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POSTGAME: Practice Match vs Carlton


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5 hours ago, Monbon said:

UM, weren't we undermanned as well??????

Yep.

From our best 22 we were missing Clarry, Petty, Hunter and Melk (and potentially spargs and McAdam?). And of course no BB or Tmac.

They had Weitering and Walsh out. I'm not sure if they had other best 22 players out, none were mentioned in the call.

Hard to argue they were more undermanned than us i would have thought (Walsh is gun, calrry is better. Weiterng perhaps has Petts covered, both in terms of ability and importance to the team. But no Mcadam or Melk meant we didn't have a medium size defensive forward we like to run with) 

Edited by binman
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28 minutes ago, Neil Crompton said:

I’ve recently praised ANB for the way he has improved his skills and, as a result, the great season he had last year.
When ANB is pressuring a player, he is great, however, when ANB is under pressure, too often he fumbles or gives a poor disposal and the forward flow is haltered or we turnover the ball as a result. This happens too often to just be an occasional occurrence, and as such, until he can consistently improve this area of his play he will continue to not receive the recognition he should by the demon faithful. 

Ok Froggy I accept that you have made positive comments about ANB but that you would like to see improvements in his disposal. Fair enough. However, ANB seems to attract forensic comment over his skills.  There is not a player out there without a weakness or not prone to error. However it’s best to look at a players strengths and what he brings to the team. In most cases a players strengths will outweigh his weaknesses. So you accept the weaknesses if on balance he brings added value to the team. At the end of the day, ANB is a premiership player whose efforts that day contributed to a famous victory. I’m sure he had his fumbles along the way. I seem to remember another premiership player nicknamed Froggy who was slow, turned like the Queen Mary and kicked wobbly old punts that were lucky to stretch beyond 50m but who happened to kick the winning goal. 

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Didn’t see the game, but I noticed Ed Langdon had 92% game time and hasn’t been mentioned once in this thread. 

Really hoping for an improvement on last year’s season for Ed. 

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8 hours ago, Binmans PA said:

Dunstall's commentary was appalling. He has absolutely no idea about Melbourne or its players. Deadset numbnuts.

That's all from me.

Two resolutions this footy season.

One, avoid getting worked up about the footy media outside of game day. Key strategy is to avoid footy media.

Two, avoid getting worked up about the footy commentary of mathces. Key strategy - be more sanguine. 

But good lord they make it hard. Dunstall is not a work experience kid on a kayo stream of a practice match at some suburban ground. I assume he is paid pretty well by Fox to provide expert comments.

How then does he not know Chandler was a best 22 player for most, if not all, of last season? Just embarrassing to say he rates Chandler and think he will make  a case and become a regular best 22 selections?

I mean clearly he watches few games other than those he is involved in covering on Fox and does zero research.

A little while later Montagna pointed out  that Chandler played a key role last season and King reference his leadership. 

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Went along last night in the sauna at Princes Park, we looked great, too fast, strong and skilled for Carlton. Especially like our quicker ball movement and more open game style which I've always thought plays better to the strengths of our list - we don't have the foot skills to play a Brisbane Lions style kick mark game.

Midfield balance will be better too with less inside bulls and more class with Salem/Kosi running through there. Billings will be a handy acquisition as the pressure is off him, we don't care he was a high draft pick he can just play his role and use his foot skills to help the side. He can certainly play and will be more than serviceable I reckon.

Forward line a big improvement on last year, love JVRs attack on the ball and marking ability and I though Schache was useful, draws his opponents by running to good spots and played his role quite well. 

All in all a very positive night, bring on Opening Round! 

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1 hour ago, fr_ap said:

ANB is a champion player & human. Steadily improved himself, worked on his deficiencies, and did his time in the VFL no complaints until he absolutely smashed the door down & couldn't be left out of the side. 

Not the perfect player but gives the most consistent effort of anyone in our team, without being an emotionally charged yo-yo like some others. Level-headed, self-aware, leadership in spades & consistent effort/attitude - you really cant ask for more. 

One of those guys who probably won't be fully recognised until he hangs them up.

Great post.

BIG YES FROM ME.

ANB is a pivotal part of this team and its success. 

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22 minutes ago, Mel Bourne said:

Didn’t see the game, but I noticed Ed Langdon had 92% game time and hasn’t been mentioned once in this thread. 

Really hoping for an improvement on last year’s season for Ed. 

From my seating, I noticed that Ed played on the defensive side of his wing opponent. It appeared as though this provided cover for Caleb to be more attacking from his wing. He didn't have a stand out game but I think Goody would say he played his role well. 

