Post Match Discussion - Preliminary Final

[BarnDee 287]

[censored] off  but proud of the dees this year   but gotta murder lower teams stk etc  losing those games is just not on  

[layzie 34,023]

Finally got home. It’s been a tough one. A few conflicting emotions but will try to keep it as consistent as possible. 

This was a lifetime game personally, I’ve been this nervous and pumped for maybe half a dozen other days in my life. It felt like the final frontier. And just like that, it was over. Nice while it lasted, but as Melbourne fans we know all too well that nothing has ever come to us easy.

We looked so nervous before the game. The build up, the drama it all got too much I think. Oliver needing to go the bathroom before the bounce was a sign of that. We got slaughtered in contested ball from the word go, and that was it. This allowed them to take over with their skill and outside game with uncontested marks. Hawthorn threatened this a little last week, West Coast took it to levels beyond belief. By half time it was 11 inside 50 marks to 1 and it’s already been documented about the tackle count. 

Turnovers killed us. West Coast were way too good. I’m actually not going to nit pick too much on individuals because there is no point. As a team we failed. Lewis had a complete honker, worst game I have ever seen him play. At least 6 players with a 0 for tackles. 

But really, it was a bridge too far anyway. First finals appearance in 12 years and two great finals wins, this moment was coming as it does with most young teams/teams in this position. In the history of the game I would be shocked to hear than a team who hasn’t won a flag for over 50 years and then hasn’t made the finals for 12 years has waltzed in and won the flag. This is JUST NOT POSSIBLE, it cannot happen. You have to go through this hardship and get the experience. Someone will n doubt point out that Collingwood hasn’t made it for 5 years and could win it all well that’s great! Do you want a medal or a showbag? 

They will learn from this. They have to. They have a duty to go on with the narrative that they are setting up, the Demons are finally relevant again and we have people’s attention. The season ended terribly but we took a big step. I believe now that this is the team that is going to get us there, I believe now that this is the coach that is going to get us there.

I want to now point out some things said so far that he’ll sum up how I feel, because there are a lot of emotions. I think these are all good points:

In Harmes way - “It’s a long time to same time next year. What a disappointment.”

It certainly will. I felt this when we just missed last year and it burned like buggery. No guarantee we’ll even be there either but all we have is hope.

DSP - “We are still are way off top 3-4. Big difference.”

Yeah I never thought we were top 4. Top 6 was about right and there are a few things that need to be rectified to break into it.

SWYL - “Natural improvement isn’t the answer”

Unfortunately the pessimist in me agrees with this. To think that we’ll automatically be in a prelim next year is wishful thinking. At the end of the day we may well have blown our best chance with a lot of teams like Essendon and Brisbane ready to get a rifle and pick off teams in this year’s 8.

SWYL - “But this club has history of not getting up after being belted”

Again SWYL isn’t wide of the mark. Severe beltings seem to have a lingering effect on us. You are quite often left wondering if that was the moment. Gonna take a big change to right it this time.

Titan Uranus - “Our game starts and ends with contested ball”

It certainly does. We play in the phone box most of the time. Break even with us there and you’re a chance. Being a great contested ball side is awesome and I’ve really enjoyed it, but we must be able to run and spread to the outside a bit. These guys are humans and although they are great at winning hard ball, all it takes is 1 off game like this to go to water.

Nasher - “I'm perpetually frustrated at the way people become irrational and grossly exaggerate the magnitude of the problem after losses (and get told I don't care as much or I'm a happy clapper or whatever), but that's how people cope so fair enough.”

Yep, too right Nasher, I’m done with it. Don’t get me wrong, happy to critique but there is just no point at all demanding 1 guy gets the chop because he had a howler like everyone else did. It’s stupid. 

I do not believe we need to make wholesale changes, yes we need re-tooling but that is it. The game plan, while solid is also not being executed to its full capacity yet and I believe another season or two will see it firing. The quick ball movement through the middle is great but still erring with that one handball too many or putting a guy under pressure. Keep refining this and it is going to be very hard to stop. 

