1 minute ago, Jaded No More said:

You know very well that once players have only a year left on a deal, you lose heaps of leverage

We didn’t need to re-sign Kosi now either but we got the opportunity to and so we jumped at it

Clarry was arguably the best player in the competition. And we are a small club. When you get lucky enough to find these types of stars you move heaven and earth to keep them.

Trac hasn’t worked out how we planned either. But you have to take those risks to keep those players happy when they’re at their peak.

Every club does the same. Ffs Richmond gave Balta a 7 year deal 😂

You're missing my point once again. I have zero issues with long term contracts.

But why give a dude thats completely off the rails a 7 year contract 🤣 literally setting him up to fail not succeed.

Honestly, give him a 3 year deal if you have too with some behavioural clauses included.

Petracca deserved his because not only did he live up to the expectations and perform but he has been an absolute professional all the way to the end as we speak. I hate the thought of losing him but have accepted that its probably best for both parties.

Edited October 6Oct 6 by dazzledavey36

Just now, dazzledavey36 said:

Why give a dude thats completely off the rails a 7 year contract 🤣 literally setting him up to fail not succeed.

Dunno. Ask Carlton and Geelong who had similar offers on the table for him.

If we lost him to another club, you would be the first one to pot us as a mess.

And your perception of Trac as a professional may not be totally true. Is he professional on field? Sure. But his behavior the last 18 months has been incredibly toxic and not at all professional for a senior player on big bucks.

7 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

I never said he’s done a great job, but you’re going on about him folding at trades when there is no proof of that.

I can tell you categorically that the Viney and Gawn extensions came from the board in a time when we needed good news and to manage optics. It was not Lamb’s decision alone.

And these list cloggers you speak of cost us genuinely nothing.

When he got May Lever and Langdon he was ace, and now he’s not?

And where was the bitchin and moaning when Lamb managed to snag Kosi for 9 years when every man and his dog thought he was gone?!

Didn't Tim Lamb join in late 2020 after Mahoney left? May, Lever and Langdon were brought in by Mahoney.

5 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Didn't Tim Lamb join in late 2020 after Mahoney left? May, Lever and Langdon were brought in by Mahoney.

He’s been with us in drafting and list management since 2012

https://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/130821/lamb-choice-cut-for-dees

By the way Lamb and Jason Taylor work together to identify potential trade targets. People talk about Lamb like he’s Putin. He doesn’t get to operate in a vacuum. He needs approval from a whole host of people to sign deals. Especially big deals.

Edited October 6Oct 6 by Jaded No More

With regard to the situation with both Petracca and Oliver I think we should take what the club says regards retaining both of these players during this trade period at face value.

I believe that we are more than prepared to keep both of them if the right deal cannot be done. A lot on here are looking at the situation through eyes that reflect the values of 20/30 years ago when a player's loyalty to a club was a thing that was highly valued. That is not the case anymore. A lot more dollars involved. Player loyalty is a thing of the past.

Players and clubs are a hell of a lot more professional and footy clubs are business first.

I see the position MFC are taking as the next step in professionalism. In reality the club is saying that any player, no matter what the contractual situation is, is free to explore the market, but unless the club gets value for money, it will not facilitate a trade.

To my mind the club has to be prepared to back their words and accept either/both back into the playing ranks if a deal cannot be struck.

They have been up front about where they stand, now they need to back it up.

1 minute ago, Jaded No More said:

He’s been with us in drafting and list management since 2012

https://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/130821/lamb-choice-cut-for-dees

That role was as a recruiter. Scouting potential draftees.

He was appointed List Manager in 2020.

Edited October 6Oct 6 by Dr. Gonzo

6 hours ago, bing181 said:

Deals are never simple, and the problem for us here is that GC know that Trac can’t come back to us now. They also know we want him and his salary off our books.

In spite of all the posturing, we’re on a hiding to nothing here, and GC very much have the upper hand.

Garbage.

4 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

Dunno. Ask Carlton and Geelong who had similar offers on the table for him.

If we lost him to another club, you would be the first one to pot us as a mess.

And your perception of Trac as a professional may not be totally true. Is he professional on field? Sure. But his behavior the last 18 months has been incredibly toxic and not at all professional for a senior player on big bucks.

He wouldnt have left lol. Around that time we weren't losing anyone of significance considering we were right in our premiership to what, go to Carlton? 🤣

That's based off your own assumption whilst using big words such as "toxic" around the club is just a narrative to suit your own negayive agenda you have had against Petracca since last year.

