CHANGES: Rd 02 vs Carlton

[58er 6,458]

12 hours ago, binman said:

They scored 78 points.

Jonesy a cert!

oscar also I reckon 

[58er 6,458]

13 hours ago, Deespicable said:

OK clearly the coach is keen on having small forwards, but I just hope that he realises that in hindsight, he took it a step too far with five small forwards against West Coast and that he can play Jackson as a mobile tall, who has the speed to pressure like Spargo or Bedford anyway and one who can also provide a down the line outlet we so sadly missed in Rd 1. Not to mention he can give Gawny a chop out if needed and means that if we lose a tall through injury, it is not game over.

Clearly with shorter games, the pace will be intensified this season and as a result playing three tall backs as we did against WC and most sides is not a realistic option. Many of you have commented that Lever is better as the peel off intercept man, but I'm afraid as he's got older (and stronger) he is now better suited to play on a big. Hence if you are setting up a defence it is May and Lever as talls backed by a quick intercept tall which is Smith at this stage, but already there are promising signs that Rivers will be ready for that role as well soon. O.Mac should only be in the side when one of May or Lever is out injured.

So with the above logic in mind, here's my 22 with the back-ups waiting in the wings in brackets. I have ruled out Bennell and VDB, but clearly they will come into the equation soon. I just hope they wait maybe until Rd 3 or 4 and don't rush them.

Defenders (7): May, Lever, Smith, Hibberd, Salem, Jetta, Harmes - Emerg: Lockhart (very, very stiff), Rivers and O.Mac

Mids (8): Gawn, Viney, Oliver, Brayshaw, Petracca, Tomlinson, Langdon, Jones - Emerg: Dunkley, Sparrow and Preuss

Fwds (7): Fritsch, T.Mac, Melky, Jackson, Pickett, ANB, Weid - Emerg: Bedford, Hannan, Spargo, Petty, Brown

No way Lockhart won't be in 22 or 23.

Jones will be HFFlank 

Hipefully Harmsey in mids and forwards not backs 

[dee-tox 4,835]

Brown has to go. 

Jetta and Hibberd struggled and may be finished.

Spargo was useless but good in pre-season games, 

Don't get the love for Smith. Not a footballer.

Jones and Salem are certainties to come back in.

Can't remember if Lockhart is worth persisting with. Probaby not as  is Salem is back.

Is the Weid up to it?

[Paulo 285]

On 5/24/2020 at 11:03 PM, Simon Port said:

With all of the time off and the players going away and doing their own individual programs, it'll be interesting to see if there are many changes from our round 1 side. Selection will be based purely on training so this will give an opportunity for many players to have a crack at it. We have a few interesting types such as Hannan, Smith and Petty who have shown that when fully fit they are capable. We also have Harley Bennell coming back from that long term injury who could be a classy inclusion if he stays fit. Question marks still surround the selection of Sam Weideman to step up and take a key forward role and at the other end of the ground, Omac always provides a topic for discussion. Are Jones and Hibberd still automatic selections? 

The Round 2 team I would go with:

Jetta May Hore

Salem Lever Hibberd

Langdon Oliver Tomlinson

Melksham Tmac Petracca

Pickett Weideman Fritsch

Gawn Brayshaw Viney

Harmes Bennell Jones t

[Paulo 285]

Could bennell play as a deep forward early this year, until he gains enough match fitness to push further up the ground, 

Bennell.   Weid   Kossie

Fritta.      Tmac.      Tracc

Langdon.     Oliver.      Tomlinson

Salem.    Lever.     Harmes

Jetta.    May.      Hibbo

Max.    Brayshaw.     Viney

Smith.    Jones.    Melk.     Jackson

 

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,850]

15 hours ago, Laughing Goat said:

Backline a worry for me......got exposed in round 1 

I thought most of our defence were outstanding in round 1. Lever, May and O Mac were tremendous in keeping the dangerous duo of Kennedy and Darling to just 1 goal.

