POSTMATCH: Rd 21 vs Collingwood

[Farmer 702]

2 hours ago, DSP said:

Forget the last quarter, Pies had shut the engine off.

We have some bloody average footballers in this team.

I disagree. Pies needed to win by 10 goals. Considerable angst on their bench and coaching area

[titan_uranus 22,753]

14 minutes ago, Cards13 said:

Financially this has to have been a disaster season. Losing Anzac eve and Queens Birthday in the same year was a ridiculous call by the [censored] n AFL. Obvs the terrible product onfield has made it so much worse. 

Our fixture this year gave us home games against Essendon, Collingwood, Richmond and Hawthorn, along with a Friday night vs Sydney. We'll get ANZAC back next year and then every year we'll get one of them as a home game guaranteed.

The risk was that the Collingwood, Richmond and Sydney games were in the final month which meant that we needed both sides to be going well (particularly us) in order to draw big crowds. 

The rain at both the Richmond and Collingwood games didn't help but the fault rests almost entirely with us for failing to be competitive when the big home games came around.

[titan_uranus 22,753]

3 minutes ago, Farmer said:

I disagree. Pies needed to win by 10 goals. Considerable angst on their bench and coaching area

Yep I agree with you. They need the percentage and they need to build form for their final two 8-point games.

I reckon people saying they put the cue in the rack are just looking for things to be negative about.

[Skin Deeamond 339]

2 hours ago, Lord Travis said:

Rubbish game. Scoreboard flattered us as we kicked some junktime goals after not giving a yelp for 2.5 quarters. May injured again. Lever destroyed by Mihochek, he’s no good one on one unfortunately. Those two big trades have set us back big time. 

Looks like another rebuild looms. We need to hit the top end of the draft hard again to get more young talent in. 

Cale Morton, Jimmy Toumpas and Jordan Gysberts??!

[Cards13 9,117]

19 minutes ago, praha said:

on the plus side if we have a good year next year it'll be very beneficial. 

Mate I see it raining $100 notes next year, while riding a unicorn fairy. 

[Robbie57 1,996]

Well what a pack of miserable old sods you are, we get a 129 cms of fresh snow and all I hear is complaints. There is no pleasing some dees supporters.

 

 

(Omac was alright today and looked like a weight had been lifted from his shoulders.)

[Choko 493]

Well I have to say I haven't posted in quite some time, but I am totally and utterly sick of the same players, and the team generally, making the same mistakes week in week out.

I don't want to name names for the players making the same errors week on week, but I have serious concerns about the coaching team's ability to influence and improve players' flaws. Too many players who choose the wrong options or can't execute basic skills. 

As for the team, we continue to be moths to a flame. We draw too many to the contest (at ground level and in the air) and don't defend on the outside. Every week. We half lead, not to advantage, then kick it to even less advantage. We fail to tackle well enough to stop the ball going out to the opposition's advantage. We cannot keep the ball in our forward line. 

Same every week

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

46 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Our fixture this year gave us home games against Essendon, Collingwood, Richmond and Hawthorn, along with a Friday night vs Sydney. We'll get ANZAC back next year and then every year we'll get one of them as a home game guaranteed.

The risk was that the Collingwood, Richmond and Sydney games were in the final month which meant that we needed both sides to be going well (particularly us) in order to draw big crowds. 

The rain at both the Richmond and Collingwood games didn't help but the fault rests almost entirely with us for failing to be competitive when the big home games came around.

I heard that we are set to post a masssive loss this year. It’s prwtty disappointing really. I feel like this club is slipping back to where it was prior to Roos and Jackson. The president isn’t strong and self interested, Pert is arrogant and te coach has a wonky game plan. We are on a path to nowhere 

[At the break of Gawn 3,672]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

IMO they didn't beat us, we beat ourselves. When we limited turnovers we were on top (first and fourth quarters). When we turned it over we gave up score after score (second and third quarters). And we couldn't hang in there because we kept missing easy shots.

We're clearly trying to move the ball differently, with far more kick-mark than playing on and handpassing. The problem is that too many of our players aren't good enough at this gameplan for it to work for four quarters.

Hibberd, Viney and Jones are a massive part of our current problem. All three turn it over by foot far too much, Hibberd destructively so. Viney isn't adding enough as a midfielder and Jones is really lost out there position-wise.

Hunt shouldn't be played in the backline again. He's either a forward or not in the side. Ditto Fritsch - what a waste of a season by playing him back/wing for so long.

