I want both at the club next year. I get it, we're losing so we want to blame our senior players. If we off load them cheaply, you can expect a decade in the wilderness. Nothing surer.

Trac's numbers are better this year than last if you want to believe it or not. His player rating is still above Neale, Daicos, Dawson... player ratings are severely impacted by missed shots at goals and if he had kicked straight he would be in the top 10 midfielders. (Will he ever again?) Im sure the usual, 'he isnt having an impact' is brought up, but objectively he is, his score involvements are still top 15 in the league.

As for Clarry, he's had a different role this year with less game time, but he still is a top 15 midfielder for contested possessions and pressure acts. He is 100 percent having a go and is very aware of his limitations by foot and trying not to get the cheap handball receives like last year. Adding to the midfield this year has been Pickett who has been AA phenomenal. Yes, today they had their colours lowered but overall this season they are not the problem.

Our biggest gap to competition in 2025 has been our goal kicking (generationally bad) and inability to take marks inside 50 per entry. That's because we set up poorly (press too high up) and have massively substandard kpfs who continue to get a forward role with 2 or less scoring shots a week. Petty amd JVR have has 16 marks inside 50 in 23 games between them all year. Neither one of them are in the top 110 players. That's not all delivery. That' s a total lack of afl level forward nous.

Edited July 6Jul 6 by Jjrogan

Not having a go at anyone in particular but there is a lot of excuses here.

End of the day these 2 are paid handsomely to perform as elite footballers and they aren't producing that.

Both have let the club down off the field. Both have serious question marks on how them at the club are influencing their teammates/culture.

It's either change of coach to try spark them up or see you later as far as I'm concerned.

So stupid to give these long term deals. Even did it again with Kossie after all this.

Clarry’s tackling is big problem at the moment as a lot of them don’t stick or he gives away a head high free which is extremely frustrating to watch.

Just now, Devil In Disguise said:

Clarry’s tackling is big problem at the moment as a lot of them don’t stick or he gives away a head high free which is extremely frustrating to watch.

He's been always like that, bad tackler and gets exposed far too often defending in open field.

I just remembered that it was only a bit over 4 years ago against the Crows that Clarry played one of the greatest individual performances probably ever played by a mid at Adelaide oval. 40 disposals, 3 goals, 14 clearances (including 7 center clearance). Think his player rating for that game is still in the top 10

Crazy to think how much has changed with him.

1 minute ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I just remembered that it was only a bit over 4 years ago against the Crows that Clarry played one of the greatest individual performances probably ever played by a mid at Adelaide oval. 40 disposals, 3 goals, 14 clearances (including 7 center clearance). Think his player rating for that game is still in the top 10

Crazy to think how much has changed with him.

Unfortunately it has been more about off field issues, derailing his otherwise stellar career.

He should have been a Brownlow medallist, Norm Smith and 2 time champion. At least that's what I thought he would be back in October 2021.

Just now, At the break of Gawn said:

I just remembered that it was only a bit over 4 years ago against the Crows that Clarry played one of the greatest individual performances probably ever played by a mid at Adelaide oval. 40 disposals, 3 goals, 14 clearances (including 7 center clearance). Think his player rating for that game is still in the top 10

Crazy to think how much has changed with him.

He played like Chris Judd at his peak in that game. He was bursting through stoppages at lightning speed and kicking goals for fun.

He was only 23 at the time and I thought we'd be getting performances like that for many years to come.

6 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I just remembered that it was only a bit over 4 years ago against the Crows that Clarry played one of the greatest individual performances probably ever played by a mid at Adelaide oval. 40 disposals, 3 goals, 14 clearances (including 7 center clearance). Think his player rating for that game is still in the top 10

Crazy to think how much has changed with him.

The greatest game I've seen by a demon... and we lost, but wow I wish he could get back to that level

Trac has checked out and is just biding his time until the end of the year.

He loves the spotlight on him when he does well, when it gets a bit hard he sooks it up.

Probably still ticked off at champion data that he didn’t get the most possies in a gf.

4 hours ago, Redlagged said:

Petracca and Oliver to be replaced by Sparrow and Tholstup? Is this an attempt at comedy? Our problem is not Petracca and Oliver, despite their relatively modest output (perfectly explicable in CPa case), but because we have some very mediocre players who wouldn't get a game in a good side. One is Sparrow. Another is Tholstrup, though let's hold off on wiping him for another year. Jefferson? Clearly nowhere near it. Not up to it. Margins are fine in this caper. Replace those 3 with effective contributors and we'rea different side.

Well you do me a better makeup then?

6 hours ago, GS_1905 said:

Well you do me a better makeup then?

