POSTGAME: Rd 18 vs West Coast Eagles

[Bitter but optimistic 22,241]

9 hours ago, deegirl said:

Thanks for the mansplanation

FMD! That's a new one . Thanks for broadening my vocab deegirl.

8 hours ago, Beetle said:

I didn’t even notice the umpire was female.

All I knew was they seemingly had a relatively high voice and that they were absolutely shithouse.

Couldve been anyone. End of the day...shithouse.

edit: in all seriousness the admins might want to add the word shithouse to the censored list.

And thanks to you Beetle. Previously, when I wanted to say shithouse, I always misspelt it as shitehouse - due to censorship considerations.

Demonland certainly broadens one's education.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Proud of the boys yesterday.  Tremendous effort and the best our forward line has functioned in some time, especially with some key players out.

Back line is looking better and better each week.  May smashed Kennedy and Lever is improving each week.  Frosty had a bit of a shocker on Darling, who is in super form, but that's going to happen.  Salem continues his good form and I thought Josh Wagner wasn't too bad across half back either.

It was like watching a local footy game though - we are the side outside the five who is full of endeavour, effort and willingness to hunt the footy, but we lack the polish to put a superior team away at the minute.  The Eagles kicked goals when it counted and we just couldn't do the same often enough.

Kudos to Jordan Lewis, and Goody, for his role up forward, and let's hope Fritsch stays as a permanent forward from now on.  Have him down there with Tom Mac and they could be a formidable force.

But the loss sums up our season really.  We've been in so many contests but we just can't finish the job.  It's disappointing, but I'm still positive about our chances from 2020 and beyond.

[beelzebub 23,376]

7 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

It was like watching a local footy game though 

No disrespect to the rest of your post..

But this bit stuck out...and sums it up really.

That's  exactly  where our skills and kicking are....local footy team standard.

Handballing to poor options. Cant kick a 30m snag to save ourselves... and no real plan of forward entry sans bombs away baby. 

The comparison  to our opposition  was enlightening.  They hardly needed the field...the boundary line sufficed on more than a few occasions, they invariably stuck their marking...most of their handball targets were moving ( in some purposeful fashion )

Yes we had a crack...then ran out of puff...again.

Local footy...yeah i reckon our coaching could hack that ( hell...they hack everything  else )

[binman 42,972]

3 hours ago, praha said:

 

Same could be said of literally any loss during the Goodwin era. We lose games the exact same way every time and we're now three years into his reign.

 

 

This is simply not true.

In 2017 and the first half of last year when we lost it was usually because we got smashed on transition and gave up too many out easy out the back goals (ie player running into an empty 50 and running it to the line) as we employed such a high, aggressive press (which is also why we won a lot of games and with big scores, such as the corresponding Alice game last year v the crows).

Goody adjusted that mid season and we became much harder to score against (the hardest team to score against round 13 - 23). The few losses we had thereafter were usually a result of poor kicking for goal (eg v the swans) and/or teams spreading wide and stretching us with chip/kick/hold it up and cross it style (eg WC in the prelim). This approach has hurt us this year too but again we have really improved, in part because we have modified our style and also the players are probably finally near peak fitness.

This year the key factor in our losses has been our inability to covert our inside 50s and our woeful kicking for goal (and field kicking for that matter), which were both an issue at times last year but nowhere as bad an issue as it has been this year.

Edited July 22, 2019 by binman

[Lucifers Hero 39,811]

Just saw a replay of the Viney concussion incident.  It is in this article Hit on Viney (but I don't know how to just post the video.  Any tips welcome). 

Careless+High contact+Severe impact+bad optics = at least a week's holiday.

No attempt to shepherd.  To my biased eye Barass lined him up!

Viney had to sit out nearly 3 quarters when he was on fire so hope the club don't play 'nice guy' and squip the medical.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

6 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Just saw a replay of the Viney concussion incident.  It is in this article Hit on Viney (but I don't know how to just post the video.  Any tips welcome). 

Careless+High contact+Severe impact+bad optics = at least a week's holiday.

No attempt to shepherd.  To my biased eye Barass lined him up!

Viney had to sit out nearly 3 quarters when he was on fire so hope the club don't play 'nice guy' and squip the medical.

I agree, and what annoyed me the most was that the commentators, at the time, tried to say he got him in the shoulder first and he just followed through and got him in the head.  That clearly wasn't true.  As you say, he deserves at least a week.

[Lucifers Hero 39,811]

1 minute ago, Wiseblood said:

I agree, and what annoyed me the most was that the commentators, at the time, tried to say he got him in the shoulder first and he just followed through and got him in the head.  That clearly wasn't true.  As you say, he deserves at least a week.

Agreed.  Thru' my biased lens the commentators always seem to down play hits on us, like the hip and shoulder comment yesterday, or imply staging.  However, they stick the boots into us when our player has 'offended' eg May in the JLT. 

[dazzledavey36 54,944]

Josh Wagner played on the wing yesterday instead of his usual role at half back. What did people think? I thought he cracked in real hard and laid some strong tackles.

Still did some "Wagner" shockers with the ball but.

