18 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I don't buy this argument. In 1986, being the last year of the "traditional" 12 team competition, the population of Australia was 16 million, meaning there were 1.3 million people per team. In 2018, the population of Australia is 24.7 million, meaning there are 1.3 million people per team. The talent pool should therefore be the same. Sure, there's competition from more sports and other non-sporting opportunities, but the average 17-18 year old who is drafted is far more professionally prepared than 17-18 year olds 30 years ago. 

I'm also not sure the standard of the game has dropped. It might be that all games are now shown which means we get to see the good and the bad, whereas back in the "good old days" we saw fewer and perhaps better games (because of the selectivity of which games to show.) It's also possible we just choose to remember selectively and remember the good games and not the bad ones.

Other sports have grown in popularity amongst kids and teens since the 80’s. I don’t think it’s a case of dividing our population by the amount of teams in the competition and saying “the talent pool should therefore be the same.”

Edited May 30, 20186 yr by Ethan Tremblay

19 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I don't buy this argument. In 1986, being the last year of the "traditional" 12 team competition, the population of Australia was 16 million, meaning there were 1.3 million people per team. In 2018, the population of Australia is 24.7 million, meaning there are 1.3 million people per team. The talent pool should therefore be the same. Sure, there's competition from more sports and other non-sporting opportunities, but the average 17-18 year old who is drafted is far more professionally prepared than 17-18 year olds 30 years ago. 

I'm also not sure the standard of the game has dropped. It might be that all games are now shown which means we get to see the good and the bad, whereas back in the "good old days" we saw fewer and perhaps better games (because of the selectivity of which games to show.) It's also possible we just choose to remember selectively and remember the good games and not the bad ones.

Many kids are turning to soccer and other sports so the figures dont equate to more people playing AFL, country leagues all across the country are either folding or merging, that to me is the telling factor, grass roots footy has been neglected for too long. Just because we have a higher population doesnt mean the talent is better/same, for all we know they may be people from other countries moving here and not playing. Grass roots is the key factor IMO

1 hour ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I don't buy this argument. In 1986, being the last year of the "traditional" 12 team competition, the population of Australia was 16 million, meaning there were 1.3 million people per team. In 2018, the population of Australia is 24.7 million, meaning there are 1.3 million people per team. The talent pool should therefore be the same. Sure, there's competition from more sports and other non-sporting opportunities, but the average 17-18 year old who is drafted is far more professionally prepared than 17-18 year olds 30 years ago. 

I'm also not sure the standard of the game has dropped. It might be that all games are now shown which means we get to see the good and the bad, whereas back in the "good old days" we saw fewer and perhaps better games (because of the selectivity of which games to show.) It's also possible we just choose to remember selectively and remember the good games and not the bad ones.

I can only speak from my experience but AFL football is not my number 1 sport. For me the globalisation of other sports has impacted on my AFL viewing habits. 

If, a Green Bay Packer game was on against any other team but Melbourne I would watch the Packer game. I can now watch Horse Racing 24/7 start in New Zealand, move thru Australia, then Singapore, Hong Kong, Sth Africa, France then UK. 

And even more I will actually go to Singapore & Hong Kong to watch the races live -

5-10 years ago I never got the global coverage of other sports so defaulted to footy. 

AFL football is under threat from other sports globally. 

Edited May 30, 20186 yr by DaveyDee

18 hours ago, P-man said:

I wonder if next season they will finally, FINALLY learn their lesson and stop allocating every other Thursday and Friday night to Carlton. Live in hope.

Does Fitzpatrick still hold a position at AFL HQ?  

If not Carlton may get what they deserve next year, being Sunday twilights at Doglands.  

5 hours ago, SFebey said:

AFL needs help and an 18 team competition is ludicrous, talent is spread too thin hence the rubbish we watch every weekend. Greed took control at AFL headquarters, now they just try and patch everything up on the run. 

No, i don't think it really is SFebey.

I agree it appears that way, but the Press is rejecting more players from AFL, than there is, not being enough talent to go around.

I think its more there isn't enough players who can play In the 'Press' style game. 

