Dean Bailey wrestling his Demons

[beelzebub 23,347]

My brother is a man of courage and conviction, but I wouldn't have him coaching Melbourne in a month of Sundays (and he has played about 200 games of state league football)

We all know Bailey can be very articulate, non-emotional and logical. You only have to remember his presentation in the original coach selections. But do all these nice admirable personal attributes make a good premiership-capable coach?

I don't know and I do agree that just at this moment it is still too early to pass judgement, but I'm not swayed by a sentimental journalistic piece of political correctness in the Hun.

Oh how such obvious observation will be missed by many....

A bit early possibly to pass judgement...but certainly an appropriate juncture to judge

[beelzebub 23,347]

Hindsight may never have won the game that was being reflected upon, but it sure as hell increases the chances of winning games in the future! I like Bailey's, as you call it, mantra... it shows he is willing to admit to his mistakes and learn from them going ahead.

Its only benefit is if it prompts to act in the moment the next time. If he doesnt ( act upon whatever needs acting ) then its all words.

If words is saying, then add saying to hindsight as to things that dont win you matches...Only DOING does...well gives you the chance.

all goes to Talking the Talk

or Walking the Walk.

we're struglling to crawl

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Its marvellous in a way that he recognises it, uselss in another as that moment has passed, opportunity missed. i.e FAIL !! He subscribes to the notion that he is always learning and that today he will strive to be a better coach than yesterday, his mantra, not made up by me.

Criticising that mantra is ridiculous, the question isn't whether Bailey is perfect? It is whether he is good enough or the best possible coach for the Melbourne Football Club?

If you have stopped learning then chances are that you are much further from perfection than you think.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

Simplistic

It is simplistic, but it is also correct.

[rpfc 28,383]

Hindsight never won a game

Isn't this site full of 'monday quarterbacks' after a loss?

It's a little unfair to hang Bailey with his own words on the Watts to Goddard issue.

He realised he had missed an opportunity that he rarely misses - giving opportunities for younger players to develop.

I have no idea whether he can coach, he hasn't impressed with our lack of a press, and I don't know whether he will be there in October, but he has a pretty good record with developing players.

[beelzebub 23,347]

Isn't this site full of 'monday quarterbacks' after a loss?

It's a little unfair to hang Bailey with his own words on the Watts to Goddard issue.

He realised he had missed an opportunity that he rarely misses - giving opportunities for younger players to develop.

I have no idea whether he can coach, he hasn't impressed with our lack of a press, and I don't know whether he will be there in October, but he has a pretty good record with developing players.

wel two things on this. Firstly unelss youre privy to his iner thinkings you have no idea as to what else hes failed to act on , he does admit to this. Judging by sonme strange matchups and moves over time id say this wasnt a one out occasion. Yes. We all make mistakes. His contribute to us losing. Not sole cause..but contributory.

As to opportunities. Its really a separate issue as to things such as where and on whom Watts played on a day. Also...his hand is forced. Injuries require others to fill void. Impossible to truly know who or when some would have debuted or played otherwise. His forte is supposedly developmental, granted. Personally I wish it was winning games

[PaulRB 6,362]

Its also about the timing of this article. Bailey has come out and earnestly said he is the right man for Melbourne. He's timed this to come out on the Day the team goes into it's hardest month for the year with the highest amount of injuries for the year. Why? To tell his players he believes in them, trusts that they won't humiliate him again and that he intends to be there at the end of the journey they have started together. His resolute belief in and commitment to the rebuild /development strategy he started and his drive to improve, his humility and his obsessive resolve all mark him as a top level coach. All he needs is a patient club and fewer injuries and he may turn out to be a great coach.

Edited May 27, 2011 by PaulRB

[Guest Artie Bucco]

My brother is a man of courage and conviction, but I wouldn't have him coaching Melbourne in a month of Sundays (and he has played about 200 games of state league football)

We all know Bailey can be very articulate, non-emotional and logical. You only have to remember his presentation in the original coach selections. But do all these nice admirable personal attributes make a good premiership-capable coach?

I don't know and I do agree that just at this moment it is still too early to pass judgement, but I'm not swayed by a sentimental journalistic piece of political correctness in the Hun.

Nor should you be.

But some supporters should be, since they have swayed in the opposite direction first as a result of poor results without taking the time to understand why they occur.

The only problem I have, is how can any of us mere supporters be expected to know one way or another?

It is very difficult for us to judge his coaching ability from the outside.

I take comfort in the fact I've not seen Richmond or Freo beat a team by 96 points.

West Coast have a better team than us right now, but they haven't had wins quite as big.

He must be doing something right.

