Game plans, tactics and all that jazz

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,447]

What will our gameplan in 2025 look like?

I read with interest that during pre Christmas training some of the drills had us full ground spreading and pulling the trigger, using the corridor with quick ball movement. I feel if we don’t play this way we will be left behind and have another wasted year. The obvious comment is do we have enough skilled players to play this way? My counter argument would be who does? The Giants perhaps the only one yet a few teams play this way, Hawks, Pies, Port etc. How much of this style is about

Having elite kicks of the footy on every line

vs

Having your best users by foot coming out from halfback.

Players running / spreading to create an overlap and breakdown a zone.

Relentless pressure when not in possession including laying effective tackles.

Quick direct ball movement to an open fwd line. 

A well drilled gameplan.

Using Collingwood as an example,(some might say not a great one as they missed finals last season) they player for player wouldn’t be as skilful as the Giants yet they tick all the other boxes. Then when the ball goes fwd they have Miohcheck (no star but constantly presents and competes) DeGoey (on his day is very dangerous) Hill (unchecked will kick multiple goals) Elliot (is star often kicking clutch goals). We’ve struggled to score for the past three seasons. Now replace Miohcheck for JVR, DeGoey for Trac, Hill for Kosi and Elliot for Fritsch. How many goals a game / season do those four players kick playing in Collingwood’s forward line.
With this style there’s also the element of bamboozlement, the ball constantly coming in quickly, and the opposition has a range of different sized, highly skilled fwds with space to deal with, they often become overrun and multiplie goals can be scored quickly. 
The other thing I believe teams do better than us is back in their guns in one v one contests.

If the ball is turned over it can quickly come back the other way with interest, but both teams can be out of position.  It’s also hard to sustain this week in week out but we should be aiming to play a more attacking style for longer parts of each game. Last year at times when we do play with speed on the ball we looked dangerous.

[640MD 3,482]

On 20/08/2024 at 14:30, Adam The God said:

I never like to let this thread go too cold.

Okay, figured I'd go the early crow and do a best 22+1 pre draft and trade period, which is a bit dangerous.

The task here for no particular reason is to build a side that I think could contend, by only utilising those on the list currently, so no new players. (obviously, we will bring in talent and this side will change and get even stronger)

With a fresh pre season, I think this team could go places, and score more, but probably concede a little more too.

Here goes...

AMW May Lever

McVee TMac Salem

Langdon Oliver Windsor

Fritta Turner Melksham

Koz JVR Trac

Max Viney Rivers

Bowey Spargo Kolt Petty

Sub. between Billings, Sparrow and Howes.

Playing Fritta and Melksham as high half forwards would certainly lessen our defensive set up, but I think have an astronomical effect on the efficiency of our inside 50 entries. I'd be playing Spargo as the more defensive high half forward in that group, but his ball use by foot is also elite. Trac would rotate between high half forward and deep forward too.

Midfield rotations are: Oliver (as the anchor with most CBAs), Viney (also spending time as a pressure forward), Rivers (also playing half back attacking role), McVee (also playing half back attacking role with Rivers - occasionally will be out of rotation to play lockdown defensive role), Trac (40% mid, 60% forward, rotating forward high and deep), Koz (25-30% mid burst play, keep building on his 2024 output in midfield), Kolt (mostly forward, but some around the ground stoppages to use his explosiveness and bash and crash physicality) and if necessary, Salem (mostly half back anchor though). If Sparrow plays as sub, he plays his usual defensive role, which frees someone else up.

Petty plays forward for 2025, but is to be utilised as a swingman if injuries occur down the other end.

JVR plays second ruck again, not ideal, but it is what it is.

I'd be playing +1 or even +2 at contest next year, be really aggressive at stoppages, back our defenders to win 1v1s behind the ball, and get it to the likes of Trac, Melky, Fritta, Koz, Spargo across half forward, and Salem, McVee and Windsor across half back.

I always liked this thread.

Given our new recruits, how do they fit in with this post

Keep this thread warm !

