POSTGAME: Rd 10 vs GWS

[At the break of Gawn 4,460]

2 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Who was playing on Himmelberg?

Oscar, but I think Hore went onto him in the last.

[TRIGON 4,783]

6 hours ago, poita said:

Hibberd is 30 in January, and has generally been terrible this year. Jetta has been carrying a knee injury for at least 12 months, so blame the club for his current absence. Salem is a big loss. May is fat and lazy, and no guarantee of improving the side even if he gets fit. Lever is massively overrated on these boards, but will at least add some leadership. Hannan is a fringe player who was dropped several times last year. Kolodjashnij is all but done as an AFL player. Smith has played 11 games in five years and is yet to prove he can be a consistent AFL player. 

Yes, these players are individually better than the guys who have replaced them, but there is enough talent in the current team that they should be performing much better than we saw yesterday. I don't think that getting players back will automatically fix the problems we clearly have.

Go easy on the Prozac Pete.

[John Demonic 5,804]

49 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

Oscar, but I think Hore went onto him in the last.

There was a critical goal in the first half that should've been touched on the line but Oscar was completely oblivious to a Himmelberg bump that pushed him over the goal line and away from a goal saving spoil. ?‍♂️

Just remembered that one. Bloody clueless.

Edited May 27, 2019 by John Demonic

[jnrmac 20,097]

2 hours ago, waynewussell said:

I'm delighted to bring you up to date on Wagner. His 22 possessions was 9th best on the day... that's 9th best taking all 44 players into account. We acknowledge that he lacks polish, but there is a lot to like, a lot that is coachable. He gives a contest and does not shrink back into his shell under pressure. He keeps at it, gives his all, every time. Yes, we have better players in his position. When they are all fit he is likely to find his way back to VFL ranks, however, we are fortunate to have players who will play their role and contribute when called upon.

LOL. I have seen enough of Wags. He is not up to it no matter how hard he tries.

22 possessions. DE of 43%. So he gave it to the opposition more than 11 times. Your easily pleased. I think he's a coach killer and confidence destroyer for his team mates.

You do realise that every time one of our players turns ot over like that it throws the game plan out the window. Every other player has to turn around and chase their opponent and we leak goals because players are out of position? They get tired more quickly and its a death spiral as tired players turn it over more often.

But you are about possessions as a stat. As if that means anything. You should have spent more time watching GWS and how they deliver the ball to their team mates. You might learn something.

[jnrmac 20,097]

52 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

Oscar, but I think Hore went onto him in the last.

Figures. I wonder if some here still think he is AA material?

Or will never be dropped again in his career. What a joke.

 

[waynewussell 5,763]

35 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

LOL. I have seen enough of Wags. He is not up to it no matter how hard he tries.

Not up to what?

You may delight in making sweeping statements about a player who doesn’t meet your lofty standards (without noting his obvious contribution in his most recent outing). I prefer to acknowledge those that were giving us something when it was difficult to find a winner across the board. We just have a different focus. You seem to have a very high opinion of your ability to identify a weakness, run a line through a player and cast a 25 year old to the scrapheap.

I don’t have the same high opinion of your analysis. I quoted possessions as an indicator of his ability to find the pill. I also recognize that his finding of the pill was on the high side for the role he was playing… no more, no less.  

[dimmy 1,307]

27 minutes ago, waynewussell said:

Not up to what?

You may delight in making sweeping statements about a player who doesn’t meet your lofty standards (without noting his obvious contribution in his most recent outing). I prefer to acknowledge those that were giving us something when it was difficult to find a winner across the board. We just have a different focus. You seem to have a very high opinion of your ability to identify a weakness, run a line through a player and cast a 25 year old to the scrapheap.

 

I don’t have the same high opinion of your analysis. I quoted possessions as an indicator of his ability to find the pill. I also recognize that his finding of the pill was on the high side for the role he was playing… no more, no less.  

Agree with you wholeheartedly.. Players can improve. After the first round Marty Hore was branded as not up to it, another useless find to the club, only VFL standard etc. Now these knockers are saying we have found a new gun.

Josh Wagner had only played 1 game with NM so he has upside, but he has a very important ingredient : ATTITUDE.  Coaches lave people like that.

[Beetle 4,660]

3 minutes ago, dimmy said:

Agree with you wholeheartedly.. Players can improve. After the first round Marty Hore was branded as not up to it, another useless find to the club, only VFL standard etc. Now these knockers are saying we have found a new gun.

Josh Wagner had only played 1 game with NM so he has upside, but he has a very important ingredient : ATTITUDE.  Coaches lave people like that.

