On 20/09/2014 at 08:50, sweet dee said:

Bulldogs will only do that trade to get a KPF. It won't matter what pick we give them- they're not going to trade a midfielder to get that pick and replace it with another younger midfielder.

Unless it's a clear midfield upgrade in their eyes. Personally I think trading pick 2 is just dumb. IMO pick 3 should be traded only. I'd rather know we have pick 2 than rely upon another club's word to leave someone at 3.

Edited September 20, 201410 yr by Moonshadow

Hrovat and their pick 5 for pick 2.

  On 20/09/2014 at 09:49, DemonAndrew said:

Hrovat and their pick 5 for pick 2.

No way, Hrovat is a good hard worker & a handy player but nowhere near a pick 2 even with pick 5 coming back. At his best he will be a McGlynn type and he was traded for pick 46 & 70 tied up in the Kennedy deal. Surely we can do much better than this.

If we were to trade Petracca, a 92 kg running midfielder who can take a grab forward, we truly are insane. At some point in time you have to take a punt that a bloke will be a champ. What's the point otherwise? It's akin to saying that we are aiming at being mediocre.

  On 20/09/2014 at 09:59, rjay said:

No way, Hrovat is a good hard worker & a handy player but nowhere near a pick 2 even with pick 5 coming back. At his best he will be a McGlynn type and he was traded for pick 46 & 70 tied up in the Kennedy deal. Surely we can do much better than this.

A McGlynn type.....McGlynn is a bloody handy player.

  On 20/09/2014 at 09:08, Moonshadow said:

Unless it's a clear midfield upgrade in their eyes. Personally I think trading pick 2 is just dumb. IMO pick 3 should be traded only. I'd rather know we have pick 2 than rely upon another club's word to leave someone at 3.

Yep. They can take our word.

Statistically the likelihood of the best player in this draft being taken in the top three is surprisingly pretty low.

Though Petracca/Brayshaw look like guns now, if you look at the history of recent drafts, there is a greater probability that even better players will be available at lower picks.

Trade down Roos and co.

  On 20/09/2014 at 11:04, Al said:

A McGlynn type.....McGlynn is a bloody handy player.

Absolutely he is but the point is he got traded for pick 46 not pick 2 and I did say at best, he's miles from that level.

We all know full well that the Roos philosophy is about trading early draft picks and are mostly happy about the 2013 outcome although the final results won't really be apparent for some time yet. Assuming Frawley goes and we get pick 3 then there's a strong possibility that we would do the same again. However, it goes without saying the deal would have to be right. If the Saints take Petracca then Brayshaw and McCartin provide us with a good start to our list improvement based on some of the advice I've received from some sound judges.

  On 20/09/2014 at 10:56, Return to Glory said:

If we were to trade Petracca, a 92 kg running midfielder who can take a grab forward, we truly are insane. At some point in time you have to take a punt that a bloke will be a champ. What's the point otherwise? It's akin to saying that we are aiming at being mediocre.

I agree totally.

  On 20/09/2014 at 10:56, Return to Glory said:

If we were to trade Petracca, a 92 kg running midfielder who can take a grab forward, we truly are insane. At some point in time you have to take a punt that a bloke will be a champ. What's the point otherwise? It's akin to saying that we are aiming at being mediocre.

But St Kilda will take him.

  On 20/09/2014 at 20:58, Whispering_Jack said:

We all know full well that the Roos philosophy is about trading early draft picks and are mostly happy about the 2013 outcome although the final results won't really be apparent for some time yet. Assuming Frawley goes and we get pick 3 then there's a strong possibility that we would do the same again. However, it goes without saying the deal would have to be right. If the Saints take Petracca then Brayshaw and McCartin provide us with a good start to our list improvement based on some of the advice I've received from some sound judges.

I think so too 'Jack', a Hogan, McCartin forward line would strike fear into defenders in years to come. They both have a take no prisoners attitude to the game.

  On 20/09/2014 at 20:58, Whispering_Jack said:

We all know full well that the Roos philosophy is about trading early draft picks and are mostly happy about the 2013 outcome although the final results won't really be apparent for some time yet. Assuming Frawley goes and we get pick 3 then there's a strong possibility that we would do the same again. However, it goes without saying the deal would have to be right. If the Saints take Petracca then Brayshaw and McCartin provide us with a good start to our list improvement based on some of the advice I've received from some sound judges.

I'd be more than happy with that outcome. Both are fine players and would slot in nicely both in terms of ability and mentality.

A quality young midfielder and the best KPP coming up through the system.

What could go wrong?

  On 20/09/2014 at 13:35, Davos said:

Statistically the likelihood of the best player in this draft being taken in the top three is surprisingly pretty low.

Though Petracca/Brayshaw look like guns now, if you look at the history of recent drafts, there is a greater probability that even better players will be available at lower picks.

