I'd argue that the birth of his first child might be affecting his game over the past two weeks.

might well be something in that. His sleep patterns mightnt be so wonderful atm

You guys are hilarious. This thread reads like we're the worst team in the history of football.

You remove three absolute shank kicks and three terrible umpiring decisions from that game and we'd have won by three goals. Roos' plan is working. Even with players like Matt Jones and Dan Nicholson on the park, we're playing respectable football. Yeah, it's frustrating when a player butchers a kick, but to have Bernie Vince and Jack Watts both shank a shocker within five minutes isn't bad preparation or bad management or bad training or anything. Those guys are both excellent kicks, 99.5% of the time. It was just straight bad luck.

We played, by our new standards, quite poorly, and yet we still almost won. "Quite poorly" under the previous regime was a 100 point plus belting. We're on the right track. The sky is not falling in. We'll be playing finals in a year or two.

The voice of reason. Careful with that......

GLUTIUS MAXIMUS BEATS CLASS EVERY TIME by George on the Outer

Reports

Melbourne Nil

Western Bulldogs Nil

Umpires Chamberlain, Harris, Mollison

Crowd 24,953 at Etihad Stadium

If Eddie is asking for $200000 compensation from the AFL because only 40,000 turned up to watch the Pies and the Blues at the G, perhaps we (& the Doggies) should be asking $300000 because we only got 25000? In fact if we got compensated for every MCG Twilight Game, we may very well end up one of Melbourne's wealthiest Clubs? Eddie should be happy just to get 4 Premiership points!

RF, this is what i don't get. When you say the sooner 'we' accept we made a blunder drafting the toump the sooner 'we' can move on who is 'we'? DL posters, the MFC, Roos? What do you mean 'move on'?

The irony of course is you and some others clearly believe we made a blunder yet it is the same posters who seemingly find it impossible to 'move on'.

How about you accept nothing can change history so 'moving on' is the only logical conclusion. What's done is done. Or do you feel the need for a chorus of DL folk to agree with you that we made an error?

Which by the by will to be possible to answer for some years. Case in point you could swap the names Watts and Natanui a few years back on DL and exactly the same discussion was being had. Except there were even more people saying we made an obvious blunder (and some who were so strident in their views they simply could not countenance alternative views). I guess there are still quite a few on DL who still think we made a blunder but i'd be guessing the numbers would look pretty different today.

Well if you can't accept we made a blunder then you obviously feel that Toumpass is a better player than Wines and if that's the case then you are entitled to that opinion. This keeps coming up in thread after thread and I try to keep out of it but sometimes i get involved, this time I got involved and to be honest i can't recall why, however it's my belief that we should try to move on from it and leave it at that.

Perhaps we should start a poll to see who feels Toumpass or Wines is the better player and put it to rest for al time, then we can get on with the job of giving our advice to the club about who we should keep/delist and who should play where.

With regard to changing history or learning from it, I'm in the camp of remembering and learning so we don't repeat the same mistake again, that's if you accept we made a mistake in the first place. I don't need a chorus line to justify my position, I'm pretty sure I got it right, then and now.

On the Watts, Nik Nat debate, that has pretty much settled down and there doesn't seem to be much argument on that at all, it's more about whether Jack has what it takes to play the game and I'm on the side of he does.

Eddie has no interest in equalisation.

Eddie has no interest in equalisation.

actually he does

he want everyone to follow Collingwood.......equally !!!

actually he does

he want everyone to follow Collingwood.......equally !!!

he needs to realise we can't do that,

we have teeth, and jobs.

Rf I obviously have not made myself clear. I have never said we didn't make a mistake taking the toump. I have said we will not know for years. Is he a better player than wines ATM? No? Will he be in future? Maybe. Simply put history tells us that is folly to make definitive statements so early in player's careers and is a sure way to look silly.

Rf I obviously have not made myself clear. I have never said we didn't make a mistake taking the toump. I have said we will not know for years. Is he a better player than wines ATM? No? Will he be in future? Maybe. Simply put history tells us that is folly to make definitive statements so early in player's careers and is a sure way to look silly.

It's been a long hard day for me today, so perhaps I misread you, but I have tried to get out of this debate as it's pointless, so I just want to let others talk about it if they feel the need.

It's been a long hard day for me today, so perhaps I misread you, but I have tried to get out of this debate as it's pointless, so I just want to let others talk about it if they feel the need.

fair enough

On the Watts, Nik Nat debate, that has pretty much settled down and there doesn't seem to be much argument on that at all, it's more about whether Jack has what it takes to play the game and I'm on the side of he does.

There seems to be a lot of argument as to whether NikNat is any good and worth his new wage increase.

There seems to be a lot of argument as to whether NikNat is any good and worth his new wage increase.

That's probably true but he's a bit like Jack, he has some good games and some bad games, but he's not really consistent, even during games.

I've watched him a bit lately and he seems to spectate quite a lot, just meandering along side the play without getting involved.