I'd have to agree, although they are only going at around 70% they are not the problem, our bottom 6 players are the worst in the league that should be addressed first... Sharp, Kolt, jeffo, should be made to earn there spot at Casey problem is who replaces them? Can't remember a Casey player in the last 3 years who actually smashed the door down with consistent good form? Our list needs fixing and the senior players need a reset.

Clarry's contract is a millstone around our neck

I get the call to cull and move on. But it's not going to be a quick fix. Who were the last teams to move on that number of former stars and rebuild? Hawthorn with Hodge, Mitchell and Lewis? They changed coach and took nearly 10 years to get back to it.

Collingwood post 2010? Again, change of coach and won a flag 12 years later (but almost won it 7 years later).

It might put us on track for the next flag, but don't expect it to happen quickly

33 minutes ago, Mickey said:

I get the call to cull and move on. But it's not going to be a quick fix. Who were the last teams to move on that number of former stars and rebuild? Hawthorn with Hodge, Mitchell and Lewis? They changed coach and took nearly 10 years to get back to it.

Collingwood post 2010? Again, change of coach and won a flag 12 years later (but almost won it 7 years later).

It might put us on track for the next flag, but don't expect it to happen quickly

You have to start somewhere. This list isn’t good enough so no point waiting around.

Maybe we don’t need to go full rebuild but no question major surgery required

1 hour ago, Mickey said:

I get the call to cull and move on. But it's not going to be a quick fix. Who were the last teams to move on that number of former stars and rebuild? Hawthorn with Hodge, Mitchell and Lewis? They changed coach and took nearly 10 years to get back to it.

Collingwood post 2010? Again, change of coach and won a flag 12 years later (but almost won it 7 years later).

It might put us on track for the next flag, but don't expect it to happen quickly

agreed

people seem to forget that hodge, mitchell, and lewis were well into their 30s by the time they left dingley - they've won one finals game since in a decade of seasons, and that was last year against a footscray side who just came to a stop midway thru the third quarter

the more apt comparison for us is not petracca and oliver but instead may and gawn

the filth changed coach not once but twice after their 2010 premiership before they won another flag; they are arguably one of the most well-resourced and professionally run football organisations during that time period

puddy tatts recruited not one not two but three generational players from other clubs - dangerfield, ablett jr coming home, and cameron - after their 2007, 2009, and 2011 salutes and still have only one flag to their name since

premierships are bloody hard to win

These 2 contracts are unfortunately going to kill our chances of building another premiership list for the next 10 years probably.

But we had to give the contracts I guess (or the Oliver one at least). Oliver was with Bont as the best players in the competition and still so young. Many signs suggested he would become an absolute great of the game. From the outside it looked a no brainer to lock him up. Maybe people on the inside should have been more across how pear shaped it could have gone. Who knows.

Petracca I would have been more wary of as his better performances have always been driven by the pressure applied by his teammates and getting it to him in space. He's always been fumbly and unable to execute under physical pressure so the contract just doesn't match the quality.

If we can't come to a mutually acceptable parting with both of them then I reckon Petracca has to be played purely as a full forward. Try and get some space for him and see if he can hit the scoreboard a bit. Maybe we can get about 75% of the value of what we're giving to him out of him.

Oliver I have no idea how we can find a way to get anywhere near the payback for the amount of investment we're making in him.

We're once again being burned by senior players on big bucks (in these cases very big bucks) regressing as team footballers and dragging the whole thing down.

Maybe our focus over the last block of the season should be purely to put these 2 in a position to rack up 40 touches a game (because we all know how much the footy world love a good haul of possies) to try and inflate their value.

If Petracca wanted to leave last year because of poor standards, what would he have seen this year to suggest his concerns have been addressed?

Was he worried about something (or several things) in particular that the general public isn't privy to? Or was it more of a general "We're so much better than 2024" kind of deal?

On 02/07/2025 at 14:32, picket fence said:

Teething issues abound when teeth push through, but if you wear false teeth, then your gums are stuffed!

Most eloquently summed up !!

30 minutes ago, Demonland said:

Barrel “the first time now the second time”, this has been going on for years….

On 02/07/2025 at 14:32, picket fence said:

Teething issues abound when teeth push through, but if you wear false teeth, then your gums are stuffed!

My feeling entirely,needs to go!

10 hours ago, Demonland said:

To save everyone the pain of watching Tom Morris talk, the quotes there are just him sprouting BS, not quotes from Goodwin.

Whatever is going on, Petracca wanting to leave wouldn't have been because we were losing games there would have been other more serious things going on that the public doesn't know about. Him threatening last year seems to have been one of many things that caused a lot of changes at the club, and I would hope this means his concerns were addressed. It would be pretty petty and disappointing if a player just left because they wanted to win, especially a real heart and soul player like him. I doubt he just would pick up and leave because we aren't winning I would hope it just drives him to make us better even more and then when we do start winning it will be so much sweeter than just bailing out.