There's some really terrible commentary about some individual players in this thread though. JKH was one of our best, Lever was actually quite good, and although I don't like OMac at all he did a better job of a tall forward/second ruck than pretty much everyone else we've tried there recently.

Gawn was down on his best but Grundy didn't dominate at all. They sort of nullified each other but that's not an unreasonable result when the two best ruckmen play each other.

I agree with most of this except for Lever.

He’d be on double the money of Miocek, yet Miocek made him look like a VFL defender. If Lever doesn’t have an AA year next year, the early judgement will be that the Lever trade was a poor decision.

[trout 385]

1 hour ago, praha said:

31k at the MCG today. Of which 28k were Pies supporters. How big a hit has this season had on us? We lost the Pies home game and every big crowd was an away game. Bet your [censored] Jag will jump ship. Zurich must be counting the days. 

Today was absolutely horrible and I can't wait for this chlaymdyia of a year to end.

Pert on 3AW before the game said if we had been in finals contention ( like Richmond and Collingwood ) you could have expected about 80,000 last week and this week. Costing us about $400,000 over the two weeks, pressure will mount on Goodwin internally very quickly if this crap continues.

[Skin Deeamond 339]

1 minute ago, trout said:

Pert on 3AW before the game said if we had been in finals contention ( like Richmond and Collingwood ) you could have expected about 80,000 last week and this week. Costing us about $400,000 over the two weeks, pressure will mount on Goodwin internally very quickly if this crap continues.

Not so. Many of those supporters would have been MCC members.

[olisik 4,060]

3 minutes ago, trout said:

Pert on 3AW before the game said if we had been in finals contention ( like Richmond and Collingwood ) you could have expected about 80,000 last week and this week. Costing us about $400,000 over the two weeks, pressure will mount on Goodwin internally very quickly if this crap continues.

We arnt even in ‘contention’ which would only require us to be in the top 12

[Deecisive 1,663]

sorry but i just dont understand our game plan, everyone zoneing off. Players dont stand close to opposition players that way if the opposition miskicks it we are in a good position to intercept and kick a score from rebounds. Rebounds were extremely successful today, just not for us. let the opposition take easy kicks from kickins, let them continue to short pass all along the line because we are zoning not manning up. or opposition kicks to an unmanned player so one of our players down field leaves the general region of his man to cover the mark only to have the ball passed to his opposition. rinse and repeat. Then once it gets into their forward line hang together like a  bunch of bananas and fall all over each other.  so how many uncontested marks and kicks did the pies have again....

I miss the old style of play where you played close to your own man. you tackled the man with ball and kept pressure on all day long. admittedly the leave sidebottoms alone strategy did work to some degree, the poor fellow wore himself out getting so many kicks and running around the ground that he may have injured himself.

 

[Monocology 1,108]

3 hours ago, Wadda We Sing said:

Collingwood wont do anything in finals..

Yet we instill belief.

[binman 39,083]

6 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I agree with most of this except for Lever.

He’d be on double the money of Miocek, yet Miocek made him look like a VFL defender. If Lever doesn’t have an AA year next year, the early judgement will be that the Lever trade was a poor decision.

Agree.

Telling that Lever got moved off Mihocek (who is a pretty handy rookie pick up by the pies it must be said) after gifting him a mark and his fourth goal and onto Roughead, a novice forward 

Still confident it will be a good decision to trade him in but as you say needs a big 2020 for that to be the case, given 2020 will be his third season at the club.

[olisik 4,060]

1 minute ago, Deecisive said:

sorry but i just dont understand our game plan, everyone zoneing off. Players dont stand close to opposition players that way if the opposition miskicks it we are in a good position to intercept and kick a score from rebounds. Rebounds were extremely successful today, just not for us. let the opposition take easy kicks from kickins, let them continue to short pass all along the line because we are zoning not manning up. or opposition kicks to an unmanned player so one of our players down field leaves the general region of his man to cover the mark only to have the ball passed to his opposition. rinse and repeat. Then once it gets into their forward line hang together like a  bunch of bananas and fall all over each other.  so how many uncontested marks and kicks did the pies have again....

I miss the old style of play where you played close to your own man. you tackled the man with ball and kept pressure on all day long. admittedly the leave sidebottoms alone strategy did work to some degree, the poor fellow wore himself out getting so many kicks and running around the ground that he may have injured himself.

 

Agree, not sure where half a team doesn’t get a tackle in the first half can be considered a game plan.