Who ever were on Ryan and Sheed were the players that got flogged.

[Demon Dude 425]

1 hour ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

I thought most of our defence were outstanding in round 1. Lever, May and O Mac were tremendous in keeping the dangerous duo of Kennedy and Darling to just 1 goal.

Who ever were on Ryan and Sheed were the players that got flogged.

but that's kind of the whole point. we played 3 key defenders and so we beat Darling and Kennedy, but we got flogged by the smaller players again. we conceded 6 goals from small forwards and 1 goal from tall forwards. our defence is built to stop talls, but not smalls. and it could have been worse, Ryan actually missed 3.

while we also coughed up 5 goals from their mids. our midfield doesn't work hard enough to defend. at one stage I watched Sheed run past all of our mids and not one of them went with him. that sort of thing has become standard under Goodwin. and they don't kick enough goals of their own either.

 

[58er 6,458]

3 hours ago, dee-tox said:

Brown has to go. 

Jetta and Hibberd struggled and may be finished.

Spargo was useless but good in pre-season games, 

Don't get the love for Smith. Not a footballer.

Jones and Salem are certainties to come back in.

Can't remember if Lockhart is worth persisting with. Probaby not as  is Salem is back.

Is the Weid up to it?

Agree re Brown Hibbo Nev Spargo.

Havent been able to judge Joel Smith as he gets injured too often Needs succession of games and again why not forward???

Great to get back Salo (HB) and Jonesy (HF) both automatic.

Lockhart def worth a spot was one of 3 or 4 defenders that dud job. He attacked and was source of drive.

Weid needs this opportunity as Brown looked fragile and underwhelming fumbling marks etc.

intresting yo see final 22/23.

[Laughing Goat 308]

10 hours ago, Pates said:

Did they? They scored 78 points and we held one of the premier FF to 0 goals, 0 behinds and 2 kicks and 2 handballs. We mainly got scored on rebounds and turnovers (unfortunately reminiscent of 2019).

The forward line (and the lack of cohesion with the midfield) was the big worry for me, as that was a major issue last year and we made the same mistakes.

Yes they did.....mostly the first quarter & set up the win in my opinion. WCE controlled  the ball efficiency after that & took the foot of the pedal.

Your right re turnovers & re bounds with 159 effective kicks to ours at 116.

Cohesion no matter at what end takes time to develop & that is something we don't have so will be interesting if things change Pates.

[P-man 13,366]

Everyone who didn’t have Lockhart in their side scored an F on this exam.

[Dee Zephyr 19,267]

Thought Lockhart got better as the game went on. He was guilty of leaving his man a couple of times in the first quarter and getting sucked into the contest allowing easy goals. Hopefully with more experience he learns when to go or not but this thing about getting numbers to the contest in every part of the ground becomes really frustrating at times.

Going back to the preseason doco i remember Goody praising the boys that played against North in the scratch match for having about 90 less possessions and still winning the game. Said something along the lines of you don’t have to possess the ball as much as the opposition if you defend well. The amount of times we see 3-4 defenders running to spoil makes you think it’s a directive. Why hasn’t that stopped?

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,850]

2 hours ago, Demon Dude said:

but that's kind of the whole point. we played 3 key defenders and so we beat Darling and Kennedy, but we got flogged by the smaller players again. we conceded 6 goals from small forwards and 1 goal from tall forwards. our defence is built to stop talls, but not smalls. and it could have been worse, Ryan actually missed 3.

while we also coughed up 5 goals from their mids. our midfield doesn't work hard enough to defend. at one stage I watched Sheed run past all of our mids and not one of them went with him. that sort of thing has become standard under Goodwin. and they don't kick enough goals of their own either.

 

Have to agree with you. We held their key forwards well but what's the point if their small forwards and midfielders are running amok.