[Adam The God 30,537]

8 hours ago, 640MD said:

I always liked this thread.

Given our new recruits, how do they fit in with this post

Keep this thread warm !

My team has changed and plans for Petty too. Love that Petty is training again with backs, but will likely swing.

[640MD 3,482]

6 hours ago, Adam The God said:

My team has changed and plans for Petty too. Love that Petty is training again with backs, but will likely swing.

Just thinking off the top of my head, that will mean something like, Petty, T Mac and perhaps Johnson rotating through

Back, forward and interchange Bench   ??

I am looking forward to this year more than I was last but 2022 was a disappointment after half way.

 

[Adam The God 30,537]

I really rate Chaplin as a coach and I reckon we're gonna explode next year as an offensive force.

It'll be interesting to see if we get the balance between attack and defence right.

Edited January 13 by Adam The God

[monoccular 17,605]

On 12/01/2025 at 23:58, Bombay Airconditioning said:

Now replace Miohcheck for JVR, DeGoey for Trac, Hill for Kosi and Elliot for Fritsch. How many goals a game / season do those four players kick playing in Collingwood’s forward line.

Mumbai - this is how rumours start.  

“JVR, Kosovo, Fritsch, Trac transferring to bolster Collingwood as stated on authoritative MFC website”  😮😮😮🙄🙄🙄🤗🤗🤗

On 10/01/2025 at 21:20, Sideshow Bob said:

He'll be right. Aye

Might have just found our new FF. 

Play Trac out of the goal square pagans paddock style. Roo at CHf, koz and chin sprinting in from points of the square 

Fritta starts 30 m out 3 rows in to grandstand. 6th man sprinting straight to defence at the centre bounce

 

6-6-6 may have almost KOd Pagan’s paddock

[whatwhat say what 23,051]

On 12/01/2025 at 23:58, Bombay Airconditioning said:

Now replace Miohcheck for JVR, DeGoey for Trac, Hill for Kosi and Elliot for Fritsch. How many goals a game / season do those four players kick playing in Collingwood’s forward line.

2024:

• Mihocek, de Goey, Hill, Elliot: 80 goals from 62 games
• JVR, Petracca, Pickett, Fritsch: 121 goals from 78 games

2023:

• Mihocek, de Goey, Hill, Elliot: 137 goals from 93 games
• JVR, Petracca, Pickett, Fritsch: 131 goals from 85 games

fairly similar output in 2023 (van rooyen's first year in the afl) and then quite a bit more scoreboard impact in 2024 for the dees' foursome that you nominated as a comparison point

fwiw, the filth really missed mihocek in 2024 - he straightens then up remarkably

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,447]

8 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

2024:

• Mihocek, de Goey, Hill, Elliot: 80 goals from 62 games
• JVR, Petracca, Pickett, Fritsch: 121 goals from 78 games

2023:

• Mihocek, de Goey, Hill, Elliot: 137 goals from 93 games
• JVR, Petracca, Pickett, Fritsch: 131 goals from 85 games

fairly similar output in 2023 (van rooyen's first year in the afl) and then quite a bit more scoreboard impact in 2024 for the dees' foursome that you nominated as a comparison point

fwiw, the filth really missed mihocek in 2024 - he straightens then up remarkably

Great post, 

I clearly hadn’t run the numbers, it was more of an assumption based on my personal viewing of every Melbourne game and 6-8 Collingwood games (when they’re playing Thursday / Friday nights). Those numbers are interesting, recently we have struggled to score / make hard work of it, where as Collingwood seem at times to seem to score at will. 
  

To sink my initial argument even further, 

2023

Melbourne F 2079 A 1660

Collingwood F 2142 A 1687

2024

Melbourne F 1785 A 1812

Collingwood F 1991 A 1943

Not a great difference there either.

Moving on from any more ill fated comparisons I still believe and from I’m reading we will be, and that is playing a more attacking brand of footy focusing on quick direct ball movement into an open fwd line. 

I stand by my comment that we don’t back in our players in enough one v one contests when going inside 50. We have the some real quality, let’s play to their advantage / skill sets.