You're thinking of Corey.

[Adam The God 30,266]

23 hours ago, Dee Zephyr said:

De Boer has many scalps this season tagging, there’s another one. Not that it would have made a difference but why not throw Oliver forward in patches and bring Gus back in the middle. 

Oliver started at full forward in the last quarter.

I think they do throw him forward at times, but eventually you have to try and get him into his best position in the midfield. I like that he's taken a couple of contested marks recently. If he can add that to his game, he'll be able to kick a few more goals as a result when played one out in the forward line. 

Contested marking is what Cripps has on him at this stage, but Clarry is a much better kick.

[leave it to deever 17,511]

1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

LOL. I have seen enough of Wags. He is not up to it no matter how hard he tries.

 

Agreed. Yea he was ok but all his other games have been below par.

[Deemania since 56 6,651]

2 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

Oscar, but I think Hore went onto him in the last.

So it was Hore who beat him into submission? Must surprise a few on DL. 

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,778]

8 hours ago, waynewussell said:

Josh Wagner was one of our best throughout the first half but is always branded as not up to AFL standard here

His disposal efficiency was 45%, the worst in the whole team

Given he got 22 touches, that's 12 potential turnovers, pretty big issue for a defender

Edit: Apologies for the repetition of stats, just catching up

Edited May 27, 2019 by Graeme Yeats' Mullet

[Deemania since 56 6,651]

2 hours ago, jnrmac said:

LOL. I have seen enough of Wags. He is not up to it no matter how hard he tries.

22 possessions. DE of 43%. So he gave it to the opposition more than 11 times. Your easily pleased. I think he's a coach killer and confidence destroyer for his team mates.

You do realise that every time one of our players turns ot over like that it throws the game plan out the window. Every other player has to turn around and chase their opponent and we leak goals because players are out of position? They get tired more quickly and its a death spiral as tired players turn it over more often.

But you are about possessions as a stat. As if that means anything. You should have spent more time watching GWS and how they deliver the ball to their team mates. You might learn something.

Interesting thought, worthy of some consideration ... delivery to space will force our players to run into possession. That is what makes Pendlebury so useful, all game, for The Filth. His teammates always know that his delivery will be in THAT EMPTY SPOT, and fast, too.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,225]

On 5/26/2019 at 6:20 PM, dieter said:

Geez, reading some of the above you'd think the last day of the world was nigh. 

Keeps shirts on, lad and lasses. We are looking at a team which is totally decimated by injuries, has been all season.

End of story. Get over it. Looking for scapegoats for injuries is futile.

Doesn't excuse effort

[waynewussell 5,763]

Rusty Nails posted this in another thread... Seems like kicking efficiency is very much in the eye of the beholder. I gather that a kick is deemed efficient if it is marked or taken cleanly by another member of the team... doesn't seem to take account of the pressure one is under when taking the kick or the skill of the receiver when approaching the ball that was delivered. If the kick goes directly to an opponent who is under no pressure from one of our blokes... now I would regard that as inefficiency of the highest degree... At least this chart conflicts with some of the strong opinions expressed at Demonland. 

MFC Ave Kicking Efficiency Rankings to Rnd 9, 2019

[Dr. Gonzo 24,225]

On 5/26/2019 at 6:42 PM, one_demon said:

Goodwin says Lever, May, Hannan, Salem, Hibberd, Weideman, JKH, Kolodjashnii and ANB are all available next week

FCS he better be taking a long term view and not rushing back guys before they're ready just to salavge some respectability from this disaster of a season. I don't care if Lever, May, Hannan, Hibberd or Kolodjashnij play (again) this year - the focus should be on a long term plan to make sure they're cherry rule for round 1 2020

[Dr. Gonzo 24,225]

3 minutes ago, waynewussell said:

Rusty Nails posted this in another thread... Seems like kicking efficiency is very much in the eye of the beholder. I gather that a kick is deemed efficient if it is marked or taken cleanly by another member of the team... doesn't seem to take account of the pressure one is under when taking the kick or the skill of the receiver when approaching the ball that was delivered. If the kick goes directly to an opponent who is under no pressure from one of our blokes... now I would regard that as inefficiency of the highest degree... At least this chart conflicts with some of the strong opinions expressed at Demonland. 

MFC Ave Kicking Efficiency Rankings to Rnd 9, 2019

If a kick goes 40m to a contest it is deemed an efficient disposal regardless of whether the team maintains possession.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

12 hours ago, pinkshark said:

Yeah the one who kicked 40 odd goals for us each year.  But you are probably right, he's clearly no good.