 

I believe the press is rejecting more potential AFL players, then John West's business model.

4 minutes ago, DV8 said:

No, i don't think it really is SFebey.

I agree it appears that way, but the Press is rejecting more players from AFL, than there is, not being enough talent to go around.

I think its more there isn't enough players who can play In the 'Press' style game. 

 

I believe the press is rejecting more potential AFL players, then John West's business model.

Who or what is Press? 

5 hours ago, DV8 said:

No, i don't think it really is SFebey.

I agree it appears that way, but the Press is rejecting more players from AFL, than there is, not being enough talent to go around.

I think its more there isn't enough players who can play In the 'Press' style game. 

 

I believe the press is rejecting more potential AFL players, then John West's business model.

????? !!!

8 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Who or what is Press? 

 

3 hours ago, monoccular said:

????? !!!

 

8 hours ago, DV8 said:

No, i don't think it really is SFebey.

I agree it appears that way, but the Press is rejecting more players from AFL, than there is, not being enough talent to go around.

I think its more there isn't enough players who can play In the 'Press' style game. 

 

I believe the press is rejecting more potential AFL players, then John West's business model. 

... not as many players can cope with this new addition to our game, 2 way running and the lack of space, kills off  a lot of creatively talented players, whom do not suit the rigid structures of the regimented "press".

Many fall by the wayside, not finding the space to work their magic within, that they would have had back in say 2005.

.  ..  ..  ..  ..  ..  ..

.

Edited May 30, 20186 yr by DV8

Here is the distribution of Thursday and Friday night games for the rest of the year (not including Round 23 which is unfixtured):

• Richmond - 6
• Sydney - 4
• Geelong - 4
• Essendon - 4
• St Kilda - 3
• Port Adelaide - 3
• Bulldogs - 2
• Adelaide - 2
• West Coast - 2
• Carlton - 1
• Melbourne - 1
• Hawthorn - 0
• Collingwood - 0
• North Melbourne - 0
• GWS - 0 
• GC - 0
• Fremantle - 0
• Brisbane - 0

That's seven sides who won't feature in prime time for the rest of the year - four of which are right in the thick of the finals race, two of which are legitimate top 4 chances (North and Collingwood).

Meanwhile we will see Essendon, St Kilda, the Dogs and Carlton, all rubbish sides, 10 times between them.

The distribution is just completely out. 

44 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Meanwhile we will see Essendon, St Kilda, the Dogs and Carlton, all rubbish sides, 10 times between them.

 

The AFL have really looked after EFC & Carlton 'titan'...

I would be interested to know the break up of the Friday night TV audience by club. I've always thought it was more a footy fan night rather than just another club fan night.

...and as a footy fan you're looking for the best game which unfortunately we haven't been getting.

For some reason the AFL & 7 must see it as a club fan night and schedule the big clubs more often.

Maybe my thinking is wrong & they are on the money but one things for sure, somethings not working.

Well one can only hope it bites them in the bum big time.

Is Gillon going to take any responsibility at all for this incompetence or will he defer it down stream.  He is just a pretty face. 

1 hour ago, rjay said:

The AFL have really looked after EFC & Carlton 'titan'...

I would be interested to know the break up of the Friday night TV audience by club. I've always thought it was more a footy fan night rather than just another club fan night.

...and as a footy fan you're looking for the best game which unfortunately we haven't been getting.

For some reason the AFL & 7 must see it as a club fan night and schedule the big clubs more often.

Maybe my thinking is wrong & they are on the money but one things for sure, somethings not working.

Love them or otherwise but GWS not having exposure is ridiculous. Even if they don't make the 8 they will be reasonably competitive.

Frankly the Channel 7/AFL love for the apparent power clubs of Melbourne is becoming boring for the average footy fan.

Interesting aside many posters on here say they are not interested in any team except the MFC. Me..I love to see the stars play.

I have no problem watching a game between two interstate powerhouses so why do we never see them on FTA.

Doesn't mean I don't bleed red and blue....simply I can appreciate good football.

10 hours ago, rjay said:

The AFL have really looked after EFC & Carlton 'titan'...

