Open Mike: Todd Viney

[The Gunslinger 41]

Forgive me Gunslinger but methinks that is definitely shooting from the hip

Why do you ask for forgiveness Jack? I take what you said (ie, shooting from the hip) in the positive sense, unless of course I am totally misinterpreting your meaning.

[Guest]

As I have said long ago, the "Brett Lovett No Lollies No Coaches Box entry" story will be legendary for years to come" as will the "Mitch Clark wearing the wrong color shoe laces to training so go home" story.

I also believe Brett Lovett had to drive around Port Pirie, (?) or so the story goes, looking for said lollies and wasn't allowed in until he got them.

[T&W 38]

it would have been nice to be allowed to ask questions at the AGM

But of course those wete heavily filtered.

I am genuinely suprised that more members are not sharing my views on this considering the shambles our midfield is still in.

Ask questions at an AGM???? Dont be ridiculous - next you will be asking for a vote. Dont be silly cant you join the dots??? Things are going very nicely these days thank-you very much.

[Coup Cooper 610]

I watched it last night on the demon app.

Thought it was a soft interview, and not enough questions were asked about 2011-13. And even 1998 which was the one that really got away from us.

[Sir Why You Little 37,342]

Ask questions at an AGM???? Dont be ridiculous - next you will be asking for a vote. Dont be silly cant you join the dots??? Things are going very nicely these days thank-you very much.

Head in the sand hey T & W

"Nothing to see here...."

[praha 11,253]

And even 1998 which was the one that really got away from us.

Disagree. The system screwed us, sure, and Adelaide got the better run. But we'd still would have needed to play North in the GF and we just didn't match up well against them.

2002 was a bigger miss. Pundits before the finals series were saying that we were the best Victorian chance to beat Brisbane, and we were. We smashed North in the first week, and should have destroyed the Crows. We were down by 40 at quarter time and came back in two of the best quarters I've ever seen this club play. In the 4th it was a tussle and we lost. THAT was the one that got away. I reckon we'd have beaten the Pies in the Prelim and had a real crack at the Lions.

[nutbean 8,838]

Head in the sand hey T & W

"Nothing to see here...."

If you were able to ask whatever you like, I am not sure what your expectation is asking the specific question at the AGM ( or at any other time ) surrounding Wines and Toumpas or for that matter any recruiting decisions. The answers for each recruiting case would be one of two.

1. We picked we was considered the best available player at the time of the draft ( this would account for most of our recruiting decisions)

2. We picked this player with a pick that may have been considered a little higher than expected but he fitted our need and we believed that they would develop into good footballers. ( Cook, Strauss etc)

I'll even go further and for entertainment let you have a follow up question.

"But Wines was a better choice than Toumpas"

And Viney's answer would be

"That is your opinion and at the time of the draft it was opinion that was not shared by myself, my recruiting team and most others."

Would that satisfy you ? (because frankly, I can't see you getting any other answers but these).

[Macca 17,120]

So we should base our future drafting policy on the back of other draftees "mates"?

Sort of like what happens at suburban cricket level.

How utterly ridiculous.

[nutbean 8,838]

So we should base our future drafting policy on the back of other draftees "mates"?

Sort of like what happens at suburban cricket level.

How utterly ridiculous.

the one I find as ridiculous is - "let's draft xxxx. He barracked for Melbourne as a kid".

[Demonic Faves 39]

then you are wrong.

I spent 5 years in hospital mate. I know a bit about surgery and rehab...

Which Ward? I have a feeling I know!

By the way, was it Toumpas that put you in hospital?? Must've been, no other reason for it as he is to blame for everything the little F----R!

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,825]

I thought one of the most interesting things in the interview was Todd's anecdote about possibly going to Essendon.

Soon after his arrival at Melb he was in a bus next to an un-named Melb player. Todd told him he could have joined Essendon. The player told him he made the wrong choice.

In fact, as it turned out, he made the right choice, since ,as I remember it,Melb did much better than Essendon during Todds career, except for the "Baby Bombers" year...was it '93?. Though I suppose one premiership might be better than a lot of finals over 12 years.

But it was interesting that morale was so low in early '87, that a player would confide that Essendon would be a better choice.

