12 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

It wasn't me!

That's it, never ever plead guilty.

8 hours ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

If you truly believe a massive error was made in the non-selection of Grundy, instead of automatically blaming Goody for the decision, consider for a second that it may not have been his choice. Imagine if Grundy himself had decided he didn’t want to be selected for whatever reason and the Club made this public knowledge. What a [censored]-show that would’ve been, right?

Without any inside knowledge, the selection of Schache over Grundy was truly bizarre.  That he was unused made it even more bewildering.  I fully appreciate revealing the full explanation may not have been helpful on the day, albeit announced only 1 hour before the match.  Also understand an emotional post match press conference may not have been wise. 

However, like it or not, this will continually be raised when our finals exit and the new club for Grundy is announced. If Grundy's head was elsewhere and the club felt this, then as disappointing as this would be, most could accept that.

Hopefully, the club and player are still on good enough terms to talk this through and have an agreed and amicable exit strategy.  

As it sits, fingers will continually be pointed which is not fair on either party.

On 9/19/2023 at 10:26 AM, poita said:

The sooner we can move on from this debacle, the better. Nobody has won out of this (except possibly Collingwood), and nobody comes out smelling of roses. Grundy is ultimately most at fault because he has tethered himself to a contract under which he hasn't come close to fulfilling his end of the bargain at two clubs now.

I never liked the idea of tying so much of the salary cap in two aging ruckmen, but the signs from the pre season games were good. Grundy generally performed well in Gawn's absence in the early rounds, but his form and impact declined massively through the middle of the year. I called for him to be dropped weeks before it actually happened, and was not surprised that both Gawn and the forward structure performed better in Grundy's absence. However, circumstances changed and he clearly should have been selected for both finals, ideally starting but as sub at the very least. To think that either Laurie (QF) or Schache (SF) were ever going to contribute more than Grundy is just laughable.

I hope a fair deal can be struck on the opening day of the trade period to get Grundy to Sydney, and we can then focus on finding Max a backup / succession plan. There are plenty of options out there, but it needs to be someone willing to bide their time and learn from Gawn for 1 - 2 years. 

No, the reason it failed was not to do with Grundy. It was because the FD and Max thought that Max could play an effective role forward, which he couldn’t do. Grundy was there to fill the ruck hole effectively. That's it.

Shouldn't we have just signed him for 2 years to see how it worked?

This will go down in one of Goody's biggest stuff ups.

8 hours ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

If you truly believe a massive error was made in the non-selection of Grundy, instead of automatically blaming Goody for the decision, consider for a second that it may not have been his choice. Imagine if Grundy himself had decided he didn’t want to be selected for whatever reason and the Club made this public knowledge. What a [censored]-show that would’ve been, right?

Problem is, you have plenty of media citing his non-selection in finals as “the final straw” or “salt in the wound”, and in general a lot of conjecture about how this fractious situation began in the first place. 

The selection of the team that fateful night does have question marks all over it. Not only the Schache call, but the non-inclusion of Hibberd (which could have freed Smith up to replace MacDonald). It would be nice as a supporter of the club, not only in spirit but with wallet, to have some clarity around the thought process rather than just have to “have faith”. 

As for [censored]-shows, turns out we got one anyway. 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

4 hours ago, Kent said:

still doesnt explain not subbing Schacke

It wasnt meant to explain the sub.

They obviously don't trust Shaq hence the reason he wasn't used or they thought the game was in our control which it was and the decided against it.

Goody doesn't rate the sub going on the last 2 years.

 

Edited September 21, 20231 yr by YesitwasaWin4theAges

9 hours ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

If you truly believe a massive error was made in the non-selection of Grundy, instead of automatically blaming Goody for the decision, consider for a second that it may not have been his choice. Imagine if Grundy himself had decided he didn’t want to be selected for whatever reason and the Club made this public knowledge. What a [censored]-show that would’ve been, right?

Valid point. However if that were the case and he chose to sit out for anything less than serious personal reasons then I'd be extremely disappointed in Grundy and his professionalism. Whether or not he's been treated poorly he's still under contract with us and if healthy should be available for selection. 

