POST MATCH DISCUSSION

[Vandenberger With The Lot 238]

Are you kidding? Just checking, were you there? I didn't see enough of him in the quarter or two he played to make any judgement. I am open to constructive criticism of his game.

I was there, pretty sure he came on in the second. Got 4 kicks, butchered two.

He was pretty hard up for opportunity, his defender was bigger, and there were no big targets for him to crumb for.

He can be an effective player, but needs real targets up forward.

[Earl Hood 6,082]

Not denying that, but he was still timid at times.

Yes but looking at his efforts tonight I think he will grow into the role as long as he gets support and some protection.

[praha 11,236]

Vince on the radio said he thought they were pretty average, said the first half was terrible.

Summed it up perfectly, said they had run and were always confident when they had the ball, but as soon as they SHOULD have gone forward, they hesitated. At least they can see what we see in the stands. It always seemed they went one or two possessions more than they should.

I'd imagine that even without good positioning or a target, kicking it inside 50 towards the boundary would suit the structure rather than make an error along the center or half back line. Three goals directly from missed handballs or over possession. There's the game right there.

It seemed that for 90% of the time the players were confident with their skills, delivery and ability to control the play, but it was the 10% that led to a loss. It's all it takes.

Also there was one forward on the ground, he had three goals, and that's the difference. He is a superstar and ultimately, really, he was the game's x-factor.

[mitch 127]

We didn't have a forward line, they didn't have a midfield and we lost the clearances. Letting them off the hook just cause Roos is our coach.

[Striker475 696]

See you all next year.

Look, the midfield was good. Watts was good. Tyson, Jones x2, Watts, Cross, Vince all had good nights.

But the disturbing part was THAT WAS IT. I thought our backline would improve once the I50 numbers dropped - instead we leaked like a sieve to midfielders and let [censored] Eli Templeton destroy us. I thought we'd sweep really well out of defence, instead we often bogged down or continued to kick long in hope and contest it out.

The saving grace, really, was that St Kilda have so many [censored] second stringers.

We're still so very bad. We really, really are. And we are so far back.

Right now, I don't see us winning a game. Tonight was the crack. Sure, they'll improve. But who are we going to beat, really? The Giants? Doubtful with how they've played. The Suns? They're a finals contender. The Lions? Played a lot better than us today.

I have us stone cold motherless last. And it's not even close.

[picket fence 17,056]

Funniest thing ive read for a while

And have called a cab, cabbie wrapped because he gets double time and a half for Sunday Morning pickups!

[DeeZee 7,363]

You need to sleep on it. Understand the anger and frustration, and I expected us to go much closer to a win than this, but with ZERO forward line you don't win games of footy. We had more scoring shots and more I50s, something we rarely do, but we didn't have the targets to turn that dominance into goals. Until we do we will struggle to beat any team.

Its not just the forward line.

We needed to win that game.....the saints are awful, and we are worse.

Our silly turnovers and poor ball use cost us, we have been able to manufacture goals, kick to space, leading medium size players etc etc.

God knows what will happen to us next week against west coast.

Im sick of excuses, we are no good , end of story.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Vince on the radio said he thought they were pretty average, said the first half was terrible.

Summed it up perfectly, said they had run and were always confident when they had the ball, but as soon as they SHOULD have gone forward, they hesitated. At least they can see what we see in the stands. It always seemed they went one or two possessions more than they should.

I'd imagine that even without good positioning or a target, kicking it inside 50 towards the boundary would suit the structure rather than make an error along the center or half back line. Three goals directly from missed handballs or over possession. There's the game right there.

It seemed that for 90% of the time the players were confident with their skills, delivery and ability to control the play, but it was the 10% that led to a loss. It's all it takes.

Also there was one forward on the ground, he had three goals, and that's the difference. He is a superstar and ultimately, really, he was the game's x-factor.

Spot on. Many times tonight we got the ball, looked up and had no tall target to kick to. Hurt us big time.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,115]

It wasn't that we had no forwards. It was that they hardly moved and when they did either got in each others way or were missed with the kick. Our ability to let StKilda's VFL starting midfield get easy take aways from the centre was deplorable. We couldn't hit the side of the barn forward of centre yet one of our best two disposing mids in Vince played all of the first half in the forward line. Jack Grimes tries hard but is a liability with ball in hand. We played very stationary, predictable football.

Watts was excellent as were Dunn and Jones. Those bagging Toumpas need to watch the game and get over wishing for Wines. He works his arse off to make position, is smart with ball in hand and will improve significantly over the course of the season.

The key will be to see the learnings from the game, changes made and what they improve next week.

[Earl Hood 6,082]

My real worry from tonight is that we were beaten in the mid field clearances after half time I thought. The stats tomorrow may prove me wrong but I thought we were outplayed through the middle after the break. I can live with the rest as we had no forwards and injuries a plenty during the game. But. I hoped we would maintain midfield dominance throughout to vindicate our recruiting and our hopes for the future. Alas I think not.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Dreadful game, they aren't much but they beat us.

