POSTGAME: Rd 15 vs North Melbourne

[rufus 1,162]

5 minutes ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

I think the most pleasing thing is our side from the weekend was pretty young and we were still able to win.

Rivers - 22

Bowey - 21

McVee - 20

Windsor - 19

Tholstrup - 18

Pickett - 23

van Rooyen - 21

Howes - 21

Turner - 22

Brown - 19

I think we had 9 players with 150+ games of experience to 3. We are getting absolutely burnt by the experienced players for the umpteenth time is recent MFC history.

Someone seriously needs to study how we can have so many players regress to looking like rookies when they hit peak AFL age of 27 to 30. These guys are meant to be guiding the ship. This has happened for us, with a few exceptions, this whole century. It has to be a cultural thing. I am absolutely staggered that we might even be witnessing it with Oliver now too...a guy who improved every year early is his career and seems to have smashed into a brick wall.

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,225]

29 minutes ago, rufus said:

I think we had 9 players with 150+ games of experience to 3. We are getting absolutely burnt by the experienced players for the umpteenth time is recent MFC history.

Someone seriously needs to study how we can have so many players regress to looking like rookies when they hit peak AFL age of 27 to 30. These guys are meant to be guiding the ship. This has happened for us, with a few exceptions, this whole century. It has to be a cultural thing. I am absolutely staggered that we might even be witnessing it with Oliver now too...a guy who improved every year early is his career and seems to have smashed into a brick wall.

So those players you mention are as follows:

May - he was good

McDonald - he did his job

Oliver - He was poor and we all know the reasons why

Fritsch - he was unsighted and had a shocking night. Still our leading goalkicker for the year

Gawn - he played a solid game without being spectacular

Langdon - did his job on the wing

Viney - probably our best player behind Rivers

Salem - was subbed out with knee soreness

Tomlinson - back up defender. Will be replaced by Lever this week

I think 5 of the 9 get a tick and maybe Tomlinson as well as he wasn't terrible.

Oliver, Fritsch and Salem all get a fail for that game.

[SFebes 4,884]

I'm surprised those who normally preach xScore haven't mentioned that it was North 62.7 to Melb 55....

[Ethan Tremblay 30,966]

Anyone know if the stats are available somewhere for the average age and games played, for the teams that took the ground? 

[loges 6,767]

54 minutes ago, dino rover said:

I think the reference is to loading 

implication we used the bye to put some  hard work in on the track and are leg tired as a result 

Not denying the loading theory but if that's the reason we look flat, against Brisbane Freo and last quarter against North, I'm not sure it's working either.

[rpfc 28,775]

16 minutes ago, SFebes said:

I'm surprised those who normally preach xScore haven't mentioned that it was North 62.7 to Melb 55....

55 against the worst team in the comp… that’s indicative. 
 

We are going to slide out of the 8 and we have to make the most of it - get Gawn and Viney some rest, get games into some talent in important positions, and continue with the evolved game style. Use this year to get better next year.

[dice 712]

11 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Anyone know if the stats are available somewhere for the average age and games played, for the teams that took the ground? 

https://www.wheeloratings.com/afl_match_stats.html?ID=20241504

[dice 712]

3 hours ago, praha said:

Essendon on ANZAC Day 1992? One of my earliest football memories. We kicked the first of the last. Essendon just went BANG BANG BANG x3 and won. 

Yep. 2nd loudest roar I have ever heard in Southern Stand:

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/games/1992/051119920425.html

1st loudest when Clarko kicked goal after siren on debut against us:
https://afltables.com/afl/stats/games/1987/111219870704.html

Edited June 24 by dice

[rufus 1,162]

17 minutes ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

So those players you mention are as follows:

May - he was good

McDonald - he did his job

Oliver - He was poor and we all know the reasons why

Fritsch - he was unsighted and had a shocking night. Still our leading goalkicker for the year

Gawn - he played a solid game without being spectacular

Langdon - did his job on the wing

Viney - probably our best player behind Rivers

Salem - was subbed out with knee soreness

Tomlinson - back up defender. Will be replaced by Lever this week

I think 5 of the 9 get a tick and maybe Tomlinson as well as he wasn't terrible.

Oliver, Fritsch and Salem all get a fail for that game.

I guess another way I've been looking at it is by asking this question:

Which of our players are meaningfully better players than they were when they played in a premiership in 2021? I am struggling to think of any that have gone from average to good, or from good to great or from great to superstar. Maybe Rivers and ANB are slightly better? Of that list of 9, I don’t think a single one is a better player now than they were. None seem to have reached a level where their output in terms of helping a team win a game of football is any better than it was then.

Our list profile was nice at that point in time...many of our best contributors were not even at their peak age yet. So how did we get to where we are now? A flag should have provided a springboard to better performance from the individuals.

I just don't think Goodwin is able to bank on the baseline output that he should be expecting from the experienced players. It would make it very hard to coach IMO.

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,225]

7 minutes ago, rufus said:

I guess another way I've been looking at it is by asking this question:

Which of our players are meaningfully better players than they were when they played in a premiership in 2021? I am struggling to think of any that have gone from average to good, or from good to great or from great to superstar. Maybe Rivers and ANB are slightly better? Of that list of 9, I don’t think a single one is a better player now than they were. None seem to have reached a level where their output in terms of helping a team win a game of football is any better than it was then.

Our list profile was nice at that point in time...many of our best contributors were not even at their peak age yet. So how did we get to where we are now? A flag should have provided a springboard to better performance from the individuals.

I just don't think Goodwin is able to bank on the baseline output that he should be expecting from the experienced players. It would make it very hard to coach IMO.

I think we need some list turnover for sure. But I don't think our situation is as dire as some make it out to be.

