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Lots of goalkicking, on the run and snapshots happening now Watts, Vince and Oscar walk to the van JKH doing laps at a good pace. Ollie still sitting on his butt close to the main group I'm signing off now. Cheers

I was determined to keep mine, but unfortunately determination just isn't enough.

He looks more like his dad than his dad does.

Love what I'm hearing wayne. Keep up the great work.

Arrived a little early... Rehab group already out on the paddock, with Don Tyson joining the regulars. Tyson, Hibberd, Big Mac and Melksham kicking in pairs on the lead with Crossie overseeing them. Viney on straight sprints, Vanders on fast laps, King mixing it up. The whole group arrived with Watts looking like a former Brisbane Brownlow medalist!

On the music, it was the video guys idea, asked permission and it was granted, players all for it Can begin to see why we grabbed McKenna, Joel Smith looking even better than last season, think we have found a smoky When session finished, fitness guys were having a go at Maynard for walking back without a shirt, "3 sessions and already the rig is out" The morale amongst the whole group seems very high Standouts for me in the drills Hogan, Brayshaw, McKenna

Half as good as Howe? Yuck.

Hopefully not Brad Hardie....

Hogan, hero: loved colleague returns to The Age

I think that's the biggest thing we've got to look forward to next year, the fact that there are very few players we'll be disappointed to see out there. 5-6 years ago I reckon there were 15 blokes on the list who'd frustrate the hell out of you and you'd be annoyed to see them picked on the weekend, now there are barely any. Credit to all involved in the footy department.

Holy F$#@ Batman.... Someone been leaving bomber kitbags around ??

That is a significantly bigger Joel Smith. Wow!!

Jack Watts looks like a young Billy Thorpe with that new style! (Showing my age!! )

Brayshaw looks set for a huge year if the start of pre season is anything to go by, showed up in fantastic shape, running extremely well, looks clean and sharp, i reckon he could really bounce back strongly this year.

Hungover. Oh by the way, that was TIC

Very apt. Most people you know think that you're crazy! (Jeez I wish picket had posted the Thorpey reference!)

and your bad memory recall

Had a chat to Jack Viney, already had the reins pulled a couple of times (surprise), wants to be back with main group, was given a firm no, looks in top condition anyway, said the hip has 'settled' really well, wants to join in Monday, told to wait and see Hibberd and Melksham looking better each session as well, both feeling really good after each session, looking forward to joining main group Vince is the old man now, starting his 12th pre season, looks in great shape as well Apart from the hair, message has sunk in with Watts as well, looks in elite condition, straight into whole session

Disturbing image. Do the three of you fit?

People are quick. A good chuckle here! People Jack Watts now looks like.

Dave Colbert went really hard on SEN This morning concerning Jab and his 2012 AA Status being allowed. Great Radio We are not alone!!

Full oval kicking to lead and running on at top pace now. A lot to like here. The skip is tearing it up. Bernie is fit and chomping the bit. ANB gets a crack at a full preseason. Petracca urges them on from the sidelines. Ollie might be low on middle distance stuff but he remains very high with the ball in his sights!

Firstly - a great report. I am going open up this old chestnut - drafting vs development. We have drafted some poor choices in the past but the idea that you can take young raw talent into the club, throw them onto the field and say " please thrive" is such blatant nonsense. To me this culture of teaching and educating will be Roos biggest legacy. He brought in a teaching team and made it clear to all at that club that drafting well is only half the equation - you also need to teach and develop the talent once it gets to your club.

I'm no fan of the new design, and I agree the policy is applied inconsistently, but in the overall scheme of things there are bigger fish to fry. The club needs to prioritise different issues in its dealings with the AFL, and I'd bet (and hope) that PJ is more focussed on things like fixturing and scheduling than the colour of our jumper in a handful of matches.

