Jump to content
  • Podcast:      

Sign in to follow this  
Demonland

The Breaking of Nathan Jones

Recommended Posts

5 minutes ago, america de cali said:

If other clubs supporters had true respect for Jones they would be trashing and cursing him like we and others do to the likes of Selwood, Martin, Rance, Hodge, Franklin and other players who know how to win. They would never speak of Jones like that. Jones gets soft respect because he is ineffectual and benign and they are happy to have him keep on playing forever for us.

The difference being they are all premiership players in ruthless, successful clubs.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

The difference being they are all premiership players in ruthless, successful clubs.

 

The lack of ruthlessness keep the likes of Jones playing for us well past his time. Many better players have been tapped on the shoulder at successful clubs. That’s the law of nature that our club seems to have forgotten. 

Edited by america de cali
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great Respect for Nathan Jones, to play for as long as he has with extremely poor sides, for a club with massive off field issues and to stick fat, most players would have jumped of the sinking ship.  The ship did plug the holes for a year but these plugs couldn't with stand the pressure of 2019.  Hopefully we have a stronger ship in 2020, my fear is we will never have strong enough structures to stop the boat leaking again.

On his on field performance, last 2 years he has be moved around a lot and really don't know what position they see him playing, he isn't a defender, gets lost on the wing and really is a in the guts type of footballer.  Unfortunately, the club sees him behind a few for the role he should be playing.

Edited by drdrake

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, america de cali said:

The lack of ruthlessness keep the likes of Jones playing for us well past his time. Many better players have been tapped on the shoulder at successful clubs. That’s the law of nature that our club seems to have forgotten. 

We did tap players on the shoulder in the past, only problem was that it led to Neeld being coach. 
 

Jones is a has been though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, america de cali said:

The lack of ruthlessness keep the likes of Jones playing for us well past his time. Many better players have been tapped on the shoulder at successful clubs. That’s the law of nature that our club seems to have forgotten. 

I think you're moving the goal posts a bit now mate.

Your point was Jones wasn't hated like the players you mentioned. Opposition supporters don't generally bother hating clubs that aren't successful.

And as far as 'tapping on the shoulder' goes, he was still being selected by a coaching group that had no problems dropping Vince and Lewis, so I'm not sure you can categorically state he's deserving of that 'tap' without being inside the club.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, dworship said:

Wow, now I'm really impressed. This was my first reaction.

safe_image.php?d=AQDO0oCBZWAjhUEk&url=ht

Credit to @Sir Why You Little for having the good grace to appreciate this one.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, nacnud said:

We did tap players on the shoulder in the past, only problem was that it led to Neeld being coach. 
 

Jones is a has been though.

Our problems then were far deeper than a few ageing players. That has been well documented. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, america de cali said:

Our problems then were far deeper than a few ageing players. That has been well documented. 

True, get ourselves right off field and we can succeed on field.

Anyways, Jones is still playing mainly for the sake of leadership and with an actual preseason should hopefully improve on last year. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, america de cali said:

Our problems then were far deeper than a few ageing players. That has been well documented. 

What else has been mentioned by coach and player during last season was the roles Jones was being given. If Jones was fulfilling those, then coach and player would be comfortable. We don't know the conversations that were had.

Jones will get games this year and will be given roles to carry out by the coach's. They may end up only being cameos but if they add value he may well get more time than people believe. When Crawford finally got his GF medal it wasn't just on sentiment it was playing a role. If memory serves, he didn't play every game that year, even when fit (think it was a little over half).

If Jones is managed correctly and we get to the finals he will find something within himself and the coach will know that.

I couldn't think of anything more fitting.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, TRIGON said:
12 hours ago, dworship said:

Wow, now I'm really impressed. This was my first reaction.

safe_image.php?d=AQDO0oCBZWAjhUEk&url=ht

Credit to @Sir Why You Little for having the good grace to appreciate this one.