Worst case scenario and I'd like to think it's not that one. 

36 minutes ago, dees189227 said:

Shouldn't we have just signed him for 2 years to see how it worked?

This will go down in one of Goody's biggest stuff ups.

He had 5 years remaining on his Pies contract, which he was never going to renegotiate. 

1 hour ago, dees189227 said:

Shouldn't we have just signed him for 2 years to see how it worked?

This will go down in one of Goody's biggest stuff ups.

In hindsight we should have went after a Forward, if we had tapped up a Larkey during last year we could have been lining up for a Prelim tommorow night against BWS.

Let's wait and see what we get from Sydney then we will see if it was a waste. 

Could end up with a better pick than we out laid.

Two AA ruckman in the team sounded like a great idea win-win, preseason looked great, Max went down Brodie stepped up to the plate covered for the big man, they were killing it in the ruck but no goals flowed, something happened between Max & Brodie or FD. Experiment called of and Brodie Banished to VFL a lot of who/ ha in the press, a lot happening behind the scenes and Brodie’s management exploring opportunities with other clubs for a fully fit and healthy Brodie Grundy. We tried and we didn’t make the most of it time to move on, the real story will come out. Good luck MFC & Brodie Grundy.!!!

6 hours ago, Wells 11 said:

Interesting … and not something I had considered. You’re right though,  IF that was in any way true, for whatever reason, it would have been front page news and derailed our preparation. 

Not to mention reduced his trade value significantly.

Who would want to bring in a player who cracks it and doesn't want to play in a final to help his side win?

 

On 9/17/2023 at 9:19 AM, Demonsone said:

Goodwin said Schache was the sub only if Gawn got injured, unbelievable obviously a falling out with Grundy and not valued by him a complete 360 by the coach, frankly not acceptable if this is the case 

Again, this is an assumption. And it’s an assumption made by fans in the absence of knowing the real reasons, which some will say is to be expected because the Club aren’t telling us the whys and wherefores. But it’s an assumption nonetheless. 

Edited September 21, 20231 yr by WalkingCivilWar

7 hours ago, Wells 11 said:

Interesting … and not something I had considered. You’re right though,  IF that was in any way true, for whatever reason, it would have been front page news and derailed our preparation. 

Seems it’s a scenario pretty much no one has considered. In the absence of an official explanation, fans will guess the reasons and more often than not the go-to is that it’s an outrageous error on the part of the Club. After all, you can lead a horse to water, etc. 

2 hours ago, Mel Bourne said:

Problem is, you have plenty of media citing his non-selection in finals as “the final straw” or “salt in the wound”, and in general a lot of conjecture about how this fractious situation began in the first place. 

The selection of the team that fateful night does have question marks all over it. Not only the Schache call, but the non-inclusion of Hibberd (which could have freed Smith up to replace MacDonald). It would be nice as a supporter of the club, not only in spirit but with wallet, to have some clarity around the thought process rather than just have to “have faith”. 

As for [censored]-shows, turns out we got one anyway. 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

The media’s guesswork at play here. 

So much unfounded speculation and nonsense in this thread. 

Grundy wasn’t selected in our finals sides because his partnership with Gawn DID NOT WORK and because Grundy had little to NO FORWARD CRAFT. That’s it. There’s nothing more to it than that. 

You can pot the non-activation of Schache in the second half or the non-selection of Hibberd as the sub all you like, no problem. But please don’t revise history and pretend Grundy and Gawn was anything more than a spectacular failure during the regular season. Goodwin didn’t banish Grundy to Casey for no reason. 

The FD rolled the dice 🎲 on ‘Gawndy’ in 2023 and it didn’t work. Okay, it happens. We lost out on that gamble for one season and can now move the player on to Sydney who will likely take on his full contract and we’ll get a half decent draft pick back from them. 

Time to move on. Also, don’t feel too sorry for Brodie, the bloke is making close to a million shekels a year to tap and kick an inflated ball of pigskin around a mowed field of grass. He’ll be fine. He’ll survive. 

Edited September 21, 20231 yr by BaliDemon

3 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

The media’s guesswork at play here. 

