5 hours ago, Kent said:

I for one have never seen Tracca put in 4 full quarters Kameo king in my view

Devastatingly good for short periods never sustained

Have you seen the 2021 grand final?

5 hours ago, Kent said:

I for one have never seen Tracca put in 4 full quarters Kameo king in my view

Devastatingly good for short periods never sustained

He was (is) a superstar of the comp. True, he is a burst player, but that doesn't mean he's not putting in for the full game. He's a matchwinner in much the same way as Tim Watson was at Essendon. He is a Hall of Famer and we were very fortunate to have him for the bulk of his career.

23 hours ago, 2021 said:

When it comes to this draft, I - who have no idea, have just wasted 12 minutes of my life watching someone who has no idea.

Serves me right.

3 hours ago, Adam The God said:

Have you seen the 2021 grand final?

Yep, and just about everyone went missing for a quarter and a half except for Gus.

So as far as Trac is concerned, he did not play a full 4 quarters that day (he would’ve ended up with 50+ disposals and most possessions ever in a GF if he did).

4 hours ago, Viscount Cardwell said:

We lost 6 games by 11 points or under last year, providing King manages some improvement in game style and kicking better into the forward line

It wasn't because of game style and better kicking that we lost 6 games by under 11 points. If you get that close it comes down to your ability to win games. All in the head and around onfield leadership and smarts.

24 minutes ago, Demon Disciple said:

Yep, and just about everyone went missing for a quarter and a half except for Gus.

So as far as Trac is concerned, he did not play a full 4 quarters that day (he would’ve ended up with 50+ disposals and most possessions ever in a GF if he did).

He still had 8 touches and 2 clearances in the 2nd quarter. Not sure you could argue he went missing. But here we are.

39 minutes ago, Demon Disciple said:

Yep, and just about everyone went missing for a quarter and a half except for Gus.

So as far as Trac is concerned, he did not play a full 4 quarters that day (he would’ve ended up with 50+ disposals and most possessions ever in a GF if he did).

39 and a goal in a grand final is not a 4 quarter effort?

What the..

1 minute ago, dazzledavey36 said:

39 and a goal in a grand final is not a 4 quarter effort?

What the..

Then 38 and 2 in Round 1 the next season.

Utter cope from DD and a few others.

Laughable.

We may be worse so that we can be better.

A few are going to be moping in their Carlton Draughts I think come May.

21 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

39 and a goal in a grand final is not a 4 quarter effort?

What the..

Correction: 39 disposals and TWO goals. He equaled the record for most disposals ever in a grand final. He won a Norm Smith medal in dominant fashion and was good across every quarter.

I know some people don’t like Trac, but let’s not rewrite history and downplay how incredible he was as a player. If his Norm Smith winning performance is deemed no good or not four quarters of footy, then no living Melbourne player is worthy of our respect sadly 🤪

As for the draft, a few phantoms have Dylan Sharp falling to our pick. That would be awesome if it played out and he’d be a direct replacement for Oliver but with leadership and a good head on his shoulders. Fingers crossed as he’ll be an elite midfielder, even if he is very inside.

27 minutes ago, rpfc said:

A few are going to be moping in their Carlton Draughts I think come May.

What's new on neggieland?

I think there a few good players around our picks. Windsor was raked 13/14 in phantoms 2 weeks prior to his draft.

JT will not be worried about a 'reach' if its for the right players.

Not ruling out pick and futures swaps, order changes. Anything can happen.

Xavier Taylor, if he is not taken by Richmond with one of their 2 picks, he is a chance to slide to Melbourne, Essendon looking to draft to strengthen their midfield and may pass on him.

Quality young man, has a great leap and can lock down small and tall forwards, is also an intercept defender.

Reminds me of Miles Bergman.

1 hour ago, Adam The God said:

What's new on neggieland?

Reality

1 hour ago, Lord Travis said:

As for the draft, a few phantoms have Dylan Sharp falling to our pick. That would be awesome if it played out and he’d be a direct replacement for Oliver but with leadership and a good head on his shoulders. Fingers crossed as he’ll be an elite midfielder, even if he is very inside.

If we get Sharp and Josh Lindsay we will have two Sharps and two Lindsays on the list - awkward!

2 minutes ago, Harvey Wallbanger said:

If we get Sharp and Josh Lindsay we will have two Sharps and two Lindsays on the list - awkward!

If we draft both Taylor’s ( which I wouldn’t be unhappy with) and they play a game together being called by BT, we will have two Taylor’s been drafted by a Taylor being called by a Taylor. Confusing

18 hours ago, Adam The God said:

Have you seen the 2021 grand final?

On 02/11/2025 at 09:57, Kent said:

I for one have never seen Tracca put in 4 full quarters Kameo king in my view

Devastatingly good for short periods never sustained

I call Bulltish!!

People who keep using the 'shallow draft' line are more often than not people never sighted in specific player threads on the Trade/draft board and don't get involved in the nitty gritty of the draft. They usually heard the line from someone in the media or on here and paraphrase what they heard, it doesn't come as an original thought from personal research or anything like that. They have little knowledge of the under 18s game.

It's important to call it out for what it is because I think it's giving many people here who want to understand the draft better a disservice.

