do we get picks 1, 2 and 3 for last??? lol wow

The difference is a different recruitment dept, and a coaching/development structure designed to bring players on. We also have a fitness guru who can help develop individuals fitness. This is why players like Trengove have struggled this year. With the amount of work being put into past high draft picks and the possibiity of 1,2 11 and Viney I have more faith the club will develop a few stars and some excellent A grade players

The issues of the past with recruitment and development cannot be compared. We are a different club to last year

We certainly are "a different club to last year" - we are even worse.

We won't get a priority pick, so it will be 1, 2, 12ish and Viney.

Give it time Bitter. It may not work out but at least we have a greater opportunity with better personal and greater resources.

I don't know if I can be bothered with this if we win the spoon this year. We will move a couple of positions up the draft order but will lose 5,000 in membership and many could have been members will simply stop caring. No kid will want to barrack for Melbourne and we will lose another generation of supporters.

I honestly believe that whatever damage to our brand next year has been done. If we succeed in landing another "big fish" that will give us positive press and who knows maybe we will actually catch a break rather than have players break down.

I don't want us to finish last and get the wooden spoon, but I don't think it will be as doom and gloom as you think. Children are the most fickle fans of all, we start winning and they will be back.

Next year we will still have more members than north, dogs, and possibly st Kilda.

I honestly believe that whatever damage to our brand next year has been done. If we succeed in landing another "big fish" that will give us positive press and who knows maybe we will actually catch a break rather than have players break down.

I don't want us to finish last and get the wooden spoon, but I don't think it will be as doom and gloom as you think. Children are the most fickle fans of all, we start winning and they will be back.

Next year we will still have more members than north, dogs, and possibly st Kilda.

Pates about time someone talked sense. The poor year affects this years revenue and potentially signature of sponsors or players for next year. The people that [censored] and moan they are sick of it will be back on board after a key signing or some early promise next year. This year has no impact on memberships for the future.

What I tend to think is that first pick just guarantees you get a first pick of the draft field - you still need to choose wisely, provide an environment that maximises the player's development and provide a culture that lifts them to their potential. I doubt the demons of the past 7 years or so have provided any of those.

Its interesting that Port and the doggies have avoided much media scrutiny this year because we just cant keep out of the headlines.

Sheedy just proved his point, he is smiling in the box because he is justified.

Sheedy is sending a sign to the Melbourne Football Club right at this moment.

This is a great day in the life of Kevin Sheedy.

Sheedy had a chance to dio that when we played them; but apart from that who on here gives a [censored] about him?

$cully finished with 20 disposals so he must have had some last quarter.

I think it's out of the question that we'll be tanking tomorrow although it won't be an easy game to win come what may. The Suns did beat Richmond a few weeks ago and the Tigers have comfortably beaten us twice this year.

What we need tomorrow is a good start because, as GCS showed against the Tiges and GWS showed against Port Adelaide, you simply can't give away a big start to anyone, not even the new franchise teams.

10 disposals in the last quarter the first of which was a pass across the back 50 which went straight to a Port player who kicked a goal.

Its interesting that Port and the doggies have avoided much media scrutiny this year because we just cant keep out of the headlines.

I was discussing that today. We came to the conclusion no one cares about those 2 teams, or at least not as much as they care about us. Quite heart warming, really.

tired of spoons

can we have a fork or a knife for a change

hang on...everyone is lining up to fork us and knife us so maybe its spoons after all

Picks 1 & 2, would do more for memberships than, a win over GWS or Gold Coast......

What would pick 1 be worth on the Trade table?

What would pick 1 be worth on the Trade table?

Significantly less than it would be worth at the draft table.

Sheedy had a chance to dio that when we played them; but apart from that who on here gives a [censored] about him?

Senile sees this as justice, thats why he was smiling, its a game to Senile.

He will bid on Viney, just to send a message to us - you shouldn't of underestimated me.

Senile doesn't lose mind games.

I sure as hell hope GWS end up above us come the end of season.

I don't know if I can be bothered with this if we win the spoon this year. We will move a couple of positions up the draft order but will lose 5,000 in membership and many could have been members will simply stop caring. No kid will want to barrack for Melbourne and we will lose another generation of supporters.

I see your point, Utah, but not convinced you're right.

There are many criteria that dictate whether supporters do, or don't, sign on. Poor results are a turn off, for sure, but high draft picks and prospective future stars are a huge turn on for many fans. Most people will be making their decisions on buying memberships starting around pre-xmas (not long after the draft), then again during the NAB Cup and the first few rounds of the real thing.

What's more likely to be on fans' minds at those times?