Yes, or “conjecture” as I said  

Anyway, the story will either be told in time, or most likely, remain the stuff of further quiet conjecture among supporters for some time to come. 
 

I will never understand the Hibberd decision though. He was named as an emergency, so not injured. No doubt  carrying a niggle (as many would have been) but would have played out if his skin in his final match, and in turn given us a permanent forward in Smith, rather than MacDonald, who’s inclusion was nothing but a “Hail Mary” in a synagogue. 

 

27 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

The media’s guesswork at play here. 

Be good to hear otherwise if someone knows something 

 

A lot of mind reading and catastrophising going on around here. 

🧐

12 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

Be good to hear otherwise if someone knows something 

 

Of course someone knows something. It’s whether they’re willing to disclose what they know. And clearly, no one is. 

Is Grundy a better option than Hickey?

I think the media are overvaluing the Grundy post injury, looked slow and could not jump in the ruck contests

 

The Grundy in gave some excitement last year and if it worked then all good. It didn’t and we move on, however we are left in a precarious situation Re ruck for next year given Max’s age.

I do however wish our messaging was better sometimes so as to not feed the AFL “media”. Examples - something like “Brodie is now playing for a club that values him” and “Gone back to learn forward craft.” We just end up looking amateurish and silly.

I also can just not fathom signing Schache for another year and then doing everything possible to let him know we don’t value him at all. 
These things would not contribute to us being seen as a desirable destination when players are looking around.

6 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

Yep. That's 100 per cent on Goody.

Laurie was a poor choice in the Qf too.

Also there are some players like Chandler that seem to be on auto select. And others that struggle to get a look in.

We have also recruited poorly in not finding fwd alternatives to Bbb and Tmac. Their issues and form were evident last season. 

This year's finals losses were a combination of several factors and Goody in my knowledge making some poor selections was a reasonable part of it. 

He's still a premiership coach though,  so I guess he's entitled to make a few.

 

Still a little peeved Chandler missed a very gettable 35m running shot for goal in the third quarter

2 hours ago, BaliDemon said:

So much unfounded speculation and nonsense in this thread. 

Grundy wasn’t selected in our finals sides because his partnership with Gawn DID NOT WORK and because Grundy had little to NO FORWARD CRAFT. That’s it. There’s nothing more to it than that. 

You can pot the non-activation of Schache in the second half or the non-selection of Hibberd as the sub all you like, no problem. But please don’t revise history and pretend Grundy and Gawn was anything more than a spectacular failure during the regular season. Goodwin didn’t banish Grundy to Casey for no reason. 

The FD rolled the dice 🎲 on ‘Gawndy’ in 2023 and it didn’t work. Okay, it happens. We lost out on that gamble for one season and can now move the player on to Sydney who will likely take on his full contract and we’ll get a half decent draft pick back from them. 

Time to move on. Also, don’t feel too sorry for Brodie, the bloke is making close to a million shekels a year to tap and kick an inflated ball of pigskin around a mowed field of grass. He’ll be fine. He’ll survive. 

CIrcumstances for the season and this particular game are two different things though. I agree it didn't work as a whole but for this game we needed something.

Max was playing 87% of the game in the ruck and on a busted toe, T-mac gave us zilch in terms of what we needed from a key forward/releiving ruckman. This was a game where Grundy could have given us a little more than what we had on the night and it wouldn't have needed to be much either. A couple of decent marks, stints in the ruck and the ability to move faster than 2kph could have been enough. Hell even if he'd done nothing but just ruck for the forward line and be a big body it would have been better than what we got. 

It's done now, Schache wasted as a sub not even getting on. live and learn (hopefully).

On 9/18/2023 at 9:10 PM, jacey said:

12 weeks ago Goodwin said Grundy is now at a club that values him. 

12 weeks ago.

Disgusting how Grundy has been treated. 

I'm not sure what the biggest Blunder was... This or Clarries Hamstring issues!

1 hour ago, SthSea22 said:

Is Grundy a better option than Hickey?

I think the media are overvaluing the Grundy post injury, looked slow and could not jump in the ruck contests

 

When you consider that Hickey has announced his retirement, Grundy is marginally a better option.