I use this term a bit but let me clarify my thinking on it. If a player is 28 plus, I would classify him a pensioner in footy terms and unless he is Fletcher or Harvey he will have limited time at the top level.

If you are a team with a shot at the Premiership then you look at pensioners to fix shortfalls in the list e.g.: Hawthorn with Lake this year and North now looking at DelSanto. These types will cost either in money and/or picks but they can get you over the line.

If you have a list like ours we need to get some quality experience but can't afford to be giving up too much in the way of picks or trade. It cancels us out of some players (Delsanto, Montagna etc) but we still have the option of looking at someone like Chappy. Bringing in Byrnes and Roden didn't add much, if we are going to bring in pensioners they must be the right guys on and off ground.

If we are going to look at picks and trade then we need to be targeting players around 22-25yo. We can't afford to give up too much on pensioners until we have a legitimate shot at the prize.

That's pretty much consistent with what I'm saying. We don't want to pay too high a price but there's going to be room on our list for older, more experienced players, the teenagers and the 22 - 25 year olds and if we can get them in and make the right selections we can enrich our list and give it more quality and depth. Add to that, improvement from greater confidence and better coaching and we should see a major boost in our performances.

I use this term a bit but let me clarify my thinking on it. If a player is 28 plus, I would classify him a pensioner in footy terms and unless he is Fletcher or Harvey he will have limited time at the top level.

If you are a team with a shot at the Premiership then you look at pensioners to fix shortfalls in the list e.g.: Hawthorn with Lake this year and North now looking at DelSanto. These types will cost either in money and/or picks but they can get you over the line.

If you have a list like ours we need to get some quality experience but can't afford to be giving up too much in the way of picks or trade. It cancels us out of some players (Delsanto, Montagna etc) but we still have the option of looking at someone like Chappy. Bringing in Byrnes and Roden didn't add much, if we are going to bring in pensioners they must be the right guys on and off ground.

If we are going to look at picks and trade then we need to be targeting players around 22-25yo. We can't afford to give up too much on pensioners until we have a legitimate shot at the prize.

this is where I think you are wrong.

we have young talent, & we need to add a bit more this year.

in the past 15+ years we have not developed our young very well at all. = culture.

now we are starting to put some real talent onto the bottom end of our list. we have to start to develop our kids in a real way, & our recent past leaders were not the ones to do this, as they were brought up with the same ways of our failures..... hence the AFL has stepped in as they don't trust our high end supporter people to be able to run a footy club as it should be, & successfully.

.... they have suggested strongly a CEO, & onwards from there. & have a stake in the board selections... they are watching us like Sherlock Holmes. thankfully.

& I think we can all see the shape of things are looking bright.

Now recruiting, we have holes in all parts of our list Re needs. (leadership, experience, body strength, spirit & will, & just general AFL winning knowhow)

we don't need any experienced 25Yr + players, who will cost us picks, as we need the picks to further our future talents. we have reasonable leadership in the 24Yr - 25Yr age bracket, & there are some good leaders in our younger age groups to come thru.

but we need Leaders,,,, players who were 'Club Leaders'. That is, they were leaders of culture change, 'winning big games knowhow'. successful biggame winners.

we only need them to help us onfield for between 12 - 24 months, to help our kids transition in the best way possible. this is not designed to get us into the top 8 of the ladder, but it will likely take us somewhere near there.

.... the point is to bring in a strong Ethic of winning, the hardaRssed grit of winning big tight games. & to develop those kids mentally to become their Best...

montagna won't do this... he will only help with some points on the ladder, but we'll be no better off culture wise than we are now. he would give us 2 years & then nothing. no legacy.

get us a Chappy, get us a Sewell, a Malceski ???

& lets get on with sorting this club.

I would get him. I would hope that they delist him to make it easier for him to go where he wants, but if not a minor trade will get it done.

Same with Cross.

The hard part is getting them to want to come, the easy part is bringing them here without affecting any comp or Sylvia.