Agreed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jones deserves enormous respect from all Dees fans for his resilience during some really awful years. I can't see a role for him in our best 22 in 2020. He is a centre mid or he is not in the team. He would have been more highly regarded as a contested ball mid who could drift forward to kick a goal from the 50 if he'd played in better teams in his prime. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This conversation seems to resurface every few weeks. This is less about Nathan Jones and more about the 20 players on the list who failed to step up and take his spot last year.

Jones played 22 games last season because he was seen as a far better option, even when the season was shot, than the likes of JKH, Stretch, J.Wagner and a bunch of others who have previously been given many opportunities and failed every time.

I expect Jones to play round 1 and he will hold his spot until someone puts together a solid enough run of performances at Casey to take it off him. Given our lack of depth and his durability, there is every chance he will play game 300 in round 15.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, poita said:

This conversation seems to resurface every few weeks. This is less about Nathan Jones and more about the 20 players on the list who failed to step up and take his spot last year.

Jones played 22 games last season because he was seen as a far better option, even when the season was shot, than the likes of JKH, Stretch, J.Wagner and a bunch of others who have previously been given many opportunities and failed every time.

I expect Jones to play round 1 and he will hold his spot until someone puts together a solid enough run of performances at Casey to take it off him. Given our lack of depth and his durability, there is every chance he will play game 300 in round 15.

Good points. I hope our depth improves enough. 
we need it

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, PaulRB said:

I think Jone will have a resurgent year without the “weight” of the captaincy to bear. 
Have faith. 

He could be a real dangerous small forward, he’s a good kick at goal and a decent mark.

  • Like 1
  • Shocked 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, BrisbaneDemon said:

He could be a real dangerous small forward, he’s a good kick at goal and a decent mark.

Dismissing the point that he's as slow as a wet week, and would apply next to zero forward pressure.

But, yeah, I'm sure he'd be a "real dangerous small forward"...

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

37 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

Dismissing the point that he's as slow as a wet week, and would apply next to zero forward pressure.

But, yeah, I'm sure he'd be a "real dangerous small forward"...

If Goodwin can sort out our press, he won’t be a liability.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, BrisbaneDemon said:

He could be a real dangerous small forward, he’s a good kick at goal and a decent mark.

Sorry that just simply isnt true. His marking has never been a feature. And even if he did make a decent small forward we need quality small forwards or need to develop them quickly. Cant cop jones being picked ahead of Pickett for example. 

Edited by Gouga

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, BrisbaneDemon said:

He could be a real dangerous small forward, he’s a good kick at goal and a decent mark.

Decent mark?  Contested  marks 2019 - Nil.
For career,  27 at an average of 0.09 per game. 
He is a good kick for goal but he tends to hang off the contests just outside 50 waiting and calling for a teammate to win the ball and get it to him. Never mind looking after an opponent or winning the ball himself. Seriously if his teammates were deaf, he would never get the ball.

Edited by america de cali
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If he can keep up that form today as a forward I would be ecstatic. I love him kicking for goal.  I understand his weaknesses, he could be nice addition forward of centre.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I picture Jones being similar to what we had with Lewis and Vince in their last seasons, he’ll be in and out of the side potentially depending on injuries or demanding form. He will be valuable at times when younger blokes are tiring and he just knows how to get that extra 1% out of himself. 

He played very well in Marsh 1, so right now is in the 22 for round 1. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nathan deserves a lot of respect.

However, the last few seasons has shown that Nathan's time to finish has come.

It comes to everyone. Given the financial rewards these days, we see too many players trying to hang on to their careers. Nathan has given a lot to the club but the club and the game has given a lot to Nathan, his material lifestyle, and, his future. There are not many people that are able to set themselves up for life in their early 30's.  

Also there is a lot of ego involved. And there are plenty of people (friends, supporters and club personnel) encouraging a player to keep going. Gary Ablett is one example of this influence. .

As they say in the classics, its always better to go out on on top rather than on the slide. Ablett should have retired. Sure he is still a great player, but he has become a shadow of his former self. 