Pederson and Byrnes should be at Casey for the rest of the year. Spencer has some alright games then throws one like that in, he was dreadful, his skill was appalling and embarrassing, he's played enough games now to understand what's required.

Toumpass did a bit and because of his age I'll go easy on him but some of his work tonight was below par and he and Trenners look like the play in slow motion at times.

We didn't have a forward line and Howe was tagged out of it so we had to rely on someone to kick goals and someone didn't turn up.

JKH ran around like a madman but he couldn't get much of it, he's not supposed to be doing that he should be at the feet of the tall forwards crumbling the ball.

Some of the skill errors by the senior players were just embarrassing and Frawley is a long way from AA form and certainly isn't the best Backman in the comp.

If Bernie had slotted those early goals we might have gone on with it but he didn't and we didn't.

We will struggle to win any more than a couple of games this year, the saints are pretty ordinary but still managed to beat us. If we'd played a good side tonight we would have been slaughtered, most sides in the comp are a step above us.

I actually apologised to my grandson tonight for convincing him to barrack for Melbourne.

[jumbo returns 6,739]

Just imagine if we did too........

When will that be?

At least the Saints know when their better players are due back - we have no idea and fed constant bs about 'player management'

Fmd.

[Pipefitter 2,150]

Has there been a press conference yet?

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,115]

I expect that we will look very different with a couple of quality tall forwards. The issue is though no one knows when we may have them.

[Scoop Junior 3,435]

Nothing quite like feeling absolutely gutted after Round 1. Year after year after year.

Yeah, there were signs of improvement from last year (although could you really get any worse than losing by 321 points in the opening three rounds?) and we were completely down on luck (as usual) with our three key forwards out plus the injury to Fitz before half time, but seriously...

This was a very poor St Kilda team without its three best midfielders. I would probably rate their midfield bottom four in the league and without Hayes, Montagna and Steven a clear bottom. Yet they won more contested footy than us and smashed us in the clearances. That's right, the worst midfield in the comp. beat us in the contested footy and clearances. That has nothing to do with missing key forwards. A midfield featuring names such as Curran, Saunders, Newnes and Dunstan beat us in the contests and a dogged tagger in Clint Jones was made to look like a brownlow medallist with 39 touches.

St Kilda got the game on their terms early. Numbers back, make it hard for us to find any loose players or space in the forward line (which you need when you have a small forward line) and then break forward to Riewoldt and Maister / Stanley one out. The plan worked a treat for them. Of course we didn't help by moving the ball too slowly at times, delivering the ball poorly inside 50 and then failing to apply enough forward pressure on the way out.

I said all week not to play Cam Pederson. But many on here dismissed that, saying they like the contest he brings. Far out, that was one of the most deplorable performances I've seen from a Melbourne player. Gave us absolutely nothing all night, missed two set shots and somehow contrived to miss a goal from 5m out on the run. I don't care if he's our only tall - he can't play forward.

So we can rattle off some positives (Watts was superb, Jones and Dunn excellent), but frankly I'm not really in the mood. For me the most upsetting thing is that our one perceived advantage (midfield) didn't pan out that way - we had the cattle tonight to dominate them in midfield but we didn't. We also allowed them to play the game on their terms for pretty much the entire night.

Any other team would have smashed St Kilda tonight and to start another season with another shocking performance is just shattering. I thought perhaps for one week in seven years we may actually enjoy footy - obviously too much to ask for a MFC supporter.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

I expect that we will look very different with a couple of quality tall forwards. The issue is though no one knows when we may have them.

Best we can hope for next week is a call up for Gawn. Hogan and Dawes still a game or two away at best.

[Bang Bang Bang 5,802]

See you all next year.

Look, the midfield was good. Watts was good. Tyson, Jones x2, Watts, Cross, Vince all had good nights.

But the disturbing part was THAT WAS IT. I thought our backline would improve once the I50 numbers dropped - instead we leaked like a sieve to midfielders and let [censored] Eli Templeton destroy us. I thought we'd sweep really well out of defence, instead we often bogged down or continued to kick long in hope and contest it out.

The saving grace, really, was that St Kilda have so many [censored] second stringers.

We're still so very bad. We really, really are. And we are so far back.

Right now, I don't see us winning a game. Tonight was the crack. Sure, they'll improve. But who are we going to beat, really? The Giants? Doubtful with how they've played. The Suns? They're a finals contender. The Lions? Played a lot better than us today.

I have us stone cold motherless last. And it's not even close.

Paul Roos himself has said it a number of times, an 18-team competition will always have an 18th-placed team. If we show substantial improvement but still finish last, then so be it. It's an even competition this year. Personally I see us winning a handful of games, we will have days that we kick straight and have forward targets. But to have ever though we were anything but bottom 4 this year was wishful thinking.

[DeeZee 7,363]

Dreadful game, they aren't much but they beat us.

Pederson and Byrnes should be at Casey for the rest of the year. Spencer has some alright games then throws one like that in, he was dreadful, his skill was appalling and embarrassing, he's played enough games now to understand what's required.

