GPS Distance tracking in games

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,809]

Does anyone know the details of distance tracking in games?
I’m always surprised how little is the total distance covered in a match by players.

If someone just walks at a leisurely pace for 120 min, they’d cover at least 10k. , yet a player who does 15 k in a match is deemed to have covered a lot of ground.

Perhaps the answer is that the GPS devices only register the distance covered when the player is moving at faster than walking pace.

Does any Demonlander know about this?

[Engorged Onion 10,223]

I’m pretty average at maths - but the dimensions of the g (as an example) is 172 metres - let’s minus around 40m for most players not going right into the 20m from goal space typically.

so that’s 130m (plus let’s add 20m for a non straight line run, it takes it to 150m - and if I was to divide that by 15km that’s 100 efforts a match. Or 25 a quarter of running one end to another every minute and a bit. Plus the combativeness…. Sounds like hard graft to me 😎

[sue 9,141]

3 minutes ago, Engorged Onion said:

I’m pretty average at maths - but the dimensions of the g (as an example) is 172 metres - let’s minus around 40m for most players not going right into the 20m from goal space typically.

so that’s 130m (plus let’s add 20m for a non straight line run, it takes it to 150m - and if I was to divide that by 15km that’s 100 efforts a match. Or 25 a quarter of running one end to another every minute and a bit. Plus the combativeness…. Sounds like hard graft to me 😎

Also sounds like something which does not happen.  So Jumping Jack's question is a good one. Anyone...?

[Ethan Tremblay 30,966]

I was amazed how many k’s Ben Brown covers per game. Then remembered his run ups. 

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,809]

At a brisk waking pace you cover about 5 to 6 km in an hour…….. about 10 to 12 k in 120 min.

[Diamond_Jim 12,627]

the game is active for 100 minutes.    Take out close in play (players not involved in the play will be stationary) and shots on goal you are down to say 80 minutes.   Most players are on the field for 80% of game time = 64 minutes on average
Not sure that the above helps answer your question

PS most running is done between the 50m arcs

[Little Goffy 14,639]

The old saying of a completely not famous physics teacher of yesteryear; "The trouble with a brick is it happens all at once".

If someone threw a ping pong ball at you every couple of seconds for 120 minutes, you'd be annoyed. If someone threw the same weight of a single solid object at you in one go, you'd possibly be dead.

Same principle applies to physical effort. Going at double the speed for half as long is a LOT more effort than a good walk. That's why the stats are often broken down into 'sprint efforts' and particularly things like repeat sprint efforts within a short space of time.

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,809]

4 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

the game is active for 100 minutes.    Take out close in play (players not involved in the play will be stationary) and shots on goal you are down to say 80 minutes.   Most players are on the field for 80% of game time = 64 minutes on average
Not sure that the above helps answer your question

PS most running is done between the 50m arcs

Have a look,DJ.

No player is EVER stationary!

[layzie 33,991]

I guess there's a lot of stoppages per game 

[BW511 2,688]

Distance travelled would encompass all movement within gameplay.

Running 15km with jumping, pushing, bumping and tackling is a very different story to a constant jog. Also, a lot of the running is reactive too, so they have to run when they don’t want to.

@Engorged Onionis on the money, Ed Langdon is not covering 15km by doing constant laps of the ‘G, he’s running up and back a 150m stretch in 60-80 metre pieces. If Ed went for a 2 hour run away from play he’d likely cover 30-35km’s

Would love to see how many kicks @Jumping Jack Clennett can pick up by walking the MCG at a brisk pace on game day.

 

 

Edited April 10, 2023 by BW511

[radar 1,865]

Recent footage/audio had close up and sound of Luke Parker in real game time. 
I’d  be in ICU first tackle. 
Elite footballers get crunched - like being hit by motorcycle - who get up for third and fourth “repeat efforts”. 

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,809]

Of course the running done in a footy game is in no way comparable to just jogging with no physical contact!! That's not my point at all!

But my point is that the players are constantly on the move for the whole 120 min ( at stoppages players have to walk/jog/ run to "man up".  They don't just stand like statues)

For an example, let's assume a player sprints  pretty flat out for 30 min of the game....probably at an average of about 3 min per k pace....that's 10 k covered.  Let's assume he walks or jogs slowly for another 60 min. That's another 5k.  Let's (wrongly) assume he's dead still for the other 30 min.(10 min if he's off for rotation for 20 min.)

Wild assumptions, I know, but  that's the 15 k that player covered......more than most.

My point is that I reckon players must walk/run for more than 10 to 15 k in a match. The GPS trackers must only count the distance when they're going over a certain minimum speed.

And thanks, BW511, for speculating irrelevantly on how many kicks I'd get walking briskly on the MCG. I wish I was young enough, fit enough, and good enough to be out there . But I don't think it's relevant to my query.

[daisycutter 29,737]

26 minutes ago, Jumping Jack Clennett said:

Of course the running done in a footy game is in no way comparable to just jogging with no physical contact!! That's not my point at all!

But my point is that the players are constantly on the move for the whole 120 min ( at stoppages players have to walk/jog/ run to "man up".  They don't just stand like statues)

For an example, let's assume a player sprints  pretty flat out for 30 min of the game....probably at an average of about 3 min per k pace....that's 10 k covered.  Let's assume he walks or jogs slowly for another 60 min. That's another 5k.  Let's (wrongly) assume he's dead still for the other 30 min.(10 min if he's off for rotation for 20 min.)

Wild assumptions, I know, but  that's the 15 k that player covered......more than most.

My point is that I reckon players must walk/run for more than 10 to 15 k in a match. The GPS trackers must only count the distance when they're going over a certain minimum speed.

