Jump to content

Posting Unsubstantiated Rumours on this Website is Strictly Forbidden
  • IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING

    Demonland has made the difficult decision to not permit this platform to be used to discuss & debate the off-field issues relating to the Melbourne Football Club including matters currently being litigated between the Club & former Board members, board elections, the culture at the club & the personal issues & allegations against some of our players & officials ...

    We do not take these issues & this decision lightly & of course we believe that these serious matters affecting the club we love & are so passionate about are worthy of discussion & debate & I wish we could provide a place where these matters can be discussed in a civil & respectful manner.

    However these discussions unfortunately invariably devolve into areas that may be defamatory, libelous, spread unsubstantiated rumours & can effect the mental health of those involved. Even discussion & debate of known facts or media reports can lead to finger pointing, blame & personal attacks.

    The repercussion is that these discussions can open this website, it’s owners & it’s users to legal action & may result in this website being forced to shutdown.

    Our moderating team are all volunteers & cannot moderate the forum 24/7 & as a consequence problematic content that contravenes our rules & standards may go unnoticed for some time before it can be removed.

    We reserve the right to delete posts that offend against our above policy & indeed, to ban posters who are repeat offenders or who breach our code of conduct.

    WE HAVE BUILT A FANTASTIC ONLINE COMMUNITY AT DEMONLAND OVER THE PAST 23 YEARS & WE WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE TO BE ABLE TO DISCUSS THE CLUB WE LOVE & ARE SO PASSIONATE ABOUT.

    Thank you for your continued support & understanding. Go Dees.


2 weeks in a row sides get done by the Goal Umps


Monbon

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

It’s completely the goal umpires fault. The umpire:

- called it a point; and

- didn’t request a score review.

under the laws of the game, points aren’t reviewed. I fail to see how this is anyone’s fault except the goal umpire’s. 

It’s the fault of the AFL for not putting in place clear rules that means goal umpires cannot make these types of mistakes. 
Every score with x minutes left on the game is reviewed. Or every score when the margin is under x is reviewed. 
 

Humans make mistakes. By putting in rules in place and the proper technology, we can avoid mistakes as much as possible. 

  • Like 4
  • Thinking 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, BoBo said:

I’m not defending the current system, more advocating for using what we have, whilst we have it in its current form, to correctly adjudicate a decision, despite if it take 2-3 minutes.

In our game the review felt rushed (I thought they were definitely calling it a goal when they did as it felt so short)and they only reviewed the side on view once (to my memory) and in the Adelaide game it wasn’t used at all but if it were, conclusively it would have shown it was a goal.

Moving forward, the AFL absolutely has to upgrade the system in the myriad of ways already listed in this thread. 
 

I also wouldn’t say I’ve seen as many as 50 reviews that were inconclusive to be fair. Definitely there’s probably been 4-5 I’ve heard about/seen where the decision didn’t seem to be correct. But this falls down on the inadequacy of the technology. 
 

My only contention is really: you can try and rush decisions to save time (and fan patience) or you can spend more time (with current tech) arriving at the correct decision. We can’t expect the current set up to be both fast and correct as it’s inadequate.

That's right and I wasn't having a go at you anyway

The point is that the review system is farcical so we can't expect correct results... it's in the lap of the gods

So with the Petracca kick (and other numerous examples) the review process was inclusive either way

And the review process (if used) in the Crows/Swans game could easily have been inconclusive as well and they might have stayed with the soft call

The system we have in place is garbage and because of that, it can't be relied it

We don't know what we're going to get.  Grainy video, how many angles? It's a joke of a system

And the goal umpire is out of position because he has to get out of the way of the milling players (or risk getting crushed)

In the Crows game and with regards to the shot at goal, the umpire isn't even in the picture because he can't be.  He can't stand next to the post as that's the players domain

By contrast, the players have to get out of the way of the field umpires (or risk getting reported)

Edited by Macca
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

To further compound matters, we now have players routinely ‘claiming’ to have touched the ball from shots to put doubt in the goal umpire’s mind and get the soft call. They know the ARC will be inconclusive. Marchbank succeeded last week. Worpel tried it on Sunday (Clarrie’s goal) but failed. We even had North’s McKay claiming to have touched one that didn’t appear to be within a metre of him yesterday. This needs to be stamped out. It’s cheating.

