RIVVO'S BOOTLACES

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,799]

Were other Demonlanders as disappointed as I was in Jared Rivers when he naively spent half a minute tightening his laces when awarded 50 metres?

By the time he'd fiddled with his boots, then jogged casually up to the new mark, Hawthorn had its defensive zone perfectly organised. Predictably, the ball rebounded swiftly from our half-forward line to become a vital goal to them.

He should have either ignored the laces(they didn't appear to be flapping around from where I sat) or kicked off his boot, and run like hell to the new mark.

I've mentioned before in a post about "one percenters", that players should ALWAYS run FLAT OUT to the new mark when they get 50metres(except of course when they are going to be in range of the goals), to try to catch opposing defenders out of position. In fact I'd call it a "two percenter!"

The incident on Sunday illustrated my point succinctly.

[robbo24 66]

He's not the best kick even with his boots tied up. I'd prefer to see him try and hit a target with his laces done.

[H_T 3,047]

To tell you the truth, I was more annoyed at Brad Green marking 1 metre out from a kick from Colin Sylvia 55m out on the run that was about to sail through. All he had to do was shepherd it through - yet even that wasn't required.

Tomorrow's leaders will hopefully know better.

As for Rivers bootlaces being thread worthy, are you serious ?

Just out of interest. Where were you sitting JJC ?

[titan_uranus 25,020]

To tell you the truth, I was more annoyed at Brad Green marking 1 metre out from a kick from Colin Sylvia 55m out on the run that was about to sail through. All he had to do was shepherd it through - yet even that wasn't required.

Tomorrow's leaders will hopefully know better.

As for Rivers bootlaces being thread worthy, are you serious ?

Just out of interest. Where were you sitting JJC ?

I'm pretty sure Green lost his orientation and feared he was running towards the behinds, not the goals. That may be giving him the benefit of the doubt, though.

Rivers' decision to tie his bootlaces up would be coming under intense scrutiny if it had happened when the game was tight (or if we had a chance of winning).

[H_T 3,047]

'Lost his orientation ?', c'mon titan. We're talking Brad Green here.

[Demon16 69]

While on the subject of 1%ers, if we call them that, why do guys who take kicks for goal after the siren outside their distance, still try a drop punt? Even I knew James Strauss had no chance of making the distance after the half-time siren, so there is a fair chance he knew it too. Try a Torp......nothing to lose.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

'Lost his orientation ?', c'mon titan. We're talking Brad Green here.

If he was running towards goal but looking over his shoulder at the ball it's entirely possible he wasn't sure exactly of where he was and took the mark just to be sure.

It's not like he was standing in the goal square, had time, and chose to mark a certain goal.

[nutbean 8,838]

If he was running towards goal but looking over his shoulder at the ball it's entirely possible he wasn't sure exactly of where he was and took the mark just to be sure.

It's not like he was standing in the goal square, had time, and chose to mark a certain goal.

BOD - benefit of the doubt - if you are unsure and can mark the ball - mark the ball

[old55 23,595]

To tell you the truth, I was more annoyed at Brad Green marking 1 metre out from a kick from Colin Sylvia 55m out on the run that was about to sail through. All he had to do was shepherd it through - yet even that wasn't required.

Green went off at Bate for colliding with him for a ground ball when he was running to goal and Bate was coming out - maybe fair enough. But then needlessly flew front-on for a mark later when Petterd clearly had the sit 20m out - Pettered didn't take the mark. It hasn't been Brad's best year.

[beelzebub 23,378]

Were other Demonlanders as disappointed as I was in Jared Rivers when he naively spent half a minute tightening his laces when awarded 50 metres?

By the time he'd fiddled with his boots, then jogged casually up to the new mark, Hawthorn had its defensive zone perfectly organised. Predictably, the ball rebounded swiftly from our half-forward line to become a vital goal to them.

He should have either ignored the laces(they didn't appear to be flapping around from where I sat) or kicked off his boot, and run like hell to the new mark.

I've mentioned before in a post about "one percenters", that players should ALWAYS run FLAT OUT to the new mark when they get 50metres(except of course when they are going to be in range of the goals), to try to catch opposing defenders out of position. In fact I'd call it a "two percenter!"

The incident on Sunday illustrated my point succinctly.

His defensive work ( ie thats reactive ) is often very good. His decision making processes with ball , wellllll..............................

[PeterJames 46]

While it may look a little selfish from green as the ball was clearly going through and it would have been a massive team lifter you always have to make sure of the goal. Mark it put it through move on.