The easy decision for Nathan was to step aside as Captain. The harder decision was retirement.

He has chosen to go on. I think its a mistake both for Nathan and the club. It was time for him to take the burden off his shoulders.

He is the past and not the future. This is where a wise coach could have intervened and encouraged the player to retire with dignity. I suspect that if Clarkson had been the coach, the outcome would have been different.

If we have a successful year and he is part of it, then his decision to go on may seem the right one. However, if he retains his place in the team, it still stops the development of a young player or someone that could contribute to team success for several years.

If we have another poor year, then Nathan could become an embarrassment. And on a personal level, he will find it very difficult to motivate himself, given his comments on 2019.   

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, hemingway said:

Nathan deserves a lot of respect.

However, the last few seasons has shown that Nathan's time to finish has come.

It comes to everyone. Given the financial rewards these days, we see too many players trying to hang on to their careers. Nathan has given a lot to the club but the club and the game has given a lot to Nathan, his material lifestyle, and, his future. There are not many people that are able to set themselves up for life in their early 30's.  

Also there is a lot of ego involved. And there are plenty of people (friends, supporters and club personnel) encouraging a player to keep going. Gary Ablett is one example of this influence. .

As they say in the classics, its always better to go out on on top rather than on the slide. Ablett should have retired. Sure he is still a great player, but he has become a shadow of his former self. 

The easy decision for Nathan was to step aside as Captain. The harder decision was retirement.

He has chosen to go on. I think its a mistake both for Nathan and the club. It was time for him to take the burden off his shoulders.

He is the past and not the future. This is where a wise coach could have intervened and encouraged the player to retire with dignity. I suspect that if Clarkson had been the coach, the outcome would have been different.

If we have a successful year and he is part of it, then his decision to go on may seem the right one. However, if he retains his place in the team, it still stops the development of a young player or someone that could contribute to team success for several years.

If we have another poor year, then Nathan could become an embarrassment. And on a personal level, he will find it very difficult to motivate himself, given his comments on 2019.   

 

 

I agree with all of that except that he should have retired or been pushed. I think we've learnt our lesson from James McDonald's exit. Sometimes there are cultural intangibles that are more important than just the football. I have no doubt he understands if he's good enough he will play if he isn't he won't. But keeping him sends a clear cultural message of respect to the playing group which outweighs the cost of his position on the list. 

  • Like 1
  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Social Media

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles

    SUNSMART by George on the Outer

    If you don’t want to get sunburnt, you follow the Sunsmart rules.  Melbourne took the advice and with their season on the line, avoided getting burnt by the Gold Coast Suns, with a gripping 17 point win. It was a match that could have gone either way, with the sides within a kick of each other for all but the final minutes of the final quarter. Melbourne had stretched the lead earlier in the game to 18 points, but that quickly evaporated to a neck and neck race to the finish.  Finally,

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    NORTH OF THE BORDER by The Oracle

    The outcomes of Melbourne’s recent games against the Gold Coast Suns are a pretty good barometer of how the teams are faring. The Demons easily accounted for them twice in 2018, the last win being a 96-point cakewalk at the MCG in Round 20 when they scored a whopping 21.17.143 to 7.5.47. Ironically, Melbourne’s score of 9.3.57 at the first break that afternoon is leading its highest score for a full game to date this year by 3 points. In those days, they played fast, skillful football, moved th

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews 5

    PACK YOUR BAGS by George on The Outer

    The scene was captured by the TV camera’s before the match with a view of the Melbourne side’s bags packed next to the team bus to facilitate their flight up north to the AFL hub where they will play their next matches. However, on the basis of the efforts against Richmond, unless things change, and change rapidly, there will be some who will be told to pack their bags on a more permanent basis. Once again, the supporters got much the same story from this match against Richmond, as

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    SOUTH OF THE BORDER by the Oracle

