POSTGAME: Rd 01 vs Western Bulldogs

[Demon17 5,146]

2 hours ago, von said:

That comment was weird. When he alluded to us being a team of individual performers compared to Richmond who are all about system I immediately thought about every interview last year where each player deflected questions about themselves to praise others and highlight the team and the system we play or as we call it the Melbourne way. He genuinely just pulled that comment out of his [censored]. Not to mention, system shone through with our team still putting the choke on without any backline. 

I  was shocked from that comment by a journo I respect.  Its as if he had nothing to say so lets run this "cocky"  observation out.

Was he living under a rock and missed all the quotes about selflessness in 2020/2021?

And all the evidence too (Trac hidng his Norm Smith being the classic example)

Oh well.

The Dees right now are great, the ones to beat so move on to the garbage reporting and we'll let others have their time in the sun till september.

Just expected more from Niall. To her credit Caro didn't buy in to the comment.

[leave it to deever 17,506]

Watched the replay of round one us v dogs again and I think BBB is in for a ripper season.

Has really worked on his contested marking and if he returns to his old Norf form in a quality side like ours feeding him then he could be a Coleman chance. Apologies to Fritta.

[titan_uranus 24,963]

3 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

Watched the replay of round one us v dogs again and I think BBB is in for a ripper season.

Has really worked on his contested marking and if he returns to his old Norf form in a quality side like ours feeding him then he could be a Coleman chance. Apologies to Fritta.

Not just his marking but I reckon his fitness too. To me, he is more mobile and agile, covering the ground better than in 2021 (to be fair of course, he didn't exactly set a high bar on the mobility/agility front).

[dees189227 12,361]

That was the good thing. Fritta was a bit down but brown stood up.

Watching the replay I noticed Maxy going over to Smith at 1/4 time after he gave away that dodgy free & saw Smith annoyed about the decision & looked like he was saying don't get angry and give away the 50

[dees189227 12,361]

Just watched the flag raising bit on tv. Hadn't watched it yet. It looked great on tv & it just makes you emotional every time. I loved the loud noise for each flag person introduced but loved how Jones & RDB got the loudest

[jnrmac 20,040]

The Dogs are in trouble.

Their coach has lost it.

Their club is leaking

If their mids aren't on top they can't score

Their defence is scratchy.

Their fwds are not good without Bruce (Naughton excepted)

When the Umps stop the free kick love fest they are cooked.

Edited March 19, 2022 by jnrmac

[leave it to deever 17,506]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

Not just his marking but I reckon his fitness too. To me, he is more mobile and agile, covering the ground better than in 2021 (to be fair of course, he didn't exactly set a high bar on the mobility/agility front).

True. He is such a wonderful target and I'm reminded of him running up to the centre wing when he got that free in the gf that led to Tracs dribble goal. He has besides Big M one of the safest pair of hands clunking most marks and even if his Michael Holding run up looks strange, it seems to work. 

[DeeSpencer 25,365]

2 minutes ago, leave it to deever said:

True. He is such a wonderful target and I'm reminded of him running up to the centre wing when he got that free in the gf that led to Tracs dribble goal. He has besides Big M one of the safest pair of hands clunking most marks and even if his Michael Holding run up looks strange, it seems to work. 

He actually rushed a few set shots on the short run up, possibly impacted by the boundary line. Take the full 30 and the big run up Benny!

[leave it to deever 17,506]

5 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

He actually rushed a few set shots on the short run up, possibly impacted by the boundary line. Take the full 30 and the big run up Benny!

Yea several were inaccurate again last night but all good. At least we resolved the slow start.

[binman 42,468]

9 hours ago, von said:

That comment was weird. When he alluded to us being a team of individual performers compared to Richmond who are all about system I immediately thought about every interview last year where each player deflected questions about themselves to praise others and highlight the team and the system we play or as we call it the Melbourne way. He genuinely just pulled that comment out of his [censored]. Not to mention, system shone through with our team still putting the choke on without any backline. 