Trade down Roos and co.

but also stats can deceive, I'd be interested in which type of club took the fails & if the power clubs with top 5 picks got winners out of them.

Edited September 21, 201410 yr by dee-luded

  On 20/09/2014 at 23:52, The Great Pretender said:

A quality young midfielder and the best KPP coming up through the system.

What could go wrong?

Not to say I'm against using those top picks at the draft, but I recall people wanting us to take Scully and Butcher at 1 & 2 in '09.

Would prefer to trade one pick out for a known quality midfielder.

Having watched the TAC Cup grand final, I would have to say that it we traded our top picks for quality players and ended up with a couple of mid first round selections then getting the likes of Paul Ahern and Jordan De Goey, that wouldn't be bad going either.

http://m.canberratimes.com.au/afl/afl-news/tom-faul-hopes-all-christmases-come-at-once-in-afl-draft-20140920-10h4ia.html

Just a little story on a local Canberra lad, hope he gets picked up somewhere - he's a great kid with a good head on his shoulders - will be very much an X factor project player. Has been playing with Ainslie in the NEAFL and a few games with GWS Ressies this year. Late draft/rookie prospect

  On 21/09/2014 at 03:09, Whispering_Jack said:

Having watched the TAC Cup grand final, I would have to say that it we traded our top picks for quality players and ended up with a couple of mid first round selections then getting the likes of Paul Ahern and Jordan De Goey, that wouldn't be bad going either.

I'd like to add Pickett into this mix around the P-8 area.

... if we could get something going with GCSuns, that may be cool. P-2 for they're 2 picks, & a player... if we need to add something extra, OK.

P-3+ (for Shiel+Jaksch).

The problem with trying to do another deal with GWS is that they won't be looking at McCartin or Wright - so if Petracca and Brayshaw go at 1 and 2, I don't think they'll have a lot of incentive to trade up as high as pick 3.

Ive heard from 2 quite different sources that the saints are going for 2 meter Peter. If not him they are trading for a tall forward i.e. Cameron.

Both the sources Ive heard from are believed to be in the know from other saint supporters.

I just hope we dont get the Petracca pick traded from right in front of us.

  On 21/09/2014 at 12:19, Demon 16 said:

The problem with trying to do another deal with GWS is that they won't be looking at McCartin or Wright - so if Petracca and Brayshaw go at 1 and 2, I don't think they'll have a lot of incentive to trade up as high as pick 3.

Surely we would trade pick 2 so that they would be guaranteed of getting one of them? Anyway, I have complete faith in Roos and Viney to make the right call!

  On 21/09/2014 at 12:19, Demon 16 said:

The problem with trying to do another deal with GWS is that they won't be looking at McCartin or Wright - so if Petracca and Brayshaw go at 1 and 2, I don't think they'll have a lot of incentive to trade up as high as pick 3.

who said they won't with Patton going down with his 2nd knee reco...

The incentive they need is Shiel can walk into the draft next year for nothing if uncontracted.

try to stop a player from leaving if they Want Out... Shiel & Jaksch are meant to want Out, to come home. so they have to trade or lose them for zilch.... but the saints would be interested in both of them as well.

We have to convince the boys to come on down to the 'G'...

  On 21/09/2014 at 12:23, Franky_31 said:

Ive heard from 2 quite different sources that the saints are going for 2 meter Peter. If not him they are trading for a tall forward i.e. Cameron.

Both the sources Ive heard from are believed to be in the know from other saint supporters.

I just hope we dont get the Petracca pick traded from right in front of us.

I feel like I'd rather Brayshaw of the 2 mids top of this draft, but still prefer a Shiel deal.

Happy enough with the saints spending P-1+ for Cameron... which most likely gives Petracca to GWS, who inturn have the loss of a mid covered. if petracca is short of breath it may take him some time to get up to fitness, losing weight doing so.

I think the key is that in AFL, like in many things, you become a product of your environment.

What's the point in taking a supremely talented youngster and bringing him into an environment conducive to fear, doubt, submission and underachievement?

I think we've seen it year after year, drafting impressive talented young men, then scratching our heads 3 years later when they look a shell of themselves.

Obviously this isn't absolute, as you will still get a Nathan Jones coming from a cesspool.

But we need an environment where we instill or reinforce work ethic and strong positive work habits.

All kids who get drafted have talent. But we need an environment that will take a Luke Parker at pick 40 and forge him into a superstar, not another talented also-ran.

We're not there yet. Cross helps, Jones helps, Vince helps, Dawes helps. But we're still short a handful of quality people to lead the way.

I do think we recruited Tyson as much for his strength of character as for his talent.

We need an environment that will guarantee more hits than misses.

Then worry about making sure we recruit the kid at pick 2 who has 3.2% more talent than the kid at pick 10.