Tom Green (Drafted by GWS Giants)

[Mickey 4,647]

9 minutes ago, Deebacle said:

No but considering you must think we are, you might be able to explain the possible Jackson Draft with Gawn and Preuss.

Pretty easy. Jackson is an 18 year old kid who won't be impacting in the ruck for a number of years. Gawn has 4-5 years tops, by which stage Jackson will be 22-23. Preuss is an ok first ruck but hardly a star.

The recruiters seem to think Jackson can play forward too. That means he can contribute early in an area we lack (KPF), while he develops his ruck craft under Max.

[Accepting Mediocrity 1,418]

2 minutes ago, Deebacle said:

No but considering you must think we are, you might be able to explain the possible Jackson Draft with Gawn and Preuss.

Not saying we should take Jackson, but Gawn and Pruess are irrelevant in the decision. If he makes the grade, Jackson probably won't be much chop til he's 22-24. A week is a long time in football; half a decade is an eternity. 

On topic, Green looks the goods. More of what we have, but you can't turn down class when available. Wouldn't be disappointed if we bid.

[DeeSpencer 25,425]

45 minutes ago, WERRIDEE said:

Bidding on Green is a must. GWS mustn't get everything 

Making your own side worse to prevent GWS - who have never won a flag - getting better. Sound strategy that one.

Besides 'everything' for GWS might not be another big body midfielder, it might be a gun ruck who can compliment their already elite midfield.

[SwissDee 43]

I'm not a fan of stats, but Champion Data has Green as number 2 (Rowell 1, Anderson 3, Jackson 4). Some are saying that he would be number 1 if he wasn't in NSW. It would be an amazing turn of events if GWS didn't match the bid. Who's to say the bid won't come from GC (though I understand the strategy of Rowell and Anderson being mates)

If we bid on Green at 3 and GWS don't match, I won't be crying

[4_Kent_Watts 869]

27 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Making your own side worse to prevent GWS - who have never won a flag - getting better. Sound strategy that one.

Besides 'everything' for GWS might not be another big body midfielder, it might be a gun ruck who can compliment their already elite midfield.

How could getting Green be making our side worse? 

[Axis of Bob 11,671]

1 hour ago, Deebacle said:

No but considering you must think we are, you might be able to explain the possible Jackson Draft with Gawn and Preuss.

He plays as a forward and allows us to play Max as an attacking weapon in the ruck rotating forward. 

Or he’s just the best player available. If you’ve got two gun ruckmen then you can make it work as a weapon, especially if one is as mobile as Jackson. West Coast were equal top when Naitanui did his knee near the end of 2018, and won the flag with a two ruck combo. 

Or do you think we shouldn’t draft the best player available because he’s not a half back flanker?

[spirit of norm smith 16,245]

1 hour ago, Good Lord George said:

Pretty easy. Jackson is an 18 year old kid who won't be impacting in the ruck for a number of years. Gawn has 4-5 years tops, by which stage Jackson will be 22-23. Preuss is an ok first ruck but hardly a star.

The recruiters seem to think Jackson can play forward too. That means he can contribute early in an area we lack (KPF), while he develops his ruck craft under Max.

Jackson is no forward. No footy smarts. 

[spirit of norm smith 16,245]

IF TOM GREEN IS AVAILABLE AT PICK 3 (which he will) THEN DEES MUST NOMINATE HIM. Cripps like player.  Definitely a future star.  If the Giants want him, they will have to pay top dollar !!

[Axis of Bob 11,671]

14 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Jackson is no forward. No footy smarts. 

How would you know this? How much have you watched him play as a forward?

[Willmoy1947 4,078]

5 hours ago, Nascent said:

Interesting thought. Have a gentleman's agreement to not bid on Green to allow them to have two top 5 players on the proviso they trade us a player on the cheap next year. I like it, surely they have a surplus of mids if they take Green as well.

Nothing short of clearing Kelly for nothing.

[DeeSpencer 25,425]

49 minutes ago, 4_Kent_Watts said:

How could getting Green be making our side worse? 

If in the recruiters opinion he’s not as good as Jackson then by comparison our side is worse. 

We should focus on doing what’s best for us to beat 16 other teams. If we lose a knockout final to a dominant GWS team then so be it, that’s better than where we are right now. 

[Willmoy1947 4,078]

Green is a must. If you want to use the Cripps analogy, and you had have put Cripps, a gun mid, into the GWS side last game, they would have seriously shaken the "big tree in the sky"

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

We’d have to be super certain in Jackson to not pick Green if he’s available.

I’ve seen this script many times before, and it’s rarely turned out particularly well. For us, at least.

I really hope we don’t balls this up.

 

[WERRIDEE 5,433]

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Making your own side worse to prevent GWS - who have never won a flag - getting better. Sound strategy that one.

Besides 'everything' for GWS might not be another big body midfielder, it might be a gun ruck who can compliment their already elite midfield.

Why will our side be worse with Green in it? One of the best kids in the draft.

[DeeSpencer 25,425]

22 minutes ago, willmoy said:

Green is a must. If you want to use the Cripps analogy, and you had have put Cripps, a gun mid, into the GWS side last game, they would have seriously shaken the "big tree in the sky"

Very good player Cripps. Clearance machine, best in the league. Averaged 8.4 a game last year.

