Simon Goodwin on SEN (26/6/19)

[binman 43,696]

2 minutes ago, Watts the matter said:

So then compare him to his draft class of talls then. Curnow, McKay, Hipwood and Himmelberg were all taken after him and all have shown much better development in their 4th season of AFL. Schache was taken earlier and was traded as quickly as a pick 2 has ever been for very little. 

Yes, totally reasonable to compare him those players. I'm not convinced by either McKay or Curnow. Flashes of ability but not much more.

Really like hippwood and himmelburg. Both are ahead of weed at this stage.

But at this stage is the key. Let's wait until they are  25 to judge where they all land. 

Weed is yet another player at our club who had an interrupted preseason and is a also confidence player. He'll get there and is the best option for his position (preuss is his competition).

 

[Matsuo Basho 1,053]

18 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Weed not as good as Schwarz at the same age. Schwarz who at the time was compared favourably with Carey.  We are in the presence of football genius.

 

18 minutes ago, Grapeviney said:

You were the first one to make the comparison! You compared him to a bunch of players in the AFL Hall of Fame and MFC Team of the Century - 'truly magical forwards' in your own words. You're chasing your own tail like a little puppy and you don't even know it. 

 

Thanks both of you for highlighting why I need to post with greater frequency than should be required. 

A poster made the claim that forwards don’t usually begin to blossom until 23+yo. I refuted that claim by reeling of eight MFC forward line stars of the past 25 years who did exactly that., some even earlier than their fourth season. And that’s just at our club! 

Dance around it all you like and try to make it all about me. It just makes the silence in which you fail to defend Weideman’s paltry output this season all the more deafening. 

I’ve one and only one question for you and any other critics of me in this thread - why are you setting the bar so low? I honestly don’t get it.

[Queanbeyan Demon 6,859]

goody is either a very naughty boy or a very confused middle-aged man. 

[Little Goffy 14,633]

How about...

'His statisitcs are low and we would like him to be having more impact on games, but he is working very hard, getting to contests and not rarely being decisively beaten. He could at any moment have a really impressive breakout game (like the 2018 final) and if that form then sticks, we're talking about a seriously quality player.'

In the meantime, let's just celebrate that his contract will be cheaper for now.

[Watts the matter 1,235]

Just now, Little Goffy said:

How about...

'His statisitcs are low and we would like him to be having more impact on games, but he is working very hard, getting to contests and not rarely being decisively beaten. He could at any moment have a really impressive breakout game (like the 2018 final) and if that form then sticks, we're talking about a seriously quality player.'

In the meantime, let's just celebrate that his contract will be cheaper for now.

He already extended.

[rjay 25,061]

If we're going to make comparisons I think Josh Kennedy is a good one.

To me Weid most resembles him, hits the ball hard, handy on the ground and a nice long kick.

...and as a current day player(rather than going back to a time when forwards kicked big bags of goals weekly) if we look at his goal kicking stats...

Josh Year 1 - 5 goals  Sam 3 

Josh Year 2 - 6 goals Sam  3

Josh Year 3 - 7 goals Sam  10

Josh Year 4 - 31 goals Sam currently 9

Josh Year 5 - 41 goals Sam yet to play

It took him time...I think Weid has got the talent and I would expect a similar long term result to Kennedy at WC if he gets a clear run at it and that's good enough for me.

 

 

 

[drysdale demon 4,837]

2 hours ago, Matsuo Basho said:

I would back my understanding of the game over yours Binga, every day and twice on Sundays. 

You must have been quite upset that Nathan Buckley was given the nickname of FIGJAM

[Moonshadow 17,676]

1 hour ago, FireInTheBelly said:

I believe considering the vast amount of it, it's more like burley at this stage ET. It's like someone had a massive spew over the side of the boat.

I think of it more like sitting at the sushi train, only every dish has Japanese rabbit terrine on it

[Watts the matter 1,235]

11 minutes ago, rjay said:

If we're going to make comparisons I think Josh Kennedy is a good one.

To me Weid most resembles him, hits the ball hard, handy on the ground and a nice long kick.

