranus 25,020]

But he wants to know why Jetta should be dropped..... and so do I?

He looks tired.

I think he will be a great player, but he's played 5 consecutive games at AFL level and I think that might have taken a lot of energy out of him.

[Jaded No More 68,915]

Clearly if we are going to play one on one as you demand, then someone is going to have to play on Ablett!! So your solution is..lets give up we are all doomed. Top effort that!

Either you've completely missed my point, or you're bored and trying to pick an argument.

My solution is to play an ATTACKING player on Ablett. I would love to see Davey play on him, and make him accountable the other way. I rather he gets 42 possessions without a tag and we get Davey attacking the contest (or Moloney or Jones or Morton etc...), than he gets 30 with a tag, and we play one down for most of the game.

Each player needs to be accountable for their man, that's a given. As you said, their ruck division is thin, and therefore I want four of our best attacking players at the bottom of each bounce trying to win the ball, instead of worrying "where's Ablett", "where Selwood", because all the worrying in the world would not stop either of those two dominating.

I want us to go in with a mindset of, we're going to attack the contest because we believe we can win as many contests as you. We believe that our backline is good enough to shut your forwards down. We believe that our ruckmen can give yours a run for their money. We believe that if we win first ball out of the middle, our forwards can put pressure on the scoreboard. That's the attitude I want us to have, even if all of that isn't true and we end up losing by a bigger margin.

Shutting down the game to the point where our midfield is concerned purely about the oppositions' players, and our forwards push up the ground to try and cover our mids, only for us to rebound back to nothing, will not make us win. We're going to lose either way, so at least lets make it a contest about who can win the ball and use it effectively. Obviously if it's quarter time and we're 20 goals down, shut down mode will be well and truly applied.

McLean said on radio yesterday that the players like taking risks and playing through the middle of the ground. It was all about risk versus reward. I hope that attitude doesn't change this week just because we're playing Geelong.

Would hate to see us play the boundaries, conceeding goals but never actually getting any ourselves. It is only when we back ourselves in that we pressure the scoreboard. We know what happens when we try to play defensively and shut down the contest. Against Geelong especially, if you turn it over, they will make you pay each and every time.

In summation, please don't play Dunn or Bruce or Bartram on Ablett. Thanks.

[Choko 493]

I will ask a straight question.......

In the last five games exactly what have Jetta and Bartram done wrong?

All answers on the back of a small envelope...........

Easy.

Bartram continually turns the ball over by foot. Most opposition goals are scored through turnover. He also doesn't take the game on enough.

Jetta is still learning his craft, but has not demonstrated an ability to be front and square and read off the packs, and his miss from straight in front in the last quarter against Adelaide was terrible.

[Demons 32 235]

He looks tired.

I think he will be a great player, but he's played 5 consecutive games at AFL level and I think that might have taken a lot of energy out of him.

But who cares what he looks like... Neither of us really know if he is tired so it's a non-argument.

[Demons 32 235]

Jetta is still learning his craft, but has not demonstrated an ability to be front and square and read off the packs, and his miss from straight in front in the last quarter against Adelaide was terrible.

He isn't a FP.... He is a HF/Wingman.

Crumbing the forward ball has not really been his job, but if it has been, granted he is failing.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

But who cares what he looks like... Neither of us really know if he is tired so it's a non-argument.

What?

Jetta looks tired to me. It's not like he's dominating anyway. Give him a rest.