It would probably be the same today, (not necessarily with Essendon, but with other strong clubs)and therein lies part of our problem.

[T&W 38]

Head in the sand hey T & W

"Nothing to see here...."

You obviously cant join the dots. You dont get to ask questions and you dont get a vote for a reason - if you cant work that out for yourself you are more stupid than you make yourself out to be in this thread.

Just for the record we have an AFL approved CEO, AFL had picked President & board - AFL money to restructure our development & recruiting department - things are going along very nicely thanks.

[Sir Why You Little 37,342]

Which Ward? I have a feeling I know!

By the way, was it Toumpas that put you in hospital?? Must've been, no other reason for it as he is to blame for everything the little F----R!

I have nothing personal against Toumpas

except he cannot cut it at AFL Level.

We had a gun sitting right under our nose that is the exact player type we are lacking, but instead we chose a player with suspect hips.

Sorry if you find my anger offensive but i don't know you so i really do not care

[Sir Why You Little 37,342]

You obviously cant join the dots. You dont get to ask questions and you dont get a vote for a reason - if you cant work that out for yourself you are more stupid than you make yourself out to be in this thread.

Just for the record we have an AFL approved CEO, AFL had picked President & board - AFL money to restructure our development & recruiting department - things are going along very nicely thanks.

Well then maybe the club shouldn't accept ALL the $$$ i have donated over a long period.

2 way street sunshine...

i have no problem with the present structure btw

[Macca 17,120]

Chris Grant was pick 105

Captain hindsight required - please explain

[nutbean 8,838]

Chris Grant was pick 105

Captain hindsight required - please explain

How about all the footballers who made it through to rookie list ?

[Lucifers Hero 40,564]

I have nothing personal against Toumpas

except he cannot cut it at AFL Level.

We had a gun sitting right under our nose that is the exact player type we are lacking, but instead we chose a player with suspect hips.

Sorry if you find my anger offensive but i don't know you so i really do not care

I hesitate to buy into this but saying what we 'are lacking' now is missing a critical point.

You may be right in saying Ollie is the player we are lacking now but he was not at the time of the draft. AT THE TIME our 'classy speedy' midfielder had just defected to GWS and needed to be replaced. (Blease was speedy but there was no real confidence he would develop his defensive side (he didn't)). AT THE TIME the team had a few inside midfielders (not enough but a few): Jones, Sylvia, Viney, etc etc. Therefore, given list manangement needs as they stood then, the decision was Toumpas, speed over grunt. (Toumpas' speed is acknowledged even now; it is his disposal that is being worked on).

Evaluation of a decision needs to be made in the context of the list position/team needs and balance AT THE TIME not 3 years later.

ps Sorry to 'shout' by using CAPS but I feel the time context is important.

[jackaub 1,402]

I hesitate to buy into this but saying what we 'are lacking' now is missing a critical point.

You may be right in saying Ollie is the player we are lacking now but he was not at the time of the draft. AT THE TIME our 'classy speedy' midfielder had just defected to GWS and needed to be replaced. (Blease was speedy but there was no real confidence he would develop his defensive side (he didn't)). AT THE TIME the team had a few inside midfielders (not enough but a few): Jones, Sylvia, Viney, etc etc. Therefore, given list manangement needs as they stood then, the decision was Toumpas, speed over grunt. (Toumpas' speed is acknowledged even now; it is his disposal that is being worked on).

Evaluation of a decision needs to be made in the context of the list position/team needs and balance AT THE TIME not 3 years later.

ps Sorry to 'shout' by using CAPS but I feel the time context is important.

speed over grunt. (Toumpas' speed is acknowledged even now;

What speed would that be

Havent seen it yet!

[Sir Why You Little 37,342]

I hesitate to buy into this but saying what we 'are lacking' now is missing a critical point.

You may be right in saying Ollie is the player we are lacking now but he was not at the time of the draft. AT THE TIME our 'classy speedy' midfielder had just defected to GWS and needed to be replaced. (Blease was speedy but there was no real confidence he would develop his defensive side (he didn't)). AT THE TIME the team had a few inside midfielders (not enough but a few): Jones, Sylvia, Viney, etc etc. Therefore, given list manangement needs as they stood then, the decision was Toumpas, speed over grunt. (Toumpas' speed is acknowledged even now; it is his disposal that is being worked on).