I would be interested to know the break up of the Friday night TV audience by club. I've always thought it was more a footy fan night rather than just another club fan night.

...and as a footy fan you're looking for the best game which unfortunately we haven't been getting.

For some reason the AFL & 7 must see it as a club fan night and schedule the big clubs more often.

Maybe my thinking is wrong & they are on the money but one things for sure, somethings not working.

Essendon I can understand. They made finals last year and appeared to be on an upward trajectory. 

Travis Auld was on 3AW on Saturday and grilled about the Friday/Saturday night scheduling and made a complete hash of it. He argued very unconvincingly that it had something to do with scheduling difficulties primarily associated with ANZAC Day and ANZAC eve. (In my view that might affect the two or three weeks before and after 25 April, but not the whole year.) The 3AW panel (Tim Lane, Caroline Wilson, Leigh Matthews and Jimmy Bartel) were not persuaded by his argument at all. 

1 hour ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Essendon I can understand. They made finals last year and appeared to be on an upward trajectory. 

Travis Auld was on 3AW on Saturday and grilled about the Friday/Saturday night scheduling and made a complete hash of it. He argued very unconvincingly that it had something to do with scheduling difficulties primarily associated with ANZAC Day and ANZAC eve. (In my view that might affect the two or three weeks before and after 25 April, but not the whole year.) The 3AW panel (Tim Lane, Caroline Wilson, Leigh Matthews and Jimmy Bartel) were not persuaded by his argument at all. 

Is that who it was?

I heard somewhere someone making this ridiculous argument.  

Regarding the ANZAC round, we had SS V ADELAIDE on the Friday night ✔️ but WB v CARLTON the following Friday night but SS V CATS the Saturday.  So this “excuse” is absolute BS. 

If they just came out and admitted that they had screwed up it wouldn’t change the travesty but could at least make it a little more palatable.

5 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Essendon I can understand. They made finals last year and appeared to be on an upward trajectory. 

Travis Auld was on 3AW on Saturday and grilled about the Friday/Saturday night scheduling and made a complete hash of it. He argued very unconvincingly that it had something to do with scheduling difficulties primarily associated with ANZAC Day and ANZAC eve. (In my view that might affect the two or three weeks before and after 25 April, but not the whole year.) The 3AW panel (Tim Lane, Caroline Wilson, Leigh Matthews and Jimmy Bartel) were not persuaded by his argument at all. 

The AFL in a 18 team national competition with only 1 premiership will never please all of the clubs supporters all of the time. You earn your fixture, your supporters earn respect from the AFL by actions not words. 

24 minutes ago, DaveyDee said:

The AFL in a 18 team national competition with only 1 premiership will never please all of the clubs supporters all of the time. You earn your fixture, your supporters earn respect from the AFL by actions not words. 

And how has Carlton earned their fixture?

1 hour ago, FarNorthernD said:

And how has Carlton earned their fixture?

As I said at time of release of this years fixture, very important long-term for AFL to make Carlton finically stable on now two key strategic fronts. 

4 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

The AFL in a 18 team national competition with only 1 premiership will never please all of the clubs supporters all of the time. You earn your fixture, your supporters earn respect from the AFL by actions not words. 

 

2 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

As I said at time of release of this years fixture, very important long-term for AFL to make Carlton finically stable on now two key strategic fronts. 

So that bit where you said you earn your fixture was rubbish? 

 

26 minutes ago, FarNorthernD said:

 

So that bit where you said you earn your fixture was rubbish? 

 

Nope - you earn the fixture over many years not 6 games of fantastic onfield results. Think the AFL prefers to have a proven history - think first game of the season every year. 

That sport is made for television. I'd like to see what the crowd attendances are 

NRL crowds are generally under 15,000 except in Brisbane where they're usually between 20 and 30.

Not at all unusual to have crowds under 10,000.

Their fans goggle at the thought of a modest 40,000 crowd which is unexceptional in traditional Aussie Rules states.

2 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

Nope - you earn the fixture over many years not 6 games of fantastic onfield results. Think the AFL prefers to have a proven history - think first game of the season every year. 