[whatwhat say what 23,051]

9 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

Great post, 

I clearly hadn’t run the numbers, it was more of an assumption based on my personal viewing of every Melbourne game and 6-8 Collingwood games (when they’re playing Thursday / Friday nights). Those numbers are interesting, recently we have struggled to score / make hard work of it, where as Collingwood seem at times to seem to score at will. 
  

To sink my initial argument even further, 

2023

Melbourne F 2079 A 1660

Collingwood F 2142 A 1687

2024

Melbourne F 1785 A 1812

Collingwood F 1991 A 1943

Not a great difference there either.

Moving on from any more ill fated comparisons I still believe and from I’m reading we will be, and that is playing a more attacking brand of footy focusing on quick direct ball movement into an open fwd line. 

I stand by my comment that we don’t back in our players in enough one v one contests when going inside 50. We have the some real quality, let’s play to their advantage / skill sets.

i think we and the filth are remarkably similar in terms of what our output is, if not our method

i expect both us to be pushing for top 8 in 2025, it not top 4

both teams are very much set up as 'win now' teams who should be striving to be in the premiership 'conversation'

[layzie 34,108]

It all comes down to the way we rebound and transition the ball from the back in my view. We know what the personnel up forward is and I don't think that will change all that much, we know what kind of defence we play etc.

Will we be able to rebound hard and counter the quickest possible way through the middle is what I'm looking for with the backs not sitting quite as high in case it comes back the other way. 

[binman 44,089]

41 minutes ago, layzie said:

It all comes down to the way we rebound and transition the ball from the back in my view. We know what the personnel up forward is and I don't think that will change all that much, we know what kind of defence we play etc.

Will we be able to rebound hard and counter the quickest possible way through the middle is what I'm looking for with the backs not sitting quite as high in case it comes back the other way. 

I actually think the defensive unit will continue to sit high.

The transition game doesn't work properly if the defensive line is too close to the opponents goal.

The key to effective transition is compressing the ground and winning it back as close to your goals as possible.

It's why for example, even in 2023 when they were playing their best footy, the pies were always a chance to be scored against on the rebound.

That was one of the key reasons we struggled defensively last year.

In most games our defensive line was set way higher than previous years and that totally stress tested our structure, leg speed and fitness (because once the ball is turned over up the field the defensive unit has to bolt back to defend the turnover).

Steve May, who was absolutely gassed, spoke to that very issue in his post game, on ground interview after our win over the tigers.

Because of his leg speed, having Windsor behind the ball will really help with our transition.

But i reckon just as importantly his leg speed will help us defend turnovers because he will be able to get back quickly - something tmac, may and Lever all struggled to do last year.

Edited January 14 by binman

[jnrmac 20,205]

2 hours ago, binman said:

I actually think the defensive unit will continue to sit high.

The transition game doesn't work properly if the defensive line is too close to the opponents goal.

The key to effective transition is compressing the ground and winning it back as close to your goals as possible.

It's why for example, even in 2023 when they were playing their best footy, the pies were always a chance to be scored against on the rebound.

That was one of the key reasons we struggled defensively last year.

In most games our defensive line was set way higher than previous years and that totally stress tested our structure, leg speed and fitness (because once the ball is turned over up the field the defensive unit has to bolt back to defend the turnover).

Steve May, who was absolutely gassed, spoke to that very issue in his post game, on ground interview after our win over the tigers.

Because of his leg speed, having Windsor behind the ball will really help with our transition.

But i reckon just as importantly his leg speed will help us defend turnovers because he will be able to get back quickly - something tmac, may and Lever all struggled to do last year.

Having Langdon and Sharp play further towards our defence will help our defensive efforts no - given their excellent endurance running power.

[binman 44,089]

1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

Having Langdon and Sharp play further towards our defence will help our defensive efforts no - given their excellent endurance running power.

Agree.

Will cover the loss of nibbla too a bit because he was critical to our defence - how often last year was nibbla that last one standing inside the oppo 50?