Evaluation of a decision needs to be made in the context of the list position/team needs and balance AT THE TIME not 3 years later.

ps Sorry to 'shout' by using CAPS but I feel the time context is important.

Don't be ridiculous. At no stage was our midfield in any shape to say a player of Ollie Wines calibre was not what we needed.

That is media bullsh!t. 2012 was enough to show that alone

Jack & Ollie would have been great working under Jonesy. Young Grunt

I reckon Todd balked but sadly we won't know what happened because good old "soft [censored]" Shehan didn't ask the tough ones...

[nutbean 8,838]

I hesitate to buy into this but saying what we 'are lacking' now is missing a critical point.

You may be right in saying Ollie is the player we are lacking now but he was not at the time of the draft. AT THE TIME our 'classy speedy' midfielder had just defected to GWS and needed to be replaced. (Blease was speedy but there was no real confidence he would develop his defensive side (he didn't)). AT THE TIME the team had a few inside midfielders (not enough but a few): Jones, Sylvia, Viney, etc etc. Therefore, given list manangement needs as they stood then, the decision was Toumpas, speed over grunt. (Toumpas' speed is acknowledged even now; it is his disposal that is being worked on).

Evaluation of a decision needs to be made in the context of the list position/team needs and balance AT THE TIME not 3 years later.

ps Sorry to 'shout' by using CAPS but I feel the time context is important.

The critical point is that Toumpas was considered a better footballer - end of story -forget context - forget list position, forget speed, forget grunt. All you have highlighted are valid points except none of them are the critical point.

It is probably right to suggest that Cook was drafted as a "needs" footballer.

Listening to most recruiting managers these days they are all sing from the same hymn book. You pick the best available footballer not for needs - if two players are considered equal then you pick the player that suits your need. You trade for needs as there is more exposed form in established or emerging players.

As Macca and I have constantly banged on - there is too little exposed form on 18 year olds at the time of the draft - so there has been a litany of mistakes made in drafting in the past and it will continue in the future.

[nutbean 8,838]

I reckon Todd balked but sadly we won't know what happened because good old "soft [censored]" Shehan didn't ask the tough ones...

Are you going to answer or evade ?

What do you think Todd would say if asked the question ?

[Roost It 1,434]

I knew Toumpas was the wrong pick from his first interview and said so at the time. He's a total mummy's boy. Unbelievable error by the club but there is zero point going on about it now. Brayshaw, Salem, Hogan, Tyson, Viney, are all players we can build a club around. We need 3 more A grade mids, Petracca might be one of them, a ruckman and possibly one more key back. From there we really should see improvement. That's not too much more. We're not miles off top 4, but who k owe what happens from there

Now stop worrying about Toumpas he'll be gone soon enough

[Sir Why You Little 37,342]

Are you going to answer or evade ?

What do you think Todd would say if asked the question ?

how can i answer that?

He hasn't been asked. I am still trying to work out why he was made Head of Recruiting.

I am not evading anything. I was hoping Mike the journalist would extract all that info out of him.

But it was mostly "Hollywood Boulevard"

[jackaub 1,402]

I knew Toumpas was the wrong pick from his first interview and said so at the time. He's a total mummy's boy. Unbelievable error by the club but there is zero point going on about it now. Brayshaw, Salem, Hogan, Tyson, Viney, are all players we can build a club around. We need 3 more A grade mids, Petracca might be one of them, a ruckman and possibly one more key back. From there we really should see improvement. That's not too much more. We're not miles off top 4, but who k owe what happens from there

Now stop worrying about Toumpas he'll be gone soon enough

Very Succinct Roost. I have already done so and Toumpas doesn't figures in my team going forward.

[jackaub 1,402]

how can i answer that?

He hasn't been asked. I am still trying to work out why he was made Head of Recruiting.

I am not evading anything. I was hoping Mike the journalist would extract all that info out of him.

But it was mostly "Hollywood Boulevard"

Yep Todd was defintely one of GL's in-crowd How he has survived is beyond me.