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12 minutes ago, hemingway said:

Ok Froggy I accept that you have made positive comments about ANB but that you would like to see improvements in his disposal. Fair enough. However, ANB seems to attract forensic comment over his skills.  There is not a player out there without a weakness or not prone to error. However it’s best to look at a players strengths and what he brings to the team. In most cases a players strengths will outweigh his weaknesses. So you accept the weaknesses if on balance he brings added value to the team. At the end of the day, ANB is a premiership player whose efforts that day contributed to a famous victory. I’m sure he had his fumbles along the way. I seem to remember another premiership player nicknamed Froggy who was slow, turned like the Queen Mary and kicked wobbly old punts that were lucky to stretch beyond 50m but who happened to kick the winning goal. 

Totally agree with you EH, and thank you for your astute comment. ANB’s positives certainly do outweigh his negatives, not just on the field, but also off it as well. My comment was a response to both hardtack and fr—ap, who were looking for explanations as to why ANB doesn’t get the recognition he deserves. I simply offered my explanation as to why he doesn’t, and, as you say, why he continually “attracts forensic comments about his skills”. The sign of a really good player is that they perform and excel while they are under pressure. He hasn’t reached that stage, yet. However, he is certainly in my best 22. 
(NC’s possession and final kick in ‘64 was certainly under accuse pressure given the situation and luckily he came through).

 

 

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JVR’s first half was very exciting. I suggest that along with Salem’s impressive performance in the middle ,a position he hasn’t played since his junior days, the 2 were the biggest of a myriad of positives from last night.

 

Edited by joeboy
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To be honest MB I watched the game pretty closely and didn’t really notice Ed Langdon until 3rd quarter, maybe because there was so much going on and both teams were using the corridor more. We also had so many players that stood out but he did provide some good linkage when we did go around his wing. It was hard to take my eyes off zmax, Salo, JV, Sparrow, Laurie’s inside work, Billings kicking, JVR and Windsor is eye catching, our backline held steady. Tomlinson did what he had to do, McKay is huge, I would love to have a player of his size and power in our fwd 50. Fullarton played a full game in the 2’s and went ok backed up by Verrall and Farris-White and Verrall came on in the last and looked comfortable at senior level as did young Brownie and the Colt. With Petty, Clayton and McAdam to come back in I am feeling a lot bullish, but time will tell.

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4 minutes ago, Dannyz said:

From my seating, I noticed that Ed played on the defensive side of his wing opponent. It appeared as though this provided cover for Caleb to be more attacking from his wing. He didn't have a stand out game but I think Goody would say he played his role well. 

He was in the right spots all game and was burnt a number of times inside 50

 

Ran all day

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5 minutes ago, binman said:

Two resolutions this footy season.

One, avoid getting worked up about the footy media outside of game day. Key strategy is to avoid footy media.

Two, avoid getting worked up about the footy commentary of mathces. Key strategy - be more sanguine. 

But good lord they make it hard. Dunstall is not a work experience kid on a kayo stream of a practice match at some suburban ground. I assume he is paid pretty well by Fox to provide expert comments.

How then does he not know Chandler was a best 22 player for most, if not all, of last season? Just embarrassing to say he rates Chandler and think he will make  a case and become a regular best 22 selections?

I mean clearly he watches few games other than those he is involved in covering on Fox and does zero research.

A little while later Montagna pointed out  that Chandler played a key role last season and King reference his leadership. 

Agreed. I really don’t know why we pay attention to the footy media. I suppose it’s hard to avoid and when you do read the comments it’s frustrating and annoying. . It’s a world influenced by media. Social media has just made it a lot worse. Standards have dropped and commentators exhibit their biases, laziness and need to be noticed. We need to avoid them all. I now avoid most of the mainstream commercial media particularly Murdoch based organisations. They are appalling. 
Dunstall is bad but he has many mates. Tell me a good one. However, their laziness and lack of homework is annoying. Stick with DL for information, commentary and spirited debate. 

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1 minute ago, slimecat said:

Haven’t heard much said about Knuckles McVee yet — assuming he was solid as ever?

Solid defensively but did not get as involved in offensive transition as much as he would have liked. 

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6 minutes ago, Dannyz said:

Solid defensively but did not get as involved in offensive transition as much as he would have liked. 

 

8 minutes ago, slimecat said:

Haven’t heard much said about Knuckles McVee yet — assuming he was solid as ever?

With Motlop injured he didn't really have an opponent to play on

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4 hours ago, forever demons said:

Nibbles is the heart beat of the team.My first picked player every week

Yep.

Nibs ain’t going anywhere anytime soon. Will be selected every week.

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There was a lot of positive offseason commentary from the club around Laurie, and he was getting games last year even though he wasn't standout in the VFL. Does anyone else see it?

He reminds me of Jordon, in that he is not bad, but there's no standout element sof his game. You've gotta have something. Be quick, tall, an elite ball user (smarts, decision making or skills), tough as nails, an elite endurance runner... I don't see any of that.

Depth at best.