  • Like 5
  • Clap 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Macca said:

That's right and I wasn't having a go at you anyway

The point is that the review system is farcical so we can't expect correct results... it's in the lap of the gods

So with the Petracca kick (and other numerous examples) the review process was inclusive either way

And the review process (if used) in the Crows/Swans game could easily have been inconclusive as well and they might have stayed with the soft call

The system we have in place is garbage and because of that, it can't be relied it

We don't know what we're going to get.  Grainy video, how many angles? It's a joke of a system


Oh absolutely. There shouldn’t be inconclusive decisions. Well, maybe 1 in 100, but I’d say it’s probably 10-15 in 100 currently. 

Genuine question - What do you reckon the AFL would have done if it were 1st week of finals, at the G and instead of Adelaide… it was Carlton? 
 

I wouldn’t put it past Gil to be making a frantic phone call to the fourth umpire demanding they change the result. It would be absolute carnage. The AFL is bloody lucky both these results didn’t happen in finals. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, BoBo said:


Oh absolutely. There shouldn’t be inconclusive decisions. Well, maybe 1 in 100, but I’d say it’s probably 10-15 in 100 currently. 

Genuine question - What do you reckon the AFL would have done if it were 1st week of finals, at the G and instead of Adelaide… it was Carlton? 
 

I wouldn’t put it past Gil to be making a frantic phone call to the fourth umpire demanding they change the result. It would be absolute carnage. The AFL is bloody lucky both these results didn’t happen in finals. 

Cutting to the chase, the game needs 4 goal umpires for starters and state of the art technology to help the goal umpires

If the AFL do that, the angst will subside

As things stand, we can almost bank on another controversial goal line moment and that could decide a final

Edited by Macca
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

The Adelaide decision was obviously a blunder.

Is there categoric and undeniable proof that the umpire made an incorrect decision in relation to the Petracca goal decision last week?

 

We have no idea who is telling lies, or if there is any other angles, if that is what you mean.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just watching AFL360

NHL has a system where the review system can step in after a call that was incorrect, and they can reset the time and the score. That could have worked

NFL has a system in place where no decision in the last 2 minutes of a game is made on the field without referring or direct communications with the review system

Cricket has the captains call.

I also didn't realise there were two other reviews on the weekend that were dubious at best, and yet the 'umpires' call is upheld. It's terrible, and it shouldn't be a scenario where we put the blame on the officials on the ground. That ump made a horrible decision, I feel sorry for the guy, but the rules and the processes should be better around him. If his decision COULD have been overturned he wouldn't be basically out of a job for the remainder of the year.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Jaded No More said:

It’s the fault of the AFL for not putting in place clear rules that means goal umpires cannot make these types of mistakes. 
Every score with x minutes left on the game is reviewed. Or every score when the margin is under x is reviewed. 
 

Humans make mistakes. By putting in rules in place and the proper technology, we can avoid mistakes as much as possible. 

I do agree with what you’re saying, as a broader issue type. But in the given circumstances and with the rules the way they’re currently written, the goal umpire himself is the one at fault. He should have called for a review. If he did, it would have been overturned and called a goal. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites


10 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

I do agree with what you’re saying, as a broader issue type. But in the given circumstances and with the rules the way they’re currently written, the goal umpire himself is the one at fault. He should have called for a review. If he did, it would have been overturned and called a goal. 

Not necessarily

The video available at the time might have been inconclusive just like it was in the Petracca incident

And if the initial call was that the ball shaved the post, the soft call might have stood

We've seen various angles since but what was available at the time? We can't be sure of anything

And the umpire was miles out of position to make a call anyway ... again, not his fault because we tell the goal umpires to get out of the way of the players.  Which is farcical in itself

The goal umpire should sue the AFL for wrongful dismissal

It's classic scapegoating to appease supporter bloodlust

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, GBDee said:

To further compound matters, we now have players routinely ‘claiming’ to have touched the ball from shots to put doubt in the goal umpire’s mind and get the soft call. They know the ARC will be inconclusive. Marchbank succeeded last week. Worpel tried it on Sunday (Clarrie’s goal) but failed. We even had North’s McKay claiming to have touched one that didn’t appear to be within a metre of him yesterday. This needs to be stamped out. It’s cheating.

