Jump to content

THE ESSENDON 34: ON TRIAL


Demonland

Recommended Posts

Just to bring a little peace to the collective Demonlander psyche, I took a peek at the boy's training this morning and NO sign of peptides! In fact the group look very lean, in particular the "Prince" who looks Ks lighter than last year. Happy to say not a pumped up Wastsonesque body in sight . . . 2015 Go Dees!!

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

why is it that I have this sick feeling that this mob are either going to get off or receive a slap over the wrist.

-there seems a lot of sympathy for the players from all quarters.

Somebody reassure me that my logic is flawed or that my cynicism is unwarranted. Or point me in the direction of a good psychotherapist.

EH

Wouldn't surprise me if the got the slap on the wrist either.

Not sure about the sympathy from all quarters for the players though.

Sadly, I don't think your cynicism or logic is flawed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

which looks like a clear dig at Watson and fletcher saying you ignored the suspension thus we feel you are not entitled to back dating

I thought I heard Fletcher was one who refused to participate in the program

Edited by grazman
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Caroline lays it on the line:

"But if ever the time had come for the new AFL chief to demonstrate his authority it is now."

Essendon's refusal to play is making a mockery of the preseason competition

Yep. Gil time for you to stand up for the AFL and the other 17 clubs in the competition!!! Stop all the conciliatory crap and do what is right for your sponsor (NAB) and for the competition!

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Caroline lays it on the line:

"But if ever the time had come for the new AFL chief to demonstrate his authority it is now."

Essendon's refusal to play is making a mockery of the preseason competition

Yep. Gil time for you to stand up for the AFL and the other 17 clubs in the competition!!! Stop all the conciliatory crap and do what is right your sponsor (NAB) and for the competition!

Agree but he is not after the good of the game he is after the most money he can get out of the tv rights,sponsors, fans and media.
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Agree but he is not after the good of the game he is after the most money he can get out of the tv rights,sponsors, fans and media.

I think you are right and eventually that is what will turn so many people away from aussie rules to other sports like soccer. It may take 5 or 10 years but the writing is on the wall!

All of my demons and pies supporting family (except me) have stopped buying their AFL Club memberships to buy Melbourne Victory memberships. Sign of the times.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What continues to worry me about this whole fiasco is the difficulty involved in identifying the individuals who got each injection.

I have no doubt that ASADA has sufficient evidence to comfortably satisfy the tribunal that at least 30 syringes of a banned substance were emptied into the veins of a group of 34 Essendon players - but whether or not they can establish that all 34 got an injection and that not one syringe was lost or damaged is another matter.

If even just one syringe went astray the defence lawyers will have a ball arguing first one player , and then another ....and then another ... and etc,....... was the (un) lucky one to miss out!!

Surely the difficulty in this case lies in attaching dosages to particular individuals. Hird and his co-conspirators destroyed the trail to individuals long ago - which is why Worksafe should be queued up to prosecute the club regardless of the Tribunal's final decision!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Caroline lays it on the line:"

Yep. Gil time for you to stand up for the AFL and the other 17 clubs in the competition!!! Stop all the conciliatory crap and do what is right for your sponsor (NAB) and for the competition!

I think that's what this is:

"Fairfax Media understands the AFL will punish any club abandoning a game by withdrawing premiership points and could even threaten draft sanctions. This is what Essendon faces."

If they docked 4-8 premiership points for every preseason game they boycotted, that pretty much ends the season of a mediocre side needing things running their way just to play finals.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The afl is being made to look at the mercy of the efc about time the AFL reminded them of their place and for the love of god clarify the situation

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The afl is being made to look at the mercy of the efc about time the AFL reminded them of their place and for the love of god clarify the situation

Held to ransom by a rogue club . . grow a pair and slap the dopers down!

Personally I don't care if I never again see a black and red jumper.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

gil doesn't need to say anything at this point. feb 18 is the current date that's been bandied about as tribunal starting to consider their recommended course of action - which can of course be appealed by wada if required. the peptides don't have their first nab challenge game til march 7.

tribunal comes out and announces back-dated six month bans within a week of that, and gil announces changes to nab challenge schedules as it won't even effect the premiership season.

and then we wait to see whether there's an appeal.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you are right and eventually that is what will turn so many people away from aussie rules to other sports like soccer. It may take 5 or 10 years but the writing is on the wall!

All of my demons and pies supporting family (except me) have stopped buying their AFL Club memberships to buy Melbourne Victory memberships. Sign of the times.

LH what sport would they then follow? A sport run by Blatter? NFL is a money game for owners.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Caro, as always, is spot on.

The AFL have been made to look like inept, spineless fools throughout this saga. Indeed it appears the tail does wag the dog.