- The distant memory of a couple of embarrassing losses at the end of an embarrassing season, or the onslaught of media coverage we will be receiving when there is little else to talk about other than our draft pickups (1, 2, 12 and Jack Viney)?

- That we lost to the franchise sides (just like RIchmond and Port), or Jack Viney (and maybe some of our other high picks) showing glimpses of future stardom in the NAB Cup?

Sure, our bad results this season will be a turn off for some, but those people have probably already lost faith after the year we've had so far. A couple of wins against the franchise sides is hardly going to be much of a fillip for those types of supporters. Luckily, they will be more that offset by those signing on to see the development of Watts, Trengove, Grimes, Howe, McDonald etc, the return of Clark to dominating at FF, and the debuts of 1, 2, 12 and Viney.

Jack Viney complicates this issue, just as the priority pick did in 2009.

For mine:

Picks #1, #2, Viney, PSD pick #1, big losing culture > Viney, #4, #23, two meaningless victories, lesser losing culture, PSD #3

That's it in a nutshell.

This thread might be premature but with GWS leading Port by 7 goals, the landscape changes dramatically:

Assuming GWS win, and

GC beat Melbourne

GC beat GWS

GWS beat Melbourne

Then the spoon is ours.

The thought sickens me in the guts

BUT

With picks 1, 2, Viney, another high pick and a star free agent like Cloke- it's last chance saloon for the Dees to turn this thing around.

I agree that this is a serious possibility. I have actually tipped against us this round. The fact is that GC have us covered on two thirds of the ground right now. Their midfield leaves ours for dead and they actually have forwards who are able to get on the ground, while we are struggling to put together a makeshift group out of spare tall defenders and midfielders who have shown that they know where the sticks are. I also think that they will kill us in the ruck.

It is also very possible that GC will beat GWS. It'd basically a coin toss as to which of them turns up to play on the day.

As for us travelling and winning, it's not something that we've shown a great knack for, is it? If GWS play like they did today, they are a chance to take us.

Personally, I think that while the above scenario sucks, nobody can realistically expect us to compete with an injury list like ours, and in particular with the lack of forwards we've suffered. I am inclined to suck it up, take whatever picks we wind up getting and hope that things click over the summer and we shock the hell out of people next year.

They will 100% bid on Viney.

Greene is GWS most dominant player - he isn't fit to tie Vineys bootlace and would've definately told Senile this.

GC need Viney more than anyone, even us!

Don't think I could disagree with this post more. Absolute tosh!

So, you are saying, with absolute 100% certainty, that GC will happily risk handing GWS or us (depending on the final ladder position) a free pick at the number 1 or 2 rated player, just to grab Jack Viney (considered somewhere between 5 and 12 by most punters)? 100%?

So many conflicting likes coz I'm damned if I know

I like winning but know that you cant win all the time

an honourable loss or an unlucky loss can be acceptable

Tanking is so foreign to me that its difficult to comprehend but I have deliberatley let a game slip to recover and win a match.

I have also let one slip and lost

but it wasnt because I wasnt trying I just got Beat.

Not sure happy to read the thoughts and add to my likes

(see the culture thread)

It may persuade me in some way

I'm more worried about our developing of players than our drafting.

This is the truth of our situation. Inability to develop players. Lots of conjecture as to the cause but the evidence is plain to see,

Senile sees this as justice, thats why he was smiling, its a game to Senile.

He will bid on Viney, just to send a message to us - you shouldn't of underestimated me.

Senile doesn't lose mind games.

I sure as hell hope GWS end up above us come the end of season.

there is nothing more certain. He hates us and has stuck his nose in at every opprtunity. "I wouldn't tank if I was at melbourne" He can't let it go and will certainly bid for Viney. There is no way he would bid for Daniher like that even though he is shitty with Ess.

This is the truth of our situation. Inability to develop players. Lots of conjecture as to the cause but the evidence is plain to see,

I share your concern Jnr..

The major problem is almost no good senior players, they help young players.

But I do think that a number of our recent selections are as good as they will get unfortunately.

IMO we need to draft a couple of good senior players.

They don't have to be Brownlow medallists just players that can cut it against the better sides

And help the younger guys develop

I love how many people here are talking about this as though it's some kind of moral decision the club has to make between now and the end of the year. Not all posters, but enough to raise an eyebrow.

Truth is, we are terrible enough for the OP scenario to pan out even if we put in 100% every week. And thats a deeply embarrassing state of affairs, injuries or not

the wooden spoon will not be ours

We could easily rise to 15Th ( Redleg are you reading this )

Two more wins and the Dogs will lose all four. GWS are a win and we will beat Freo in the last game with a few players back.

We would squeeze into 15th. by percentage