The Premiership Window Closing?

[Roost it far 6,220]

21 minutes ago, Macca said:

@Sir Why You Little

What doesn't add up is if it's widely known within the club that Goodwin doesn't listen to his assistants, how has he still got his job?

And why would the assistants not leave or look elsewhere?

Your argument just doesn't stack up and I doubt that even 1 person believes your nonsense

 

You sure like to keep hammering home the same message post after post don't you. You're up to 52 posts on this thread alone. Maybe just calm the farm a little, you seem very uptight. Take a walk, it's a sensational evening.....few deep breaths, bit of a stretch, you'll feel much better and it'll give someone else a chance to voice an opinion. :) 

[Macca 16,173]

1 hour ago, Roost it far said:

You sure like to keep hammering home the same message

Only because the same person keeps quoting me and the same person started off quoting me

Go back and have a look at who started the argument

I'm just replying most of the time.  The rest of my posts have focused on the technical aspects of our team and our prospects

For instance ... 

I'm reasonably buoyant but not overly optimistic for the new season

The first major task is to get into contention (top 4) and from there we're going to have to be at our very best and we're going to need a good dose of luck

We can cover for a few injuries (here and there) but we can't cope with a massive injury list, no team can (Our forward line woes from last season has been well covered) 

But finishing top 4 is always a big ask even for a dominant team who are the reigning premiers

So it's going to take a lot of hard work just to get into contention

But we are more than capable of achieving all of the above

If most things go right, we can win the flag

Edited January 15 by Macca

[DubDee 20,770]

On 15/01/2024 at 00:06, Macca said:

@DubDee

I reckon he'll be back sooner than people think.  Just a gut feeling as he loves playing footy and he'll be missing being involved

It's still 2 months until the first game and fitness wise, he'll be good to go as he's keeping up his training.  Footy is his life

Fingers crossed he's back, better than ever

fingers crossed you’re right. physically i think he’ll be fine just worried about him

[Sir Why You Little 34,598]

19 hours ago, Roost it far said:

You sure like to keep hammering home the same message post after post don't you. You're up to 52 posts on this thread alone. Maybe just calm the farm a little, you seem very uptight. Take a walk, it's a sensational evening.....few deep breaths, bit of a stretch, you'll feel much better and it'll give someone else a chance to voice an opinion. :) 

Excellent advice Roost…

[Macca 16,173]

Our premiership window can well and truly stay open and can do until at least 2028

The only 2 great players that possibly/probably need to be replaced immediately after 2025/2026 are May & Max but do both replacement players need to be A+?  

Petty is an ideal candidate for full back as long as we can keep him and a Nankervous type rickman is not such a bad thing

And if we continue to recruit as well as we have done, there's no reason why we can't stay in the window (allowing for the odd year where we may finish in the bottom part of the 8 or just outside) 

Edited January 16 by Macca

[58er 5,610]

5 hours ago, Macca said:

Our premiership window can well and truly stay open and can do until at least 2028

The only 2 great players that possibly/probably need to be replaced immediately after 2025/2026 are May & Max but do both replacement players need to be A+?  

Petty is an ideal candidate for full back as long as we can keep him and a Nankervous type rickman is not such a bad thing

And if we continue to recruit as well as we have done, there's no reason why we can't stay in the window (allowing for the odd year where we may finish in the bottom part of the 8 or just outside) 

Why move a proven 60/80 goal forward to down back if you have won 2 flags with him as spearhead. 

Our  replacement for Maysie could be JRV ( why move him also) or more likely Jed Adams who we have recruited for defence. Disco is more like a third defender really unless he puts on more weight than he is doing between seasons. We can also trade fora defender from A+ down to B+ as well. 

[Macca 16,173]

20 minutes ago, 58er said:

Why move a proven 60/80 goal forward to down back if you have won 2 flags with him as spearhead. 

Our  replacement for Maysie could be JRV ( why move him also) or more likely Jed Adams who we have recruited for defence. Disco is more like a third defender really unless he puts on more weight than he is doing between seasons. We can also trade fora defender from A+ down to B+ as well. 