Gil might want to protect the interests of Essendon and their large supporter base, but he's a fool to do it at the expense of the other 17 clubs. Let's not forget who is to blame for this entire mess.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


and then just when you thought it was safe to . . BANG! . . another hit on the head with the WADA bat!!

11.2 Consequences for Team Sports

I f more than two members of a team in a Team Sport are

found to have committed an anti-doping rule violation

during an Event Period, the ruling body of the Event shall

impose an appropriate sanction on the team (e.g., loss

of points, Disqualification from a Competition or Event, or

other sanction) in addition to any Consequences imposed

upon the individual Athletes committing the anti-doping

rule violation.

It was mentioned on BF in one of thread where an EFC fan is holding on to hope that the AFL wanted to negotiate a team penalty rather than individual penalties. Maybe I should point them to this clause in particular the sentence that says "in addition to any Consequences imposed upon the individual Athletes committing the anti-doping rule violation." Edited by felixdacat
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Further reading suggests the following. Bans arent backdated per se. Its bordering pedantic but the bans start from the handing down from the Tribunal of the penalty. You are then to take away the time incurred having been provisionally suspended. It sort of adds up to the same thing but its very important that the ban actually( officially) starts from the tribunals decision.

you are of course correct in the noting of SCN's

I think the important thing to understand here is that neither ASADA nor WADA feel they owe Essendon and the AFL any favours. In fact quite the opposite. At the top of both organisations it is fair to say they are ropable as to the arrogance of this major Australian sport, and they are determined to ensure they get their just deserts. That means full penalties. ASADA stopped talking to Essendon around the time Hird took them to court . No communication about discounted sentences has occurred since then basically because ASADA says "they have done their dash and if they won't co-operate with us neither will we do them any favours".

Basically I believe they will stick to the letter of the law and date any penalties from the days of the handing down of sentences without any discounts. This i believe will be followed by a case mounted against Hird. He will get life.

I hasten to add though this will not come from the AFL Tribunal. Under intense pressure from a variety of vested interests, not least the ABBOTT government desperately trying to make itself popular, they will hand down backdated 6 month penalties to the end of last season, and all Essendon and their tame lackies in the media will say is "I told you so". Within weeks WADA will have taken them to CAS and the above penalties will come out.

Then there is Worksafe......it has years to run.

It is a measure of the desperation of these people that their acolytes in the Press have just started to float the idea that the AFL should renounce their signing up for the WADA charter. This is about the only way they will get out of this mess. Given the proclivities of the powerful vested interests involved in this, it would not surprise me if they are seriously looking at if this is possible, but it would be about as stupid as Abbott's knighting of Prince Phillip but be 100 times more damaging and would make us not only the laughing stock of the Commonwealth, but of the entire sporting world.

Interesting to note, the new State Governor is an AFL Commissioner, a senior judge, AND an Essendon fanatic, and was appointed by the Victorian Premier, also an Essendon tragic as is the global head of News Limited. The EFC have some very powerful people backing them on both sides of politics, and will be examining every angle to try and wiggle their way out of this. Fortunately, WADA has ultimate say, no matter how much the Anglo-Australian establishment might wish otherwise.

Edited by Dees2014
  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What continues to worry me about this whole fiasco is the difficulty involved in identifying the individuals who got each injection.

I have no doubt that ASADA has sufficient evidence to comfortably satisfy the tribunal that at least 30 syringes of a banned substance were emptied into the veins of a group of 34 Essendon players - but whether or not they can establish that all 34 got an injection and that not one syringe was lost or damaged is another matter.

If even just one syringe went astray the defence lawyers will have a ball arguing first one player , and then another ....and then another ... and etc,....... was the (un) lucky one to miss out!!

Surely the difficulty in this case lies in attaching dosages to particular individuals. Hird and his co-conspirators destroyed the trail to individuals long ago - which is why Worksafe should be queued up to prosecute the club regardless of the Tribunal's final decision!

Maybe if this were a criminal court, but we're talking about a lesser standard of proof here. There is no "beyond reasonable doubt." ASADA only need to show that the balance of probability is that they took them. Thus if they can show that 29 of 30 took them, odds are that this player did, and this player did, and this player did...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This will be followed by a case mounted against Hird in much the same way as Armstrong's coaches were prosecuted by USADA AND WADA after Armstrong got his life ban.

Just to be a pedant, the non-cyclists involved were all prosecuted together and at the same time as Armstrong. Some of them (e.g. Bruyneel) chose to contest the charges, which then went to arbitration at a later date. But there was only one investigation.

Edited by bing181
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maybe if this were a criminal court, but we're talking about a lesser standard of proof here. There is no "beyond reasonable doubt." ASADA only need to show that the balance of probability is that they took them. Thus if they can show that 29 of 30 took them, odds are that this player did, and this player did, and this player did...