 

[Ethan Tremblay 30,966]

26 minutes ago, dice said:

https://www.wheeloratings.com/afl_match_stats.html?ID=20241504

Legend, cheers. 

[Roost it far 8,582]

14 minutes ago, rufus said:

I guess another way I've been looking at it is by asking this question:

Which of our players are meaningfully better players than they were when they played in a premiership in 2021? I am struggling to think of any that have gone from average to good, or from good to great or from great to superstar. Maybe Rivers and ANB are slightly better? Of that list of 9, I don’t think a single one is a better player now than they were. None seem to have reached a level where their output in terms of helping a team win a game of football is any better than it was then.

Our list profile was nice at that point in time...many of our best contributors were not even at their peak age yet. So how did we get to where we are now? A flag should have provided a springboard to better performance from the individuals.

I just don't think Goodwin is able to bank on the baseline output that he should be expecting from the experienced players. It would make it very hard to coach IMO.

I think May, Gawn and Viney have well and truly maintained their standard and both Rivers and ANB have improved. Fritsch is playing poorly atm but he's an opportunist and lets face it those aren't as common as they were in 21 or 22 and 23 for that matter. I think Pickett continues to improve and really only Salem (injuries?) and Langdon have gone backwards. Oliver has seen the biggest drop off this year but that's for a whole host of non footy related circumstances.  

[DubDee 26,117]

Expected score has be rolled out

time to close thread

[Rab D Nesbitt 8,492]

I think we still had more shots at goal in that last quarter than Scotland had in a whole tournament. 😩

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,225]

13 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Expected score has be rolled out

time to close thread

I'm assuming we lost on expected score

[Sydee 4,529]

21 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Legend, cheers. 

Impressive from Caleb Windsor and Nick Larkey 😳

[rpfc 28,775]

48 minutes ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

I'm assuming we lost on expected score

No need to assume. We had and expected score of 55 from our 47 entries…

[gs77 4,445]

17 hours ago, redandbluemakepurple said:

Aaargghhh, I've seen worse.  47 points up, 6 minutes into the last quarter.  Lost by 1.  1991-ish

And just like that, I suddenly feel like I need to throw up. I was there that day.

[DubDee 26,117]

9 minutes ago, rpfc said:

No need to assume. We had and expected score of 55 from our 47 entries…

47 expected entries?

[DubDee 26,117]

1 hour ago, Rab D Nesbitt said:

I think we still had more shots at goal in that last quarter than Scotland had in a whole tournament. 😩

true. Scots took a Braveheart approach to the Euros. HOOOLLLDD!

robbed of a pen though

[Tracca 853]

17 hours ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

I do tend to over-share info on here. 🤭

Last night’s interaction was unusual in that it wasn’t at a training session or a DA BBQ for example, which is where this happens a lot. Maybe he saw the #18 guernsey I was wearing, a pic of which I posted on here recently. 🤷‍♀️ You don’t see too many #18 guernseys.

One time at a Family Day at Gosch’s a Demonlander guessed I’m WCW because of my red and blue nail polish. He said I’d mentioned that on here.

oh haha. That makes a bit of sense

I have a fair idea who you are lol without even meeting you in person :) 

 

 

[binman 43,759]

3 hours ago, dino rover said:

I think the reference is to loading 

implication we used the bye to put some  hard work in on the track and are leg tired as a result 

Indeed.

We have struggled pre and post bye since burgess was made high performance manager (well, from 2021 - we didn't get a proper bye in 2020 because of covid)

2021: post bye we could only manage 68 points in a scrappy 11 point win over an average bombers side.

In the lead up to the bye we had two 'uncharacteristic defeats' in our previous four matches.

2022: post bye, we came out running on top of the ground, and in a shock result flogged the lions by 62 points at the gabba. 

It was a shock because prior to the bye we had been in terrible form, losing 3 on the trot (having won our first 10 games) - freo flogged us at the G by 38 points, the swans rolled us the g and we could only manage 56 points against a very average pies team, who won by 26.

2023: post bye, in a super scrappy match, we led the cats by 7 points at 3 quarter time (6.11 to 5.10), but  stopped to a walk in the last quarter and gave up 6 goals to go down by 11 points.

In the four pre bye games we lost to Port at AO  (but played well), lost, again, to freo at the g, had a scrappy win over the blues (who were 15th at that point) and a good  win over the pies.

2024: after our first bye we we were woeful in the first half, and not much better in the second, in a scrappy win over the tigers.

After our second bye, we again stopped to a walk in the last quarter and were lucky to hold off the lowly roos. 

In the 3 pre bye games, we played pretty well in our win over the saints, we were woeful against freo and better than the scoreline suggests against the pies, but still very scrappy.

For context, it's important to note that in spite of (arguably BECAUSE of ) of those performances we finished top 4 in 2021, 22 and 23.

[Rab D Nesbitt 8,492]

1 hour ago, DubDee said:

true. Scots took a Braveheart approach to the Euros. HOOOLLLDD!

robbed of a pen though

We've been pish for 30 years DubDee. Like your mob we trawl the lower reaches of the football league for players with scottish grannies. Now it's back to cheering for whoever plays England. 

[BDA 22,875]

1 minute ago, Rab D Nesbitt said:

We've been pish for 30 years DubDee. Like your mob we trawl the lower reaches of the football league for players with scottish grannies. Now it's back to cheering for whoever plays England. 

England are so predictable. Like clockwork. They'll get knocked out in the last 16 by Romania or Austria or similar. The wrist slitting will be a joy to behold. 

Not sure who Southgate has blackmailed to stay in the job so long. He is a terrible coach. I hope they never appoint a proper coach because they have some very good players. They might actually win something. Just as well we're the other side of the world if that happened. They would be insufferable.

[Ethan Tremblay 30,966]

All the other coaches play Chess, while ours plays Checkers.