Given our stellar record with recruiting, we might end up with real depth in our forward line, 58er

We've extended Jefferson's contract so the MC must see potential in the lad

JVR will only get better and what if Fullarton can hold down a spot as a forward ruck?

T-Mac & Brown will probably be gone at seasons end so we might need to recruit another key forward anyway (although Jefferson might come on)

I suppose we did recruit May with the no.5* pick so we could do that again with another full back but we'd need the currency.  We might even have our eye on a free agent key forward to facilitate Petty going back.  Or a free agent Full Back

So, a lot can happen between now and when May hangs up the boots but Petty is an option if we've got real depth in our forward line

And we are addressing that issue with the recruitment of McAdam & Billings and Tholstrup looks like he is being viewed as forward/mid.  If he shows a bit early we may see him debut early

So Petty going back would need a few things falling into place, but it's definitely a possibility

 

*That 17 loss season in 2019 worked out alright after all! (we got Sparrow as well in that deal for May) 

[58er 5,610]

4 hours ago, Macca said:

Given our stellar record with recruiting, we might end up with real depth in our forward line, 58er

We've extended Jefferson's contract so the MC must see potential in the lad

JVR will only get better and what if Fullarton can hold down a spot as a forward ruck?

T-Mac & Brown will probably be gone at seasons end so we might need to recruit another key forward anyway (although Jefferson might come on)

I suppose we did recruit May with the no.5* pick so we could do that again with another full back but we'd need the currency.  We might even have our eye on a free agent key forward to facilitate Petty going back.  Or a free agent Full Back

So, a lot can happen between now and when May hangs up the boots but Petty is an option if we've got real depth in our forward line

And we are addressing that issue with the recruitment of McAdam & Billings and Tholstrup looks like he is being viewed as forward/mid.  If he shows a bit early we may see him debut early

So Petty going back would need a few things falling into place, but it's definitely a possibility

 

*That 17 loss season in 2019 worked out alright after all! (we got Sparrow as well in that deal for May) 

Some good points Macca but of all our players Petty is probably our best bet forward for the foreseeable future. 
JVR Is a beauty because he has no limitations in playing the game. He is fearless and so competitive thsts why I kind of like him having some tuck work at the throw ins. Even if we had Fullerton mixing the two of them up forward wouldn't be the worst move Goody has made. ( Schache prob still is the one to date as Sub and not using him). 

I'll am bullish about McAdam who looks like a slightly bigger version of Kossie but perhaps not as many tricks but enough to take some pressure off both Kossie and Fritta as he can take a good grab flying or competing. And Billing's could be the finisher with Fullarton doing exactly what we got him for. Relieving Maxy in the ruck and being a competitive beast taking the pressure off Petty and Rooy up forward.

Any improvement is possible with Jefferson and I hope he gets a good go atCasey at learning with possibly BBB who woiuld be great depth also to have. Tmac can be a defender who could still do a cameo if his fitness stands up all season.

Three others I reckon are going to have real breakout years are Riv, Tommy Sparrow and possibly Disco.

Plus The Kolt and the Duke are real potential for our speed and Goal kicking if they mature early and debut.

2024 could be our best list possible if we have some luck with injuries snd Mini helps with the game plan

I can't see any scenario where we would miss Finals and on the contrary Top4 is agsin our target with a fit and more aggressive game plan resulting in us being a free scoring attacking team that is feared by the other 17. 

[Macca 16,173]

8 hours ago, 58er said:

Some good points Macca but of all our players Petty is probably our best bet forward for the foreseeable future. 
JVR Is a beauty because he has no limitations in playing the game. He is fearless and so competitive thsts why I kind of like him having some tuck work at the throw ins. Even if we had Fullerton mixing the two of them up forward wouldn't be the worst move Goody has made. ( Schache prob still is the one to date as Sub and not using him). 

I'll am bullish about McAdam who looks like a slightly bigger version of Kossie but perhaps not as many tricks but enough to take some pressure off both Kossie and Fritta as he can take a good grab flying or competing. And Billing's could be the finisher with Fullarton doing exactly what we got him for. Relieving Maxy in the ruck and being a competitive beast taking the pressure off Petty and Rooy up forward.