[rpfc 28,383]

Personally I wish it was winning games

If it was - Cam Bruce might have got 3 votes in a 5 point win last Sunday...

I'm glad he wants to win a flag more than he wants to keep his job.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Judging by sonme strange matchups and moves over time id say this wasnt a one out occasion.

Can you provide some examples post 2009 of same? I think he generally gets his match ups right.

Surely you have made mistakes in your job that has lead to your improvement?

[Sir Why You Little 37,033]

Its also about the timing of this article. Bailey has come out and earnestly said he is the right man for Melbourne. He's timed this to come out on the Day the team goes into it's hardest month for the year with the highest amount of injuries for the year. Why? To tell his players he believes in them, trusts that they won't humiliate him again and that he intends to be there at the end of the journey they have started together. His resolute belief in and commitment to the rebuild /development strategy he started and his drive to improve, his humility and his obsessive resolve all mark him as a top level coach. All he needs is a patient club and fewer injuries and he may turn out to be a great coach.

Spot On...Every single coach has to have faith in his selections of the team, and then to those players on the field.

Once the game has started the Coaches hands are mostly tied, particularly now in the modern game with such large rotation numbers, and the major fact that it is not a man on man game anymore.

In the 70's & 80's a positional move could vastly change a result. But now such moves have been diluted. As this season has gone on, i have wondered increasingly what a "match day" coach can really do during each Quarter apart from encourage or to a lesser degree chastise.

Is this why more coaches have been sitting on the interchange bench this year....?

I am guessing, but i think coaching is far more suited to the week days now. Match day for coaches is a matter of tweaking.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

wel two things on this. Firstly unelss youre privy to his iner thinkings you have no idea as to what else hes failed to act on , he does admit to this. Judging by sonme strange matchups and moves over time id say this wasnt a one out occasion. Yes. We all make mistakes. His contribute to us losing. Not sole cause..but contributory.

As to opportunities. Its really a separate issue as to things such as where and on whom Watts played on a day. Also...his hand is forced. Injuries require others to fill void. Impossible to truly know who or when some would have debuted or played otherwise. His forte is supposedly developmental, granted. Personally I wish it was winning games

Who are you kidding?

Saying that not moving Watts onto Goddard is definitively a mistake is incorrect.

He regrets not doing it because it could have won the game for us, not because it definitively would have.

There's every chance Watts could have played terribly in that role and it resulted in a worse loss.

Without his presence elsewhere we could have been beaten soundly in another area.

You don't know.

After any loss a coach would go through things they could have done different that could have changed the result.

[beelzebub 23,347]

Can you provide some examples post 2009 of same? I think he generally gets his match ups right.

Surely you have made mistakes in your job that has lead to your improvement?

1) they occur from game to game.. others see them too. . an eg..and not confined.. shifting Juice ( of all ppl) out of a winning position into a losing one..killing momentum up front..sticks in mind...didnt jot many others down at the time.. my bad.

An element of what you post suggests is without doubt right.. Often he does get matchups right...just take too long switching them. Horse bolted etc. Possibly his worst error is to second quess himself when on many occasions his gut instinct would have been right..but more effective earlier.

2) yep..made mistakes.. even learn form some.. None of which as to do with the Coach of Melbourne and where we currently are.

[beelzebub 23,347]

Who are you kidding?

Saying that not moving Watts onto Goddard is definitively a mistake is incorrect.

He regrets not doing it because it could have won the game for us, not because it definitively would have.

There's every chance Watts could have played terribly in that role and it resulted in a worse loss.

Without his presence elsewhere we could have been beaten soundly in another area.

You don't know.

After any loss a coach would go through things they could have done different that could have changed the result.

What is, is.. You CANNOT argue it wasnt a mistake as Bailey has already ceded to it. You split hairs where none are to be split.

[bing181 9,218]

Elsewhere I've suggested that HE needs to be brave, be bold and be quick . On all three he failed in relation to Watts. This is exactly where an effective coach would have realized the opportunity and made the call.

Really? How do you know what an "effective coach" would have done? Why move a player who's playing well, as Watts was?

This is being taken out of context. Bailey was talking about the work he puts into his own coaching and that of his team. As part of that, he reviews the match-day coaching, including listening to audio tapes from the box. The Watts situation was one that he picked out as something he (they) could learn from.

It's easy to be wise in hindsight. And criticise.

Not to mention if Watts had been moved on Goddard and pantsed, you would have been one of the first here citing it as an example of Bailey's poor decision-making.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

What is, is.. You CANNOT argue it wasnt a mistake as Bailey has already ceded to it. You split hairs where none are to be split.

No, he conceded he had missed an opportunity to possibly change the result.