I would get him. I would hope that they delist him to make it easier for him to go where he wants, but if not a minor trade will get it done.

Same with Cross.

The hard part is getting them to want to come, the easy part is bringing them here without affecting any comp or Sylvia.

Hey, have you forgotten the mantra? "In Roos we trust!"... chant it now, for your own good.

How about we build a team that can win some games. As many have said chappy gives drive and leadership we need in spades, I'd also prefer him in the side that Nicholson, Jetta, Evans etc, and they all got games this year. Happy if he plays 12 games at the G and on in Geelong, maybe he could teach us how to approach it.

If Cats don't sign Chapman themselves (they won't) he will be delisted.

2 years at the right price...Yes Please..If Chapman had played against Whorethorn the result could well have been very different.

He can still play top line, maybe not every week but a forward line/midfield with Chapman involved is still very dangerous.

Even to come on after halftime in certain games.

We are the club who needs him most if the Cats say goodbye.

Our midfield is still in Play School...The Pre season teaching...The on field talk during a game.

He wins BIG games of his own boot...when did the MFC last have a player like that??

Roos and Chapman...2 years could be a great kick start.

this is where I think you are wrong.

we have young talent, & we need to add a bit more this year.

in the past 15+ years we have not developed our young very well at all. = culture.

now we are starting to put some real talent onto the bottom end of our list. we have to start to develop our kids in a real way, & our recent past leaders were not the ones to do this, as they were brought up with the same ways of our failures..... hence the AFL has stepped in as they don't trust our high end supporter people to be able to run a footy club as it should be, & successfully.

.... they have suggested strongly a CEO, & onwards from there. & have a stake in the board selections... they are watching us like Sherlock Holmes. thankfully.

& I think we can all see the shape of things are looking bright.

Now recruiting, we have holes in all parts of our list Re needs. (leadership, experience, body strength, spirit & will, & just general AFL winning knowhow)

we don't need any experienced 25Yr + players, who will cost us picks, as we need the picks to further our future talents. we have reasonable leadership in the 24Yr - 25Yr age bracket, & there are some good leaders in our younger age groups to come thru.

but we need Leaders,,,, players who were 'Club Leaders'. That is, they were leaders of culture change, 'winning big games knowhow'. successful biggame winners.

we only need them to help us onfield for between 12 - 24 months, to help our kids transition in the best way possible. this is not designed to get us into the top 8 of the ladder, but it will likely take us somewhere near there.

.... the point is to bring in a strong Ethic of winning, the hardaRssed grit of winning big tight games. & to develop those kids mentally to become their Best...

montagna won't do this... he will only help with some points on the ladder, but we'll be no better off culture wise than we are now. he would give us 2 years & then nothing. no legacy.

get us a Chappy, get us a Sewell, a Malceski ???

& lets get on with sorting this club.

...um, I think you are agreeing with me 'dee-luded', you tell me this is where you think I'm wrong then go on and make most of the points I made in my post.

...um, I think you are agreeing with me 'dee-luded', you tell me this is where you think I'm wrong then go on and make most of the points I made in my post.

are sorry rjay , you completely lost me in the first couple of lines Re the pensioners comments, thinking you meant they wouldn't cut it for us in our situation.

I neglected to read through thoroughly.. to much post reading fatigue I guess.

I need some fresh air & exercise. freshen the mind.

*We are in agreement...

Certainly not deluded DL

Rj and yourself present very coherent ataements to indicate why we could add Chappy and Cross to our mix

Contract them wisely on performance not tied to game statistics only and we could see a great improvement

are sorry rjay , you completely lost me in the first couple of lines Re the pensioners comments, thinking you meant they wouldn't cut it for us in our situation.

I neglected to read through thoroughly.. to much post reading fatigue I guess.

I need some fresh air & exercise. freshen the mind.

*We are in agreement...

Cheers 'dee-luded'.