There is a lot of pent up enthusiasm for the first game each year. The Carlton factor in that game is irrelevant aside from it being an AFL gift.

20 minutes ago, FarNorthernD said:

There is a lot of pent up enthusiasm for the first game each year. The Carlton factor in that game is irrelevant aside from it being an AFL gift.

Ironic we are having this discussion a week before the QB game. 

However, every year AFL accepts requests from ALL clubs for their preferences

mfc request  

1/ 2 home games in NT against interstate teams financial reason

2/ Anzac Eve

3/ QB home game at MCG

The AFL does the best it can with ALL 18 clubs requests - will it please all supporters of all 18 teams - No

Dont forget MFC current administration also supports the AFL rights to maximise revenue from its fixture arrangements. 

 

Edited June 4, 20186 yr by DaveyDee

its not that the talent pool is too small. Its not. Our population is nearing 25 million people. its not the skill level that makes poor games. 

Its the state of the game. 36 players chasing a footy like a flock of seagulls fighting over a bag of chips is not appealing television for all but the most die hard footy fans.

look how few highlights there are now. its very hard to put an exciting highlights reel together from a round of footy these days because apart from a rolling maul and squabble of a mass of players, nothing happens! 

I used to love watching most games each week. I cant sit through footy as a natural observer any more. Its garbage.

I love watching melbourne games but even then i feel a bit hollow. We are winning games but its not great footy. Its 10 blokes in a 5 sq m area squabbling over shittty handballs and fumbles until someone finally gets free for a cheap one over the back. 

The game is simply not appealing anymore. Its grown in to a massive snore fest, then add on the relentless wave of weekly issues and changing and bending of prexisting rules to counter previous rule changes. 

Its snowballing in to a non marketable sport.

Years ago my friends and aquaintances overseas used to love watching the game. the speccys and the great goals. I can assure you in its current format very very few first time observers of the game on Tv are being wowed like they used to.

ITs become so sterile. Its all about structures and 2 on 1s and zones. 

Remember the days when in the lead up to a game the streets, pubs and trams used to full of chat about up coming matchups.  the history that developed between carey/jakovich, fletcher/longmire. whos going to fondly remember all those 3 on 1 contests of today in the future?? 

it all changed in 2005. 2004 there were an average of 34 rotations a game. It jumped to 60 in a year and then malthouse took it to a new level. This facilitated a game style of up and back running that was previously not possible. 

I cant stand the argument of the players not being able to withstand a game of restricted rotations. they would adapt just as they did going the other way.

maybe its not possible to go back but the argument of 70s/80s footy is a furphy. we dont have to go back that far. footy in the brisbane lions, essendon PA flag eras was epic. Most players and young fans are too young to really remember it but anyone who does remember the closing years of positional play remembers a game where THE FOOTY moved quickly. Now the footy moves very slowly but the players move quickly.

The footy used to fly up one wing, transition out of defence and fly down the other wing. Now it gets bogged down in a pocket for minutes until finally a free kick is pulled out someones arsse just to get the ball moving.

Lets get rotations back to 8 a quarter. The argument of the clubs then only recruiting athletes is a furphy as well. An arms race will then develop to recruit the most talent footballing athletes. The game plan will be developed to move the footy quickly so that skilled footballers can compete against unskilled runners.

The solution is on every youtube clip or DVD of early 2000's pre malthous, pre Roos football. 

Edited June 4, 20186 yr by Fitz Fitzpatrick

6 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

Ironic we are having this discussion a week before the QB game. 

However, every year AFL accepts requests from ALL clubs for their preferences

mfc request  

1/ 2 home games in NT against interstate teams financial reason

2/ Anzac Eve

3/ QB home game at MCG

The AFL does the best it can with ALL 18 clubs requests - will it please all supporters of all 18 teams - No

Dont forget MFC current administration also supports the AFL rights to maximise revenue from its fixture arrangements. 

 

Yeah well next year's wish list ad better have the following.

1. No game at Geelong..

2. No game against West Coast in Perth.

3. Home games against larger supported Melbourne clubs at the "G" as well as the above.

Last years performance and this year's demand it.