I think our players should spend a bit of time getting into oppo cheats 

all game

Every game they play 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, GBDee said:

To further compound matters, we now have players routinely ‘claiming’ to have touched the ball from shots to put doubt in the goal umpire’s mind and get the soft call. They know the ARC will be inconclusive. Marchbank succeeded last week. Worpel tried it on Sunday (Clarrie’s goal) but failed. We even had North’s McKay claiming to have touched one that didn’t appear to be within a metre of him yesterday. This needs to be stamped out. It’s cheating.

And Steven May came out not long ago and declared that he'd instructed his fellow backmen to always claim they'd touched the footy when near the goal line (even if they hadn't touched it)

It's quite a toxic environment isn't it?  We set up the umpires to fail and then scream blue murder when they make mistakes

The sport needs an overhaul with regards to all the grey areas.  Flopping & staging needs to be stamped out as well.  Retrospectively rub the cheats out ... weeks on the sidelines like the Italian league (Serie A) dealt with the divers

And as previously stated, the area around the goal line needs a complete overhaul

Edited by Macca
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

All sporting codes seem to be aware of some failures within the protocols that they participate under and they are not happy. The year of AI2023.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are two different issues at play when the AFL talks about speeding up the game. The first is the style of game. The AFL seems obsessed with having a non-stop game. The second is keeping the length of the game shorter, partly to fit within TV schedules but also because of the perception that today's generation hasn't got the attention span for longer products. I'm not sure I agree that either concern is warranted.

Nevertheless, we all have suggestions which can speed up play to meet both. The obvious one which has been commented on over and over is to get rid of the ruck nomination rule. Combined with that, the boundary umpires should stop waiting for ruckmen to get into position. Just throw the ball back in as soon as the umpires are ready. 

If we "saved" some time this way, we could then go back to the eminently sensible way the game restarted years ago after a behind was scored. That is, after the goal umpires had signalled and more importantly, after the ARC has also given the all clear for every score.

  • Like 1
  • Clap 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The plot thickens

Turns out that goal umpires might get marked down if they go to the Arc too often

So in order to keep your position you could easily take the (perceived) safer option .. maybe more so if you're out of position

But again, being caught out of position is not the fault of the goal umpire

So the footy public got their pound of flesh & their sacrificial lamb but the overall shoddy problem still exists

Edited by Macca
  • Shocked 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, BoBo said:


Oh absolutely. There shouldn’t be inconclusive decisions. Well, maybe 1 in 100, but I’d say it’s probably 10-15 in 100 currently. 

Genuine question - What do you reckon the AFL would have done if it were 1st week of finals, at the G and instead of Adelaide… it was Carlton? 
 

I wouldn’t put it past Gil to be making a frantic phone call to the fourth umpire demanding they change the result. It would be absolute carnage. The AFL is bloody lucky both these results didn’t happen in finals. 

10 - 15 very generous 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So should we sack every umpire who makes an error that leads to a score?

How about that free kick against Clarrie against the Blues? Did he handpass the ball?

Within a short space of time we'd have no umpires left

Edited by Macca
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Macca said:

So should we sack every umpire who makes an error that leads to a score?

How about that free kick against Clarrie against the Blues? Did he handpass the ball?

Within a short space of time we'd have no umpires left

We have to stop blaming the Umps. The rules are confusing and players are smart enough to know how to exploit them. I would go as far as having a "spirt of the game law" where players can be fined or even miss games if found guilty of faking frees. Was so good to see Kossie put his hand up last year about the ball being touched after he kicked a goal. 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


54 minutes ago, YearOfTheDees said:

We have to stop blaming the Umps. The rules are confusing and players are smart enough to know how to exploit them. I would go as far as having a "spirt of the game law" where players can be fined or even miss games if found guilty of faking frees. Was so good to see Kossie put his hand up last year about the ball being touched after he kicked a goal. 