[Guest Thomo]

While it may look a little selfish from green as the ball was clearly going through and it would have been a massive team lifter you always have to make sure of the goal. Mark it put it through move on.

Agree.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Were other Demonlanders as disappointed as I was in Jared Rivers when he naively spent half a minute tightening his laces when awarded 50 metres?

Glad I am not the only one who noticed, was not the smartest move.

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,799]

As for Rivers bootlaces being thread worthy, are you serious ?

Just out of interest. Where were you sitting JJC ?

Edited July 27, 2011 by JUMPING JACK CLENNETT

[bush demon 2,041]

The answer is he prob. can't kick a torp anyway, he's from the generation of whitebread drop-punts. ps jared rivers played a good game and took a lot of big marks.

[dee-luded 2,959]

To tell you the truth, I was more annoyed at Brad Green marking 1 metre out from a kick from Colin Sylvia 55m out on the run that was about to sail through. All he had to do was shepherd it through - yet even that wasn't required.

Tomorrow's leaders will hopefully know better.

As for Rivers bootlaces being thread worthy, are you serious ?

Just out of interest. Where were you sitting JJC ?

That was close by me where that happened. I am normally @ Greeny for being selfish, but this was an honest mistake on his part & not self centered. He was running in to goal to meet the ball at a slight angle with the ball coming from over his shoulder. He couldn't be sure if there was a defender coming in from his blind side to punch or outmark him, so in the scheme of this occasion, he was actually showing courage & IMO trying to be 'Team' oriented.

He finished with a 'sorry', waive to I think Sylv'.

[dee-luded 2,959]

If he was running towards goal but looking over his shoulder at the ball it's entirely possible he wasn't sure exactly of where he was and took the mark just to be sure.

It's not like he was standing in the goal square, had time, and chose to mark a certain goal.

Yep, that's how I read it as well. Initially I was annoyed then I saw him make amends with the player & i thought it through again.

[bjDee 1,249]

That was close by me where that happened. I am normally @ Greeny for being selfish, but this was an honest mistake on his part & not self centered. He was running in to goal to meet the ball at a slight angle with the ball coming from over his shoulder. He couldn't be sure if there was a defender coming in from his blind side to punch or outmark him, so in the scheme of this occasion, he was actually showing courage & IMO trying to be 'Team' oriented.

He finished with a 'sorry', waive to I think Sylv'.

It happended below where I was sitting and that't exactly as I saw it. Had his eyes on the ball all the way. Did the right thing.

[H_T 3,047]

I'm prepared to give Green the benefit of the doubt, as I said I was more disappointed in that than Rivvo's bootlaces. Besides, Green putting his hand up to Sylvia maybe some sort of recognition of the situation. Don't you think ?

Maybe Rivers giving his bootlaces a quick fix was a 1% in itself JJC, for proper execution. God forgive him if it caused a clanger or worse turnover/goal ! Btw, it was only several seconds, "half a minute" is one hell of a stretch. And by the time he got up and ran into position the man on the mark had just got to the umps position for the mark. Over reaction IMO.

old55 - spot on regarding Green's spoiling of Petterd when he had the sit. Bad day indeed I thought. So did the MFC and HFC supporters around me. Fwiw they were of the same opinion on the Sylvia kick too.

And Strauss backed himself to hit the sweet spot, just like Ballantyne did for Freo after the siren.

PS. JJC - If you were front row of the top level of the Members stand and you could observe that Rivers laces weren't flapping around from the Punt Rd end backline, you must eat 48 carrots a day under the sun (high levels of Vitamin D). I was at the Punt Rd end on this occassion with my best mate (hawks fan) in the pocket (closer mind you) and I couldn't tell.

You must be a Where's Wally champ.

Trivial at best.

[The Chazz 4,077]

I'm prepared to give Green the benefit of the doubt, as I said I was more disappointed in that than Rivvo's bootlaces. Besides, Green putting his hand up to Sylvia maybe some sort of recognition of the situation. Don't you think ?Maybe Rivers giving his bootlaces a quick fix was a 1% in itself JJC, for proper execution. God forgive him if it caused a clanger or worse turnover/goal ! Btw, it was only several seconds, "half a minute" is one hell of a stretch. And by the time he got up and ran into position the man on the mark had just got to the umps position for the mark. Over reaction IMO.

old55 - spot on regarding Green's spoiling of Petterd when he had the sit. Bad day indeed I thought. So did the MFC and HFC supporters around me. Fwiw they were of the same opinion on the Sylvia kick too.