If Dank goes into a room with vials of TB4, and players go into that room to be injected (with something), that's already enough. The confessions, forms and dosing schedules would be enough to tie it up.

If ASADA can comfortably place TB4 at Essendon, then the players are in big trouble.

Worth remembering is that Wade Lees was rubbed out for something he never even received.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maybe if this were a criminal court, but we're talking about a lesser standard of proof here. There is no "beyond reasonable doubt." ASADA only need to show that the balance of probability is that they took them. Thus if they can show that 29 of 30 took them, odds are that this player did, and this player did, and this player did...

Technically incorrect.

Section 7.1 Anti-Doping policy (ASC) States that the standard of proof is greater than a mere balance of probability but less than proof beyond reasonable doubt.

Somewhere in between the two it would seem.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Demonland Forums  

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    2024 Player Reviews: #31 Bayley Fritsch

    Once again the club’s top goal scorer but he had a few uncharacteristic flat spots during the season and the club will be looking for much better from him in 2025. Date of Birth: 6 December 1996 Height: 188cm Games MFC 2024: 23 Career Total: 149 Goals MFC 2024: 41 Career Total: 252 Brownlow Medal Votes: 4

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 8

    2024 Player Reviews: #18 Jake Melksham

    After sustaining a torn ACL in the final match of the 2023 season Jake added a bit to the attack late in the 2024 season upon his return. He has re-signed on to the Demons for 1 more season in 2025. Date of Birth: 12 August 1991 Height: 186cm Games MFC 2024: 8 Career Total: 229 Goals MFC 2024: 8 Career Total: 188

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 5

    2024 Player Reviews: #3 Christian Salem

    The luckless Salem suffered a hamstring injury against the Lions early in the season and, after missing a number of games, he was never at his best. He was also inconvenienced by minor niggles later in the season. This was a blow for the club that sorely needed him to fill gaps in the midfield at times as well as to do his best work in defence. Date of Birth: 15 July 1995 Height: 184cm Games MFC 2024: 17 Career Total: 176 Goals MFC 2024: 1 Career Total: 26 Brownlow Meda

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 8

    2024 Player Reviews: #39 Koltyn Tholstrop

    The first round draft pick at #13 from twelve months ago the strongly built medium forward has had an impressive introduction to AFL football and is expected to spend more midfield moments as his career progresses. Date of Birth: 25 July 2005 Height: 186cm Games MFC 2024: 10 Career Total: 10 Goals MFC 2024: 5 Career Total: 5 Games CDFC 2024: 7 Goals CDFC 2024: 4

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 6

    2024 Player Reviews: #42 Daniel Turner

    The move of “Disco” to a key forward post looks like bearing fruit. Turner has good hands, moves well and appears to be learning the forward craft well. Will be an interesting watch in 2025. Date of Birth: January 28, 2002 Height: 195cm Games MFC 2024: 15 Career Total: 18 Goals MFC 2024: 17 Career Total: 17 Games CDFC 2024: 1 Goals CDFC 2024:  1

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 15

    2024 Player Reviews: #8 Jake Lever

    The Demon’s key defender and backline leader had his share of injuries and niggles throughout the season which prevented him from performing at his peak.  Date of Birth: 5 March 1996 Height: 195cm Games MFC 2024: 18 Career Total: 178 Goals MFC 2024: 1 Career Total: 5

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 1

    2024 Player Reviews: #13 Clayton Oliver

    Lack of preparation after a problematic preseason prevented Oliver from reaching the high standards set before last year’s hamstring woes. He carried injury right through the back half of the season and was controversially involved in a potential move during the trade period that was ultimately shut down by the club. Date of Birth:  22 July 1997 Height:  189cm Games MFC 2024:  21 Career Total: 183 Goals MFC 2024: 3 Career Total: 54 Brownlow Medal Votes: 5

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 17

    BLOODY BLUES by Meggs

    The conclusion to Narrm’s home and away season was the inevitable let down by the bloody Blues  who meekly capitulated to the Bombers.   The 2024 season fixture handicapped the Demons chances from the get-go with Port Adelaide, Brisbane and Essendon advantaged with enough gimme games to ensure a tough road to the finals, especially after a slew of early season injuries to star players cost wins and percentage.     As we strode confidently through the gates of Prin

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 3

    2024 Player Reviews: #5 Christian Petracca

    Melbourne’s most important player who dominated the first half of the season until his untimely injury in the Kings Birthday clash put an end to his season. At the time, he was on his way to many personal honours and the club in strong finals contention. When the season did end for Melbourne and Petracca was slowly recovering, he was engulfed in controversy about a possible move of clubs amid claims about his treatment by the club in the immediate aftermath of his injury. Date of Birth: 4 J

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 21
  • Tell a friend

    Love Demonland? Tell a friend!

×
×
  • Create New...