He didn't say that to put Watts on Goddard would've secured the match for us, and you are foolish to believe so.

[bing181 9,218]

.. shifting Juice ( of all ppl) out of a winning position into a losing one..

Same as the (possible) Watts/Goddard scenario? Juice was needed to have his turn in the ruck, as simple as that. Ruckman resting forward ... new concept for you?

You're like a dog with a bone here, taking one tiny remark out of context from a lengthy interview, and using it to justify a point that wasn't even made.

I'm with some of the other posters, hard to see how that interview shows Bailey in anything other than a favorable light.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

1) they occur from game to game.. others see them too. . an eg..and not confined.. shifting Juice ( of all ppl) out of a winning position into a losing one..killing momentum up front..sticks in mind...didnt jot many others down at the time.. my bad.

An element of what you post suggests is without doubt right.. Often he does get matchups right...just take too long switching them. Horse bolted etc. Possibly his worst error is to second quess himself when on many occasions his gut instinct would have been right..but more effective earlier.

2) yep..made mistakes.. even learn form some.. None of which as to do with the Coach of Melbourne and where we currently are.

The Juice in the ruck move?

It's just as stupid to criticise as it was then.

Juice was performing well up forward, but we needed to rest Martin in the ruck, and Bailey chose to use the bloke who had been selected for just that role.

As coach, is he supposed to have faith in the players to perform the role selected for them, the one they have been performing at Casey?

Or should be worried about shifting them in case they inexplicably return to being completely inept?

Are you sure he wouldn't have ceased having an impact on the game if he had've stayed as a forward?

The problem was with Newton, not the coach.

You deal in gibberish to disguise your lack of a real argument.

[H_T 3,043]

Hindsight may never have won the game that was being reflected upon, but it sure as hell increases the chances of winning games in the future! I like Bailey's, as you call it, mantra... it shows he is willing to admit to his mistakes and learn from them going ahead.

Good call. There is a thing called learning from your mistakes. Insightful article.

I'll find the matchups at tonights game intriguing.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

2) yep..made mistakes.. even learn form some.. None of which as to do with the Coach of Melbourne and where we currently are.

Has everything to do with it seeing as you ridiculed Bailey for having a mantra that I would expect every coach would have, especially the very best.

All Coaches make mistakes.

[DemonOX 8,791]

could have just nailed himself a job for the next couple of years. i am very glad he was prepared to open up like this. Takes Guts to do that.

r u nuts? Matthews is a great mentor to have but hell he would be an excellent coach to have instead.

[Sir Why You Little 37,033]

r u nuts? Matthews is a great mentor to have but hell he would be an excellent coach to have instead.

That is yet to be known actually, and Lethal is far more interested in his Gran Kids these days to be a full time coach.

His mentoring of Bean Dailey is the closest we shall get to Lethal.

[DemonOX 8,791]

That is yet to be known actually, and Lethal is far more interested in his Gran Kids these days to be a full time coach.

His mentoring of Bean Dailey is the closest we shall get to Lethal.

I know he still lives in Carindale (Qld) but you always have hope and as a Dees supporter hope is what we have had for a very, very long time.

Edited May 27, 2011 by DemonOX

[Guest 36DD]

Lets not get too cute or apologistic for him shall we, He himself says he wished he had played Watts on Goddard.. Thats it. You cant extrapolate out ad-infinitum. Bailey wished he had, but missed the opportunity..its irrelevant what the opportunity was for, whether to fil la game day situation or anything longer term..he missed it. He says so himself.

Its marvellous in a way that he recognises it, uselss in another as that moment has passed, opportunity missed. i.e FAIL !! He subscribes to the notion that he is always learning and that today he will strive to be a better coach than yesterday, his mantra, not made up by me.

Hindsight never won a game

You managed to extrapolate that it was a failure on his behalf yet if the man didn't mention it himself you would be none the wiser, i've done a search of your posts and failed to find one where you said that it would have been a good idea to play watts on Goddard. Get your blinkers off mate, and give the bloke a break. One thing in life I cant stand is people who sit on the fence and take pot shots rather than putting it on the line. I too am yet to be convinced whether he can take us even further, though thus far he has ticked most boxes for me. The remaining rounds will determine where to for Dean.

[Nasher 33,613]

Given that on any given match there are infinite possible combinations that coaches don't try, hanging Bailey for ruing not trying one is ridiculous. I'd imagine any coach would have the same thought after every single match (especially a loss) - "hmm, maybe I shouldn't tried XYZ". Given the real time nature of footy I doubt any coach ever walks away thinking they got every single last matchup and every single last tactic right, but one bloke vocalises it and some have him up on the gallows for it.