To get rid of diving the Serie A soccer league started retrospectively ousting the divers (3 match bans) ... cleaned things up straight away

Edited by Macca
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Demonland Forums  

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    PREGAME: Opening Round vs Sydney

    The Demons head up to Sydney to open the 2024 AFL Season against the Swans at the SCG. Who will debut for the Dees? Will Clarry be recalled to the team?

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 158

    PODCAST: Practice Match vs Carlton

    The Demonland Podcast will air LIVE on Thursday, 29th February @ 8:30pm. Join George, Binman & I as we dissect the Practice Match victory over the Blues at Ikon Park. You questions and comments are a huge part of our podcast so please post anything you want to ask or say below and we'll give you a shout out on the show. If you would like to leave us a voicemail please call 03 9016 3666 and don't worry no body answers so you don't have to talk to a human. Listen & Chat LIVE

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 66

    POSTGAME: Practice Match vs Carlton

    The Demons had total control of the practice match against the Blues taking out the honours and running out victors by 38 points at Ikon Park.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 270

    GAMEDAY: Practice Match vs Carlton

    It's Game Day and the Demons are headed for a date with the Blues at Ikon Park for their final practice match before the ball is kicked in anger to open the season in just over a week's time. Date: Wednesday 28th February 2024 Location: Ikon Park Gates Open: 5:30pm Match commences: 6:40pm Watch: Foxtel & Kayo VFL practice match: Please note, the VFL practice match (10:30am) is no longer open to public. Entry: Your entry gate will be detailed on your ticket (4, 5 or 6)

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 308

    TRAINING: Tuesday 27th February 2024

    I headed down to Gosch’s Paddock this morning for the Captain’s Run in the lead up to tomorrow night’s practice match against the Blues.  The squad that took the field was indicative of the lineup for that match at Ikon Park.  Likely Selections based on the groupings of players at the Captain's Run today at Gosch's Paddock. Main Group: Gawn, Viney, May, JVR, Lever, Petracca, McVee, Windsor, Billings, Langdon, Bowey, Schache, Rivers, ANB, Fritsch, Sparrow, Chandler, Kozzy,

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports 4

    SCRUTINY & RESILIENCE by Whispering Jack

    If the week when preseason training melds into scratch matches with other clubs, is the first marker for the beginning of a new season, then this has certainly been a torrid opener for the Melbourne Football Club in its campaign to remain a leading AFL premiership contender in 2024. The Demons were already under enormous scrutiny from the media and football’s fan base (including their own) after consecutive straight-sets finals exits, with Clayton Oliver’s well documented woes, the Joel Smi

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 27

    Angus Brayshaw Forced into Retirement

    After 167 games including the drought breaking Premiership Angus Brayshaw has made the heart breaking decision to medically retire from football as a result of a series of serious head knocks over his nearly decade of footy. We wish Gus all the best and he'll always be a hero at Demonland. 😢

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 414

    PODCAST: Match SIM vs Richmond

    The Demonland Podcast will air LIVE on Tuesday, 20th February @ 8:30pm. Join George, Binman & I as we dissect the Scratch Match loss to the Tigers and hopefully provide me with some free MFCSS therapy. You questions and comments are a huge part of our podcast so please post anything you want to ask or say below and we'll give you a shout out on the show. If you would like to leave us a voicemail please call 03 9016 3666 and don't worry no body answers so you don't have to talk to a

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 43

    PREGAME: Practice Match vs Carlton

    The Dees will play their final practice match before the start of the 2024 seasons against the Blues at Ikon Park. What are you wanting to see in this final hit out before the season proper? Will Clarry & Salo return to the side? 2024 AAMI Community Series | Carlton v Melbourne Date: Wednesday 28 February Time: 6:40pm (AEDT) Location: IKON Park | Wurundjeri

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 183
  • Tell a friend

    Love Demonland? Tell a friend!

×
×
  • Create New...