$1m per year; I don't think so.

just saying

Nik Nat has taken a few games by their scruff and changed them

Id love Jack to do so......and I reckon he could...between the ears !!

just saying

Nik Nat has taken a few games by their scruff and changed them

Id love Jack to do so......and I reckon he could...between the ears !!

They're different types of players. Has NikNat ever received three votes? Jack has twice. He's more consistent. NikNat is flashy and is, IMO, one of the most overrated players in the league. Jack has dominated games, not physically, but he has dominated them. The sooner people accept Jack's not a KPF, the sooner people will appreciate him for his skills and decision-making. I'm not saying Jack doesn't need to improve his physicality, but your statement above, BB, is simply unfair. Don't get done over by the media hyperbole.

Perhaps we should start a poll to see who feels Toumpass or Wines is the better player and put it to rest for al time

It's not about who "is" the better player. No question ... at the moment.

It's who will be the better player for Melbourne over the length of their career - and with all due respect, i can't see how you or anyone else is in a position to even begin to judge that at the moment.

Roosy highlighted on 360 the after effects of the Bail rushed behind decision, with Dunn being unsure of what to do under pressure which resulted in another goal. At least two or three goals all on the back of one terrible decision.

It's not about who "is" the better player. No question ... at the moment.

It's who will be the better player for Melbourne over the length of their career - and with all due respect, i can't see how you or anyone else is in a position to even begin to judge that at the moment.

I'd like to be as sure of winning Tattslotto.

Roosy highlighted on 360 the after effects of the Bail rushed behind decision, with Dunn being unsure of what to do under pressure which resulted in another goal. At least two or three goals all on the back of one terrible decision.

It was an outrageously unfair decision in the context of the game, and it was at least good to hear Gerald Whateley say the umpires today admitted it was an incorrect decision. When you think about the Crameri goal and the last goal our players could have rushed through, we would have won by 3 goals.

I also don't care how many times I watch Bontempelli's goal but that was a miracle kick. 9 times out of 10 he'd never kick that. The Bulldogs were very lucky to win. They gave up a huge lead and got gifted a goal that 99 times out of a hundred would have been a point. McCartney talked them up after the game but had they gone down they'd be a game behind us after 3 years under him with a lot more senior experience to work with.

Can you tell I'm still bitter?

They're different types of players. Has NikNat ever received three votes? Jack has twice. He's more consistent. NikNat is flashy and is, IMO, one of the most overrated players in the league. Jack has dominated games, not physically, but he has dominated them. The sooner people accept Jack's not a KPF, the sooner people will appreciate him for his skills and decision-making. I'm not saying Jack doesn't need to improve his physicality, but your statement above, BB, is simply unfair. Don't get done over by the media hyperbole.

I think youve missed my gist.

Jack has amazing talent but seems affraid to own it., Nik Nat isnt

JW needs to

It was an outrageously unfair decision in the context of the game, and it was at least good to hear Gerald Whateley say the umpires today admitted it was an incorrect decision. When you think about the Crameri goal and the last goal our players could have rushed through, we would have won by 3 goals.

I also don't care how many times I watch Bontempelli's goal but that was a miracle kick. 9 times out of 10 he'd never kick that. The Bulldogs were very lucky to win. They gave up a huge lead and got gifted a goal that 99 times out of a hundred would have been a point. McCartney talked them up after the game but had they gone down they'd be a game behind us after 3 years under him with a lot more senior experience to work with.

Can you tell I'm still bitter?

I get why the goal is being hyped up because of the shrugging of tackles in a confined space, the angle, and the circumstances in the context of the game. But I agree that it was a miracle floater. I genuinely think Jenkins goal is still GOTY . There aren't many players in the league who could do that.

That was with out a doubt the most disappointing lose of the season.

Struth. This thread is hard work. I don't want to wish away the season any sooner than nature intends, but roll on Round 16!

I concur, although base camp was so low, that it muddies what should be reasonable expectations for any AFL side. When a fellow bottom side have two of their three best mids out, we should beat them. Our resurgence in the third term shows how 'diabolical' our first half was.

There's absolutely no doubt the first half was diabolical. It was. Roos even used that word himself.

What annoys me is one half was diabolical, the second half was OK (the coach said 'good' - but I'll stick with 'OK') - and in some people's mind, that averages out to diabolical. In case I haven't made it apparent, I get very frustrated with people who seem to default to looking at things from the worst possible angle.

Think this defeat really hurt all concerned. Will be interesting to see how they respond. Get the feeling the penny has dropped about needing to play 4 quarters and to value your possessions and make them count.

Think this defeat really hurt all concerned. Will be interesting to see how they respond. Get the feeling the penny has dropped about needing to play 4 quarters and to value your possessions and make them count.

Much better than this time last year when a defeat like this would've been classed as a win.

Nothing like a 6 day break in to Freo to refocus the lads.