    Thankfully they moved this week’s game from Sydney where the sun shines and the virus breeds ever so slowly and almost nobody returns a positive test. The change of fixture comes at precisely the right time to allow everyone in town to head to the MCG on Sunday at around 3:30pm, not to catch up with what’s going on inside the ground but rather, to do what’s fashionable for woke folk in 2020 — pulling down statues. It’s time for Kevin Bartlett and Leigh Matthews to go but you can’t touch Norm Smi

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    LESSONS IN LOSING by George on the Outer

    Turn up for the game and look like you want to win it.  Melbourne lost this game to Geelong, a game after a couple of extended breaks, looking like they were at the end of a 22 game season. Right from the start there was a lack of intensity across the board, as the Demons played exactly the type of game that the ageing Geelong list wanted. Geelong repeatedly played possession footy, to avoid having to run those ageing legs, something that Melbourne failed to exploit.  To use the oft quot

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    QUARRANTINO by Whispering Jack

    At a little after 4.00pm last Saturday, the MCG ceased to be the centre of the AFL universe. That was when the AFL’s el supremo Gil McLaughlin announced that the Bombers’ Conor McKenna had returned a COVID-19 positive result and declared that the game set for the following day between Essendon and Melbourne was postponed.  What followed was truly the stuff of a pulp fiction novel. We witnessed a suitcase load of mental gymnastics and spin calculated to let McKenna (and the Essendon Football

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    WHADDA WE SING? by Whispering Jack

    When the Melbourne team sang “The Grand Old Flag” last Saturday at Marvel Stadium in the absence of skipper Max Gawn, Ed Langford and Adam Tomlinson who were first time winners at their new club and Jayden Hunt, the leading goal kicker of the day it was passed off as an honest mistake. Taken in isolation, it most probably was accidental but the problem is that little accidents have been happening far too often in the club’s recent history and, in this case, it was symptomatic not only of a day t

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    A POINT OF DIFFERENCE by George on the Outer

    It was Melbourne v Carlton at the comics stadium; a game between 16 and 17 in 2019. How could anyone pick a winner?  There had to be a point of difference, and so it would prove to be as the Demons literally fell over the line at the end, by a solitary point. In an almost complete replica of the Richmond v Collingwood game two nights previously, one of the sides (Melbourne in this case) rushed out to a five goal lead in the first quarter, while the Blues failed to bother the goal umpir

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    EXPOSED FORM by The Oracle

    Carlton fancies itself to beat Melbourne at Marvel Stadium on Saturday and, based on exposed form, why not? The Blues took it right up to the reigning premiers in their last up start and the Demons were simply horrible against the Eagles at Optus Stadium. That opening game of the season revived all of the nightmares of 2019 for a team that went inside the 50 metre arc 45 times, an advantage of 10 times over the home side and yet lost by almost five goals. Such statistics sum it up for a gam

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    SOCIAL DISTANCING by George on the Outer

    It was good to see the MFC players practicing the directives about social distancing at the game against West Coast.  Pity was that they continued to do so after the first bounce of the ball, as they allowed numerous WCE players run around un-hindered, with not a Melbourne player within 1.5 metres of them! They then found themselves looking at nearly a 5 goal deficit at the first break, which was to be essentially the final margin for the game. It is difficult to judge exactly what is going

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    BEST IN SHOW by Whispering Jack

    I am writing this knowing that the AFL has deemed that the opening round of competition will proceed but fully believing that it should not.  The world is going through cataclysmic change as a result of the overwhelming spread of the Covid-19 virus and I agree that a distraction like sport would be good for the public. However, while the physical threat to the population is bad enough, there are other  issues to be addressed including the mental health of the community and the effects on th

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    TASSIE DEVILS by Van Demon

    If you were looking for something new from the Demons that wasn’t there last year, you didn’t have to look further than the perfectly trimmed grass surface of UTAS Stadium last night as the team steamrolled the Hawks to record a comprehensive 32-point victory to complete their Marsh Community Series commitments for 2020. One new thing was the fact that for the second Marsh game in a row, the team finished full of running and they dominated the second half without the presence or the dominan

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

×
×
  • Create New...