[Jaded No More 68,915]

1 minute ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Agreed.  Thru' my biased lens the commentators always seem to down play hits on us, like the hip and shoulder comment yesterday, or imply staging.  However, they stick the boots into us when our player has 'offended' eg May in the JLT. 

Yep. I hope we say Viney is in doubt for this week, make sure Barras cops a suspension then play him. Sick of being the nice guy. To concuss Viney is no mean feat. 

[Jaded No More 68,915]

Just now, dazzledavey36 said:

Josh Wagner played on the wing yesterday instead of his usual role at half back. What did people think? I thought he cracked in real hard and laid some strong tackles.

Still did some "Wagner" shockers with the ball but.

I thought he was ok. His disposal is terrible which lets him down and we won’t improve until we get some skills on the wings. I don’t know why they refuse to play Salem here. He is the best user of the footy by a mile. I know we use him for kick outs, but surely May and Hibbo have that covered. 

[Red and Blue realist 2,051]

4 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Josh Wagner played on the wing yesterday instead of his usual role at half back. What did people think? I thought he cracked in real hard and laid some strong tackles.

Still did some "Wagner" shockers with the ball but.

He was better there than he has been at half back, but still stops and props waiting for the ball to come to him rather than going hard at it all the time. Also needs to drive through his tackles, we let to many go yesterday when we should be ensuring the tackle stops the play. Preuss had a shocker in that regard, but Wagner had 3 or 4 where he had hands on the player but it probably wasn't even counted as a tackle in the end. Not sure if he'll get another run next year, but he should get a few games on the wing to see if there's something to work with.

[BlueandRedTilImDead 3]

Was frustrating to watch. Not saying the umps killed us because there were some woeful decisions both ways. West Coast got the rub of it in the first quarter but then we seemed to get the rub of it in the 2nd and 3rd.

Our skill errors and effort levels absolutely kill us, week in and week out not just at AFL level but VFL also. And thats the part that kills me most. I dont care if you are the least talented side in the competition you cant overcome that. But its the effort level at times. Thats always controllable.

[jnrmac 20,065]

14 hours ago, P-man said:

Like fish in a barrel ?

Anyone who didn’t watch the game can read the stat sheet. Anyone who watched the game free of bias would admit he had a good game. Don’t strain yourself too much though.

He was terrible. Don't try to suggest otherwise. Usual handballs to players feet, or behind them, fumbles, turnovers etc.

ANB is a liability. 

[jnrmac 20,065]

38 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Just saw a replay of the Viney concussion incident.  It is in this article Hit on Viney (but I don't know how to just post the video.  Any tips welcome). 

Careless+High contact+Severe impact+bad optics = at least a week's holiday.

No attempt to shepherd.  To my biased eye Barass lined him up!

Viney had to sit out nearly 3 quarters when he was on fire so hope the club don't play 'nice guy' and squip the medical.

Have watched this a few times. Barass will get off. Viney initiated contact, Barass was focused on handballing and braced for contact, Didn't leave the ground.

 

[Lucifers Hero 39,811]

Yesterday was one of Goodwin's best coaching efforts.  It looked like he simplified the game plan and simplified player roles.  Things I noticed:

- Played more like WCE in prelim: 

• Slowed down movement out of backline.  Jones and Salem took their time to find targets.
• Switched the ball across half back often, particularly by May.
• a more kick/mark/control game as shown by the # of uncontested possessions, kick to handball ratio, and # of field marks.

- He gave players simple and very clear roles:

• Lewis at ff to keep McGovern deep.
• Fritsch our lead up marking forward (took 14 marks!!!)
• Those two positional moves really opened up the fwd line and made it easier for connection with mids.
• Gus to tag Yeo
• May to go one-on-one all day with Kennedy.
• The Wagner boys on the wings

- Played 'tempo' footy - controlled by Jones and Salem and to some extent Harmes in the midfield

- Played mainly one-on-one defence rather than zone..

Its probably a bit early to say the manic/chaos style with zone defence is dead but there are very clear and significant signs that our coaching box has got the message than in 2019 the top teams are the slowest to play on and the lowest teams are the fastest to play on. 

We may have done some of that recently but yesterday was the first time I noticed a significant and simultaneous change in game style, player roles, ball movement and tactics.  It worked.  Damn shame we didn't get the 4 pts.  The coaching box deserved it.

There is still a lot of work to be done but if I read yesterday correctly Goodwin has taken a huge step towards flexibilty and change.

Edited July 22, 2019 by Lucifer's Hero

[jnrmac 20,065]

12 hours ago, Mydee said:

You get good umpires when you are a good team that is winning- we are neither so we cop the dregs

AND we seem to cop some new interpretation or some previously un-awarded free kick each week.

 

[BlueandRedTilImDead 3]

4 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Have watched this a few times. Barass will get off. Viney initiated contact, Barass was focused on handballing and braced for contact, Didn't leave the ground.

 

Good to see someone talking sense while taking the red and blue glasses off for a moment. Barrass was running full tilt with ball in hand. Released the handball and braced for contact. The AFL when judging a lot of these decisions looks at what other options the player has. Barrass could have stood there and let Viney plough into him without protecting himself.