Go and watch Harvey Langfords rising star video and he was nothing but glowing appraisal for Petracca for supporting him with his development on and off field.

Even on his cooking insta page there is a video of him mid year inviting a few boys and their partners over for dinner he prepared.

Yep, sure sounds like a guy thats completely toxic around his teammates...

MFC should just list the GC players we would consider as part of a trade and say unless you are prepared to move one or more of them then we just don't meet to discuss.

3 hours ago, Doug Reemer said:

Taylor is responsible for drafting, lamb does recruiting. I’d be frogmarching Lamb out the door post trade period.

Taylor is head of recruiting.

Easy to check.

25 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

He wouldnt have left lol. Around that time we weren't losing anyone of significance considering we were right in our premiership to what, go to Carlton? 🤣

That's based off your own assumption whilst using big words such as "toxic" around the club is just a narrative to suit your own negayive agenda you have had against Petracca since last year.

Go and watch Harvey Langfords rising star video and he was nothing but glowing appraisal for Petracca for supporting him with his development on and off field.

Even on his cooking insta page there is a video of him mid year inviting a few boys and their partners over for dinner he prepared.

Yep, sure sounds like a guy thats completely toxic around his teammates...

You when we signed Clarry

Also you “WHY DID WE SIGN HIM FOR 7 years”

You love to pretend like you know everything so let’s go with your version of events at whatever point in time it suits you

After day 1 of the trade I find it hard to see a Petracca deal without Humphrey in it, so Petracca stays and it looks like May stays which I'm comfortable about he can be controlled. Oliver can't so it looks like Oliver is the only one that will go. I hope he rejuvenates his career at GWS.

Pick 41 for Heath

Pick 59 for Miochek

Pick 64 for White

McVee for pick 33

Oliver for Derksen

B: Lever, May, Bowey

HB: Salem, Turner, Rivers

C: Culley (a), Langford, Windsor

HF: Petracca, Petty, Chandler

F: Fritsch, Mihochek, Melksham

FOLL: Gawn, Viney, Pickett

IC: Lindsay, Langdon, Sparrow, Tholstrup, Heath

Casey

B: White, Adams, Derksen

HB: Howes, McDonald, Moniz-Wakefield (a)

C: Sinnema (a), Pick 27, Pick 33

HF: Henderson(a), Johnson, Sharp

F: Kentfield (a), van Rooyen, Jefferson

FOLL: Campbell, Laurie, Rookie

IC: McAdam, Mentha(b), Berry (b)

Edited October 6Oct 6 by WERRIDEE

30 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

He wouldnt have left lol. Around that time we weren't losing anyone of significance considering we were right in our premiership to what, go to Carlton? 🤣

That's based off your own assumption whilst using big words such as "toxic" around the club is just a narrative to suit your own negayive agenda you have had against Petracca since last year.

Go and watch Harvey Langfords rising star video and he was nothing but glowing appraisal for Petracca for supporting him with his development on and off field.

Even on his cooking insta page there is a video of him mid year inviting a few boys and their partners over for dinner he prepared.

Yep, sure sounds like a guy thats completely toxic around his teammates...

In fairness to us he did legitimately meet with David Teague and patty Cripps at the time, probably to leverage his 7 year deal but the interest was there.

I get frustrated with Kane Cornes knocking us for this deal. Clarry was flying at the time. We were winning, he was as consistently in the Brownlow mix, on track to be one of the greatest demons ever and 17 clubs would have signed him to the exact same deal given the chance.

It isn’t an ideal situation now, but lots of players have really significant off fiend challenges and no one cares if they’re playing well.

The reality of AFL footy is the AFLPA have skewed the rules so far in favour of players not clubs that all clubs, especially smaller clubs like Melbourne have to offer big money long term deals to sign anyone. Like Clarry isn’t going to knock back 8 years at Geelong and sign 3 years at Melbourne.

2 hours ago, DutchDemons said:

What is shizzen supposed to mean, it’s your favourite word and I have no idea what you’re trying to say.

https://en.langenscheidt.com/german-english/scheissen

1 hour ago, Whispering_Jack said:

What the clubs are saying (from the Herald Sun:

• Melbourne says trading Oliver and Petracca will only be done if the club feels it sets them up for their next premiership. 

• List boss Tim Lamb says he “will dispute” that Oliver was pushed out of the club.

• Lamb also confirmed the Demons are interested in Bailey Humphrey and now expects Steven May to remain at the club. 

What’s changed (with May) between being asked to find another club and now we’re saying we expect him to stay?