I say at this point in time I’ll probably head to somewhere for a getaway next week but who knows. I have never not watched a Grand Final apart from in 2002 when I was on a remote island in Greece. Sorry to all the Victorian marks or people still annoyed at today but I hope West Coast goes on with the job. They are a good side and have great forwards. Please smash Collingwood back to the Stone Age. 

Lastly, Peter Jackson. Your efforts will never be forgotten. All the best and live life to the full, you deserve it.

Edited September 22, 2018 by layzie

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

2 minutes ago, Stand and Deeliver said:

Awful first half should not detract from good year. As Richmond also found out, in prelim week you are always one bad game from disaster.

A good mate who's a Swans supporter says he envies our list - i reckon he's right.

Now, if only we could add a solid key defender...

Jake Lever goes ok.

[puntkick 325]

51 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

That was odd wasn't it.

The whole game was perplexing to me, not saying it happened but it was as if they all got food poisoning or something.

I think the Russians intervened !

[Wiseblood 24,637]

11 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Whilst I agree the failures were in winning the contested ball I thought for the first 10 minutes or so of the game we weren't terrible around the ball and got it forward a few times but were unable to lock it in. Just locking it in our half for a while would've stalled the Eagles momentum.

I said to my wife that, with a few of those early shots, we needed a goal.  It would have settled the nerves and we could have gotten down to business.  As it happens we didn't kick a goal and the Eagles strangled us around the contest.  The rest is history.

[Stand and Deeliver 6]

Indeed he does.

 

After Darling and Kennedy, maybe he needs help.

[DeeZee 7,445]

I’m still stunned by the pathetic effort from our boys in the first half.

The lowest score line in a first half of a final since 1927.

 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

4 minutes ago, layzie said:

SWYL - “Natural improvement isn’t the answer”

Unfortunately the pessimist in me agrees with this. To think that we’ll automatically be in a prelim next year is wishful thinking. At the end of the day we may well have blown our best chance with a lot of teams like Essendon and Brisbane ready to get a rifle and pick off teams in this year’s 8.

SWYL - “But this club has history of not getting up after being belted”

Again SWYL isn’t wide of the mark. Severe beltings seem to have a lingering effect on us. You are quite often left wondering if that was the moment. Gonna take a big change to right it this time.

SWYL is wide of the mark.  He's stuck with the old Melbourne and, as Paul Roos wrote about today, that old Melbourne is dead, regardless of the result today.

Natural improvement will continue to be a key thing for the club.  So many of the kids have plenty of improvement left, and as a young side who are clearly hungry for success, natural improvement will help us stay ahead of the pack.  Sure, other clubs will trade in a few players and so forth, but that doesn't always equal success.  Look at the Bombers and Port.  Both traded in plenty of established players and both missed the finals.  Seeing our list continue to grow and improve will be important.

And what big changes do we need?  Alright, we put in a stinker, but we just played in a Prelim Final.  You could argue we over achieved a little this season.  We had two 'beltings' early in the season against Hawthorn and Richmond - we then went on to win six in a row.  The Pies knocked us over easily on QB, yet we recovered enough to finish fifth.  The old Melbourne might have found it difficult, but we can only self flagellate with the past for so long.  This is a new side, not one holding on to what happened in 1981.

[DutchDemons 1,430]

We got done like a dinner today, but season 2018 was by far the most enjoyable ride I’ve had watching the Dees in decades. We beat Geelong and Hawthorn in finals!!! Our club is finally going on the right direction and, for the first time in a long time, the future looks very bright indeed. Remember how crap today feels, and build from it.

[Sir Why You Little 37,165]

19 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

SWYL is wide of the mark.  He's stuck with the old Melbourne and, as Paul Roos wrote about today, that old Melbourne is dead, regardless of the result today.

Natural improvement will continue to be a key thing for the club.  So many of the kids have plenty of improvement left, and as a young side who are clearly hungry for success, natural improvement will help us stay ahead of the pack.  Sure, other clubs will trade in a few players and so forth, but that doesn't always equal success.  Look at the Bombers and Port.  Both traded in plenty of established players and both missed the finals.  Seeing our list continue to grow and improve will be important.

