1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

Yep, very much the potential dilemma and why we need to act to get ahead of it.

Hesitate and flounder.

The reality is the window is shut. This list as is isn't getting within a bulls roar of a Granny.

Time for a complete makeover. Reality suggests only a half dozen or so current Dees will still be running around in red and blue in 5 years time.

Need to bite the bullet. The current setup isn't taken us far.

The bolded bit is the only bit I hesitate over. The pity of it is it may well be the list that could win the Granny, as it once did.

Goodwin has many faults as do we all and I am so far removed from him and the players that I could not assume which of his is causing the hesitation. If ,,,Just Iffffff he could recognise and overcome so many of them we could win the big one.

It may well be that the genius of winning the games we have to, you know, those against inferior opposition , teams that contain less stars, teams that are developing but dont have the same fitness and support staff, that dont have the charismatic leader that dont win Grand Finals, could just get us there!

Thats what makes this game so exciting I guess.

If it all goes pear shape then Goody will not be the first or last coach to be let go. BUT i would be reluctant to have a complete makeover. Coz as Ive said many times I think we have a great list we just need to get that greatness out, perhaps by using the whole list and that just might be Goodys saving. Out of desperation he just might use a bit more variation than he has shown so far .

Bite the bullet and support the team

5 hours ago, beelzebub said:

Would Kozzy be that naive to think Goodwin would always be there ? Doubt it. Pickett has feathered his nest, and we'll. Good on him.

Probably not so naive, but he is human and it seems fairly obvious that he has a very close relationship with Goodwin as his coach. As I said (to cover my [censored] 🤣), it’s just a thought.

9 hours ago, GS_1905 said:

Goody is approaching the 10 year milestone

1) Buckley is the same type of coach as Goodwin he is more a player relationships coach and lacks any real additive tactical nous

2) He has been out of the game for almost 4 years, which is a generation in football years

3) The 2023 CFC premiership list is largely the same list he was working with. McCrae almost immediately turned it around in 2022 after just a couple of months with the team.

If that doesnt have a warning label on it, then i dont know what will. I wouldn't touch him in particular with a 10 ft pole.

I dont have anything personal against, i dont mind his commentary when he doesnt have his Pies goggles on. But keep him out of MFC.

No worries, happy to agree to disagree.

I think just as important is to bring in a new voice, new ideas and a breath of fresh air, especially for the older brigade. And I think Buckley is one (of a few) that are available and that have that kind of aura about them. And I'm of the belief that he'd have learnt a lot about his time at Collingwood, mistakes he made, things he did well/didn't do well etc.

Melbourne supporters get too caught up in his 'Collingwoodness' and all that allegiance nonsense. And I think just as importantly, some stronger line-coaches would help.

Again, no idea whether or not anything of the sort is financially viable.

But as one of many, I'm ready for change. Goody is just a broken record now. No substantial/consistent change in our weaknesses for yearssss and no serious pieces moved in order to keep up with the pack.

The players feel it. You can see it. Many supporters feel it. There comes a time.

Good old Cam Bruce or Hanson from Carlton

16 hours ago, Gibberish said:

This is what worries me. We really only have an interim CEO and interim Chairman with their full time replacements several months away from taking their roles full time. It's hard to see them making any changes until they're in place.

Not an ideal situation.

Only Melbourne could achieve that

On 02/08/2024 at 22:11, praha said:

Goodwin still deserves to turn things around next season but he's burnt his tickets up quicker than any other coach in recent memory. 

He has coached poorly this year. And as a club we've been poor this year just as we were in 2019. It might take a while to right this ship. But it's definitely the end of an era. 

He hasn’t coached well for his 9 years yes he won a flag but Yze played a big role, has struggled by his own admission in 19 & 24, pigheaded in 22 & didn’t play Casey players to rest seniors going into finals, burnt players like Bedford & Jordan, trading in Hunter who had issues culture issues allowing Oliver to play senior footy whilst he missed pre season, that sent a poor message to the others needed to earn his spot & respect back!

If we keep losing like this, you’d think Simons job would be in serious jeopardy

On 16/06/2025 at 21:33, Superunknown said:

Jeez the jungle drums are cranking

Not sure if it’s Danny Carey, Matt Cameron or Brad Wilk, but they’re being hammered.

Or Neil Peart?