The same thing would happen against Collingwood. We'd probably hold Cox and Miocheck but let De Goey, Thomas, Stevenson and Hoskin-Elliott run amok.

It was an extremely poor performance by the club, and as you pointed out, we let the opposition's midfield waltz around us which has been all too common under Goodwin since week 3 of the 2018 finals.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,850]

23 minutes ago, P-man said:

Everyone who didn’t have Lockhart in their side scored an F on this exam.

I thought he earned another game but was he warming the seat for Salem?

Brown, Spargo and probably Bedford are the three certain omissions in my book.

[WERRIDEE 5,479]

8 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

I thought he earned another game but was he warming the seat for Salem?

Brown, Spargo and probably Bedford are the three certain omissions in my book.

Why not Neal-Bullen he was hopeless?

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,850]

Just now, WERRIDEE said:

Why not Neal-Bullen he was hopeless?

And he go too.

I guess he did kick our first goal of the season when nobody else had a clue around goals??

[M_9 2,082]

4 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

I thought most of our defence were outstanding in round 1. Lever, May and O Mac were tremendous in keeping the dangerous duo of Kennedy and Darling to just 1 goal.

Who ever were on Ryan and Sheed were the players that got flogged.

Jetta handed Eagles 2 goals early. Handballed straight to Sheed who put it through from 30m. Ryan goaled (Jetta's man? - maybe Harmes) 2 minutes earlier.

No way Harmes should play back.

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

7 minutes ago, M_9 said:

No way Harmes should play back.

I think there was merit in the idea but with Lockhart's preseason form and solid performance round 1, One of Harmes or Salem should be moved up into the midfield rotation. 

FB: Jetta Omac Hibbard

HB: Salem May Lever 

7th def: Lockhart

Looks like a reasonable defensive structure to go with for now. I'd like to see Harmes playing the defensive/2 way midfielder role again.

[dl4e 5,851]

I would have Sparrow and Petty in my best 22. 

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,850]

2 hours ago, M_9 said:

Jetta handed Eagles 2 goals early. Handballed straight to Sheed who put it through from 30m. Ryan goaled (Jetta's man? - maybe Harmes) 2 minutes earlier.

No way Harmes should play back.

Agreed. Harmes plays his best footy as a midfielder that goes to head with a gun opposition mid and can go down forward and pinch a goal. His goal kicking talents are wasted down back.

Rewind to round 23 and week 1 finals of 2018. Polled near maximum Coaches votes in both games as a pure midfielder.

He can return to midfield and either Petracca plays full time forward or Brayshaw gets dropped to Casey as he’s no good in any other position. Harmes has been moved back to cater for these two - the former a midfield experiment and the latter still living off his third place in the Brownlow.

[whatwhat say what 22,780]

if we don't have harmes go to cripps, who does? viney? head to head with oliver?

i just can't fathom how we have a player who is one of the best run-with mids in the comp and we're going to position him across half-back

17 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

He can return to midfield and either Petracca plays full time forward or Brayshaw gets dropped to Casey as he’s no good in any other position. Harmes has been moved back to cater for these two - the former a midfield experiment and the latter still living off his third place in the Brownlow.

that's the thing tho - trac and harmes can play multiple roles, whereas gus has only showed capability in one role, and one to a high level for less than a season

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,850]

5 minutes ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

that's the thing tho - trac and harmes can play multiple roles, whereas gus has only showed capability in one role, and one to a high level for less than a season

I’d go back to the 2018 model with the addition of a healthy Viney who was excellent in round 1:

Oliver

Viney

Harmes (head to head with gun oppo)

Brayshaw (mostly mid, bit of wing)

Petracca (20 mid / 80 forward)

 

[M_9 2,082]

2 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

I’d go back to the 2018 model with the addition of a healthy Viney who was excellent in round 1:

Oliver

Viney

Harmes (head to head with gun oppo)

Brayshaw (mostly mid, bit of wing)

Petracca (20 mid / 80 forward)

 

Harmes on Cripps - spotting him 10cm but agree he's our best option. Leaves them to find a match for Oliver.