I haven't heard Niall's comments. I'm guessing that was in the Real Footy podcast?

Did he seriously imply we were not 'all about systems'?

Fair dinkum, how is it possible for someone PAID to cover football come to that conclusion?

We have by far the strongest system in the AFL.  And a very simple one at that. Goody as said for years he wants fan to come to the footy knowing what effort they will see from our players AND what it will 'look like' in terms of how we play.

And we have well and truly arrived at that point.

Even the most see ball, watch ball dees fan (and i don't mean that in critical way, nothing wrong with just watching the game and not worrying about structures and systems) can tell Jake how we will play any given game.

They can tell Jake exactly where may will kick to after a point, who will be at that aerial contest rom the kick and the role of of each and every player in the team.

Sheesh. 

Coincidentally i was just thinking las night watching the pies and saints turn the ball over time and time again that we have now arrived at point where we have an incredibly effective and consistent system AND an incredibly talented list, spearheaded by four or five true A graders. 

That's why i am so bullish about chances this year. And the next few years after that for that matter.

What an idiotic comment from Niall. 

 

Edited March 19, 2022 by binman

[leave it to deever 17,506]

5 minutes ago, binman said:

What an iditoic comment from Niall

Its jealousy. Potshots will come fast and from everywhere now we are on top.

Nialls probably one of those Pies fans that dislikes us as some sort of over sophisticated and upper class club. Not our fault we have class, culture, structures and systems that will give us several flags this decade.😁

[Chook 15,012]

21 minutes ago, binman said:

I haven't heard Niall's comments.I'm guessing that was in the Real Footy podcast?

Did he seriously imply we were not 'all about systems'?

Fair dinkum, how is it possible for someone PAID to cover football come to that conclusion?

We have by far the strongest system in the AFL.  And a very simple one at that. Goody as said for years he wants fan to come to the footy knowing what effort they will see from our players AND what it will 'look like' in terms of how we play.

And we have well and truly arrived at that point.

Even the most see ball, watch ball dees fan (and i don't mean that in critical way, nothing wrong with just watching the game and not worrying about structures and systems) can tell jake how we will play any given game. They can tell Jake exactly where may will kick to after a point, who will be at that aerial contest rom the kick and the role of of each and every player in the team.

Sheesh. 

Coincidentally i was just thinking las night watching the pies and saints turn the ball over time and time again that we have now arrived at point where we have an incredibly effective and consistent system AND an incredibly talented list, spearheaded by four or five true A graders. 

That's why i am so bullish about chances this year. And the next few years after that for that matter.

What an iditoic comment from Niall. 

 

Niall didn't say that. People on this site have a low interpretation skills at times.

What he said was Richmond was system first, talent second whereas Melbourne is talent first and system second. The implication for me is that system is equally important between the two clubs but that the talent is higher at Melbourne and the players know it. This lead directly into his "cockiness" comment.

People tend to think in terms of zero sum games, and this is a prime example IMO.

[BDA 22,691]

3 minutes ago, Chook said:

This lead directly into his "cockiness" comment.

His use of the word cockiness was appropriate though. He used the example of Gawn talking about dynasties when interviewed  after winning the GF. I didn't think that was cocky at all. To my mind it demonstrated belief and conviction which we had shown in abundance during our finals run. Why wouldn't Gawn talk in terms of winning more, not settling for just the one

[leave it to deever 17,506]

22 minutes ago, Chook said:

People on this site have a low interpretation skills at times.

I'm not sure if this is correct grammar.

Sorry but Demonstone isn't logged in.

I just don't like Jake Niall.

He tried to crack onto my first real girlfriend almost forty years ago. Not that I'm one to hold any sort of grudge.

And last time I saw him he still argued he had more hair.

And he's a rabid pies fan.

Edited March 19, 2022 by leave it to deever

[rpfc 28,220]

Niall is more clumsy verbally than written. I am the same.

Petracca, Oliver and Gawn are in top 5 players in the league atm and they know it.