...and as a current day player(rather than going back to a time when forwards kicked big bags of goals weekly) if we look at his goal kicking stats...

Josh Year 1 - 5 goals  Sam 3 

Josh Year 2 - 6 goals Sam  3

Josh Year 3 - 7 goals Sam  10

Josh Year 4 - 31 goals Sam currently 9

Josh Year 5 - 41 goals Sam yet to play

It took him time...I think Weid has got the talent and I would expect a similar long term result to Kennedy at WC if he gets a clear run at it and that's good enough for me.

 

 

 

That's good enough for you? We would be over the moon if he became a Josh Kennedy.

Unfortunately for every Josk Kennedy there is a Tom Boyd, Josh Schache and Tim O'Brien. 

I still hold hope that he makes it, but you need to move past just jumping at the ball and contesting at some stage and that's currently all the coaching staff appear to be asking for. With our 'elite' crumbing forwards it's not what we need.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,266]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Agree.

One of the commentators noted some thing about how we enter forward 50 compared to other teams that I hadn't given much thought to.

 I know we like to go quickly into the hotspot 30 out, often to a contest and that we struggle to hit up targets.

But the comment was most teams kick it around the arc until an option opens up as opposed to our style of going directly in. Which is right. Going around the arc allows teams to flood back a but also means you risk a rushed kick that does not hit a target. 

It also opens up the forward 50 and gets defenders moving which makes it easier to pick the gaps.

[binman 43,696]

20 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

It also opens up the forward 50 and gets defenders moving which makes it easier to pick the gaps.

Yep. And good kicks can put one in to players in holes created by zones, like the one Freo found 30 metres out (which did my head in). It does require good kicks to hit the free target. Which is why we need fritter forward. And maybe Lewis?

[KLV 1,768]

So... did Goody have anything else to say?

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,778]

Wow, just catching up today... 4 pages of vigorous defense of Weids

I'm not a fan of British motor vehicles, especially not loud, old gas guzzling oil leakers like the Toorak Tractor. And am not really happy saying it but I have to agree with MB on some of his points

A good 6 possession game? Wtf?? And ZERO tackles?

Before you write me off as a stats reader, I was there, and commented and cringed at the time at the number of marking opportunities he spilled.

The guy has potential and we hope he realises it but FFS he had an ordinary game - just call it how it is

[Matsuo Basho 1,053]

5 minutes ago, KLV said:

So... did Goody have anything else to say?

Yes. He said that Jesse Hogan's 5 disposal effort for Freo was the best game by an injured player who spent three quarters off the ground he's ever seen.

[Moonshadow 17,676]

Actually, Paul Roos was full of praise as well for Weid's repeat efforts and spoils despite the less than acceptable delivery inside 50. But what would he know....

[Matsuo Basho 1,053]

2 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Actually, Paul Roos was full of praise as well for Weid's repeat efforts and spoils despite the less than acceptable delivery inside 50. But what would he know....

Yeah nah. Roosy's ego is up there with the best of them. Pot a bloke who got drafted and received development under his watch? Fat chance. See his vehement defense of the Tyson/Salem for Pick 2 (Josh Kelly) trade. 

[rjay 25,061]

2 hours ago, Watts the matter said:

That's good enough for you? We would be over the moon if he became a Josh Kennedy.

Unfortunately for every Josk Kennedy there is a Tom Boyd, Josh Schache and Tim O'Brien. 

I still hold hope that he makes it, but you need to move past just jumping at the ball and contesting at some stage and that's currently all the coaching staff appear to be asking for. With our 'elite' crumbing forwards it's not what we need.

Some time you have to just take a good look at the talent on offer 'Watts'...

The Eagles saw something in Kennedy despite him only being a skinny kid with a grand total of 11 goals over 2 seasons.

You don't seem to see it and that's ok...

None of those other 3 by the way have the attributes that Sam has.

...and a bit precious if you think the FD are just asking him to jump & bring the ball to ground.

That would be bare minimum.