And thanks, BW511, for speculating irrelevantly on how many kicks I'd get walking briskly on the MCG. I wish I was young enough, fit enough, and good enough to be out there . But I don't think it's relevant to my query.

jack, I think you'd be surprised at how much time they are moving at <6km/hr 

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,909]

JJC has asked an interesting question. In a related query, how accurate are GPSs? Given their name, I assume GPSs rely on satellites for their measurements. I'd find it hard to believe a satellite can measure any movement that is less than at least 5 metres at any time, but what would I know?

[daisycutter 29,737]

1 minute ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

JJC has asked an interesting question. In a related query, how accurate are GPSs? Given their name, I assume GPSs rely on satellites for their measurements. I'd find it hard to believe a satellite can measure any movement that is less than at least 5 metres at any time, but what would I know?

and walking around in a very tight circle might get the poor old gps confused

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,809]

4 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

JJC has asked an interesting question. In a related query, how accurate are GPSs? Given their name, I assume GPSs rely on satellites for their measurements. I'd find it hard to believe a satellite can measure any movement that is less than at least 5 metres at any time, but what would I know?

Thanks, LaDVC

The satellite trackers are pretty good at specifying the distance from your golf ball to the pin on the green. Within a metre or two.

I don't think that's the answer.

I was hoping some Demonlander might  be "in the know" as far as the tracking info is concerned.  I'm also interested in the Champion Data employees. There must be at least a dozen at each match. Who are they? How well do they understand footy? It must take a lot of knowledge and experience to judge, for example, what was a hit out to advantage,what was a clanger, a sacrificial act....etc, etc, etc..  Are they well paid?

Do they travel interstate? Or, for example, are the Perth statisticians only  there.? Ditto with Melbourne stats workers etc.?

Do any Demonlanders work for Champion data?

Edited April 11, 2023 by Jumping Jack Clennett
typo

[deanox 9,989]

A quick google search of GPS in elite sport generated links to a number of published, peer reviewed papers discussingnthe topic.

I couldn't see anything about whether the AFL data includes walking around, like discussed here.

But it does seem that with devices used at elite level, a <1% error margin seems achievable, particularly given the ground is flat (not inclined) and there is no overhead obstruction (i.e. trees).

I am unsure what alternative systems they use indoor at Marvel.

[durango 2,023]

GPS data is skewed by players when they kick a goal they rush off the ground to the bench

[Macca 17,032]

8 hours ago, daisycutter said:

and walking around in a very tight circle might get the poor old gps confused

Didn't Mark Jackson do that?

[BW511 2,688]

18 hours ago, Jumping Jack Clennett said:

Of course the running done in a footy game is in no way comparable to just jogging with no physical contact!! That's not my point at all!

But my point is that the players are constantly on the move for the whole 120 min ( at stoppages players have to walk/jog/ run to "man up".  They don't just stand like statues)

For an example, let's assume a player sprints  pretty flat out for 30 min of the game....probably at an average of about 3 min per k pace....that's 10 k covered.  Let's assume he walks or jogs slowly for another 60 min. That's another 5k.  Let's (wrongly) assume he's dead still for the other 30 min.(10 min if he's off for rotation for 20 min.)

Wild assumptions, I know, but  that's the 15 k that player covered......more than most.

My point is that I reckon players must walk/run for more than 10 to 15 k in a match. The GPS trackers must only count the distance when they're going over a certain minimum speed.

And thanks, BW511, for speculating irrelevantly on how many kicks I'd get walking briskly on the MCG. I wish I was young enough, fit enough, and good enough to be out there . But I don't think it's relevant to my query.

The short answer is whilst the players are on the move a lot, there is a hell of a lot of time where they are stationary or barely moving.

Kick ins, goals, stoppages around the ground, centre bounces, injuries, blood rules and rotations.

 

 

Edited April 12, 2023 by BW511

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,909]

14 hours ago, Jumping Jack Clennett said:

Thanks, LaDVC

The satellite trackers are pretty good at specifying the distance from your golf ball to the pin on the green. Within a metre or two.

I don't think that's the answer.

I was hoping some Demonlander might  be "in the know" as far as the tracking info is concerned.  I'm also interested in the Champion Data employees. There must be at least a dozen at each match. Who are they? How well do they understand footy? It must take a lot of knowledge and experience to judge, for example, what was a hit out to advantage,what was a clanger, a sacrificial act....etc, etc, etc..  Are they well paid?

Do they travel interstate? Or, for example, are the Perth statisticians only  there.? Ditto with Melbourne stats workers etc.?

Do any Demonlanders work for Champion data?

I was in the car last night listening to SEN who had someone from Champion Data on. He said that Champion Data have 11 people at every game recording the stats.

[daisycutter 29,737]

14 hours ago, Macca said:

Didn't Mark Jackson do that?

i believe so, unlike tmac who moves in very wide circles 😆

[deanox 9,989]

9 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I was in the car last night listening to SEN who had someone from Champion Data on. He said that Champion Data have 11 people at every game recording the stats.

I watched the stats guys at a Casey game once and there was 4-6 recording stats just for Casey. They obviously had a system, different people recording different information, it was pretty intense.

I am unsure how it works with Champion data at AFL level, but with GPS trackers in every player (and possibly the ball) they may be able to enter data directly into a system that is already catching stuff like possession, and ball location (i.e. nothing whether the ball was kicked or handballed but the system already has the location and the player in possession. And if location of kick and recieve if auto recorded, then the computer would be able to auto compute things like "rebound from 50", "inside 50", long kick vs short kick, etc.