Farewell Jesse Hogan

[durango 2,023]

The person would not be able to do so unless the contract signed by the player was in the company name and no club would be allowed to use this method because the player is a sole trader and would be considered tax avoidance by the taxation office.

[SFebes 4,884]

The fact that Hogan or the club havent denied any of it doesn't sound too promising does it?

[Ted Lasso 19,549]

5 minutes ago, Demons11 said:

Won’t happen. 

I’d say pick 5 and a 2nd rounder 

5 & 6 or he stays... I bet you they will give both up. They’re that desperate 

[ManDee 7,222]

4 minutes ago, SFebes said:

The fact that Hogan or the club havent denied any of it doesn't sound too promising does it?

Febes that is where I differ, we can benefit form this deal, so I'd say no news means it could be good news. They are probably negotiating the steak knives.

 

Edit:- No player is more important than the club. If we trade out of a player and get better value elsewhere then go for it.

Edited September 27, 2018 by ManDee

[DubDee 26,121]

can one of you accountants open a separate Tax thread on the general board for the love of all things holy!

[SFebes 4,884]

1 minute ago, ManDee said:

Febes that is where I differ, we can benefit form this deal, so I'd say no news means it could be good news. They are probably negotiating the steak knives.

Agree mate, if we can get 5 & 6 out of this buckle up!

[ManDee 7,222]

1 minute ago, SFebes said:

Agree mate, if we can get 5 & 6 out of this buckle up!

If it is 5 & 6 or similar I don't think we go to the draft with both. I would expect more horse trading for established stars. We my friend are in the window for a flag!

[Yokozuna 1,004]

Dont want him to leave, at all. We are in the stage of trying to win a GF, and we need him in my opinion.

not with everyone who says no comment means he is going, but yes he may.

dont want draft picks unless we can move them on for someone proven.

i would prefer to keep a known quality player like hogan over a potential good player or two.

[beelzebub 23,383]

5 minutes ago, ManDee said:

Febes that is where I differ, we can benefit form this deal, so I'd say no news means it could be good news. They are probably negotiating the steak knives.

 

Edit:- No player is more important than the club. If we trade out of a player and get better value elsewhere then go for it.

well put

I somehow sense you may be right about the negotiating...i.e...its the periphery  perhaps. I also get a feeling for us to maximise the benefits of value here the deal will be convoluted. It will to a degree be about how other clubs ( not us ) value certain picks and combos.

If Jesse goes I believe the club is quite sure it has in mind the player/s( at least the types )  it wants in return. 

[layzie 34,012]

1 hour ago, Dappa Dan said:

lol... Everyone wants to know, no-one wants to do the homework.

I imagine your knowledge is similar to mine. I believe players are RFAs until after their 7th season when they become fully free agents. But for all I know that might have been adjusted multiple times.

Couldn't have hit the nail sweeter!

Yeah I'm going by the 7+ year thing. I'm sure there's other things involved.

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

2 hours ago, daisycutter said:

85 pages and sadly i am none the wiser

Sadly though, i'm still happy, and lever can play forward anyway....

[Adam The God 30,420]

3 hours ago, Bring Back Barassi said:

I have heard May referred to by some tv hacks as the 2nd best defender in the league, not that that means anything, but I suggest he is better than a good average backman

He's ordinary. Vanilla. 

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

2 hours ago, Grand New Flag said:

The word I am getting is that Hogan is not looking for a trade this year, but would not say no if one comes up to Freo.  Hogan has indicated he wishes to play out his contract but is yet to decide whether he will sign a new contract with Melbourne or Freo.

He has not and is not expected to ask to be traded this year.

How I would play this is as follow:

Do not trade Hogan this year unless something massively stupid overs comes up. 

• With Hogan we are in the Premiership window next year.  Many Demonlanders badly underrate Hogan.
• We may win a Premiership with him next year.  It is unlikely, certainly less likely without him.
• Unless there is some sort of disaster Hogan will have the same currency next season as he does this season.  Possible more.
• West Coast will likely join the bidding for 2020, delaying gives them 12 months to prepare, further increasing his value.
• Hogan is not a RFA until 2021 so there is no fear of him just leaving.
• Hogan may choose to stay at Dees over the coming 12 months.
• Most importantly this will give the Dees 12 months to work on recruiting Kelly. It would give us the picks and the salary cap to secure Kelly. The two top 10 picks we receive for Hogan can be used to get Kelly.

So I say roll the dice. Dont trade him this season. More upside to wait.

 

 

The only problem with that, that springs to mind immediately is that the rest of the Team has to "believe" enough to play alongside him for all of next year, keeping in mind most will have signed up for the long haul at "team umbrella rates" possibly.

[Moonshadow 17,677]

52 minutes ago, bing181 said:

All those “Dees better without Hogan” articles and posts couldn’t have helped his frame of mind re staying. 

You honestly think he reads Demonland or media/social media at all, especially at trade time? I am confident that players are told not to look at footy forums and to keep their social media accounts closed.