And Strauss backed himself to hit the sweet spot, just like Ballantyne did for Freo after the siren.

PS. JJC - If you were front row of the top level of the Members stand and you could observe that Rivers laces weren't flapping around from the Punt Rd end backline, you must eat 48 carrots a day under the sun (high levels of Vitamin D). I was at the Punt Rd end on this occassion with my best mate (hawks fan) in the pocket (closer mind you) and I couldn't tell.

You must be a Where's Wally champ.

Trivial at best.

Gee HT, you hate people disagreeing with you! The gesture from Green to Sylvia would most likely have been Greeny acknowledging that if he left it it would have been a goal, but he wasn't 100% at the time and did the team thing (ie ensuring a mark was taken deep forward).

The issue regarding Rivers should be more about his form and his leadership rather than his bootlaces. I think the past month hasn't seen Jared play his best football, and think that he has gone through on this site quite unscathed compared to others. For a leader, his body language is terrible at times, mainly when he is getting a smashing from his opponent, which is a standard front-runner quality.

Some could argue that Frawley's body language wasn't great at times, but his was more out of frustration when our loose man (Watts in one instance), didn't get in the right position.

The difference between Frawley and Rivers is that Rivers gives up too easily, and the opposition can tell that he has.

[H_T 3,047]

Gee HT, you hate people disagreeing with you!

You love disagreeing with me !

[The Chazz 4,077]

You love disagreeing with me !

Haha, it's not like that at all! You just see things differently to me, I can't help that!!!

To be honest, my first comment when I saw Green take that mark was "hungry". Then after about 10 seconds, I thought that in the same situation, I'd do the same thing. When you're running back with the flight of the ball, and you are fully focused on it like what he was, there is always that chance of misreading where it is heading. While it would've looked great on the highlights reel if Sylvia kicked it, it was better to make sure of it and that's exactly what Green did. The highlights reel would've looked pretty bad if Greeny had've let it go and found that it was a point!

Do you agree about Rivers' form though?

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,799]

"if you could observe that Rivers laces weren't flapping around from the Punt Rd end backline, you must eat 48 carrots a day under the sun (high levels of Vitamin D). I was at the Punt Rd end on this occassion with my best mate (hawks fan) in the pocket (closer mind you) and I couldn't tell."

Trivial at best.

[H_T 3,047]

Haha, it's not like that at all! You just see things differently to me, I can't help that!!!

To be honest, my first comment when I saw Green take that mark was "hungry". Then after about 10 seconds, I thought that in the same situation, I'd do the same thing. When you're running back with the flight of the ball, and you are fully focused on it like what he was, there is always that chance of misreading where it is heading. While it would've looked great on the highlights reel if Sylvia kicked it, it was better to make sure of it and that's exactly what Green did. The highlights reel would've looked pretty bad if Greeny had've let it go and found that it was a point!

Do you agree about Rivers' form though?

As I've already said, I'm prepared to give Green the benefit of the doubt.

On Rivers, in the last month we've played Haw, Port, Bye, Dogs and Tigers. He played well against the Tigers, as did most, against Dogs we got killed in the middle and everywhere and I'm having trouble recalling exactly what he'd done. Up in Darwin I thought he did nothing particularly special in tough conditions - but who really did ?

Against the Hawks I saw him make two errors of judgement. One where he should have applied more pressure - but so too should have Jamar and Green who were in the same vicinity, the other he should have spoiled Buddy instead of opting for the mark. But, he did spoil well, he had 11 x 1%'s, more than double the next teammate in line and took 9 marks, more than any other. Nothing flash, but serviceable.

Overall, I think he's had one of his best seasons, particularly the first half of the season, even though the last month probably isn't something to write home about. I think Frawley's last month has been much better and the bloke we came to love in 2010 has re-appeared after a average first half of the year where he has gradually re-gained confidence in his peck.

Finally, I think there hasn't been much of a concern with Jared, he has done his job very well overall, but according to some a pair of shoelaces is absolutely diabolical.

[H_T 3,047]

More trivia, HT(though it is with trepidation that I contradict you!), you don't get Vitamin D from carrots(it's Vit A), and you'll get cataracts from sitting in the sun! (but you'll get strong bones,too!)

The carrot is an herbaceous plant containing about 87% water, rich in mineral salts and vitamins (B,C,D,E).

- reference: http://www.carrotmuseum.co.uk/nutrition.html

We'll agree to disagree!

Ok.