8 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Well let's just with the big chest pumping about Luke Jackson on October 4 2022 hey?

Speaking to AFL.com.au's Callum Twomey and Riley Beveridge on Continental Tyres AFL Trade Radio on Tuesday, Lamb said it "would be fair to say" they would look to secure more than Fremantle's pick 13 and a future first-round selection, and will look to strike a deal with whichever club can offer the better package.

Obviously, both Freo and West Coast are still exploring their options and we are going to do a deal with whoever comes up with the best deal for us, for Luke to get back to Western Australia," Lamb said.

"Where that stands at the moment is we are just waiting for the best offer from both clubs. We've had initial talks with both of them but it hasn't progressed very far at all.

"We'd love to get as early in the draft as we could this year, understanding that obviously when you deal with a futures market, you can't predetermine where that pick will land. We understand that.

"Luke was a pick three, he's a Rising Star winner, premiership player, he's 21 years old. Whoever gets Luke is getting 12 years of what we would describe as a generational talent so I think we are being fairly reasonable there."

Now let's look at the final trade..

Melbourne gets pick 13, Fremantle's future first round pick and future second round pick (tied to the Dockers) in exchange for Jackson, picks 44 and 67. GWS gets Toby Bedford.

Huffed and puffed at the start then folded in the final hurdle.

Should we discuss the McAdam trade whilst we are at it?

Correct. You've got to fear the worst with the Petracca trade.

4 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

You mean the players that he retained on long term contracts that now he’s trying to negotiate for them to leave … as we have guys like Trac and Clarry in $1.3m a year each. Irony is he’s trying to get us the best deal to try to salvage his long term 7 and 8 year contracts. Guys like Viney and May who got extensions out to be 35year old at end of term. Not sure he’s to be exactly applauded with such gusty. I like the AFL possibly introducing a 5- year contract max term by the way.

That 5 year AFL term max came through Geelong because they have run out of land to bargain with.

1 hour ago, CHF said:

With regard to the situation with both Petracca and Oliver I think we should take what the club says regards retaining both of these players during this trade period at face value.

I believe that we are more than prepared to keep both of them if the right deal cannot be done. A lot on here are looking at the situation through eyes that reflect the values of 20/30 years ago when a player's loyalty to a club was a thing that was highly valued. That is not the case anymore. A lot more dollars involved. Player loyalty is a thing of the past.

Players and clubs are a hell of a lot more professional and footy clubs are business first.

I see the position MFC are taking as the next step in professionalism. In reality the club is saying that any player, no matter what the contractual situation is, is free to explore the market, but unless the club gets value for money, it will not facilitate a trade.

To my mind the club has to be prepared to back their words and accept either/both back into the playing ranks if a deal cannot be struck.

They have been up front about where they stand, now they need to back it up.

That's the second most sensible post in the last five days .

Thanks CHF.

2 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

Clarry had multiple similar offers at the time.

Would anyone here be happy to lose him given his form at the time?

good question Jaded

and i’ve noticed no one will actually answer this directly.

He was the best player in the league at this stage. 31 brownlow votes. back to back coaches awards. The best player i’ve seen in red and blue (fan since ‘88)

But a long term deal?

Crazy!

Sure he had issues but wouldn’t you back yourself in to manage them? Offer him 3-4 years and he would obviously leave to get what he deserved

1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

He wouldnt have left lol. Around that time we weren't losing anyone of significance considering we were right in our premiership to what, go to Carlton? 🤣

That's based off your own assumption whilst using big words such as "toxic" around the club is just a narrative to suit your own negayive agenda you have had against Petracca since last year.

Go and watch Harvey Langfords rising star video and he was nothing but glowing appraisal for Petracca for supporting him with his development on and off field.

Even on his cooking insta page there is a video of him mid year inviting a few boys and their partners over for dinner he prepared.

Yep, sure sounds like a guy thats completely toxic around his teammates...

you know you’re losing an argument when you are quoting from Trac’s insta cooking page 😂

58 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

You when we signed Clarry

Also you “WHY DID WE SIGN HIM FOR 7 years”

You love to pretend like you know everything so let’s go with your version of events at whatever point in time it suits you

100% i was wrapt like any other Melbourne supporter without the knowledge that he was leading this footy club to a merry dance with his [censored] off field behaviour.

I dont actually don't claim to know anything unless i go off facts which i have done.

What I dont do is guesswork like you have made out with the whole Petracca being toxic (clearly made that up) and our board now offering contracts to players to which you still haven't provided any evidence or confirmation of things actually happening.. but sure, you just keep on guessing away.