2 hours ago, Ugottobekidding said:

Good old Cam Bruce or Hanson from Carlton

No thanks

We need a hard nosed teacher like John Longmire

10 hours ago, GS_1905 said:

What’s the wrap on the up and coming coaches. I was a bit worried when WCE were really struggling to find a coach and ended up going for Mini purely as there were no other candidates that stuck out.

West coast are a mess and that job was a poisoned chalice. You're basically agreeing to 5 years of pain before likely being sacked when all the hard work is done.

There are plenty of good assistants around. One we should certainly look at is Brisbane's midfield coach Cameron Bruce.

On 16/06/2025 at 06:21, bing181 said:

Can't. Not in the short term at least, and not without changes in the players they're playing alongside. Put Scott Pendlebury in that team and watch what happens to Clarry and Trac.

It's quite a situation where 3 players on elite money can't hit targets by foot

Petracca, Oliver & Viney ... so in terms of expectations we're getting B grade performance from all 3

And that's not necessarily a criticism as all 3 have probably been pumping the ball forward in the way they do for 20 years

But as we know, the long kicks forward often eventuate with a negligible return or in some cases, turnovers which can lead to opposition scoring opportunities

We shared the ball well (heading forward) in the games against Freo, Lions, Sydney and to a lesser extent against the Hawks & Saints, so the new plan can work

But sharing the ball in every game seems like a bridge too far

And it's a player & coaching issue, not one or the other. Goodwin will likely stay as the payout will be too costly (especially when factoring in the 75% tax on the extra FD spend)

Do we move some players on? Possibly, but the FD might think that the old habits can be fixed. I'm not convinced that can happen

Edited 18 hours ago18 hr by Macca

1 hour ago, Demonsone said:

He hasn’t coached well for his 9 years yes he won a flag but Yze played a big role, has struggled by his own admission in 19 & 24, pigheaded in 22 & didn’t play Casey players to rest seniors going into finals, burnt players like Bedford & Jordan, trading in Hunter who had issues culture issues allowing Oliver to play senior footy whilst he missed pre season, that sent a poor message to the others needed to earn his spot & respect back!

Don’t agree with Jordan, he’s struggling this season

Agree with Oliver from last season and whilst hindsight is wonderful could you imagine if we let Clarrie go after 21/22 and hadn’t extended his contract Demonland would have exploded

Yze responsible for 21 yet had no roll in the straight sets exits of 22 and 23, that is a myth

Unfortunately for the last 3 years Goodwin has been playing a giant game of scrabble with our forward line. He has 7 tiles and he’s just moving those 7 tiles around trying to make a word……..and he can’t.

On 16/06/2025 at 21:33, Superunknown said:

Jeez the jungle drums are cranking

An explorer is deep in the jungle, in a corner of the earth never before seen by civilized man. Suddenly, he hears drums in the distance. He turns to his faithful native guide and asks what the drums mean.

“No worry, no worry,” says the guide, “drums good, drums okay.”

The explorer, trusting his guide, continues on through the jungle. The drums get louder and closer as darkness falls, and they set to make camp. “Are you sure this is safe, making camp with those drums so close by?” says the explorer.

“No worry, no worry,” says the guide, “drums good, drums okay.”

So they make a little fire, and eat something. The explorer is uneasy about sleeping, with that strange drumming nearby. He is about to ask his guide once again for reassurance, when, as suddenly as they began, the drums stop. The guide freezes, a look of terror on his face. “What? What is it?” whispers the explorer, “Is it bad that the drums stopped?”

“Drums good, drums okay,” said the guide, “But drums stop, that bad. Very bad, when drums stop…”

“What? Tell me! What is it that comes after the drums stop?!?”

“Bass solo.”

On 16/06/2025 at 19:31, beelzebub said:

We aren't a clever club are we

Very strange to extend his contract after winning a flag and following up with two 16 win seasons

1 hour ago, KozzyCan said:

West coast are a mess and that job was a poisoned chalice. You're basically agreeing to 5 years of pain before likely being sacked when all the hard work is done.

There are plenty of good assistants around. One we should certainly look at is Brisbane's midfield coach Cameron Bruce.

It's, interesting. I automatically thought about the lions forward line.

Charlie Cameron is great, Kozzy is even better.

Daniher? I used to love watching him when he was horrible. He's quite formidable now.