Any improvement is possible with Jefferson and I hope he gets a good go atCasey at learning with possibly BBB who woiuld be great depth also to have. Tmac can be a defender who could still do a cameo if his fitness stands up all season.

Three others I reckon are going to have real breakout years are Riv, Tommy Sparrow and possibly Disco.

Plus The Kolt and the Duke are real potential for our speed and Goal kicking if they mature early and debut.

2024 could be our best list possible if we have some luck with injuries snd Mini helps with the game plan

I can't see any scenario where we would miss Finals and on the contrary Top4 is agsin our target with a fit and more aggressive game plan resulting in us being a free scoring attacking team that is feared by the other 

What can happen when a team is in contention is that a team can have a gap year.  Happens quite a lot 

So even though I believe we're good to go for the next 5 years, we may have a year or 2 in there where we don't perform to our best. Or we have a rash if injuries or we don't have luck on our side

For instance, for years people kept writing off Geelong off but they kept bobbing up

And I've been keen observer of how the best teams have gone about it.  Their window often just stays open as they keep recruiting well

So if Jason Taylor isn't the most important pillar at the Demons, who is?  He keeps recruiting good players and if you keep adding 2 or 3 good players to the team, year after year, you'll remain in contention 

That stands to reason

So last year we added JVR, McVee  & Hunter to the team along with Grundy who was by no means a poor player

Along the way you have to add A grade talent and that's where the savvy recruiting comes into play.  Free agency, trading and somehow working our way up in the draft is the way to go about it

And that's what we continue to do

We're just not going to win the premiership every time we're in contention.  The key to it all is to remain in contention

[58er 5,610]

11 minutes ago, Macca said:

What can happen when a team is in contention is that a team can have a gap year.  Happens quite a lot 

So even though I believe we're good to go for the next 5 years, we may have a year or 2 in there where we don't perform to our best. Or we have a rash if injuries or we don't have luck on our side

For instance, for years people kept writing off Geelong off but they kept bobbing up

And I've been keen observer of how the best teams have gone about it.  Their window often just stays open as they keep recruiting well

So if Jason Taylor isn't the most important pillar at the Demons, who is?  He keeps recruiting good players and if you keep adding 2 or 3 good players to the team, year after year, you'll remain in contention 

That stands to reason

So last year we added JVR, McVee  & Hunter to the team along with Grundy who was by no means a poor player

Along the way you have to add A grade talent and that's where the savvy recruiting comes into play.  Free agency, trading and somehow working our way up in the draft is the way to go about it

And that's what we continue to do

We're just not going to win the premiership every time we're in contention.  The key to it all is to remain in contention

Correct Macca

[Fanatique Demon 2,408]

17 hours ago, 58er said:

Why move a proven 60/80 goal forward to down back if you have won 2 flags with him as spearhead. 

I must have missed. Admittedly I was on holiday, but who was the proven 60/80 goal forward and when did we win those two flags?

[58er 5,610]

1 hour ago, Fanatique Demon said:

I must have missed. Admittedly I was on holiday, but who was the proven 60/80 goal forward and when did we win those two flags?

Harry is now up forward and in the next 2  years he could kick 60 goals plus and that may be enough for us to turn the forward line around and win 2 flags.

If Harry’s done this there would be no earthly reason to return him to the backline. After all it’s harder to kick goals than stop them. 
Of course he could play small cameos in defence and swap with  Disco  or Tmac ! 

[Kent 2,590]

On 14/01/2024 at 13:10, Macca said:

We have to come to terms with the notion that Grundy's cards were clearly marked

Once a coach tells you that you are surplus to needs, the relationship is as good as over.  Especially for a player who was playing quite well in his role as ruckman

It should be remembered that Grundy himself wasn't sprouting his ability as a forward.  That was our notion

So in Grundy's eyes he's not surplus to needs elsewhere so he's on the move as soon as the axe comes down.  We can't ordinarily compare him to a player dropped because their form is poor (and is told that if he performs in the 2's, he can get back in the team)

We closed the door once we went in another direction (Gawn to ruck with JVR & T-Mac as back up ruckmen)