Over the years I've seen many drafts that were considered shallow where a couple of real gems came in the 3rd and 4th round. In contrast I've seen strong drafts that had major busts in the first round. Whatever your opinion on the quality of the draft, we only have the draft in front of us and in a couple of years you'll see some real 'shallow' drafts. There are kids in this one that can definitely help us.

I've never heard a list manager say that they won't trade for picks because it's a shallow draft. It's total BS and I'm so grateful that the people saying it aren't the list manager because we'd be in the tank.

Sorry, I thought I pressed on pick 7,8 thread but must have picked the Petracca thread… strange

20 hours ago, TRIGON said:

When it comes to this draft, I - who have no idea, have just wasted 12 minutes of my life watching someone who has no idea.

Serves me right.

I've seen a few of this guys videos, and whilst I don't necessarily want to pot a young bloke trying to make some content, his 'analysis' is consistently very poor.

Highly recommend True Footy and Dylan Alexander.

51 minutes ago, layzie said:

It's important to call it out for what it is because I think it's giving many people here who want to understand the draft better a disservice.

Love your work, layzie, but I've come to a different conclusion.

As someone with no connection to the Under 18 comp and a generally below average understanding of the nuances of what makes a good footballer, I want to understand the the draft better. And, over the years (particularly the Jason Taylor period) one thing I've come to realise is that the quality of the draft is a hugely important variable.

The difference between the 2016 and the 2019 draft is massive. The top 20 in one are now mostly B and C graders. The top 20 in the other is almost entirely champions, A-graders and some excellent B+ers.

And then there are drafts that seem to have really good players all the way through. The 2013 draft had an up-and-down top 10 (including Bont and Josh Kelly) and then excellent footballers all the way into the mid 50s: Zach Merrett at 26. Alex Pearce at 37. Jake Kolodjashnij at 41. Barrass at 43. Aliir Aliir at 44. Ben Brown at 47. Byrne-Jones at 52. Sicily at 56.

1 hour ago, layzie said:

Over the years I've seen many drafts that were considered shallow where a couple of real gems came in the 3rd and 4th round. In contrast I've seen strong drafts that had major busts in the first round. Whatever your opinion on the quality of the draft, we only have the draft in front of us and in a couple of years you'll see some real 'shallow' drafts. There are kids in this one that can definitely help us.

All of this is true. But it's also true that if you have a good hand in a bad draft - if the draft in front of you is just comparatively poor - you're at a disadvantage. It's not impossible to find gems - and the skills of your recruiting team are vital - but even the best struggle to find players at the point a draft falls off a cliff. In 2021 we might just have sneaked in before the huge drop. In 2022 I'm not sure we did.

1 hour ago, The Taciturn Demon said:

Love your work, layzie, but I've come to a different conclusion.

As someone with no connection to the Under 18 comp and a generally below average understanding of the nuances of what makes a good footballer, I want to understand the the draft better. And, over the years (particularly the Jason Taylor period) one thing I've come to realise is that the quality of the draft is a hugely important variable.

The difference between the 2016 and the 2019 draft is massive. The top 20 in one are now mostly B and C graders. The top 20 in the other is almost entirely champions, A-graders and some excellent B+ers.

And then there are drafts that seem to have really good players all the way through. The 2013 draft had an up-and-down top 10 (including Bont and Josh Kelly) and then excellent footballers all the way into the mid 50s: Zach Merrett at 26. Alex Pearce at 37. Jake Kolodjashnij at 41. Barrass at 43. Aliir Aliir at 44. Ben Brown at 47. Byrne-Jones at 52. Sicily at 56.

All of this is true. But it's also true that if you have a good hand in a bad draft - if the draft in front of you is just comparatively poor - you're at a disadvantage. It's not impossible to find gems - and the skills of your recruiting team are vital - but even the best struggle to find players at the point a draft falls off a cliff. In 2021 we might just have sneaked in before the huge drop. In 2022 I'm not sure we did.

The main thing that never seems to get remembered are those drafts that were supposed to be chock full of talent or the ones that are supposed to be shallow (not the aftermath comments by those using hindsight, the pre draft comments ... the consensus)

Because it takes a good 5 years to properly evaluate a draft, no one seems to know what was said before the drafts

And in every draft, there are any number of good players picked past the first round

There's a lot of luck involved but there again, there are those recruiters that have the midas touch (like Taylor with non talls)

It's always fascinating to re-evaluate any draft as the order is generally completely different years down the track

Happy to acknowledge that the industry is a lot better at drafting these days but a few unknown areas still exist ... like coachability and whether a player is a self-starter

A manic desire to succeed is another area that is hard to evaluate. Or players who relish physical contact (copping it, rather than dishing it out)

We need to remember that the draftees are still teenagers and certainly not the finished product

Edited 17 hours ago17 hr by Macca

31 minutes ago, Macca said:

The main thing that never seems to get remembered are those drafts that were supposed to be chock full of talent or the ones that are supposed to be shallow

Because it takes a good 5 years to properly evaluate a draft, no one seems to know what was said before the drafts

I think this is a very fair point.

It would be fascinating to go back and look at publicly available information before, say, that shocking 2016 draft. Was there a general sense it was awful? Was there positivity? Did 'experts' get it completely wrong: were they hinting it might have been a ripper?

What I have noticed, though, is that although it's very early days, what people were saying about the 2024 (bountiful; one for the ages) and 2023 (strongish with a big cliff in the teens) drafts looks to have been pretty spot on.