[jnrmac 20,065]

3 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Yesterday was one of Goodwin's best coaching efforts.  It looked like he simplified the game plan and simplified player roles.  Things I noticed:

Played more like WCE in prelim: 

• Slowed down movement out of backline.  Jones and Salem took their time to find targets.
• Swithched the ball across half back often.
• a more kick/mark/control game as shown by the # of uncontested possessions and field marks.

He gave players simple and very clear roles:

• Lewis at ff to keep McGovern deep.
• Fritsch our lead up marking forward (took 14 marks!!!)
• Those two positional moves really opened up the fwd line and made it easier for commenction with mids.
• Gus to tag Yeo
• May to go one-on-one all day.
• The Wagner boys on the wings

Played 'tempo' footy - controlled by Jones and Salem

Played more one-on-one defence than zone so.

Its probably a bit early to say the manic/chaos style with zone defence is dead but there are very clear and significant signs that our coaching box has got the message than in 2019 the top teams are the slowest to play on and the lowest teams are the fastest to play on. 

We may have done some of that recently but yesterday was the first time I noticed a significant and simultaneous change in game style, play roles, ball movement and tactics.  It worked.  Damn shame we didn't get the 4 pts.  The coaching box deserved it.

There is still a lot of work to be done but if I read yesterday correctly Goodwin has taken a huge step towards flexibilty and change.

 

Its taken 18 rounds for his ego to accept what many on here have 'advised' for months

We have clearly changed our 'Brand' - or to paraphrase Groucho Marx said "we have principles and if you don't like them.... well we have others"

[picket fence 17,169]

14 hours ago, President Dee Trump said:

How about an imposing forward who can mark and kick goals!

Yep even more so than an outside mid WE NEED ANOTHER GORILLA KEY FORWARD

A combo of Josh Jenkins and Ed Langdon would be nice!! Even Zac Jones!

[Lucifers Hero 39,811]

6 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Its taken 18 rounds for his ego to accept what many on here have 'advised' for months

We have clearly changed our 'Brand' - or to paraphrase Groucho Marx said "we have principles and if you don't like them.... well we have others"

Better late than never!

Goodwin can't win!  Some say he doesn't change enough and when he does someone else says it should have happened earlier!

Anyway, the 'brand' (ie game style) changes have been happening for quite a while but yesterday was the first time they all clicked.  Allocating specific player roles was also good tactics which helped the revised game style.

Edited July 22, 2019 by Lucifer's Hero

[Smokey 4,389]

11 hours ago, ding said:

You are talking to the only male nurse in a regional hospital........ All my bosses are female... all my workmates are female. Every,Single,One.

Been that way for 15 years.

You have much to learn, but i wouldnt hold my breath.

Enjoy living your life being offended by everything.

 

You're career choice does not make you the bastion of gender equality, nurse boy 

Back on track - a lot to like about Sunday, but the frustration of not being able to execute the basics like set shot kicking is becoming almost impossible to endure. 

This season cannot finish quickly enough. 

Edited July 22, 2019 by Smokey

[drdrake 3,163]

Kicking, we just can't hit targets, absolutely disgrace that full time professional well paid players can't hit a target 20m away.  We tried to put the ball into dangerous spots but the downside is once we missed the turnover was a goal, that was the difference yesterday, we worked hard for our goals, the Eagle got cheap goals due to our turnover and it wasn't Eagle pressure it was just pure skill errors.

[Kent 2,909]

2 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Kicking, we just can't hit targets, absolutely disgrace that full time professional well paid players can't hit a target 20m away.  We tried to put the ball into dangerous spots but the downside is once we missed the turnover was a goal, that was the difference yesterday, we worked hard for our goals, the Eagle got cheap goals due to our turnover and it wasn't Eagle pressure it was just pure skill errors.

Yep Dr been like this all year!

No wonder we are out of juice at the end. We put all our energy in to I50s time and time again with low success

The other sides waltz out the back and because our press is so High have an easy track to goal

Our guys are out of juice and cannot chase

[ding 5,126]

8 minutes ago, Smokey said:

You're career choice does not make you the bastion of gender equality, nurse boy 

Back on track - a lot to like about Sunday, but the frustration of not being able to execute the basics like set shot kicking is becoming almost impossible to endure. 

This season cannot finish quickly enough. 

Need directions to your safe space Smokey? The real world is a bit dangerous for someone with such a delicate constitution.

Did i mention i am also the Union Rep for my workplace? Must be because i hate the women i work with.

Or something.

 

Nuffies gonna nuff. Carry on.

 

[beelzebub 23,376]

24 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Better late than never!

Goodwin can't win!  Some say he doesn't change enough and when he does someone else says it should have happened earlier!

Anyway, the 'brand' (ie game style) changes have been happening for quite a while but yesterday was the first time they all clicked.  Allocating specific player roles was also good tactics which helped the revised game style.

And he has a small handfull of games and a preseason  to prove his mettle.

We really need to employ Blind Freddy as a mentor for he could  plainly see the things that needed attention.

It was a better game technically if not technique-ly yesterday. Still full of glaring mistakes but a small step for our mankind.