Edited September 27, 2018 by Moonshadow

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

2 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

FWIW, Karl Langdon just mentioned on SEN that he bumped into Jesse's mum outside Optus Stadium last week and "bombarded her with questions". She said Jesse loves living in Melbourne, he was homesick initially, but given his dad's death, does not have that drawcard anymore. He said she told him she loves coming to Melbourne city about 6 times per year to visit Jesse (I thought she lived in Melbourne???). Langdon flippantly added Hogan would be more likely to go to another Melbourne based club than to WA.

This is Karl Langdon, though, so grain of salt.

Which one of the first four games that he played in did he fall on his head???

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

2 hours ago, chook fowler said:

Personally, I don’t care who is in the side that gets us a flag - as long as we get one.

Yep i want a Flag that i can be proud of.......

[Red and Blue realist 2,058]

6 minutes ago, willmoy said:

The only problem with that, that springs to mind immediately is that the rest of the Team has to "believe" enough to play alongside him for all of next year, keeping in mind most will have signed up for the long haul at "team umbrella rates" possibly.

That's just not right, there's still players on our list that are unsigned and guys that are signed right now that might move on. Just because someone is out of contract at the end of the year shouldn't make any difference as to how their team mates play alongside them for the year. It'd be like saying the team don't 'believe' in Lewis because he's likely to retire at the end of the next season.

This is one area the NRL really excel at, player movement happens a year out and it makes no difference to how they or the team plays.

[Redleg 41,451]

1 hour ago, Demons11 said:

Won’t happen. 

I’d say pick 5 and a 2nd rounder 

Ridiculous.

You value him less than Lever, Gibbs at 29 and Wingard. First two were 2 first rounders and Wingard is being placed in the same category, a hot and cold flanker.

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

10 minutes ago, Red and Blue realist said:

That's just not right, there's still players on our list that are unsigned and guys that are signed right now that might move on. Just because someone is out of contract at the end of the year shouldn't make any difference as to how their team mates play alongside them for the year. It'd be like saying the team don't 'believe' in Lewis because he's likely to retire at the end of the next season.

This is one area the NRL really excel at, player movement happens a year out and it makes no difference to how they or the team plays.

Do you think that's why the Tigers bowed out when they found out who was coming onboard from GC and for how much?

[Redleg 41,451]

There was talk of Freo swapping pick 4 if Neale is traded, or 5 for picks 9 and 10, I think with Port.

If we trade Jesse for say 4 and 5 why cant we do that trade. We then would have 5 , 9 and 10. We could use 10 in a trade and have 5 and 9 in the draft to take top end talent.

You could then end up with 3 players for Jesse.

[Olgreybeard49 242]

1 hour ago, Smokey said:

All this tax talk has me thinking. To any people here proficient in tax: 

Could a player set up a company, have their salary paid to the company - and then pay themselves a modest wage over a period of time to save on tax? In theory that person could buy assets under the company too, like houses and cars etc. Hello 30%? 

Short answer - no. Long answer would be more boring than my last contribution.

[Ted Lasso 19,549]

1 minute ago, Redleg said:

There was talk of Freo swapping pick 4 if Neale is traded, or 5 for picks 9 and 10, I think with Port.

If we trade Jesse for say 4 and 5 why cant we do that trade. We then would have 5 , 9 and 10. We could use 10 in a trade and have 5 and 9 in the draft to take top end talent.

You could then end up with 3 players for Jesse.

Yep I think that’s a good plan! Pick 10 I think is also a fair deal for may. So head to the draft with a couple of top end picks and get in may! 

Or even package up 5,9 and chase another good player 

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,708]

11 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Ridiculous.

You value him less than Lever, Gibbs at 29 and Wingard. First two were 2 first rounders and Wingard is being placed in the same category, a hot and cold flanker.

Couldn't agree any more with you Redleg. Why do people undervalue our players on this forum? 

Edited September 27, 2018 by Win4theAges

[corowa 216]

1 hour ago, Yokozuna said:

Dont want him to leave, at all. We are in the stage of trying to win a GF, and we need him in my opinion.

not with everyone who says no comment means he is going, but yes he may.

dont want draft picks unless we can move them on for someone proven.

i would prefer to keep a known quality player like hogan over a potential good player or two.

 

Our window of opportunity is the immediate 3 or 4 years.

We want 'good' players now, not high draft picks who might or might not develop into players as good as, or better than Hogan. And who might take 4 or 5 years to reach that level.

Too risky! Past experience shows this in spades.

Trade Hogan only if the trade immediately strengthens our team and prospects of winning the GF next year.

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,708]

7 minutes ago, Redleg said:

There was talk of Freo swapping pick 4 if Neale is traded, or 5 for picks 9 and 10, I think with Port.

If we trade Jesse for say 4 and 5 why cant we do that trade. We then would have 5 , 9 and 10. We could use 10 in a trade and have 5 and 9 in the draft to take top end talent.

You could then end up with 3 players for Jesse.

He's on fire.