As they should. It’s the flip side of expectation and I hated Geelong for it.

Think I might enjoy it from our Demons though…

[von 1,559]

44 minutes ago, binman said:

I haven't heard Niall's comments.I'm guessing that was in the Real Footy podcast?

Did he seriously imply we were not 'all about systems'?

Fair dinkum, how is it possible for someone PAID to cover football come to that conclusion?

We have by far the strongest system in the AFL.  And a very simple one at that. Goody as said for years he wants fan to come to the footy knowing what effort they will see from our players AND what it will 'look like' in terms of how we play.

And we have well and truly arrived at that point.

Even the most see ball, watch ball dees fan (and i don't mean that in critical way, nothing wrong with just watching the game and not worrying about structures and systems) can tell jake how we will play any given game. They can tell Jake exactly where may will kick to after a point, who will be at that aerial contest rom the kick and the role of of each and every player in the team.

Sheesh. 

Coincidentally i was just thinking las night watching the pies and saints turn the ball over time and time again that we have now arrived at point where we have an incredibly effective and consistent system AND an incredibly talented list, spearheaded by four or five true A graders. 

That's why i am so bullish about chances this year. And the next few years after that for that matter.

What an iditoic comment from Niall. 

 

The first game proved how wrong he was in the most effective way possible. No best backline in the league and our system still choked one of the best teams to death. Hard to argue against that system. 
 

he compared us to Richmonds system and claimed we were more a team of individual performers than they were. Which as we all know is utter rubbish. Sometimes journalists get found out knowing sweet [censored] all about a team and this was one of those times. Strange because he has always come across as more knowledgeable than he showed himself to be in this case.

The cocky comment also suggested he’s never seen Melbourne play or heard a player interview. 

[Demon17 5,146]

26 minutes ago, Chook said:

Niall didn't say that. People on this site have a low interpretation skills at times.

What he said was Richmond was system first, talent second whereas Melbourne is talent first and system second. The implication for me is that system is equally important between the two clubs but that the talent is higher at Melbourne and the players know it. This lead directly into his "cockiness" comment.

People tend to think in terms of zero sum games, and this is a prime example IMO.

But Niall DID say the Dees "...are a little bit cocky..."

 

 

[binman 42,468]

59 minutes ago, Chook said:

Niall didn't say that. People on this site have a low interpretation skills at times.

What he said was Richmond was system first, talent second whereas Melbourne is talent first and system second.

 

 

That is no better.

We are systems first, second, third and fourth.

And fitness is fifth

The difference between us and te tigers at their peak 2017 though 2020 is that we have a far more talented team. 

And our systems is actually way better too for that matter - in particular our defensive system. The tigers never cam close to implementing a defensive model as effective as ours was las year.

And i think history will show we were a better team than the tigers ever were

[binman 42,468]

37 minutes ago, rpfc said:

Niall is more clumsy verbally than written. I am the same.

Petracca, Oliver and Gawn are in top 5 players in the league atm and they know it.

As they should. It’s the flip side of expectation and I hated Geelong for it.

Think I might enjoy it from our Demons though…

Geelong are the perfect example of why having the right system is the priority. 

[FarNorthernD 5,861]

2 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

……….. (Ben Brown) has one of the safest pair of hands clunking most marks and even if his Michael Holding run up looks strange, it seems to work. 

Funnily enough I hardly notice it any more

[rpfc 28,220]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Geelong are the perfect example of why having the right system is the priority. 

Geelong had stars up and down the field and they were cocky too. Scarlett, Bartel, Ablett, Hawkins, Selwood, Enright, Kelly, Corey, Taylor.

Systems make you competitive but stars win you flags.

[rpfc 28,220]

Just now, rpfc said:

Geelong had stars up and down the field and they were cocky too. Scarlett, Bartel, Ablett, Hawkins, Selwood, Enright, Kelly, Corey, Taylor.

Systems make you competitive but stars win you flags.

And the cockiest of them all; Chapman and Stevie J.

They we’re stacked.