[Moonshadow 17,676]

1 minute ago, Matsuo Basho said:

Yeah nah. Roosy's ego is up there with the best of them. Pot a bloke who got drafted and received development under his watch? Fat chance. See his vehement defense of the Tyson/Salem for Pick 2 (Josh Kelly) trade. 

Nah, he leaves that up to anonymous nobodies on Demonland.

Along with potting Roos, Goodwin, Taylor and anyone at MFC.

We know better....

[Matsuo Basho 1,053]

1 minute ago, Moonshadow said:

Nah, he leaves that up to anonymous nobodies on Demonland.

Along with potting Roos, Goodwin, Taylor and anyone at MFC.

We know better....

Is that the royal 'we'? ?

 

[Pennant St Dee 13,301]

Demonland is actually being ruined by one particular poster and members need to stop feeding MB.

It's getting unbearable to have to scroll through content to find some decent discussion which is not someone trying to have the last word 

[Cards13 9,117]

7 hours ago, Nasher said:

Goodwin is either a liar or incompetent according to Mats.

Everyone is according to him.

[Cards13 9,117]

22 minutes ago, Matsuo Basho said:

Yeah nah. Roosy's ego is up there with the best of them. Pot a bloke who got drafted and received development under his watch? Fat chance. See his vehement defense of the Tyson/Salem for Pick 2 (Josh Kelly) trade. 

... hahaahaaahahaahha that’s rich Mr Pot.

[praha 11,240]

56 minutes ago, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

Wow, just catching up today... 4 pages of vigorous defense of Weids

I'm not a fan of British motor vehicles, especially not loud, old gas guzzling oil leakers like the Toorak Tractor. And am not really happy saying it but I have to agree with MB on some of his points

A good 6 possession game? Wtf?? And ZERO tackles?

Before you write me off as a stats reader, I was there, and commented and cringed at the time at the number of marking opportunities he spilled.

The guy has potential and we hope he realises it but FFS he had an ordinary game - just call it how it is

Honestly I thought we had evolved past golf clapping "trying". At least I thought we left that in 2014. Like, no one would have said anything about his game had people not actually started overrating it. 

Our season is so far down the gurgler that we've actually started applauding simple "effort" and "trying hard". fmd.

Okay, he brought the ball down, and got to the contest. Hooray for the professional tall forward who can get to marking contests!

Seriously, we're cuddling this kid now ever since his choke against Adelaide. I'm sure he'll be a decent player but he's entering year 4 and is still distinctively average. 

We only do well as a club when the player is a ready-made, bonafide star. Schwartz, Lyon, Jakovich, Neitz, Hogan, Oliver. If it's simply "talent" that needs nursing and development, they either take 3-4 years longer than other clubs (Gawn, Jetta), or we screw them up so much that we're guilted into keeping them past their used by date (Watts).

We still can't develop raw talent for [censored].

Edited June 26, 2019 by praha

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,778]

2 minutes ago, praha said:

Honestly I thought we had evolved past golf clapping "trying". At least I thought we left that in 2014. Like, no one would have said anything about his game had people not actually started overrating it. 

Our season is so far down the gurgler that we've actually started applauding simple "effort" and "trying hard". fmd.

Okay, he brought the ball down, and got to the contest. Hooray for the professional tall forward who can get to marking contests!

Seriously, we're cuddling this kid now ever since his choke against Adelaide. I'm sure he'll be a decent player but he's entering year 4 and is still distinctively average. 

We only do well as a club when it comes to forward when the player is a ready made, bonafide star. Schwartz, Lyon, Jakovich, Neitz, Hogan.

We still can't develop raw talent for [censored].

Yep

"One of the better 6 possession games I've seen from a key forward" ?‍♂️

Post-hoc rationalisation of mediocrity

[Go the Biff 3,439]

Quoting myself but what the hell. For those interested in a comparison later than the '80's / 90's  a comparison to Hawkins is instructive. Hawkins, who came into AFL with a much more developed body, didn't become a dominant forward until his sixth season in the comp. In his first five years the only times he really looked like a quality player was when he played on Nathan Carroll.

I wouldn't be giving up on the Weed just yet.