So went to my first training ever, was with my brother and my 16 month old kid, had an unexpected week back in Oz. I presumed there were some landers about but didn't have a clue to say hello too. We got there just as they were setting up. This is not exhaustive but the people we didn't see were Lumumba, Watts, Trengove, (Garland was doing the Tan), Pedersen, Gartlett and Lewis. Stayed till the end. Some additional comments about the running: Oliver looks like he has the most work of anyone to do fitness wise. It was a reminder that you are nude on the running track when the coaches are watching, there is no place to hide. He copped a very steady eyeball from Goodwin but was given some verbal encouragement at the end by everyone. Trac went out to hard early and was shot, when he finished last in the last lap he punched the ground and said 'I suck' he was not joking. There was love for him but you can tell he is driven, I do not expect him to be last for long, his thighs are amazing, he looks like he should be in a Marvel film. He wastes a huge amount of energy with his running style, being such a big unit I reckon he should cop some specialist coaching he will find speed from improved efficiency. Angus looks settled. Jones has the most perfect gait, he was torching Kent and he was running the wider track, is looking super fit. Kent is a solid unit, I really hope he can lift his defensive efforts this season, it is where I think he can really make a name for himself with his strength. Neal-Bullen is trying to be a small forward, (work in progress) his running is elite, he is not going to die wondering about his place, he is certainly trying to make the senior squad. Kennedy was 'clumsy' (this is by AFL standard) today, he seemed to have the yips when he was kicking for goal. He also is far from fit enough for the midfield at this stage. Melksham is a pretty ordinary kick, no better than McDonald, looks lean though. Hibbered was ok, the two category B rookies (names escape me Smith's son and the other one who were basketballers) both looked like they belong, could see them being players. Tom McDonald is a machine doing laps, fresh scar tissue on his shoulder on it is still angry from whenever it was done (I've never seen it without tape before). Coaches: Cross still looks like he should be playing and I'm sorry to say he is fitter than about 3/4 of the list. McCarthy was very verbal and chatting over the fence, unsolicited he offered that they were teaching them everything and made some quite negative comments about the Neeld era. He also mentioned that they are teaching the new coaches as well. I didn't get a read on Goodwin. I could see that he was taking the most interest in the contested drills. The culture was very positive in general I didn't see any sniping. Gawn has an amazing confidence and an even better desire to learn, no sign of hubris at all, very reassuring that his approach genuinely seems to be 'I will get better'. Stafford the ruck coach won a contest after McCarthy miskicked it, his words (first one in a hundered that I've won). Everything Gawn did he had a go, he was also doing some drills with Jetta who I rate highly but he was not going 100 % there were a few who seemed to be on various restrictions. Was a pleasure to see them using the footies, is funny I had always thought everyone would be a superstar in practise with the footy but you can see the decision makers from those that react and those that are natural kicks and those that are not mirror match play. Salem is the best kick we have, doesn't quite have the hoof of Bernie (and we are talking a shade of difference) but there is something about Salems hands, when he receives the ball there is this micro adjustment and the ball is perfectly centred in his hands (running or still) ready for the shortest ball drop of any we saw today. Has a very nice draw to his kick as well. While I was already a wrap for Salem, if he gets a tank he could be a more industrious Yze, didn't realise how much upside he had till i saw him kicking in person (my brother and I spent the afternoon trying to mimic his ball drop ) Hunt is bigger than I thought he would be. Hogan's stutter step isn't as bad in the flesh, he moves well but he really needs to go to a lab, he is still not kicking through the ball from a set shot, as soon as he does he will get another 15-20m distance. Still jet lagged, if I remember other stuff will write it up.

He went and played basketball Ted, hasn't played footy since junior days, I was talking to him about how we could field quite a good hoops team if they could persuade Max or Pencil to play centre, and Goodwin would allow it, not a bad starting five Gawn, Maynard, Petracca, Watts and Frost

I had to laugh that he is angry he can't give an oral submission. With his meticulous record keeping he shouldn't need to. I caught the last couple of minutes or so of the big ticket on the weekend, which was a recording of a live panel about drugs in sport (not sure of the exact topic but it seemed a WADA bashing exercise) hosted by Tracey Holmes. Dank was on the panel. I'm not an ABC basher but it infuriates me my tax dollars are going to a program that legitimizes this lunatic.