But at the Giants:
Hopper 6.2
Taranto 5.3
Coniglio 5.1
Kelly 4.6
Greene 3.7
De Boer 3.5
Mumford 3.5
Whitfield 3.3

Compared with the Blues:
Cripps 8.4
Kreuzer 5.5
Ed Curnow 4.7
Sam Walsh 3.4
Marc Murphy 3.4

There's one player on that GWS list who's old and about to retire and every other player is either in their prime or still young and improving. Hopper finally got inside midfield time and was a top 10 clearance mid in the game when given the chance, he could go up a level again if he keeps getting more centre square time.

The only other older guy is Cal Ward who's coming back after missing the whole year and of course Coniglio's coming in as well. 

The Giants aren't thinking they really need the next Cripps. They know they are absolutely loaded with mids. They want a 2 for 1 deal but what they would really like is Jackson or Young.

 

[Fat Tony 5,217]

I hope we go for Green. He looks the safest pick in this year's draft. And he's a good size to be able to go forward and be dangerous.

[DeeSpencer 25,425]

10 minutes ago, WERRIDEE said:

Why will our side be worse with Green in it? One of the best kids in the draft.

I'd answered this above but the best thing for us is to take the best kid that we identify and let the Giants be the Giants. Our job isn't to take a slightly lesser kid just to thwart them.

[RDBhero 65]

On 10/10/2019 at 5:56 PM, spirit of norm smith said:

We would definitely nominate him.  He will be a Cripps like midfielder. Scary given talent at Giants already. 

I’d nominate him to annoy Giants and make them use max points to match it.  

Gold Coast nominating him would be more interesting!

[dazzledavey36 54,197]

1 hour ago, Axis of Bob said:

How would you know this? How much have you watched him play as a forward?

He hasn't.

Started playing ruckman then resting key forward later towards the year at Colts level and by all reports really drove his bargain up even more due to some of his potential he showed when playing up forward.

I know @Pennant St Dee has a good eye for talent up the West. Were you able to see him live down at Colts level?

[spirit of norm smith 16,245]

1 hour ago, Axis of Bob said:

How would you know this? How much have you watched him play as a forward?

Exactly. Jackson has not played as a forward.  It’s about position and leading and competitive marking. Jackson has not shown this so why suddenly in the AFL?? Ridiculous 

[Axis of Bob 11,671]

6 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Exactly. Jackson has not played as a forward.  It’s about position and leading and competitive marking. Jackson has not shown this so why suddenly in the AFL?? Ridiculous 

Yes he has .... Taylor specifically spoke about it in the podcast. He watched him play after the championships where he was very impressive as a forward who still got the ball 20+ times a game. 

You’ve never even seen him even play in the position. In fact you didn’t even know that he had played the position! So how can you say that he “is no forward. No footy smarts”? You cannot.

 

[spirit of norm smith 16,245]

Didn’t play forward against carnival against Vic country or against Vic metro.

 Kicked how many goals?? ZERO. or points ?? ZERO or marks within 50??? One.     IN 4 GAMES. 

[Willmoy1947 4,078]

44 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Very good player Cripps. Clearance machine, best in the league. Averaged 8.4 a game last year.

But at the Giants:
Hopper 6.2
Taranto 5.3
Coniglio 5.1
Kelly 4.6
Greene 3.7
De Boer 3.5
Mumford 3.5
Whitfield 3.3

Compared with the Blues:
Cripps 8.4
Kreuzer 5.5
Ed Curnow 4.7
Sam Walsh 3.4
Marc Murphy 3.4

There's one player on that GWS list who's old and about to retire and every other player is either in their prime or still young and improving. Hopper finally got inside midfield time and was a top 10 clearance mid in the game when given the chance, he could go up a level again if he keeps getting more centre square time.

The only other older guy is Cal Ward who's coming back after missing the whole year and of course Coniglio's coming in as well. 

The Giants aren't thinking they really need the next Cripps. They know they are absolutely loaded with mids. They want a 2 for 1 deal but what they would really like is Jackson or Young.

 

You are right DS, these stats are indisputable. Harder at it were Richmond, fitter, smarter and better coached. Would Cripps have dragged two on ballers and made it easier for creation type play. I don't know. Creativity and hardness don't usually gel. But could a Cripps ie a Green be the whole Martin package.

[Axis of Bob 11,671]

3 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Didn’t play forward against carnival against Vic country or against Vic metro.

 Kicked how many goals?? ZERO. or points ?? ZERO or marks within 50??? One.     IN 4 GAMES. 

Ha ha ha! You’ve really leant in to the ignorance, haven’t you.  

Although it’s obvious, and you clearly know this and are trying to bluff your way out of this pit, I will mention that he has played other games of football other than these four games specifically. I know this because Jason Taylor specifically talked about the thing that you claim never to have happened. 

Anyway, enjoy the draft.

[spirit of norm smith 16,245]

Tom Green should be nominated at 3.  He is a Cripps like player. We cannot allow Giants a free swing. Make them pay maximum points if they want him.  

If they don’t match, I’d happily bring him into a red and blue jumper.