The ruse was naming Grundy as an emergency a few times.  In my view, Grundy wasn't under consideration

So what was the use of selecting him and then sacking him

What actually happened as now we have no effective back up to Max when he is older and continually roughed up by the opposition

I find it bizarre that the club haven't been transparent in this matter 

[Macca 16,173]

Just now, Kent said:

So what was the use of selecting him and then sacking him

What actually happened as now we have no effective back up to Max when he is older and continually roughed up by the opposition

I find it bizarre that the club haven't been transparent in this matter 

Ordinarily dropping a player because of form issues is quite straightforward

But with Grundy it was different as he was doing quite well in the ruck but we decided to go down a different path and he became surplus to needs

I've no doubt all that would have been explained to him but effectively, the relationship was over (in my view only, Kent) 

So picking him as an emergency was probably token to make it look a bit better? But again, that's only my view and there was probably a lot more to it

I've come to terms with it as nothing ventured, nothing gained

The rucking position and the back up to a stellar ruckman like Gawn can be problematical in terms of what is needed as back-up.  And then we can't predict injuries.  There's more than a few what if's

[Demonland 65,565]

 

[Demonstone 19,307]

Another unfortunate stab by Stevie J.

[Roost it far 6,220]

No one rates us. They saw are underbelly last year and it’s up to us to come out breathing fire. I’m not overly confident but if we get it on, stay fit and say no to drugs who knows. I do know I’d love to prove some [censored] wrong.

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,246]

Where did most people have us in Feb 2021?

Maybe the players might perform better with lesser expectations.

All the pressure is on Carlton to win the flag. Are they up to it?

[Bay Riffin 1,420]

6 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

No one rates us. They saw are underbelly last year and it’s up to us to come out breathing fire. I’m not overly confident but if we get it on, stay fit and say no to drugs who knows. I do know I’d love to prove some [censored] wrong.

its interesting we are getting predictions to miss top 8 from Jenkins and Stevie J. we won the majority of games sans Clarry, in fact our midfield did extremely well. I think a bigger factor is we may need to move an A grader in Brayshaw to defence. 

In saying all that we lost finals due to goal kicking so the ingredients are there otherwise. If we hold our mettle keep most of the list fit we can finish up the top. 

[DeeZone 7,810]

Jeez Stevie J doesn’t even mention us in the top 13, that should stir the hornets nest up, a bit of ammo for the coaches. We have the backs and midfield pretty well covered with sufficient depth to cover for some injuries, however need Clayton back at some stage. What we do need is a bit of luck with our forwards both Fritta and Petty are critical to our structure, JVR will keep getting better. Kozzie, ANB and Spargs have been strengthened by Jack Billing’s and Shane McAdam plus we have Sestan, Fullarton, Jefferson and Verrall building at Casey. When you throw in Woewodin, Laurie, Disco, Howes, Adams, Farris-White the Kolt, the Duke and young Brownie plus Jake Melksham come finals I am thinking top 4 in ‘24. I am also expecting several of our youngsters to have breakout seasons this year and will more than cover for the players that we have lost. Go Dees.

Like Macca and 58er I am a bit bullish about our chances in 24 - 28 and also very keen to see what McQualter brings to the table.

Edited January 30 by DeeZone
Added last paragraph

[DiscoStu17 145]

12 minutes ago, DeeZone said:

Jeez Stevie J doesn’t even mention us in the top 13, that should stir the hornets nest up, a bit of ammo for the coaches. We have the backs and midfield pretty well covered with sufficient depth to cover for some injuries, however need Clayton back at some stage. What we do need is a bit of luck with our forwards both Fritta and Petty are critical to our structure, JVR will keep getting better. Kozzie, ANB and Spargs have been strengthened by Jack Billing’s and Shane McAdam plus we have Sestan, Fullarton, Jefferson and Verrall building at Casey. When you throw in Woewodin, Laurie, Disco, Howes, Adams, Farris-White the Kolt, the Duke and young Brownie plus Jake Melksham come finals I am thinking top 4 in ‘24. I am also expecting several of our youngsters to have breakout seasons this year and will more than cover for the players that we have lost. Go Dees.