[KLV 1,684]

3 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

If someone could invent a brain implant which makes you oblivious to footy until your team starts playing finals footy, I’d be the first to buy. 

I think a lot of people have that implant already. I saw most of them at the finals games last year.

[olisik 4,060]

Lever looked like OMac today, got towelled by a player picked from the VFL. I have big concerns that this trade will really set us back a long way.

[Watts the matter 1,235]

1 minute ago, olisik said:

Lever looked like OMac today, got towelled by a player picked from the VFL. I have big concerns that this trade will really set us back a long way.

It was always a poor trade but we are incredibly lucky that we finished where we did last season. The fact we don't appear to have salary space to chase any big name players now is also telling and shows how poor our list management has been. We have a bunch of overpaid players on our list and Lever is just another one of them.

[titan_uranus 22,753]

I genuinely don't understand the Lever criticism, which I suppose might mean I'm on my own in thinking he was OK.

He could be better, and we all want him to be an AA-defender week in and week out, but I thought he was pretty good today. There are so many other parts of our game today that stood out to me as problematic rather than Lever.

As I said, maybe I'm on my own on this, but I really think too many have stupidly high expectations of him, the more so when the commentary around someone like Preuss is generally far more positive.

[olisik 4,060]

1 minute ago, titan_uranus said:

I genuinely don't understand the Lever criticism, which I suppose might mean I'm on my own in thinking he was OK.

He could be better, and we all want him to be an AA-defender week in and week out, but I thought he was pretty good today. There are so many other parts of our game today that stood out to me as problematic rather than Lever.

As I said, maybe I'm on my own on this, but I really think too many have stupidly high expectations of him, the more so when the commentary around someone like Preuss is generally far more positive.

Mihocek kicked 4 on him before he was moved off him. I would almost put my money that OMac would have fared better. Almost

[titan_uranus 22,753]

Just now, olisik said:

Mihocek kicked 4 on him before he was moved off him. I would almost put my money that OMac would have fared better. Almost

Sure, Mihocek kicked 4, but at the game I never felt like that was because he was beating Lever (e.g. I didn't see him beating Lever in one-on-one contests, or leading him to the ball).

Again, I might be wrong about that. Do you recall (or can you find video of) Mihocek's goals being a direct result of poor play by Lever?

[olisik 4,060]

Just now, titan_uranus said:

Sure, Mihocek kicked 4, but at the game I never felt like that was because he was beating Lever (e.g. I didn't see him beating Lever in one-on-one contests, or leading him to the ball).

Again, I might be wrong about that. Do you recall (or can you find video of) Mihocek's goals being a direct result of poor play by Lever?

Yep, when Mihocek ran in to mark in front of Salem, with Lever just watching and not making a contest.

Lever also had 0 tackles.

[Axis of Bob 10,379]

4 hours ago, olisik said:

We messed up the Lever trade. Injury prone player who can’t kick.

 

3 hours ago, Axis of Bob said:

Ha! You are trying so hard to make this stick, aren't you? Despite everything, you just want it to happen so, so hard.

You're wrong, of course, and Lever was excellent today, but it's just a bit sad watching you trying so hard to make this a thing.

I feel like giving you a couple of little pats on the head while reminding that there are people in your life that still love you. 

Chin up, sport.

9 minutes ago, olisik said:

Lever looked like OMac today, got towelled by a player picked from the VFL. I have big concerns that this trade will really set us back a long way.

If you didn't try so hard to shoehorn this in every time then it would be a little bit less sad. 

You've jumped on a losing side really early and you're trying desperately to make it an issue. But it's only an issue to you. And it's only an issue to you because you took the wrong side too hard too early as part of some 'hot take' you were making.

Now you're just holding on like a gambler who's down a bundle but swears the next spin will be a green.

Stop embarrassing yourself. It's very difficult for some of us to watch.

[binman 39,083]

2 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Sure, Mihocek kicked 4, but at the game I never felt like that was because he was beating Lever (e.g. I didn't see him beating Lever in one-on-one contests, or leading him to the ball).

Again, I might be wrong about that. Do you recall (or can you find video of) Mihocek's goals being a direct result of poor play by Lever?

Three that i can remember:

One: allowed Mihocek an easy run and jump at a marking contest and didn't even get body on him

Two: lever gave away a holding free kick (though to be fair it was very soft).

Three: he got completely lost, slipped and allowed Mihocek and uncontested mark 10 meters out from goal.