1 x 1-year deal for 1 of Chappy or Cross sits about right with our needs at present.

Not both players.

No huge, luring salary.

No 2 year contract.

No promises.

= win for MFC.

1 x 1-year deal for 1 of Chappy or Cross sits about right with our needs at present.

Not both players.

No huge, luring salary.

No 2 year contract.

No promises.

= win for MFC.

= getting no-one to the MFC

Your kidding right?

Chappy's older than me!!!

We need to bring in under utilised players at the right age a la Kennedy to the Swans,Burgoyne to the Hawks,Ball to the Pies,Goddard to the Bombres

See what i'm sayin?

No thanks

The Cats offered Chaapy a 10 game contract for '14 and they know his body better than anyone.

Would have Chappy at Melbourne in a heartbeat, even at 31 years of age. A gun.

We just wasted a complete drafting, on Pedersen, Dawes, Byrnes, Rodan and Gillies, set the club back another two years, if that is possible, wouldn't surprise me if they go for Chappy, Dids, Hunt, Jolly and Cross, anything is possible at the MFC.

Set the club back 2 years? Hyperbole.

If we are to get either Cross or Chapman, we'll want them to stay for 2 years at least anyway.

When we have guys on the list like Pedersen, Dunn and Nicholson still to be shed, we can always find room for Cross and/or Chapman.

Playing hardball with those 2 will result in not getting them, and we'll be worse off for it.

A single common denominator with the good young AFL clubs, Port, Tigers and Dogs, they have not collected "Has Beens and Dead Beats", Yes some deft recruiting in Monfries, Maric and possibly Cramer.

Chappy and Cross have been delisted by better clubs than us, so maybe we should just take the hard lesson rather than just continuing the same old mistakes every year.

My question mark with Chappy is his passion. Here's a guy who could lift himself and his teamates by desparation and a strength of will that flowed from his commitment to his club. I suspect he will always be a cat at heart and wonder whether he could lift himself and others in the same way at a new club.

Your kidding right?

Chappy's older than me!!!

We need to bring in under utilised players at the right age a la Kennedy to the Swans,Burgoyne to the Hawks,Ball to the Pies,Goddard to the Bombres

See what i'm sayin?

No thanks

In an ideal world yes, but we're not in that position yet and don't have that kind of pull yet. We can't keep throwing cash at everyone ala our two key forwards who are always injured. Chappy for two year, even at 15 games a year would offer more than some players who have clogged this list as if it's their right. I could mention some names but we all know who they are.

Edited September 30, 201311 yr by Al's Demons

The Cats offered Chaapy a 10 game contract for '14 and they know his body better than anyone.

They are full-on into rejig with youth. the writing is on the walls for them... bring the kids thru quick & now or risk losing some. they will fall off the finals pace if they keep all 4 or 5 of they're over 30's.

the big games showed they have too many over 30 to contest against the other finalists, so they have to bring more youth thru now.

Chappy is being reportedly chased by the Pies, Tiges, & a couple of others I read earlier.

& for us, he doesn't have to play all games, as his main role apart from playing, would be to lead, teach, & mentor. To impart his knowhow & attitudes on our young.

A single common denominator with the good young AFL clubs, Port, Tigers and Dogs, they have not collected "Has Beens and Dead Beats", ...

the single difference between us and those clubs is that they already had some senior players worth their sale, and in particular, some midfielders capable of playing AFL footy.

We don't.

Hearing the bombers are pretty keen on him, would be pretty happy if we swooped in and landed him first though.

My question mark with Chappy is his passion. Here's a guy who could lift himself and his teamates by desparation and a strength of will that flowed from his commitment to his club. I suspect he will always be a cat at heart and wonder whether he could lift himself and others in the same way at a new club.

you could ask the same thing about Roos.

you could ask about Malthouse, or about Parkin.

I think a player would know if he has the passion to go thru all the preseasons to continue... If he's prepared to move his home interstate, then I think he knows.