And what big changes do we need?  Alright, we put in a stinker, but we just played in a Prelim Final.  You could argue we over achieved a little this season.  We had two 'beltings' early in the season against Hawthorn and Richmond - we then went on to win six in a row.  The Pies knocked us over easily on QB, yet we recovered enough to finish fifth.  The old Melbourne might have found it difficult, but we can only self flagellate with the past for so long.  This is a new side, not one holding on to what happened in 1981.

Don’t speak on my behalf and take things out of context. 

“You are only as good as your last performance...”

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, Sir Why You Little said:

Don’t speak on my behalf and take things out of context. 

“You are only as good as your last performance...”

You go with that first line all the time.  No one is speaking for you, those are the things you said.  If you don't like it, don't type it.

And you love a good cliche as well.  This has been our best season in almost two decades.  We are heading in the right direction, regardless of yesterday's result.  I look at the season, not one game like you do.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

3 minutes ago, AmsterdamDeesFan said:

We got done like a dinner today, but season 2018 was by far the most enjoyable ride I’ve had watching the Dees in decades. We beat Geelong and Hawthorn in finals!!! Our club is finally going on the right direction and, for the first time in a long time, the future looks very bright indeed. Remember how crap today feels, and build from it.

Did you watch at Coccos Bar? Just curious..

[layzie 34,023]

16 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

SWYL is wide of the mark.  He's stuck with the old Melbourne and, as Paul Roos wrote about today, that old Melbourne is dead, regardless of the result today.

Natural improvement will continue to be a key thing for the club.  So many of the kids have plenty of improvement left, and as a young side who are clearly hungry for success, natural improvement will help us stay ahead of the pack.  Sure, other clubs will trade in a few players and so forth, but that doesn't always equal success.  Look at the Bombers and Port.  Both traded in plenty of established players and both missed the finals.  Seeing our list continue to grow and improve will be important.

And what big changes do we need?  Alright, we put in a stinker, but we just played in a Prelim Final.  You could argue we over achieved a little this season.  We had two 'beltings' early in the season against Hawthorn and Richmond - we then went on to win six in a row.  The Pies knocked us over easily on QB, yet we recovered enough to finish fifth.  The old Melbourne might have found it difficult, but we can only self flagellate with the past for so long.  This is a new side, not one holding on to what happened in 1981.

I also said we don’t need wholesale changes Wise, I know the ‘big change’ sentence was a bit misleading but it was more to the point of a big change is needed to avoid the results of yesteryear but that this big change is currently happening. I apologise for not being clear on that one.

We are on the right track, this setback is hard yes but we will be better for it. I will stay positive but I do think it is important to acknowledge that nothing is guaranteed. We can only hope.

[Chook 15,022]

Having now read this whole thread, it's bedtime for me at last in the land of the boos. And so my final act is the solemn devouring of the Max Gawn cookie. May it feel as much pain as I did today.

 

EDIT: Dry and tasteless. Should I have expected any less?

Edited September 22, 2018 by Chook

[DutchDemons 1,430]

19 minutes ago, Wadda We Sing said:

Did you watch at Coccos Bar? Just curious..

Nope, didn’t wanna be around West Coast fans!

[Sir Why You Little 37,165]

23 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

You go with that first line all the time.  No one is speaking for you, those are the things you said.  If you don't like it, don't type it.

And you love a good cliche as well.  This has been our best season in almost two decades.  We are heading in the right direction, regardless of yesterday's result.  I look at the season, not one game like you do.

No i didn’t say them. 

Others said in earlier posts that natural improvement would lift the club next year

i disagreed. Hard work once again is what will get improvement. 

DO NOT TAKE WHAT I SAY OUT OF CONTEXT AND MAKE AN ESSAY OUT OF IT....

[layzie 34,023]

6 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

No i didn’t say them. 

Others said in earlier posts that natural improvement would lift the club next year

i disagreed. Hard work once again is what will get improvement. 

DO NOT TAKE WHAT I SAY OUT OF CONTEXT AND MAKE AN ESSAY OUT OF IT....