Maynard doesn't look too bad for a B class rookie, if that makes sense, I expected his kicking to be all over the place but it's quite good, and he is like a sponge asking questions all the time, when he is not in the drill, he watches intently

Gee I love the Training breakdown - its the first pre season for me on this forum - love the dedication from the members - some of us are up country

Goodwin was talking about playing him as a forward, even though he was playing as a defender at GWS, junior was forward

No. Look up Thorpey and The Aztecs doing "Poison Ivy"

Good size, speed, neat and tidy kicking action, knows where to run, know it is early days but was receiving lots of praise from coaches and other players during drills

Jack looks like he has been pumping iron with Gysberts in the break...

Wayne Ludbey photo from today's training. To be honest, I'm more troubled by the royal blue shorts than the platinum hair.

How is this for a conspiracy theory, the club purposely made the jumper look like a pile of puss in order to get the fans to revolt, that way they have clear evidence of the fans hatred of the AFL policy with which to approach the AFL and tell them to change it. We all know how much Dill hates annoying fans and making decisions through fan polls, there are stupider ways of making him see sense.

Oscar wearing number 37 maybe makeshift. Joel Smith continues to impress with speed and delivery.

Very few things tug at a supporters heart as much as the JUMPER !! It's not immaterial (npi) to how we perceive the club.

They'd want to do something special for $80 a pair! I could get a slab of Woodstock 440ml cans for that and by about the 8th one I wouldn't care if I had shorts on or not

not sure what you are telling us, mm just because something bad could have been even badder is not much consolation

Funny choice of words " feel like there was agreement with ASADA " Either there IS or its imagined ? Must be the "vibe"

Gill is quoted later in the article though: 'Asked if there was a chance ASADA would challenge the bans, McLachlan said: "I wouldn’t be announcing this if I didn’t feel there was agreement with ASADA."' of course 'if I didn't feel' are the sorts of weasel words that allow all sorts of escapes if required later. I'm not sure too many people put them 'on a pedestal' rjay. Most positive comment has been about the kind of job they've been able to do given how substantially underfunded they are and (in the Essendon case) without sufficient powers to obtain the sort of evidence they needed. The latter has been addressed by an amendment to the ASADA Act but the former won't change in a hurry. Without the capacity for a 'cost no object' investigation it's inevitable they'll do deals where it at least allows a guilty finding. They did with Cronulla, entirely pragmatically. And a deal with Essendon would at least have foreclosed on the eternal whining (which Watson continued even as he handed back the medal) about how the players really didn't do anything wrong. However unsatisfactory any resultant penalties might have seemed to many of us, the players (and Essendon) would at least have had to own their misdeeds. But,as you say, along came James.

Caravan Club are doing their first festival and it is going to be a rip snorter - in particular three of my favourites are playing - The backsliders, Jeff lang and Chris Russell's chicken walk.

Surely Biff you don't think so little of your fellow Demonlanders (or at least your fellow habitués of this thread) as to compare them with the TIO? The TIO has just proved in the last few days how much noise it can make about the number of complaints it has received against the nbn. It is somewhat less voluble about the number of complaints it has resolved (presumably the TIO's job, but maybe not). You wouldn't find anyone round here just making a noise for the sake of it, I trust. (My apologies for the lateness of this response btw. It may go without saying that my internet service was, as usual, intermittent most of yesterday. As to the government's part in that I cannot possibly comment without fear of contravening the court order again.) Added: Kudos on the comment on the Goodwin thread btw. Hope it goes well.

Well said nutty.

no reason he can't walk and chew gum at the same time, gv obviously, it's not one of the big issues but that shouldn't be a reason to do nothing. the afl is not going to come down on him like a ton of bricks if he brings it up as an issue

As much as its distasteful to suggest, but our club is talking shlt !! All the whiles evading the question. Poor form Mfc ...poor.:(