[Chook 15,012]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Geelong are the perfect example of why having the right system is the priority. 

Geelong in the late 2000s was talent first, system second.

[monoccular 17,408]

10 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

Watched the replay of round one us v dogs again and I think BBB is in for a ripper season.

Has really worked on his contested marking and if he returns to his old Norf form in a quality side like ours feeding him then he could be a Coleman chance. Apologies to Fritta.

Maybe double history this year?

BBB / Fritsch shared Coleman

Tracc / Clarrie shared Brownlow

🤗❤️💙

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

23 hours ago, DEE fence said:

I think Brayshaw was key,  going down back and picking up Salem's role, 1st test of the season for the club passed with flying colours. I can understand why Goodwin was so effusive with his praise for the defense. 

Left field -  Tmac, Tmac used to do a great job on Riewoldt, who was murder in the air. Keeping Naughton to 4, I would almost say is a pass though for May, Naughton is just a brilliant player, Only player apart from Bont I would take straight into our starting 18. I also really thought that Smith had a brilliant game, his closing speed and size is scary and if he continues to improve ,he might have a role to play, as Naugton's timing in the air is as good as a Russian Ice skater high on 02 boosters.

For me cobwebs - also see post clearance contest wins (as per the thread ' Centre Clearances - Considered Analysis Requested'), that said I think the Doggies read Maxy better than most teams - I actually think Bevo put a lot of work into the Ruck, and as he mentioned before he had his minor wobble, they went with a different ruck plan of pinch hitting ruckman. What he didn't mention, which was probably the key part of the plan, was that they reckon they would be able to shark the tap. 

I agree, didn't run the same he did 1st half of 21, but he must have done enough in training, will be interesting to watch. I thought Hunt need to do more as well, I want Rivers back urgently.

I was down on Harmes years gone by, but he had a great finals series and role in r23 that he has credits in the bank for 2 more rounds, but if he drops off the way he did at times last year would love to see Dunstan. '21 really did change my mind on Harmes though and I used to be critic, I felt like he demonstrated good coachability and adapted a lot.  

The thing is our zone and marking ability (contested/intercept) is so strong we nullify what he does, am still in favour of sticking to our D style. It comes back in over his head and I'm not ready to sacrifice our zone defensive style. would rather do a few things very well than try and do everything. If Caleb could kick it 45-55 then I might have different ideas but as brilliant and brave as he is, and I respect him, his short kicks don't hurt us because he is not releasing other players in a way that gets through our zone often enough for the dogs to win. 

I also am a fan of Kossie doing a bit in the middle and maybe this is an idea. I actually thought Kossie's pressure acts were Davey and Uncle like and upset the Dogs' carry, to me 'cameo' is faint praise. I did like how Kingy highlighted on 360 how Kossie is taking 'wickets' this year.

Viney fit is a weapon, and he is our much needed hard man, watch the 2nd Gus and Gawny with Viney. and a fit Viney is now running on the top of the ground. Clearly ahead of Harmes and Dunstan while fit. As others have mentioned working better with Clarry now. Petracca is a blessing, it is like having Christmas 27 times a year.

He had two eyes and both his hands on the ball, a shocking free, he does not get a good go. I almost think there is a Maxy tax as well, for just being so dominant, there is not another ruck who gets such a hard time, even that dog Mumford.

How I loved our Captain walking up and calming Smith down from dissent, never stops being a leader. Weightman will only have so many flops in the bank.

I think it's a plan to drop back and set up the zone. Normally our zone is great, this I felt (as others have mentioned) is because Lever wasn't there in his General role. Zones are super tricky to perfect and we had gaping holes with the change of cattle. I am prepared to forgive on this occasion but will keep this in mind going forward. Personally I still think we are best practice on zone defense.

Many thanks for your great thoughts, gave me something to bounce off. 

Some interesting and very valid points DEE f thanks.

Lets hope Viney can stay as fit as he appeared on Weds.  Looked pretty sharp for mine and did some handy clean up work at the center bounces i felt.