The Lions midfielders and defence move it fast and accurately (in general)

System and skills.

I don't think our list is good enough for a flag right now, but it's good enough to make the finals if we had better skills and a better system.

Goal kicking, field kicking.

Kynan Brown is another who has the pace and evasiveness to be a full time senior player. He's wonderful through traffic and with his tackling. But.. His kicking has been letting him down. That's been the case for 2 years now.

If Joe Daniher can transform their game. Anyone can with the right mindset, coaching and support.

We've replaced a fair chunk of assistant coaches but nothing is changing with systems and skills.

As ANB left us, he said that Yze really helped him with his kicking (remember he used to butcher it as well but he got much better). He said Yze taught him to straighten and take a beat before disposal. I.e. make sure of it. Made a world of difference for our team. He went from a second tier player to a vital cog for us.

Gus was very much the same. Very steady under pressure.

Windsor has been too but it feels like his calmness and disposal is starting to crumble now.

There's a heap of players out there just hack kicking out of defence or into f50 right now.

I can't believe that if they really were supported and time was invested, the likes of Clarry, Tracc, Max and JV couldn't dramatically improve their kicking.

They may never be disposal guns but they could do much much better.

What's going on?

We still seem to be in a world of chaos on the field most of the time.

1 hour ago, Demonsone said:

He hasn’t coached well for his 9 years yes he won a flag

Another classic quote

1 hour ago, Billy said:

No thanks

We need a hard nosed teacher like John Longmire

Hasn't been able to get the swans over the line.

1 hour ago, Dee Viney Intervention said:

Unfortunately for the last 3 years Goodwin has been playing a giant game of scrabble with our forward line. He has 7 tiles and he’s just moving those 7 tiles around trying to make a word……..and he can’t.

Did you acknowledge Dwayne Russell when you quoted him

1 hour ago, Macca said:

It's quite a situation where 3 players on elite money can't hit targets by foot

Petracca, Oliver & Viney ... so in terms of expectations we're getting B grade performance from all 3

And that's not necessarily a criticism as all 3 have probably been pumping the ball forward in the way they do for 20 years

But as we know, the long kicks forward often eventuate with a negligible return or in some cases, turnovers which can lead to opposition scoring opportunities

We shared the ball well (heading forward) in the games against Freo, Lions, Sydney and to a lesser extent against the Hawks & Saints, so the new plan can work

But sharing the ball in every game seems like a bridge too far

And it's a player & coaching issue, not one or the other. Goodwin will likely stay as the payout will be too costly (especially when factoring in the 75% tax on the extra FD spend)

Do we move some players on? Possibly, but the FD might think that the old habits can be fixed. I'm not convinced that can happen

I think old habits are too engrained at this stage in their careers (for those 3 players mentioned).

Even if they worked on improving, which in theory they have, realistically it could take them 2 more preseasons before we can see results in performance on the field.

By then Viney will be 33, 31 Petraca, 31 Oliver.

6 minutes ago, ElDiablo14 said:

I think old habits are too engrained at this stage in their careers (for those 3 players mentioned).

Even if they worked on improving, which in theory they have, realistically it could take them 2 more preseasons before we can see results in performance on the field.

By then Viney will be 33, 31 Petraca, 31 Oliver.

I reckon we can fix Oliver (just handpass it) but not so sure on the other 2

The midfield looked far better when Viney was out of the side. Also reckon we looked a lot more balanced in that game against Gold Coast last year when both Oliver and Petracca weren't playing.

Basically we can't play all three in the midfield, and we are wasting guys like Windsor and Langford by prioritising the old guard.

I think Goodwin should really drop one of Viney or Oliver but highly doubt he does.

14 minutes ago, Macca said:

I reckon we can fix Oliver (just handpass it) but not so sure on the other 2

Don't try to fix Viney, just use him purely as a HF. No more midfield for you mate.

10 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

The midfield looked far better when Viney was out of the side. Also reckon we looked a lot more balanced in that game against Gold Coast last year when both Oliver and Petracca weren't playing.

Basically we can't play all three in the midfield, and we are wasting guys like Windsor and Langford by prioritising the old guard.

I think Goodwin should really drop one of Viney or Oliver but highly doubt he does.

And that's one of his issues. Hence why a lot of us are asking for a new coach with fresh eyes and no strings attached.