That is not the word I would use. Take your pick of illogical, discracefull or challenge to "the integrity of the competition" - MFC/AFL words, see below response from MFC. This is one of the prime reasons I hate last years and similarly this years clash jumpers with a passion - they look like some bad love child of a St Kilda and Carlton jumper and I don't recognise it as being a MFC jumper. My email and response from the club below: From: Melbourne Football Club <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>Date: 16 November 2016 3:32:28 pm AESTTo: Subject: RE: White Clash Jumpers are Not MFC Thanks for taking the time to contact the Melbourne Football Club. It is the Club's strong preference to wear our home guernsey all of the time however the AFL require all clubs to have a clash strip for when we play teams with similar colours to our own. The reasons for this are quality of broadcast - ease of the viewer to tell the teams apart when watching on television and, the integrity of the competition in terms of players being able to easily tell the opposition players apart from team mates in a contest. The broader debate around the use of clash guernseys is an industry wide issue. For reasons of history and tradition, all Club's would choose to wear their home guernsey at all times but the AFL, as the governing body, has determined for reasons such as clarity for television viewers and player confusion during play etc that clash guernseys are a required part of the game. We have tried a number of designs that don't include white but none of those designs reduce the clash issues with all the teams the AFL determine us to clash with. The bottom line is, some Club's uniforms, like ours, Fremantle, Western Bulldogs, St Kilda, West Coast etc are perceived to clash with more Clubs than others. Clubs like Collingwood and the Swans hardly have any issues with clash. When we are the home Club we will always wear our home Guernsey but as the away Club there are occasions when the AFL will require us to wear the clash guernsey. In 2017 we will be required to wear our clash guernsey 5 times, and potentially a sixth. We will look to work with the AFL to determine if our home guernsey can be worn when we play against St Kilda as the away team in Round 1. In 2015 we had an additional clash option, a predominantly red clash guernsey. This guernsey was only worn twice during that season. As our guernseys need to be approved by the AFL before proceeding to production in May/June the year prior to the season they are to be worn, without a fixture it is impossible to determine if in fact we could wear a clash guernsey that isn't predominantly white. For the past two season we have kept a similar design. The 2017 design has allowed us to include more red and blue whilst remaining predominantly white. We will continue to have discussions with the AFL about our clash guernsey options during the design process for 2018 in the first half of 2017. Thank you for your feedback and ongoing support it is greatly appreciated. Melbourne Football Club T: (03) 9652 1111 | melbournefc.com.au<http://melbournefc.com.au> Melbourne Football Club, Great Southern Stand, MCG, PO Box 254, East Melbourne, Vic 8002 -----Original Message----- From: Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 4:06 PM To: Melbourne Football Club Subject: White Clash Jumpers are Not MFC Jumpers To whom it may concern, I have been a MFC member for the past 30 years, having recently renewed my membership again around 2010, a period in which the club saw little success. I am writing to express my extreme dissatisfaction with MFC playing jumpers that feature a predominance of white. Jumpers featuring a majority of white are not identifiable as a Melbourne Football Club jumper and I have high confidence that the vast majority of Melbourne Football Club members and supporters have the same view. Every heart beats true for the RED and BLUE, not Red, Blue and White - that is the Western Bulldogs. I understand that this issue is somewhat driven by relatively contemporary AFL requirements. However these requirements are not applied universally as Essendon and Richmond featured clash jumpers without a predominance of white. I am tired of the club rolling over on this issue, meaning that we watch our team play in putrid playing jumpers for a significant number of games over the past ten or so years. It is time that the club acted on the interests of it's members and refuse to bow to the AFL's white clash jumper policy. Sincerely,

our stephen does a lot of blustering, threatening and promising, but when things get to the pointy end he just disappears like a puff of smoke. then pops up at his next footy pie night to pick up a nice purse and offer a bit of salacious condemnation of all and sundry. surprisingly he is very popular at such high brow events. much like the table-top strippers who complete the show

Comparisons with Parish are irrelevant. We have Oliver and I hope he becomes a great player. He has loads of potential but so do many others. Fitness and attitude to preparation and training are going to be all important. The drink driving thing is a storm in the teacup, the most important thing is whether it represents a pattern of poor behaviour, and, if so, can it be turned around. Hopefully, he will have a good mentor who can be a positive influence.

I remember watching replays in the 60's and 70's....I never ever had trouble dishtinquishing between teams even Melb vs Fitzroy on black and white TV on muddy quagmires. Why do the AFL think that supporters are so dumb now that we can't tell the difference between sides.....How have we become so stupid lately that we need to be led by the hand by the AFL Some times I turn on the footy and it takes a minute or two to see who the side in mainly white is. I know that it is a marketing ploy for people to buy new jumpers each year but please Port Adelaide 8 year old supporter designed their home jumper in a competion and a simple turn around of colours with white for their away jumper..... I wish she was a Melbourne supporter.....We might get a better design