I know we all look through red and blue coloured glasses here, but I honestly thought we were the best team in it last year. Especially considering the injuries we were covering. Many of the “experts” played in an era where MFC regularly performed below expectations, and I think this has coloured their opinions.

As always, injuries and depth will determine who is able to have a genuine crack at the premiership. I wouldn’t be surprised if we have another top 4 finish. 

[Macca 16,173]

2 hours ago, DeeZone said:

Like Macca I am a bit bullish about our chances in 24 - 28 and also very keen to see what McQualter brings to the table.

I have got us playing finals but not top 4 unless we fix our forward line issues

But even with a makeshift forward line along with a stellar defence and defensive structures as well as a strong midfield, it's not hard to see at least a 14 & 9 finish as a minimum

A flag can happen as long as we are a true contender.  I'm always reminded that a team has to win 3 finals to win big and with a majeshift forward line, that's a big ask (as we found out last year)

But we've recruited with a big emphasis on the forward line so we just need a bit of luck with injuries.  The delivery forward and forwards creating separation needs to be fixed as well

Time will tell, DZ

[Macca 16,173]

2 hours ago, DiscoStu17 said:

I know we all look through red and blue coloured glasses here, but I honestly thought we were the best team in it last year

Not all of us look through rose coloured glasses and because of our forward line issues we weren't the best team

The Pies or Lions might have beaten us even if we were at full strength.  Both teams are very good

A contender? Definitely

But best team? No

Edited January 31 by Macca

[praha 10,287]

On 17/01/2024 at 09:47, Macca said:

What can happen when a team is in contention is that a team can have a gap year.  Happens quite a lot 

So even though I believe we're good to go for the next 5 years, we may have a year or 2 in there where we don't perform to our best. Or we have a rash if injuries or we don't have luck on our side

For instance, for years people kept writing off Geelong off but they kept bobbing up

And I've been keen observer of how the best teams have gone about it.  Their window often just stays open as they keep recruiting well

So if Jason Taylor isn't the most important pillar at the Demons, who is?  He keeps recruiting good players and if you keep adding 2 or 3 good players to the team, year after year, you'll remain in contention 

That stands to reason

So last year we added JVR, McVee  & Hunter to the team along with Grundy who was by no means a poor player

Along the way you have to add A grade talent and that's where the savvy recruiting comes into play.  Free agency, trading and somehow working our way up in the draft is the way to go about it

And that's what we continue to do

We're just not going to win the premiership every time we're in contention.  The key to it all is to remain in contention

Geelong lost Corey, Scarlett, Enright, Wojinski, Ling, Mooney, Milburn, and Ottens in 2011, 2012, and 2013. They still finished 3rd in 2014 before missing one finals series for the decade in 2015. They lost Toohey, Stokes, Bartel, and Enright in 2016, and finished second in 2017. Add losing Ablett in 2010 as well. They finished 8th in 2018 with the league's second best percentage.

In six seasons they turned over a team that won three flags in five years and finished top 4 most seasons and made a GF and Prelim in 2020, 2021 and 2022.

We're not even close to losing what they lost in retirements over that period.

Missing finals would be a colossal failure for this group.

[Macca 16,173]

10 minutes ago, praha said:

Geelong lost Corey, Scarlett, Enright, Wojinski, Ling, Mooney, Milburn, and Ottens in 2011, 2012, and 2013. They still finished 3rd in 2014 before missing one finals series for the decade in 2015. They lost Toohey, Stokes, Bartel, and Enright in 2016, and finished second in 2017. Add losing Ablett in 2010 as well. They finished 8th in 2018 with the league's second best percentage.

In six seasons they turned over a team that won three flags in five years and finished top 4 most seasons and made a GF and Prelim in 2020, 2021 and 2022.

We're not even close to losing what they lost in retirements over that period.

Missing finals would be a colossal failure for this group.

Yeah I've got us at a minimum of 14 & 9

But we could just miss the finals or finish 18 & 5 ... these things are notoriously hard to predict and many get it horribly wrong

But given a reasonable run with imjuries along with fixing our forward line woes, it's hard to see us missing the finals

Edited January 31 by Macca