"Tanking"

[binman 42,618]

Biggest issue is tanking is not defined in AFL rules,We

We do have an official definition of tanking. The AFL CEO was explicit in his definition and left no room for confusion. Until it is codified his definition stands as the official AFL definition of tanking.

I don't understand all the semantic posturing over this issue. We have a definition. Perhaps if people want to have a semantics or ethics discussion they could open a thread called 'Lets have fun and define tanking'.

The only question that for me is worth debating and or discussing in this thread (which is - or was - about the outcomes of the AFL investigation and possible sanctions) is did we tank according to the official definition? The answer is no. The investigation appears to have found absolutely no evidence we did. Nothing, nada, zip. McClardy made that clear in his intelligent and to the point response to CW's silliness.

We did not tank.

Edited February 18, 2013 by binman

[Demon Forever 219]

Why isn't this article coming up?

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/more-news/dean-bailey-and-chris-connolly-will-be-forced-to-serve-full-term-of-bans-for-their-roles-in-melbourne-tanking-saga/story-e6frf9jf-1226580702476

[Hannibal 5,814]

I hope you don't see me as gutless, disingenuous, or just plain stupid. I actually agree with your post.

Given that we both agree that there is no credible evidence that we tanked, are you as angry and bewildered as me that we face sanctions?

No. There are reasons why we're in the position we're in and I've mentioned them before - media storm, etc. Obvious I would have thought. And I understand why we're being investigated and others aren't - the AFL never wanted this anyway. I understand the trail of events. I don't think it's overly fair, but I'm not affronted by it. That WOULD be arrogant. This was Anderson's doing.

I've just never felt it could be proved, unless we were mind-bogglingly stupid.

EDIT: I answered too quickly. Yes, I agree that we shouldn't face sanctions and have all the way along. But if there are no draft penalties I consider that a MASSIVE win.

Edited February 18, 2013 by Ben-Hur

[Hannibal 5,814]

salaam, bwana!!

(grovels in amazed admiration).

As you should.

Accepted.

[Hannibal 5,814]

All those that said Demetriou would make the decision. Where are you now ?

[Alf Stewart 73]

from the herald scum

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/dean-bailey-and-chris-connolly-will-be-forced-to-serve-full-term-of-bans-for-their-roles-in-melbourne-tanking-saga/story-fnelctok-1226580702476

FORMER Melbourne coach Dean Bailey
and his football lieutenant Chris Connolly will be forced to serve the
full term of bans for tanking.

The Herald Sun last night confirmed the AFL had rejected a bid to have part of their sentences suspended.

Bailey
and Connolly will each be barred from working in the AFL for several
months. The pair will become the face of tanking with Melbourne chief
executive Cameron Schwab appearing to have escaped sanction in the
seven-month probe.

The AFL Commission considered a report on the
investigation into Melbourne's 2009 season at a meeting yesterday.
Melbourne will be fined about $500,000 - but has been spared the loss of
draft picks or premiership points.

Despite Melbourne's protests, it is believed the AFL have found the Demons were guilty of deliberately manipulating results.

[McQueen 17,864]

Why isn't this article coming up?

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/more-news/dean-bailey-and-chris-connolly-will-be-forced-to-serve-full-term-of-bans-for-their-roles-in-melbourne-tanking-saga/story-e6frf9jf-1226580702476

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport/afl/dean-bailey-and-chris-connolly-will-be-forced-to-serve-full-term-of-bans-for-their-roles-in-melbourne-tanking-saga/story-e6freck3-1226580702476

[darkhorse72 1,902]

Now to see our official response?

[Sir Why You Little 36,958]

"Gentlemen....Start your engines..."

[bing181 9,193]

New thread?

[hoopla 418]

from the herald scum

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/dean-bailey-and-chris-connolly-will-be-forced-to-serve-full-term-of-bans-for-their-roles-in-melbourne-tanking-saga/story-fnelctok-1226580702476

FORMER Melbourne coach Dean Bailey

and his football lieutenant Chris Connolly will be forced to serve the

full term of bans for tanking.

The Herald Sun last night confirmed the AFL had rejected a bid to have part of their sentences suspended.

Bailey

and Connolly will each be barred from working in the AFL for several

months. The pair will become the face of tanking with Melbourne chief

executive Cameron Schwab appearing to have escaped sanction in the

seven-month probe.

The AFL Commission considered a report on the

investigation into Melbourne's 2009 season at a meeting yesterday.

Melbourne will be fined about $500,000 - but has been spared the loss of

draft picks or premiership points.

Despite Melbourne's protests, it is believed the AFL have found the Demons were guilty of deliberately manipulating results.

So that's it is it ?

"Manipulating results" is a damning charge - which sounds too much like match fixing to me. How will that effect our sponsors - and our gaming licences? $500k on top of our legal fees is bad enough ---------------- but that is utterly devastating!!

Might just have to be off to court !!

(Well at least Caro didn't break the final story)

[Longsufferingnomore 1,631]

Shite

[Sir Why You Little 36,958]

Do not accept this sham double standard MFC.

Take it higher. Learn to fight...now.

[Jesse Christ 2,884]

We are "guilty of deliberately manipulating results" and the two games that were focused on were the Richmond and Sydney games. First of all what the f? How do you concoct a loss after the siren and how is losing to Sydney- a perennial finalist- manipulating a result?

They have no hard evidence. Where do I donate to the legal fees?