Toumpass did a bit and because of his age I'll go easy on him but some of his work tonight was below par and he and Trenners look like the play in slow motion at times.

We didn't have a forward line and Howe was tagged out of it so we had to rely on someone to kick goals and someone didn't turn up.

JKH ran around like a madman but he couldn't get much of it, he's not supposed to be doing that he should be at the feet of the tall forwards crumbling the ball.

Some of the skill errors by the senior players were just embarrassing and Frawley is a long way from AA form and certainly isn't the best Backman in the comp.

If Bernie had slotted those early goals we might have gone on with it but he didn't and we didn't.

We will struggle to win any more than a couple of games this year, the saints are pretty ordinary but still managed to beat us. If we'd played a good side tonight we would have been slaughtered, most sides in the comp are a step above us.

I actually apologised to my grandson tonight for convincing him to barrack for Melbourne.

Good summary.

My 12 year old went to bed so dejected.......again.

Im so bloody sad and angry weve been lumbered with this lame excuse for a football team.

Edited March 22, 2014 by DeeZee

[Undeeterred 3,123]

Dreadful game, they aren't much but they beat us.

Pederson and Byrnes should be at Casey for the rest of the year. Spencer has some alright games then throws one like that in, he was dreadful, his skill was appalling and embarrassing, he's played enough games now to understand what's required.

Toumpass did a bit and because of his age I'll go easy on him but some of his work tonight was below par and he and Trenners look like the play in slow motion at times.

We didn't have a forward line and Howe was tagged out of it so we had to rely on someone to kick goals and someone didn't turn up.

JKH ran around like a madman but he couldn't get much of it, he's not supposed to be doing that he should be at the feet of the tall forwards crumbling the ball.

Some of the skill errors by the senior players were just embarrassing and Frawley is a long way from AA form and certainly isn't the best Backman in the comp.

If Bernie had slotted those early goals we might have gone on with it but he didn't and we didn't.

We will struggle to win any more than a couple of games this year, the saints are pretty ordinary but still managed to beat us. If we'd played a good side tonight we would have been slaughtered, most sides in the comp are a step above us.

I actually apologised to my grandson tonight for convincing him to barrack for Melbourne.

All of this. Except the grandson bit, but if I had one I'd be apologising too.

[Redleg 40,841]

Without the big 3 up forward, and then Fitz and TMac being injured winning went from tough to really difficult.

Aside from Watts Jones Vince and a bit of Toumpas I was underwhelmed with the midfield after quarter time.

And please no more Pedersen.

Agree, especially on the last line.

[S.R.J 418]

All you whinging bastards need to harden up. Yes we lost but surely we played a better brand of footy than last year. It was easy to see we had no forward structure. Yes it would have been nice to win but I still have faith Roosy has us in the right direction. I believe we will be a better side in the 2nd half of the season. Remember it's not easy adapting to a new game style.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

All you whinging bastards need to harden up. Yes we lost but surely we played a better brand of footy than last year. It was easy to see we had no forward structure. Yes it would have been nice to win but I still have faith Roosy has us in the right direction. I believe we will be a better side in the 2nd half of the season. Remember it's not easy adapting to a new game style.

Problem with that is so are St Kilda, they have a new coach and just as many new players and have to adapt to a new game style as well.

It was a really poor game last night, both sides are bottom 4 on that performance and I can't see either side winning many if any at all.

To be honest they were more slick than us and had more of a purpose when they had the ball.

[dees189227 12,373]

Vince was good but its a shame he couldnt convert his 4 behinds into some goals

Tyson was good and liked his goal and will help out our midfield a lot

Jones what can you say just a standout captain and player and dont shoot me down people but he should have kicked that goal he missed in the 2nd quarter

People want Byrnes to go. Why do you want to get rid of our leading goal kicker? He was ok but he stuffed some things up

Howe where were you? What happened to that leading player we have seen who runs and leads for the ball? YOu were invisible tonight and probably the worst game you have played

the 2nd quarter. 8 behinds. Our goal kicking was woeful. We had more scoring shots. Pederson how did you not kick that goal in the last quarter

JKH should be started on the field. The poor kid was probably so nervous but we needed a crumbing forward tonight

Poor Tom, you battled on so bravely.

Watts fanatstic. You took on players and your ball use is outstanding.

Roos I hope you like a challenge.

[Whispering_Jack 29,799]

Pretty much as Scoop Junior has stated but, whilst not wanting to make excuses, there's one thing worse than having injured players and that's having them during the course of a game. In the context of this game the loss of Fitzpatrick through concussion coming at the same time as McDonald's corkie was pretty devastating. It co-incided with Riewoldt taking control of proceedings in the St. Kilda forward line - nullify him or keep him down to an output equivalent to the first quarter and we win the game.

[samcantstandya 1,044]

Without the big 3 up forward, and then Fitz and TMac being injured winning went from tough to really difficult.

Aside from Watts Jones Vince and a bit of Toumpas I was underwhelmed with the midfield after quarter time.

And please no more Pedersen.

Pederson offers nothing.