Doubt Brayshaw will play on Wing. Tomlinson and Langdon brought to the club specifically to release the likes of Gus.
Gus half forward for a while? Can kick goals from 50+.

I'd think Jetta on Betts. Geez, Nev had better improve on round one effort.

[Demon Dude 425]

I think they'll take on the Blues midfield first, then will possibly throw Harmes at Cripps if he's winning too much ball. hard to stop Cripps though as he's so big, but Harmes could make him pay going the other way as Cripps is a bit of a plodder most of the time.

is Brayshaw guaranteed a spot in the 22? he was bad in the first half against WCE then improved in the second half, which I think also mirrored a couple of his pre season games from memory. he needs to wake up and come to play right from the first bounce if he wants to be in in the team every week.

[MyFavouriteMartian 572]

3 hours ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

i just can't fathom how we have a player who is one of the best run-with mids in the comp and we're going to position him across half-back

Have you never seen a champ mid go to half-forward,  or deep forward,  in an attempt to throw a tag.?  Harmes needs to learn to play in that role and position,  to round off his skills,  for our long term advantage.

I would try either Salem in the pivot,   or play Brayshaw there, for decent parts of the season.   Salem needs to get game time in the midfield.

 

Rivers also, I'd like to see how he shaped up in the midfield,  to see how he handles that.   Because of his mature body.    I know,  I agree,  he'll be a defender, initially.

 

I'd like to see Sparrow play a combo of centreline,  and half back, as well.  I think hell be a good attacking player,  which is suited to both Mids, and also as a back flanker.  I think he has the strength and the dash,  to cover both areas.

[whatwhat say what 22,780]

12 minutes ago, MyFavouriteMartian said:

Have you never seen a champ mid go to half-forward,  or deep forward,  in an attempt to throw a tag.?  Harmes needs to learn to play in that role and position,  to round off his skills,  for our long term advantage.

I would try either Salem in the pivot,   or play Brayshaw there, for decent parts of the season.   Salem needs to get game time in the midfield.

Rivers also, I'd like to see how he shaped up in the midfield,  to see how he handles that.   Because of his mature body.    I know,  I agree,  he'll be a defender, initially.

I'd like to see Sparrow play a combo of centreline,  and half back, as well.  I think hell be a good attacking player,  which is suited to both Mids, and also as a back flanker.  I think he has the strength and the dash,  to cover both areas.

harmes has already shown he can play forward and thru the mid - but i'd rather have him playing as a key run-with player who hurts his man going the other way - cos, as @Demon Dude said, cripps is a bit of a plodder defensively - than i would have him across the back flank as a mop up and rebound

salem has been tried further up the ground and he just doesn't get involved in the play enough for mine, while brayshaw is even worse stationed in the forward line than he has on half-back; he's a mid, and a bit of a potato

rivers and sparrow are a long way off being best 22 you'd hope, if we're play well

1 hour ago, Demon Dude said:

I think they'll take on the Blues midfield first, then will possibly throw Harmes at Cripps if he's winning too much ball. hard to stop Cripps though as he's so big, but Harmes could make him pay going the other way as Cripps is a bit of a plodder most of the time.

is Brayshaw guaranteed a spot in the 22? he was bad in the first half against WCE then improved in the second half, which I think also mirrored a couple of his pre season games from memory. he needs to wake up and come to play right from the first bounce if he wants to be in in the team every week.

i tend to agree with the first bit - head to head to begin, then harmes is a run-with option if cripps is absolutely dominant and they're doing well...i'm personally fine if cripps gets it 40 times and we win by 42...

brayshaw SHOULD be guaranteed a spot in the 22 but he's super, super lazy between the contests and ultimately we have a two pure mid only types - oliver and viney - who are significantly better than he has been performing over the last season and a bit