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25 minutes ago, hemingway said:


Dunstall is bad but he has many mates. Tell me a good one. However, their laziness and lack of homework is annoying. Stick with DL for information, commentary and spirited debate. 

Two words: Joey [censored] Montagna! 🥳

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43 minutes ago, Neil Crompton said:

Totally agree with you EH, and thank you for your astute comment. ANB’s positives certainly do outweigh his negatives, not just on the field, but also off it as well. My comment was a response to both hardtack and fr—ap, who were looking for explanations as to why ANB doesn’t get the recognition he deserves. I simply offered my explanation as to why he doesn’t, and, as you say, why he continually “attracts forensic comments about his skills”. The sign of a really good player is that they perform and excel while they are under pressure. He hasn’t reached that stage, yet. However, he is certainly in my best 22. 
(NC’s possession and final kick in ‘64 was certainly under accuse pressure given the situation and luckily he came through).

 

 

Probably unsurprisingly, I have a different take on why he doesn't get the recognition he deserves.

Short version - confirmation bias.

As a rule, i rarely visit game day threads once the game begins. But did a couple of times last night- practice game and all that.

First post I read (near the end of first q i think) was knocking nibbler's disposal. And yes he missed a couple of kicks inside 50.

And I posted, that I agree, then joked, that i misread the post and thought it was about tracc.

That's because tracc already had two howlers kicking inside 50. Without a single comment being made. 

Ironically after that tracc made three even worse howlers (beginning of second q), one of which, a total clanger (missed an open target completely and kicked it straight to a blues player) in the middle of the ground that cost us an easy shot on goal - and they scored on turnover.

A potential 12 point play that nibbla would have got roasted for.

At half time I checked the stats and tracc was only going at 52% DE. 

Nibbla, was 72%. .

Nibbler hit a number of targets with neat kicks in scoring chains and had at least two direct scoring assist with kicks inside 50.

Nibbla had TWICE as many scoring involvements (6 to 3) than tracc - only salo, koz, sparrow and viney had more

And nibbla kicked 1.1, whilst tracc didnt bother the scorer (kicking one on the full iirc). 

Yet there was very little comment, if any, about those excellent kicks and skills by nibbla.

Or criticism of track's appalling disposal.

Nibbla finished the game on 72.9% DE - the same as salo (tracc improved in the second half, finishing on 65.2%)

Note tracc only had 1 more contested possession than nibbla so the data is very comparable (ie nibbla didn't pad his stats with, say easy chip kicks accross hb).

Nibbla is a better kick than tracc. Of that there is no doubt. The career data and the eyes completely back that assertion up.

But i reckon most fans would disgaree, in large part because of baked in confirmation bias about both players. 

Edited by binman
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11 minutes ago, binman said:

Probably unsurprisingly, I have a different take on why he doesn't get the recognition he deserves.

Short version - confirmation bias.

As a rule, i rarely visit game day threads once the game begins. But did a couple of times last night- practice game and all that.

First post I read (near the end of first q i think) was knocking nibbler's disposal. And yes he missed a couple of kicks inside 50.

And I posted, that I agree, then joked, that i misread the post and thought it was about tracc.

That's because tracc already had two howlers kicking inside 50. Without a single comment being made. 

Ironically after that tracc made three even worse howlers (beginning of second q), one of which, a total clanger (missed an open target completely and kicked it straight to a blues player) in the middle of the ground that cost us an easy shot on goal - and they scored on turnover.

A potential 12 point play that nibbla would have got roasted for.

At half time I checked the stats and tracc was only going at 52% DE. 

Nibbla, was 72%. .

Nibbler hit a number of targets with neat kicks in scoring chains and had at least two direct scoring assist with kicks inside 50.

Nibbla had TWICE as many scoring involvements (6 to 3) than tracc - only salo, koz, sparrow and viney had more

And nibbla kicked 1.1, whilst tracc didnt bother the scorer (kicking one on the full iirc). 

Yet there was very little comment, if any, about those excellent kicks and skills by nibbla.

Or criticism of track's appalling disposal.

Nibbla finished the game on 72.9% DE - the same as salo (tracc improved in the second half, finishing on 65.2%)

Note tracc only had 1 more contested possession than nibbla so the data is very comparable (ie nibbla didn't pad his stats with, say easy chip kicks accross hb).

Nibbla is a better kick than tracc. Of that there is no doubt. The career data and the eyes completely back that assertion up.

But i reckon most fans would disgaree, in large part because of baked in confirmation bias about both players. 

And for Petracca, the halo effect - the assumption that everything he does is magnificent because in general, is such a high quality player 

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6 minutes ago, MrFreeze said:

And for Petracca, the halo effect - the assumption that everything he does is magnificent because in general, is such a high quality player 

That's exactly right - i think that is a key factor in the positive confirmation bias for tracc.

Nibbla suffers from whatever the opposite is to the halo effect. 

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