56 minutes ago, Ted Lasso said:

In fairness to us he did legitimately meet with David Teague and patty Cripps at the time, probably to leverage his 7 year deal but the interest was there.

I get frustrated with Kane Cornes knocking us for this deal. Clarry was flying at the time. We were winning, he was as consistently in the Brownlow mix, on track to be one of the greatest demons ever and 17 clubs would have signed him to the exact same deal given the chance.

It isn’t an ideal situation now, but lots of players have really significant off fiend challenges and no one cares if they’re playing well.

The reality of AFL footy is the AFLPA have skewed the rules so far in favour of players not clubs that all clubs, especially smaller clubs like Melbourne have to offer big money long term deals to sign anyone. Like Clarry isn’t going to knock back 8 years at Geelong and sign 3 years at Melbourne.

Met with Teague at the end of 2020 season in which he was still contracted under and at the time of probably not knowing where success was coming.

He signed his monster deal in mid 2022 when he was already contracted for another 18 months and off the back of a premiership and probably 10 game winning streak. There is absolutely no way he was EVER going to entertain any offers by then.

Edited October 6Oct 6 by dazzledavey36

47 minutes ago, BoBo said:

What’s changed (with May) between being asked to find another club and now we’re saying we expect him to stay?

May is contracted for 2026.

We have simply told him that his opportunities will be limited so IF he wants to extend his career at another club we will help him get there.

Its not that hard and the media saying he is being pushed out is creative licence

If no one wants him he stays a Dee

8 hours ago, deanox said:

I thought Lamb just straight batted most things in a reasonable way, and I thought he answered the questions about Clarry's role and off-field well.

But the questions overall were poor. Too much focus on things they all knew Lamb couldn't answer - will you pay salary, what trade would you accept - and not real question ls like:

• What is the role King would require Oliver to play? Did Oliver say he was or wasn't prepared to play that role?

• You've talked about how Trac is a modern day great, but Oliver has 4 X Bluey and 2 X AFLCA MVP and you don't talk about him in the same way, why?

• You mentioned that to trade Trac the offer needs to be head turning, but you aren't using the same language Oliver. Is that because you see him as surplus to your current needs?

• Are WCE in the conversation for McVee? Would you be prepared to send him to the PSD if Fremantle didn't offer a reasonable trade? Would you be prepared to re-draft McVee ahead of Freo in that situation?

Personally, I am a bit disappointed that there has been a clear decision to pump up Trac as a great but effectively down play Oliver. There is no reason the club couldn't say similar things "Clayton is a great player and if he would prefer to seek a trade because he doesn't like the role outlined for him, we expect to see a deal that provides value to us versus the value he'd provide in role we think he'll play on King's game plan moving forward.".

My take is that they want to move on one of Trac or Clarrie, probably prefer to retain Trac, would trade both at the right (high) price, realize Clarrie has a lot less trade value, and believe we can maximise our trade position by having both in the market at the same time - for each we have a back up option and we would automatically rise our price for Trac if we secured a trade for Clarrie and vice versa giving the receiving club an incentive to deal first.

It is interesting how deep we are cutting the list in the weakest draft on record*

Oliver, May, Petracca, McVee OUT on top of the exits already confirmed and with only Heath and Mihocek coming back the other way (given such deep cuts Woewodin probably gets 12 more months)

We're looking at 31 Senior 4 A and 1B (ok two B for the berry believers)

Meaning we have 7 spots still to fill (5+2 OR 7+0) and I'd be shocked if we wanted to take more than the minimal 3 draftees (2 + Kalani or MAYBE could see it being 4 if we take Sinnema in the ND if we are likely to think he would be given a 2nd year as a rookie anyway to properly develop)

So even if May doesn't leave and with White locked in that would still be 5 more spots to fill. thats ALOT in a weak draft.

compared to some years when players are chopped early clubs will be more willing to back what they have this year (meaning next year they'll probably cut deeper if the draft projects better providing better DFA opportunities) this year theres just no delisted players who intrigue me at all. so where do we find 5 players from?

do we carry 1 or 2 spots into PS or even the MSD?

2 hours ago, Turner said:

It is interesting how deep we are cutting the list in the weakest draft on record*

It's a myth that this is a weak draft. My understanding is that the issues with it are a) there's perhaps not the real standout talent compared to previous years and b) it's compromised by academy and father/son picks. But there are still plenty of good draftees in the first couple of rounds.

Let's not forget that this year's Rising Star was taken at Pick 17.