[Longsufferingnomore 1,631]

So much for the AFL trying to frame wording of a charge that would not lead to further financial difficulties ie loss of gaming licence. A charge of "manipulating results" is only going to end up with one thing happening - goodbye gaming licence. Unless - they already know that there will be no investigation!

$500,000 how are we going to come up with that. Do we get an additional $500,000 to what we will receive anyway. I dont think so.

Did Fitzpatrick remove himself from the Commission meeting whilst the issue was discussed. I bet he didn't.

This stinks. I was on the side to not go to court but if the charge is as has been leaked then I dont think we have any other option now. (Unless they have produced written evidence then we are bug$4#ed.)

We thought we had an "annus horribilus" last year. This one is not going to get much better.

WJ you had better do something positive with that info. Anything will help.

[hoopla 418]

We are "guilty of deliberately manipulating results" and the two games that were focused on were the Richmond and Sydney games. First of all what the f? How do you concoct a loss after the siren and how is losing to Sydney- a perennial finalist- manipulating a result?

They have no hard evidence. Where do I donate to the legal fees?

I guess the thrust of the article is the fact that Bailey and Connolly's sentences will not be suspended - so the "manipulation bit" might not be right.I must say I didn't even know that it was a possibility. If it is manipulation we have to fight it !

As you say we weren't good enough to manipulate anything!!

[Longsufferingnomore 1,631]

HS now leading with an article on Brisbane being investigated for match fixing and drug use 2002 - 2009.

John Ralph tweeted in answer to why it seemed MFC were being made a scapegoat and other teams who had tanked were not being looked at and he tweeted "Because they have more former employees ready to dump on them".

We must be able to unearth some unhappy Collingwood, Carlton ........, etc etc former employees.

CW is now reporting that CC faces a 12 month ban from the AFL which the club is hoping to have reduced. She also says that because Bailey was a more cooperative witness that Adelaide is hopeful that a large chunk of a 3 month ban will be suspended. MFC is endeavouring to reduce or have part of the $500000 fine suspended. She did point out that Melbourne is seen as one of the Clubs identified as being in a perilous financial position. Well $500,000 fine is not going to make it any easier.

Well there you go - 12 months for being sarcastic.

[Buffalo 203]

If the only charge is "manipulating results", there are far more blatant examples the league could have investigated...and they are more recent than the games we played in 2009. eg. Fremantle vs Hawthorn in Tassie, GWS dropping half it's side for the Whitfield cup. Almost everyone accepts that the losses Freo and GWS experienced were manipulated. The games MFC lost were very hazy examples. As we all know, we were in front against Richmond at the final siren, and only innaccuracy cost us against Sydney. The only reason we have been targeted is due to the Brock McLean setup and the fact that Angry wanted to be seen as Mr. Integrity...

[bing181 9,193]

If the only charge is "manipulating results", there are far more blatant examples the league could have investigated...

Acknowledged by everyone, but irrelevant now, and not a defense. If there are charges, either we accept them and move on, or we fight them. It's a bit like bad umpiring decisions.

Think we should wait to see what exactly the charges are before getting too far into this.

[Whispering_Jack 29,764]

If what the media is saying is correct the AFL is about to deliver a massive vote of no confidence in Demetriou.

We need to see the charges and the details of the negotiated settlement (if and when it comes) but it would appear that Vlad's credibility is going to be undermined at the very time when he needs it the most in order to deal with the drug issues the code is facing.

Instead, he's going to have to consider tendering his resignation.

[Deefender 231]

The Board needs to send out a message.

We protect our own.

We will go to the wall.

The players in our team will be watching.

[deanox 9,897]

No info yet on what rules we broke or have been charged with.

[CBDees 3,167]

from the herald scum

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/dean-bailey-and-chris-connolly-will-be-forced-to-serve-full-term-of-bans-for-their-roles-in-melbourne-tanking-saga/story-fnelctok-1226580702476

FORMER Melbourne coach Dean Bailey

and his football lieutenant Chris Connolly will be forced to serve the

full term of bans for tanking.

The Herald Sun last night confirmed the AFL had rejected a bid to have part of their sentences suspended.

Bailey

and Connolly will each be barred from working in the AFL for several

months. The pair will become the face of tanking with Melbourne chief

executive Cameron Schwab appearing to have escaped sanction in the

seven-month probe.

The AFL Commission considered a report on the

investigation into Melbourne's 2009 season at a meeting yesterday.

Melbourne will be fined about $500,000 - but has been spared the loss of

draft picks or premiership points.

Despite Melbourne's protests, it is believed the AFL have found the Demons were guilty of deliberately manipulating results.

I do hope that it is finished for us. I am sure that the AFL does too as it now clears their investigators to look into Carlton, Richmond, Collingwood, Fremantle, Brisbane, West Coast and other guilty parties (when they finish with Essendon and the drug issue)

[Dr John Dee 1,057]

Acknowledged by everyone, but irrelevant now, and not a defense. If there are charges, either we accept them and move on, or we fight them. It's a bit like bad umpiring decisions.

Think we should wait to see what exactly the charges are before getting too far into this.

No, it's not a defence and never has been. But it's a pretty persuasive reason for extending investigations. Given the way things are going, with the drugs issue and now Brisbane, the only people who are going to need a defence soon are the AFL and showing some competence with how they go about things might actually strike them as a good idea.

[Redleg 40,815]

If this is the official result and it is not a negotiated one, then we weren't given a hearing under the rules of Natural Justice. That would take a Court less than a day to throw out. Is this the plan? Charge us and let a Court decide.

Also as I posted previously have the Commission members even read the report?