Sorry mate, I didn’t help matters.. 

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

Just got off the flight from Perth and back home. I felt embarrassed in the first half and remembered what it was like to be a loser. Butt of jokes. Anyway, good ok them for showing some fight in the 3rd, bitvtyt was a disgrace. Ten blokes had their worst games for the year. I don’t need to name them. I will say that Dom Tyson is a scrubber and has been for two years...Lewis was foul and coughed up so many goals at crucial times. His position must be questioned. Oliver battled on. Viney has a good second half butt was missing , along with Jones, for 2 quarters 

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

50 minutes ago, AmsterdamDeesFan said:

Nope, didn’t wanna be around West Coast fans!

Wouldnt have thought there would be many, cause they wouldnt be able to figure out how to book flights, but thats why we didnt go.

[kev martin 10,418]

They ran out of steam. 

Even when they tried to lift they could not get it to run their way. 

A young team in the headlights of a hardened, mature group with a ruthless game.

The energy of the spectators sat heavily on them.

They just couldn't stop the momentum.

No alternative plan.

Couldn’t handle the ball, the surface of the field, or noise levels. 

They failed at performing the basics (too many clangers).

Feel for them, couldn’t get a break, as shown by the bounce of the ball.

In their last four games, they played good football. 

I was expecting a whole lot more.

They weren't prepared for war, need some mongrel. 

Mainly they looked tired.

[WERRIDEE 5,520]

Really disappointed in Clarry's game in the first half didn't have a tag and I thought he would have a blinder but was no where to be seen. 

[bing181 9,330]

"Melbourne had a serious bout of stage fright, with their inability to hit simple targets – mainly by hand – brutally exposed by a clinical West Coast side. The Demons coughed up 12 turnovers in their defensive half in the opening quarter alone ... 56 of West Coast's 63 points at the main break came directly from Melbourne turnovers."

(AFL)

[bing181 9,330]

A few harsh truths amongst this, unfortunately:

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-09-22/every-demon-rated-from-the-preliminary-final

 

[beelzebub 23,383]

I spent the afternoon at a nephews.(hes from WA...yes...an Eagle )  They'd put on a great spread and I was very much looking forward to not only only dining out on the yummy food but on a 4 course dish of Eagles.

Instead of a" fine fair" of a game I was served up offal. It seems predatory birds find this tasty.

Much of what can be said already has. It was a disgrace to the jumper. It was embarrassing. We were more than capable of matching it with this lot but we we were a world away. If anyone thinks thats anywhere near the effort and ability needed they are so far removed from reality it's not funny. I actually felt for Simon Goodwin.

Finals are a game between ears and something went very very wrong.  Im not pessimistic about our future, but nor am I quite as optimistic about it right at the moment. The Club has still a mountain of work ahead of it to be truly considered relevant . My definition of relevance means finals footy..EVERY year as a minimum. Not saying you always can...but when you dont you are NOT relevant.

At the end  I decided I would just go home. I had no taste for a beer or anything really. I just felt gutted. An offer for a lift was kindly refused. I just wanted to be alone.I walked home..all 5 k. My wife got a text from her sister. "Hope  XXXXXXX is ok, looked so disappointed, we felt so sorry for him".  My wife knew Id be fine by the time I got home. I was. But it seriously makes me sick to my stomach to be on the receiving end of Pity from Collingwood people again!!  I thought those days were now behind us.

Melbourne should look at history and learn a lot from Collingwood as they did before our halcyon days.

They have a line.."side by side we play together , they KNOW how to win the game"   Yesterday we did neither. We fell apart and went out with a whimper.

Hopefully , apologies to Keating ( something I thought Id never say btw)  perhaps this is the trouncing we had to have !! This is THE wake up call. No good being on the stage if you cant perform. Harsh ?  well...life's like that isn't it.

Go Dees

[Thehardtackler 785]

No point dwelling on the negatives. We can't change the past. As a club we draw out the positives and work on our strengths and weaknesses, to improve them. Hopefully, this season will encourage the very best players to want to come to us during the trade period so that our list can evolve.