He's excellent.

But he wouldn't commit to the club long-term. He wanted to play in Perth.

We 100% made the right call. Our problem isn't trading Hogan, it's the complete lack of form of TMac and Weideman combined with the ineptitude of those kicking it to them.

12 hours ago, Stevienic23 said:

Basic 1 percenters that become momentum shifting is what does me in. In the first qtr himmelberg kicks a goal that goes through 2 meters high as Max has been bumped off the line. Two mins later Mcdonalds shot from 45m out doesn't make the distance and is touched on the line and there's no one there to shepherd it through. 

Agree. The non-shepherd of TMac's shot at the start of the second killed us. We had a modicum of momentum at that point and could have got the crowd up with an early goal. TMac not making the distance is bad enough, but no one in the goal square to shepherd it through is unforgivable. Absolutely unforgivable.

[Lucifers Hero 39,870]

10 hours ago, waynewussell said:

Rusty Nails posted this in another thread... Seems like kicking efficiency is very much in the eye of the beholder. I gather that a kick is deemed efficient if it is marked or taken cleanly by another member of the team... doesn't seem to take account of the pressure one is under when taking the kick or the skill of the receiver when approaching the ball that was delivered. If the kick goes directly to an opponent who is under no pressure from one of our blokes... now I would regard that as inefficiency of the highest degree... At least this chart conflicts with some of the strong opinions expressed at Demonland. 

MFC Ave Kicking Efficiency Rankings to Rnd 9, 2019

That highlights the problem brilliantly!  Our worst kicks are in the midfield or the forward line which is exactly why we can't keep the ball i50 and can't kick a winning score. 

And, to me it highlights a major flaw in our 'chaos', play on at all costs styled game plan.  Simply, 'chaos' football does not allow time for players to lower the eyes or gain composure.  So, kicking efficiency suffers.

Our major problem is in the fwd half and it will not be overcome simply by getting injured players back. 

[Dr. Gonzo 24,225]

On 5/26/2019 at 7:54 PM, Sorry kids said:

I think we are the most 'confidence" reliant side in the competition and think this should be explored if it has not already by a professional.  Perhaps it comes from a combined lack of individual confidence which is on display when we play poorly. Conversely when we hit our straps we play like few others. Its as if our guys are saying," wow, we are better than I thought. It was on display again today,

Do we have a sports psychologist on the books? If not we definitely need one and should've had one 20 years ago (though I remember Daniher specifically was against it/thought it was rubbish)

[Sorry kids 635]

16 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

If a kick goes 40m to a contest it is deemed an efficient disposal regardless of whether the team maintains possession.

Terrible stats for Viney, Brayshaw and Harmes.

[Farmer 884]

On 5/27/2019 at 10:14 AM, Lucifer's Hero said:

A real worry for me is Tom Mc.  He has improved in recent weeks with a couple of goals.  Nonetheless, he doesn't get separation from his man to mark, nor is he able to bring the ball to ground and let the small forwards go to work. 

Has he lost the ability to jump?  Also, did he fail to make the distance with a shot for goal from about 40m yesterday?

I know the mid field is bombing it in but Tom should at least bring the ball to ground if he can't mark but he rarely is in a position to do so. 

Well surely you can see the problem. Last year, most of  the time he was playing alongside Hogan. Weideman hasn't made it, so Tom McD is the only tall forward we have. He attracts the best defender each week. And yes, he is  not in great form. He tried bloody hard as he always does 

 

[Deemania since 56 6,651]

13 minutes ago, Farmer said:

Well surely you can see the problem. Last year, most of  the time he was playing alongside Hogan. Weideman hasn't made it, so Tom McD is the only tall forward we have. He attracts the best defender each week. And yes, he is  not in great form. He tried bloody hard as he always does 

 

Agree with this Farmer. It is simplistic but a clear picture emerges that this has been the case and will continue to be so until TMac is supported - this will most likely come from Preuss - and should come from Preuss as he is a pre-occupation that opposition teams will continually struggle with to block, dismantle and foil. We have spent a long time preparing the Weed. It has been costly so he must bite the bullet as a Team man. All deep forwards additionally need support from the ants at ground level, as well; particularly those who show some guts and determination.

[Farmer 884]

On 5/27/2019 at 6:00 PM, leave it to deever said:

 

Agreed. Yea he was ok but all his other games have been below par.

Well he was better than OK I thought, but he MUST develop his kicking on the R foot. Every time he turns back onto the left he either falls over or is caught.

[Farmer 884]

22 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Doesn't excuse effort

If u think this team isn't trying, u r not watching